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Which Small Echo Saw?

Started by lxskllr, October 14, 2018, 05:11:21 AM

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lxskllr

At this point, I can't fatten it up. I have it turned as far as the limiters will allow. I was having trouble pulling them, and it seemed about right, so I left it alone til I get around to dealing with the muffler. I pulled the spark arrestor, but eventually want to open it up some, and may need more adjustment at that time.

If your comment refers to the chain stopping dead, I think that was due to the confused grain and "knotlets" teeth were catching on. and the motor not having enough to muscle through. These were very dense crotches, and forks I couldn't get a wedge in, so I was using the saw to "split" them. I don't generally like doing that, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

I'm not experienced in saw tuning, or use in general as far as that goes, but the performance seemed about right to me. That was about the worst I could have given it as far as wood goes. Only way to make worse conditions around here would be to drag them through mud first. It was the hardest, densest wood I could expect to ever find. Mud might have helped. Dull the chain so it didn't bite so aggressively  :^D

I will put more effort into getting the limiters off though. I was using a deck screw, but couldn't get enough bite to pull them off. A drywall screw might work better, with deeper/quicker to start threads.

ladylake

 
 You really need to pull the limiter caps and tune good, most come lean and will bog easy if not burn up thanks to The EPA.  Use a drywall screw and turn it in as far as you can without stripping it, then take it out and use a screw driver to turn the cap counterclockwise until the tab on the cap and slot in the carb are lined up, then turn the screw back in but not so hard that you turn the cap and get the slot out of alignment . Then pull with a pliers. After you do a few its easy.
 Adjust the low open enough so it doesn't bog when opening the throttle, on the high open it up at least 1 turn which should make it real rich and then gradually back  in until it cuts the fastest in bigger wood, if you get too lean it will bog easy.  Did I mention these saws make a LOT more power if you open up the muffler.   Steve 
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

John Mc

I'm not familiar with the limiters on the Echo saws, but On my Husqvarna and Jonsered saws, I was able to just reach in with the small blade on my Swiss Army knife and just shave the plastic tabs off the limiters without having to remove them (the limit was caused by the plastic tabs hitting the something - probably the shaft of the nieghboring adjustment screw? It's been a while since I looked at it.) They now can turn fully in or out. I've not looked at newer models to see if the design has changed. Is a similar approach possible on the Echo saws?

You definitely want to richen things up a bit for chainsaw milling. Those long cuts can make the saw run hot. Running a bit on the rich side can give the saw a little additional cooling. Keep the chain very sharp, and the cooling fins clear. An occasional pause might be needed in longer cuts to let the saw cool. You also need to resign your self to being very patient. A 40cc saw is small for milling. Expect to have to take it easy.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

wild262

           I recently purchased a 361P myself and really like it for limbing.  I find that I grab it more often than my OE346.  That's another saw you might consider although no longer made.  Its a 42mm high revving speedster.  My cutting buddy has a cs400 as his only saw.  But he doesn't cut much.  I did a muff mod on it, and really woke the saw up.  There a good saw as well.

lxskllr

Alrighty... Finally got the caps off. I also took the muffler off, gutted the cat, took the louvers off the front, and filed some of the restrictor plate that's on the engine side, but I didn't take a whole lot off of that. A .25" file stroke is tedious. I literally just finished, so I haven't tried tuning it yet. I'll try that before the weekend's done.

John Mc

A Dremel tool works wonders on those mufflers - though I suspect a file is safer: some of the metals in the catalytic converter are toxic. You don't want them flying all over the place as you work.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

lxskllr

I did the cat mainly with a screwdriver. Jam it in, and gouge around with it. Once I got most of it out, I screwed a screw in several places, wallowed out the holes, then gouged them away with the screwdriver. It was helpful that the metal was brittle. Pretty easy to break off in small pieces, but ceramic would have probably been easier.

wild262

      Try not to breath any dust you might stir up.  I learnt the hard way yrs ago on my first M Mod.  Choked up for 2 days.  You will most likely need to richin the mixture aft a M Mod.  Downside about'em is the increased noise.  But hopefully you wear hearing protection.       Enjoy.

lxskllr

Yea, one of the things I liked about the saw was it was relatively quiet. Oh well. Shouldn't be any louder than my 362. The muffler on that isn't anything more than an empty can on the front. I always wear hearing protection anymore. My ears have held up surprisingly well considering my life of loud music and construction work, and I'm trying to keep them in decent shape.

lxskllr

Ok, I need a sanity check. How does this plug look?



I didn't check it before hand, but this includes me futzing with it, and about 5 minutes running hard with the 16" bar buried in oak. If it were a car, I think I'd call it good, but I don't know about 2 stroke. It sounds about right, and the throttle response is decent, but perhaps could use some tweaking. I'm leery of setting the rpm to the edge of failure. I'm not familiar with adjusting these things, and the response to screw turns is slow. I don't how lean you can run it for how long before you're the owner of a doorstop, so I tried to be conservative.

Bandmill Bandit

That plug is in good shape. 
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

lxskllr

Thanks Bandit. I'm gonna check again after I run a full tank of gas through it, and see what it looks like. Hopefully it'll be stable. That'll also give me a good idea of what it runs like under working conditions. I think the low screw could still use some work, but I need time with it, when the saw isn't my primary focus. Seems concentrating too hard on something is counterproductive for me. I can't get a feel of what's really going on. Just using it gives a better impression.

Bandmill Bandit

If it goes more toward grey your a little lean - moving to more brown you're getting rich.

Well maybe not you but the saw!  :D

I tend to run a bit leaner but with close to 50 years of modifying, fixing and running all manner and size of 2 cycles in about every conceivable application, I am pretty confident in my ability! Even if I do burn the od set of rings. Haven't done that for more than a few years though. 

Leaner at the color your at on that plug may be as fine as a 1/8 of a turn or less.      
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

Inaotherlife

Yep. I agree. That plug is just a touch on the dark side.

On another note. Just got my cheap 8-piece carb adjuster set.
My Echo CS-361P didn't have any kind of limiters on the high and low, but uses a "pacman" screwdriver to adjust them.

Contemplating building an custom muffler with a tubular outlet for the 361P, to replace the cat-can.
As the cat is mounted offset in a baffle from the opening.
Or might order a CS350 muffler and mod it.

sawguy21

I would leave it alone with that color or even richen it slightly. Stalling in the cut indicates it is already too lean.
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

ladylake

The plug looks good.  On these smaller Echo saws the adjusters are around 3 turns out and will need more than a little bit of a turn to adjust.   Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

wild262

      I agree with sawguy21.  That's a pretty good color overall.   Much better on your bottom end to run a "tad" on the rich side, then on the lean side ;)

Inaotherlife

Pulled the plug out of my 361P and it looked a little darker than that. 

I didn't really consider leaning out the mixture yet. 
It's a pretty new saw still. And it seems to be running good.
And I'm still considering building a high flow muffler for it...which should even it out a bit.

wild262

Quote from: Inaotherlife on December 10, 2018, 11:00:49 AM
Pulled the plug out of my 361P and it looked a little darker than that.

I didn't really consider leaning out the mixture yet.
It's a pretty new saw still. And it seems to be running good.
And I'm still considering building a high flow muffler for it...which should even it out a bit.

          If you end up doing that, I'd like you post the outcome & maybe some photo's if you would.  I have the very same saw, and thinking on doing that to.

lxskllr

Alright, last question; I promise!  :^D

Got some good run time in with the echo today. Throttle response was fine, but it smelled a little rich. It would burble with the bar partially engaged(light pressure), then clean up with the bar fully in the cut. I left my saws at work, so I haven't been able to check the plug, but does that sound rich to you? I'm thinking the sound should clean up as soon as it's in wood? If rich, I may leave it as-is for a little while. It runs fine, and that'll help ingrain the sound in my head so I can more readily recognize it when tuning in the future.

Bandmill Bandit

From your "word videos" I'd say you got a good ear developing. With a new saw I'd run as is for at least 2 tanks of fuel. IF you are using a top grade mix oil, I would expect it to move a bit more toward " burbly" (to us older guys that the 4 cycle sound)  as you get deeper in the second tank. Start to lean it a bit when that starts. you want to be just out of the burbly stage when running warm and normal working load. You will be a pro at this in short order.  
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

krustysurfer

2511T such a wonderful scary little machine with a bad attitude! pure awesomeness! 8) its soooooo light you think its a toy after running a 372,however it is not, got me boot 1st few hours running it one handed - i have not ever done that i think - dont want to repeat ! what a great saw! aloha
You are Awesome and Loved By God! Aloha

Inaotherlife

Quote from: wild262 on December 10, 2018, 11:18:23 AM
Quote from: Inaotherlife on December 10, 2018, 11:00:49 AM
Pulled the plug out of my 361P and it looked a little darker than that.

I didn't really consider leaning out the mixture yet.
It's a pretty new saw still. And it seems to be running good.
And I'm still considering building a high flow muffler for it...which should even it out a bit.

         If you end up doing that, I'd like you post the outcome & maybe some photo's if you would.  I have the very same saw, and thinking on doing that to.
Absolutely I will.
The CS-350 muffler may be an option. I think it's an open can(no cat or baffle), and like the way it looks. 
It might be pretty easy to open up the outlet a bit.

Price looks to be around $30.

Inaotherlife

Quote from: krustysurfer on December 17, 2018, 11:25:19 AM
2511T such a wonderful scary little machine with a bad attitude! pure awesomeness! 8) its soooooo light you think its a toy after running a 372,however it is not, got me boot 1st few hours running it one handed - i have not ever done that i think - dont want to repeat ! what a great saw! aloha
Eets muey fantastico!!
Arriba Arriba Andale Arriba - Yeppa - YouTube

lxskllr

I put in my order for a 2511t today. The hardware store used to have it in stock, but they sold it. Disappointing that I have to wait a couple weeks, but I'm pretty excited. Been wanting one for awhile, and trying to justify the purchase. Hard to justify, but it's gonna be my truck saw. I'll pick up another pair of chaps, then I'll have a set of gear for work. The saw will always be with my, and I have a 362 I've been keeping at the office. The cs400 I bought has already paid for itself, so it's almost like I didn't spend money on it at all. That helps justify the new purchase anyway  :^D

edit:
BTW, inflation has struck. Echo's 20% off day is now a 15% off day. No dealers listed last I looked, but I guess it'll be populated soon.

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