New land/farm owner- need to upgrade my saw

motzingg · November 02, 2018, 12:10:06 PM

ok i'll take the bar to compare. I've always just replaced chains, never replaced a bar before, still trying to figure out what all the dimensions mean.

my big problem is i have a 25+" dead red oak that has to come down this weekend, a buddy of mine is going to fell it and i told him i'd get it cut up once its on the ground. tree has been dead for 5 years or more and its real dangerous. the 16 inch bar it came with is basically shot, all burr'd and blued up on both sides, to the point the chain doesn't move nice in it. Gotta get a new bar, gotta get a 20", hate doing this in a hurry, thanks in advance for the help!!

motzingg · November 02, 2018, 12:35:07 PM

Eh ok, the internet is pretty against putting the 20" on there, i guess i don't get why it makes that big of a difference- a 20 inch bar going through a 10 inch log is just as engaged as a 16" bar going through a 10" log, but i've got a lot to learn on the practical side of this.

I'll go grab the narrow kerf 18 for today and see how it runs, I guess if i need more bar i'm gonna need a bigger saw, time to start dumpster diving.

lxskllr · November 02, 2018, 12:42:00 PM

Careful with the bar you get. Looking at the Oregon site, it looks like .325 is the narrow kerf bar, and if I had to put money on it without looking, I'd say your saw is setup for 3/8. You'd need a new spur to switch it over. Make sure you know what you need before dropping money on it.

samandothers · November 02, 2018, 01:10:37 PM

An internet search for the saw specs should help with bar/chain. I looked and thought it indicated .325 x .050 and up to 18" bar.

motzingg · November 02, 2018, 02:49:44 PM

Yeah it took trips to 3 different stores but I got the husky brand bar and chain all-in for 50 bucks (on sale to boot)

Its a .325 x .050, 77 links, 18" bar. It looks much higher quality than the oregon stuff, made in finland instead of china.

She'll be darn near a brand new saw by the time i'm done with her.

mike_belben · November 02, 2018, 03:56:34 PM

its a high speed saw and does not like to fall off its powerband.. you dont really get torque until youre into the 60cc and up class. i guess thats subjective but the 50cc saws dont want to lug. if you are a dog in cutter then youd want 16" on it with a 7pin sprocket. a 20" bar on that will make it a pine limber that you dont have to bend down quite as far with but not much more. its too much bar and will stall the clutch too easy when the RPMs nose over. you must have a light touch to keep that chain pulling with a 20 on it. soon as rpm dives ease off.

-.325 050 gauge is what you want. small frame husky bar mount.

-the removable sidecovers on jred transfers are a godsend if you want to fool around with porting. dont go too high with your exhaust and transfer ports or what little torque it has will evaporate. the arboristsite hotsaw forum is decades of these sorts of discussion that arent common on FF.

-a muffler mod, carb limiter delete and retune will wake it up, study madsens saw shop tech articles.

-the muffler loosening, leaking hot exh gas onto the oil tank will be its death if it happens so loctite them and be sure they arent stripped. those shoulda had 3 screws but think only had 2.

-hsl saw supply is a good vendor for parts.

-you can buy an entire chinese overhaul kit for a husky 61 in the $70 range or so. i dont think anyone is spending $400 on rebuilding saws anymore. new throwaways are priced right in there for such a reason. i think that 2150 was in the mid 300s new. i put the jonsered above the open transfer lowes husky 350

-the MS250 you quoted is a comparable saw to the 2150 but IMO is much more aggravating to reassemble, the clamshell husky products are very assembly line fisher price sort of components that pop right together. im knocking both of them equally.. compared to a pro husky or stihl they are both toys that will wear out and are really only worth a chinese rebuild IMO. pro saws are a better investment long term. the only leg up i give to the jred is an easier reassembly. when running theyre both fine. die hard stihl guys will say im just doing it wrong but whatever. im a normal mechanic and dont have 4 tiny hands which is what youd want for working on homeowner stihls. (im teasing the stihl fanboys. all in good fun)

motzingg · November 02, 2018, 05:31:10 PM

Ha ha mike, sweet dude thanks for the knowledge dump, I've spent a little time in between things at work the last two days looking some of that stuff up.

I ordered the 'tube port' EU-spec muffler from chinabay, probably start by modding that out, see where it goes. Just getting the exhaust spooge to not blow right on the chain brake will be a huge win. I'll pull it all apart over the winter and give everything a good cleaning and reseal, crank bearings, and play around with the porting. Mine is the early one with the 44mm open transfer so i'll probably buy that flyway jug to play with.

I'll have to look up the carb restriction you speak of... when i bought the saw the carb only opened half way due to the linkage being all waller'd out, but i got that fixed by just bending the pushrod up.

Yeah the muffler bolt thing... scary stuff... some of the pics on line are brutal. Worst case a couple locking heli-coils in there, but I'm used to putting stuff together with a torque wrench. It was the first thing i checked when i bought it, still tight from the factory, fingers crossed it stays that way.

Still freaks me out seeing the bottom half of the crankcase being plastic, but i guess the engineers knew what they were doing. Lots of brass inserts in the plastic- whereas my old poulan pro was the same design but using Plastite screws. I haven't worked on an MS250 but just looking at the exploded view i like the idea of the all metal jug/crankcase clamshell split, definitely can see where its a lot of screwing around to get that apart.

I'm hooked, next up i'll be keeping an eye out for a full frame saw, maybe that guy with the '61' will come to his senses and i can scoop it cheap in a few weeks.

mike_belben · November 02, 2018, 08:39:17 PM

Stihl 026/260 pro, 036/360 and 038 are good too, worth buying basket cases to fix. They arent clamshells and arent hard to work on comparatively.

The limiters are plastic caps over the H and L carb screws. If you have them use a sheetrock screw to pull them off and either leave off or clip the limit wings then reinstall.

For mufflers i slit a gill open on the side and then pry that so its blowing back toward the clutch. Then i form and weld a little tin deflector shroud over the gill aiming the gas the other way. This uses the reflective wave principle to cancel out sound. They flow good without being louder really. The big benefit is lower temps on the jug.

Regarding plastic clamshells.. Id say the engineers knew what they were doing. Slipping the world a lesser product and keeping a higher margin for the board of directors bonus package. Isnt that always the case?

HolmenTree · November 03, 2018, 08:11:30 AM

The new MS261 CM are amazing for making torque for a 50 cc saw.

On mine I run .325 23RSC, when I'm in smaller wood I run a 8 tooth rim sprocket and in bigger wood I gear down to a 7.
Beauty of inboard(sprockets ???) ;)

I see the new series 261 362 and 462 as triplets in design and character, will be interesting to run a 462 when their finally available.

mike_belben · November 03, 2018, 01:39:47 PM

Didja mean outboard sprockets?

Ive always wondered why the 395 is inboard. And wish it had a right angle chain adjuster.

John Mc · November 03, 2018, 02:51:39 PM

Quote from: mike_belben on November 03, 2018, 01:39:47 PM
Didja mean outboard sprockets?

Probably thinking inboard clutches, but was just talking about sprockets, so that's what was on his mind?

HolmenTree · November 03, 2018, 08:37:53 PM

Yep sorry fellas for letting you down.... seeing I had sprockets on my mind

But I guess I don't have go on proving that right? :D

Fishnuts2 · November 03, 2018, 08:45:47 PM

That Hyway jug you found is the best of the clones as it is closer to a 346 than the 350's and 353's with the transfer covers. Once you see them from the bottom of the jug, you'll see what I'm talking about. I have one on a 350 that I built and it runs real close to my real 346.

The loose muffler thing can be cured by buying a cheap 346 clone muffler and Brace, and cutting off the leg of the brace on the flywheel side as a 350 can't accommodate it. Retorque the muffler screws after the saw is warmed up and they will stay tight from there on out. Plus, you can cut and modify the muffler and not be out a lot of money if it's too loud.

While I also have a nice ms250 and ms260 to run as well, I'd have to say that the 250 isn't even in the same game as the 350's and it's red headed cousins. The 260 with base gasket delete and muffler mod is just about as fast as the Husky, but not as smooth and fun to play with.

Oh, most all 350's come with .325 chain and are best with a 16" or 18" bar.

Looks like you're on the right track and are showing the first signs of CAD, but don't worry though, because there is no cure!

Fishnuts2 · November 03, 2018, 09:21:51 PM

Here is a picture of the modified muffler brace on a 350, and a neat little idea I found on some thread for the decompression
button on my 353.

mike_belben · November 03, 2018, 09:52:35 PM

I built an ms250 for a friend and didnt think it performed as well as my jred 2152. It cut wood, dont get me wrong.

Im pretty eager to put my 346 together but itll probably be quite a while before that hits the front burner.

motzingg · November 05, 2018, 10:53:22 AM

Wow ;D didn't have any time to turn on a computer this weekend!

All I can say is wow, once I got this saw dialed in with the 18" B&C and everything cleaned, torqued, tuned up, (fixed the throttle only opening 3/4 of the way) I am just blown away at how hard this thing runs. A brand new chain never hurts, but I just couldn't believe how hard this little 'plastic homeowner saw' runs at high rpm. This thing straight blows the doors off my uncles' brand new husky 450, like they aren't even in the same realm. This thing probably runs a good 2000-3000 rpms faster just out of the box. To be honest, until I get used to the power, I'm much more comfortable running the little 235 for anything under 3-4 inches and trimming off little limbs, this is just plain scary any time you get near the kickback zone on the tip.

We got 2 trees all the way down and major haircut on 2 other big oaks. Even the 30" dead old red oak was totally workable with the 18" bar, just like ya said, had to keep the pressure light and the rev's up and like my grandpa always said 'let the saw do the work'.

I have the 'tube style' non epa muffler coming sometime this week, thanks for showing a photo of the bracket, that picture is worth 1000 words. If it stops snow/raining long enough i've got a 9" oak limb that i can set up for an impromptu 'hot saw' test. I'll run it right now as it is with the EPA muffler, i can run the tube style stock, then i'll probably take it back off to play with it some. For 10 bucks or whatever, i can afford to hack up a bunch of them and try different techniques.

I'll also get some photos and video of the 235 and my old 150 homelite, just for fun.

Thanks again, couldn't be happier with how this is working out, its always a good feeling knowing that you have the tools and capability to get work done that needs done.