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Official MS261CM vs 550XP test

Started by HolmenTree, June 06, 2017, 10:46:34 PM

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HolmenTree

Speaking of the Stihl harvester chain I have used some old Stihl .063  RMH that I bought years ago. Still have a couple of loops broken down from loops for a  5 foot 090 bar when I used to cut paper rolls for the local paper mill. Can't  find new anymore as I think Stihl no longer sells it. Probably for safety reasons as guys like me who run it on chainsaws.
Tough chain.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

ButchC


'couple years ago when I was assembling the parts and pieces for my firewood processor build there was a 100' spool of that Stiihl .404 .063 harvester chain on Ebay for small money but I couldn't find a .063 bar to fit my already completed bar mount. Guy listed it several times and as far as I know it never sold on that venue.  Guess I will try some RM for stump duty and see how it goes.
Peterson JP swing mill
Morbark chipper
Shop built firewood processor
Case W11B
Many chainsaws, axes, hatchets,mauls,
Antique tractors and engines, machine shop,wife, dog,,,,,that's about it.

khntr85

Quote from: ButchC on June 30, 2017, 06:56:09 AM

'couple years ago when I was assembling the parts and pieces for my firewood processor build there was a 100' spool of that Stiihl .404 .063 harvester chain on Ebay for small money but I couldn't find a .063 bar to fit my already completed bar mount. Guy listed it several times and as far as I know it never sold on that venue.  Guess I will try some RM for stump duty and see how it goes.
I always use old RM semi-chise when stumping...I have never stumped with full chisel, cant imagine it would last long...

HolmenTree

Got up to 80F today and the 261 with 16" 23RS chain perfomed really nice.
Did some "heavy pruning" in some Northwest poplar with a little help with my pickup truck on a redirected 3/4" rope.
Lateral stems almost as big as the tree its self. I love when people plant these trees, makes work for years to come :D


  

 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

Here's a job I did yesterday afternoon with temperature close to 85F. A storm front rolled through a couple of hours earlier and dumped about a hour of heavy rain.
Humidity was still close to 100% when the sun was bright while doing this job.

I needed production as I had more jobs later in the afternoon to grind stumps so I used the 562XP.
Had 4 poplar here to fell and cut up, customer will do the cleanup :o
562 managed the first tree but getting into the 2nd tree it started running rich and would no longer run.
I pulled on the starter rope while holding  WOT and couldn't get it to start.

Thought about grabbing the new 550XP  but the MS261 was closer. The 261 motored through the last 3 poplars running perfectly.
Lowered the stumps for the stump grinder with the 395XP-36".

Weather is getting hotter here now that we're getting into summer. Will be lots of tests on the 550/261 in 90F plus heat with lots of humidity.
Got 2 more days of work here, then on Friday I'll be taking my family to the west coast in Vancouver, B.C. for a week holiday.


 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

I'm just having my lunch here on another stump removal job.
I remember my old Stihls where the rewind handle would always spin around while cutting, and I would always have to turn it back in the right position to get a good grip on it when restarting.  Grip was very important on the old 064/066 without a decompression button.

Now what I noticed yesterday was my new MS261CM seems to have the old problem engineered out ???
After starting it sometimes the handle will rest in the backwards position but after cutting a bit it will turn back into the right position in the rewind cover's indented grommet.
I can't see for sure what changes they did but it works. One thing that may help is the handle is at a slight sideways angle to help it rotate back into the indentation.

When I worked for Stihl in the last 6 months of 1979 as a technical services manager, I was sitting next to Hans Peter Stihl while having dinner with then Stihl Canada president Fred Whyte and my Edmonton branch manager Steve Meriam.
Mr. Stihl had his note book out and was taking notes on what changes could be made on the then newly introduced 044AV. I suggested from experience with my 044 while logging the chain brake  mechanism should be tightened up a little as the chain brake tripped easily when cutting.

Well it wasn't long Fred followed me to the salad bar and he said to me.
"Willard, you have to be careful what you say to Mr.Stihl. He will now probably  have some poor engineer  down in the dungeons working for days on that chain brake."

It looks like the Stihl engineering department  is still doing a great job! 
8)

Making a living with a saw since age 16.

khntr85

Quote from: HolmenTree on July 05, 2017, 10:07:23 AM
Here's a job I did yesterday afternoon with temperature close to 85F. A storm front rolled through a couple of hours earlier and dumped about a hour of heavy rain.
Humidity was still close to 100% when the sun was bright while doing this job.

I needed production as I had more jobs later in the afternoon to grind stumps so I used the 562XP.
Had 4 poplar here to fell and cut up, customer will do the cleanup :o
562 managed the first tree but getting into the 2nd tree it started running rich and would no longer run.
I pulled on the starter rope while holding  WOT and couldn't get it to start.

Thought about grabbing the new 550XP  but the MS261 was closer. The 261 motored through the last 3 poplars running perfectly.
Lowered the stumps for the stump grinder with the 395XP-36".

Weather is getting hotter here now that we're getting into summer. Will be lots of tests on the 550/261 in 90F plus heat with lots of humidity.
Got 2 more days of work here, then on Friday I'll be taking my family to the west coast in Vancouver, B.C. for a week holiday.


 

The 562 is giving you problems too????

Man that's is to bad!!!

HolmenTree

Yep the 562 let me down in the 85F heat and high humidity. MS261CM just kept on cutting without a whimper.
The 562 wasn't fully fueled up at the start of the job and when it ran out of fuel in the 2nd tree I couldn't get it started after refueling.
I blame it on the tiny NGK CMR6H Husqvarna went to.
The MS261CM stuck with the full size BPMR 7A.

What was Husqvarna's thinking...trying to save weight?
I might be wrong but that's my educated guess.

In my pic you'll notice my saws ride on 3 inch thick foam pads in the back of my pickup.


  

 

Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

I put the 550XP on light duty on a pruning job this evening. Just got home as it's now 11:05 PM and it's just getting dark.

I put a new plug in the 550 but it still didn't cure the missing while warming up. Takes a good 2 minutes before it's fully warmed up even after sitting for about 10- 20 minutes.
2 minutes is like 20 minutes to me if I have to wait for a saw to make production. I guess time will tell when the hot weather comes around, maybe then it'll take half the time to warm up. But I have a funny feeling every time I go to start it I'll have to fumble with the fast idle.



  

 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

khntr85

Well I sure do appreciate this post of yours, good info here!!

  I am hoping the best for the 550 as I will be getting a used one soon from a saw buddy of mine....I can't wait to run it, I really hope is does t have any issues, but who knows....I am like you when I grab a saw it has to work...I don't care to let it idle for a minute, but if I have to hope/worry about it starting at all, it won't get any respect from me...

  There are times or jobs when I only grab one saw....if I am finishing a job, or maybe going to grab a quick load of firewood there are many times I have just grabbed 1-saw...I couldn't have a saw in my stable that I couldn't trust, just not worth the worry or wasted time.....I sure hope your 550 and the one I will be getting work out In the end!!

ehp

the small sparkplug idea was to leave more metal in the combustion chamber  so the was to transfer more heat from the sparkplug to the metal of the cylinder.

ehp

I bought a new 261C today just to carry around and lower the tops once done logging , I donot use the .325 chain you guys use . I hate that stuff, 18 inch 3/8's full size  setup on it . Not sure if Im going to mod this one but the one I just did for Jeff was a pretty much dead heat running 20 inch setup on cutting bigger red oak, I timed the saw against a 372 XPG and both saws were 23 seconds per cut

HolmenTree

Thanks for explaining the plug difference Ed.
If I was logging I wouldn't run .325 either, just not enough filing life plus binding and stretching would be a PITA.

For my tree service on cutting alot fewer trees a day the .325 is a  nice fit on my smaller stock saws from the top handles to the 562 with 18" and under bars.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

Quote from: ehp on July 07, 2017, 06:47:27 PM
the small sparkplug idea was to leave more metal in the combustion chamber  so the was to transfer more heat from the sparkplug to the metal of the cylinder.
Thanks Ed.
But now that I think more about it, while the engine is running cooling air flow through the cylinder would expel that cylinder and plug heat.  But with my experience with the Husqvarna AutoTune is when the engine is shut down for a bit that is where the heat sink and flooding problem is.
So I'm thinking maybe a larger standard spark plug with a larger threaded base with larger electrode and insulator would stay cooler.
Probably why Stihl never went to the smaller plug to work with the new micro processor technology.



 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

PNWRusty

Spark plugs typically have a good thermal bridge with the cylinder head (seeing how they are threaded into the aluminum head). The temperature of the spark plug in a running engine is mostly a function of how far it reaches into the combustion chamber. Once the engine is shut off I don't think it matters much as the temperature of the cylinder head and plug will quickly equalize.

The larger diameter plug allows for more space between the insulator and body of the plug so it would naturally be more resistant to fouling in this area. But I think most fouling happens at the tip, no? And this would be corrected by using a plug with a different heat range. But manufacturer specified heat ranges have always worked for me.
Everything I've heard about your hot start/hot running issues leads me to think it's the fuel system, not the plug diameter.

ehp

yes but the smaller diameter sparkplug allows you to shape the combustion chamber different , I did not say I agreed with the factory thinking but that was the reason I was gave,

I got abit of time on the 261, so far no problems .

HolmenTree

I'm still out here on the West coast at Vancouver,B.C.with my family, will be home next week.

It's sad to hear Fred Whyte former Stihl Inc. president passed away recently at age 70. Fred is a native of Vancouver, B.C.
When I first met Fred in 1989 the first thing he said to me upon shaking hands, was "Willard you are a true chainsaw man."
I really liked Fred , he was was a great leader with substance and style!


Here's a pic of some big second growth Douglas Fir we came upon in the Lyn Canyon in North Vancouver.


 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

Well back to work in 2 days on Monday morning.
One more pic of big 2nd growth in Capilano Park in Vancouver, B.C.
We were walking 50 feet above ground amongst these giants.

I wanted to visit Mike Acres chainsaw museum in nearby Burnaby but plans didn't work out with our schedule.....next trip. :)


  

 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

Quote from: HolmenTree on July 08, 2017, 11:33:51 AM
Quote from: ehp on July 07, 2017, 06:47:27 PM
the small sparkplug idea was to leave more metal in the combustion chamber  so the was to transfer more heat from the sparkplug to the metal of the cylinder.
Thanks Ed.
But now that I think more about it, while the engine is running cooling air flow through the cylinder would expel that cylinder and plug heat.  But with my experience with the Husqvarna AutoTune is when the engine is shut down for a bit that is where the heat sink and flooding problem is.
So I'm thinking maybe a larger standard spark plug with a larger threaded base with larger electrode and insulator would stay cooler.
Probably why Stihl never went to the smaller plug to work with the new micro processor technology.



 
I just found out some interesting info about these plugs.
From information a dealer who has been servicing the prototype Husqvarna 572's. He claims the 572XP uses a full size BPMR plug, not the mini  CMR plugs the 550/562 use.

Some food for thought here.......
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

ehp

they can say what they want, In my small mind I still say the smaller plug is more a money grab, you pretty much have to go to a saw dealer to buy one, the larger plug you can buy at most stores

HolmenTree

My Morbark chipper's Wisconsin air cooled V4 engine takes a big spark plug that needs a 1 inch socket to remove them.
Also had a old SkiDoo 640cc twin that took a plug that big too.

Back to work today with light rain showers.
61F. Pressure is 101.3 kPa with 55% humidity.
First tree removal job of the day was 2 willows and 1 spruce.
Started out with the 550XP on the first willow. Tried to warm it up on a few small stems but boggy and when the boggy condition went away I was stuck with a ignition miss. Looked up and saw the customer and neighbors were watching me.
Felt a little embarrassed  :D so I grabbed the 261. Warmed up real quick on the small stems with no bog or ignition miss. Cut up all 3 trees with the 261with 16" 23RS chain.
Great running  torque producing 50cc saw!


 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

Sorry everyone for reporting one sided like this with just the MS261C.
As the season goes on the 550XP will get lots of exposure too.
Doing stumps today and forgot to throw the 395XP-36 " on the truck for lowering stumps with my stump grinder.
Used the 261 with 16" 23RS chain in some stumps over 20inch diameter. The 261 has close to 20 tanks through it now and boy is it developing some serious torque.
Seems really weird for a little factory stock 50cc saw to put out steady power like this and works really well with the stainless steel dogs.

Fuel consumption is low and seems to be getting better. After alot of cutting I think I should fill up the 261 but get surprised when I open the fuel cap and see lots of fuel left.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

HolmenTree

This came in my mailbox today from Stihl.
My warranty confirmation, coupons and a chance to win $250 in Stihl Bucks.
Very nice touch for purchasing the MS261C.  :)

 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

trapper

Have you had a chance to run it in hot weather?  My dealer has had problems with other m tronic saws idling in hot weather.  With my 241 which has only had 6 tanks of gas had minor problems idling when it was about 87F if I let it idle far longer than normal between cuts.  So far I like it and may trade my 290 for a 261.  PS he has a phobia about the m tronic but I buy from him because he takes care of me.  If he is not too busy he will do minor things while I wait.
stihl ms241cm ms261cm  echo 310 400 suzuki  log arch made by stepson several logrite tools woodmizer LT30

HolmenTree

Had it working around 80F a week ago and worked fine . Normally up here we get our hottest weather in August.
Forecast is for 85 by this weekend, record temps here a few years ago got up to 108F (42C) so hot you could see a mirage on the parking lot....wasn't cutting that day lol.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

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