225 timberjack vs 540 b

[millcreek40]

Wondering if someone could chime in??  I currently have a nice 225 d timberjack 353 Detroit   It's a very nice machine but here's the question??  I just bought a 183  acres  some of it is a mile skid with some uphill skidding. Pulling three 16" trees is a slow go up hill. 2nd gear. It gets the job done but as I will be here for a while. I cut alone and do a bunch of firewood. Have been thinking about a deere540b.  Pros cons?  Some people tell me the Deere won't pull that much more.  I think it should but have not ran one. Others tell me the Deere is very tippy .  Deere parts very $$. On the other hand there QUITE. Any thoughts and thanks in advance

[timberjackrob]

I would rather have a 240 jack as the 540 deere just my opinion tho I just like the simplicity of timberjacks and had a 240 at one time it would pull a load and the cummins versions were pretty quite compared to the detroits.

[millcreek40]

That's for the reply. I also like the  simplicity of the jack. Have you ever ran a 540. I have not. I did have a nice 508 cat. I sold it because of the cost of parts. I did not have any tranny issues with it. But I made the mistake of looking up what a trans job would cost. Scared me so I bought the timberjack. I just found a nice 540 b for 20k. Nice clean rig. Just not sure

[Nemologger]

I have owned both a 225 jack and a 540b deere. If I had to choose one to run all the time it would be the deere.

[millcreek40]

I know the Deere certainly is quieter & has much more as far as  creature comfort. How about on steep ground??

[CCC4]

First off, I am more of a full time faller, but as of late I have been running skidders in steep rough terrain. Second, I have been running bigger skidders than what you are inquiring about...450 C TJ and a 648 G3 Deere. Even though more seat time has been in the 450's I quickly settled in and appreciate the 648 in rocky steep terrain. It's larger footprint and just overall better mechanics would push me to the Deer line of larger skidders. My boss has always liked 450's because we run through so many of them and parts are so easy to interchange and readily available with a lesser price tag. If it were me as an owner operator, I would choose the machine not the cheapness of parts. I have ran probably 10 different 450's in the last 2 years, climbing into the 648 is like climbing into a Rolls Royce compared to the 450's I have run...except for So Ill Logger's 450...now that is a well kept, good steering and powerful 450 for sure...so 1 out of 11 for me. ! (meaning I really liked 1 out of 11 450's )

None of this may help but these are my own findings and can sort of play into your original question.

[Mark K]

I had a 225 for many years till my business out grew it. Ran a 540b for a while too. The one I ran had 18.4-34's on it. Tippy on the side hills. Alot more comfortable to run on a day to day basis though. A friend of mine has one with 23.1-26's. Alot more stable. Cant knock a timberjack though

[millcreek40]

The one I am looking at has 18.4s I personally think the skinny tires go in deep snow much better than the wide ones. The cat i used to own had 23.1-26. Deep snow it just would jump up & down.  Do you think the 540 is say more tippy than a c5.  I do realize that it wouldn't be as stable as the timberjack.  Just seems like everyone is telling me the 540 is very tippy. I am in upstate ny so we do have some steep ground

[ehp]

all I can tell you is a brandnew 540B we got back when was upside down before it even got off the landing and it had 18.4 by 34s on it , johndeere delivery man flipped it by trying to drive over a log on the landing to show us how stable it was compared to the 230 it was replacing , nope not even close but it was faster in the bush

[millcreek40]

That must have been  impressive. I guy I haul wood for told me that he has tipped over 5 skidders in his  career . Said 4 where 540s. Maybe I should learn to live with the noisy Detroit

[millcreek40]

You still bought it ???

[timberjackrob]

never run a 540 but had a 440 at one time it was pretty weak on power and wouldn't go nearly as good as the 208 I have now.i notice you said you work by youself a lot might want to give some thought to having to climb on and off a deere all day too.

[millcreek40]

I guess I must be like everyone else.  Just want to pull more than I should. Lol. The 225 pulls fine till you have to skid uphill then it just seems to light. Go light & go often I guess

[Nemologger]

I have worked in the woods for over 35 years, ran a lot of different skidders. I have never turned one over and we log some steep Mississippi river bluffs at times. Anyone can turn one over the trick is to NOT turn one over.
I did have a guy helping me a few years ago had a 240 Jack up on 2 wheels and still laying the winch to it. Needless to say I fired his stupid a$$ on the spot. Guys that know me know I wont put up with skidder abuse.
I can honestly say the skidder that would pull the most I ever owned was that old 240.

[millcreek40]

I agree with you totally!! I realize you can tip any of them. Just seems some are better than others. I ran a c5 for a while. It's more tippy than the jack. Imo. How does a c5 compare with the 540b. About the same??  There are a lot of 540s around here.  Just seems hard to believe there that tippy.

[Nemologger]

You take a 540 with 23.1 tires and it aint as tippy as you think, I had a 540 B grapple with fluid in the front tires...really hard to tip that girl.

[millcreek40]

Thank you for that. I have never driven one but would surely like to. Don't get me wrong.  I am in no way putting down the Deere   My fathers  construction co ran nothing but Deere with great luck.  That's why I am looking at one

[tom h]

I have a c5 treefarmer cable skidder with a 353 detroid also have a 540b with grapple and winch. The 540b has 23.1x26 tires and is pretty stable,the tires are loaded.  The 540b is a lot more skidder especially using the grapple with powershift transmission,also is a lot more maneuverable.The winch on the c5 is a lot better than the one on the 540b.I have spent a lot more money keeping the 540b going,but is more fun to run.If I have to winch a lot of trees I use the c5 Tom h

[David-L]

the 540 is a very friendly machine to run and I love the powershift. That said, I do alot of TSI work and cord wood and getting off and on  my 225 Jack is way easier than a Deere skidder. if I had a chopper ahead of me I would consider the deer but I am a one man team and that on and off eats you up by the end of the day. I would get a 240, Cummin's or Detroit and you will be glad you did. And they are alot cheaper to run than the Deer as parts are cheaper and still available. My two cents. Good Luck.

[millcreek40]

There is a 240 for sale not to far away with a  Deutz   Maybe I should be looking at that instead. They are nice & quite.  About the same money as the Deere

[Spartan]

If it were me...
long skids with some uphill, hands down I would want a heavy machine with POWER.  I would not want to be making 3 times as many mile long skids.  Git er done and do it quickly.  Of course I own a light machine with little power (TJ 450a) go figure.   But I cut my teeth on a CAT 518 and that thing will haul wood.

[David-L]

That 240 with the Duetz will pull. Check the engine over real careful. there should be no oil around the juggs and the injection pump area should be dry also. brakes in the transfer case are expensive to rebuild if they are not working. I had a 225A with a five cylinder Duetz and wish I had never sold it.

[lopet]

What are they asking for that 240 ?  The reason I am asking is, because I have seen them selling for very reasonable money and on the other hand i have seen them way over priced. But then again, it all depends what the previous owner had put into, and maybe can proof it .

[ehp]

Its pend so long I cannot say if the 540 would out pull my 230A , I'm thinking they should be pretty close but one thing for sure is my 230A is cheaper to run per year as parts are cheap and have very little trouble , we had tranny trouble with those 540B and there not cheap to fix up here , Very little difference between a 240 and the later 230A's with cummins power in them

[Ken 45lc]

I owned and operated a 240D with 18.4x34, and a 540B with 23.1x26 and to me the Deere was just as stable, and more powerful and nimble.

I know I'm going to catch crap for saying this, but I didn't like that Timberjack one bit, well except for the ease of getting on and off. Someone sandblasted the serial tag on it so that you could no longer read the number, this made getting any part a royal pain in the butt. There wasn't any TJ dealers near me, so getting parts wasn't easy. And I have to laugh when I read everyone saying that Deere parts are so expensive, I had to pay $95 each for a stinking wheel seal on the TJ.

I found the Deere much easier to work on, you can actually remove the skid plates on the Deere and reach everything. The TJ was welded on, changing the hose on the steer jack is a nightmare. The dang starter on my TJ (453) seemed to go out once a year, and that was always a pleasant job to do in the woods. To me the Deere was more accessible, and the parts much easier to obtain so that more than offset the price difference to me.

Keep your fluids clean and the machine greased and it should give you years of good use. I could go on, but I'll shut up for now.

Hope this helps,
Ken

[millcreek40]

Thanks ken for the great post .  Think I will go & try it out

[millcreek40]

The 240 with the  Deutz   The asking price was 19k. Has a gearamatic winch that needs bands

[tj240]

i own a 240 with a duetze, gearamatic winch. very stable and powerful. i also run a 540b with 18.4-34 tires. the deere is faster, more user friendly, but it is very ass end light. if you load the tires no problems. Once you know what you can and cant do with the 540, you wont have problems until something breaks, they arent cheap to fix. i really like the 240, if you have ran a c5, the 240 will out pull it hands down, i believe the had the same winch. the 240 with the duetze is a 6 cyl. the c5 with a duetze is a 5 cyl. good luck i run them both, tj and deere, and like them both, but bad ground go with the tj. good luck

[Ken]

I've owned and run several different types of TJ's (225, 230, 380, 450) and can not say anything bad about them.  Although I loved my 225 with 16.9-30 tires for ease of getting on and off it was a bit small to haul big wood or yard any distance.   The philosophy of "loading light and going often" is a good one though.  I would like to find a very well maintained 230 or 240 with a Cummins.

[Bill_G]

Have you considered a John Deere 640  D ?

[millcreek40]

Hi bill. No I have not considered the 640d. I just think it's to big for what I normally do.  I did purchase a 1984 540b today. It's going to be delivered Friday or Monday . I can't wait to try it out. I decided to keep the 225 at least until I decide if I like the 540

[Decked]

If/when I ever get another skidder, I will search long & hard for a "D" series...they rock

[OH logger]

had a 1981 540 B and it was a good strong skidder and pulled a lot for me. the only problem was a pulled a lot for it. (winch cable that is) :(. gets old in my book

[millcreek40]

Pulling the cable does get old. But cutting by hand & working alone, I don't think a grapple would be much of a help. Could be wrong. Never used one

[millcreek40]

Well I bought a 1984 540b. It was delivered yesterday. I went & pulled a couple hitches this morning. I really didn't care for it that much. Sure is a little more tippy than my 225. Hopefully I just have to get used to it.  Time will tell

[lopet]

Good luck with your purchase.
Maybe you gonna let us know after a while what you like about it and what not.

[Spartan]

Well I bought a 1984 540b. It was delivered yesterday. I went & pulled a couple hitches this morning. I really didn't care for it that much. Sure is a little more tippy than my 225. Hopefully I just have to get used to it.  Time will tell

If the tires are decent, fill them with fluid, (at least the rears)

[Nemologger]

Pulling the cable does get old. But cutting by hand & working alone, I don't think a grapple would be much of a help. Could be wrong. Never used one

Don't knock a grapple till you tried it. Working alone myself at times a 540b with a grapple is a mans best friend. Cut a couple tanks then climb on the skidder and rest while you drag them out. Soft ground, when a log really sinks in the ground...no problem. Cut ahead when its too muddy to skid, maybe a few tops get on other downed trees...no problem.

[tom h]

I also have 540b with a grapple and winch.I cut and skid by myself.Like Nemologger says the grapple makes my work a lot easier.

[Nub121]

I would go with the 540 B but it has to be newer then a 78!! A 540 can pull 1200 bd ft at a drag if you push it and if you put a set of 28L tires it'll have pretty good flotation also!! As far as comfortably operation the deer wins hands down!!

[millcreek40]

Well sad to say but I bought a machine with issues. The man I bought it from promised it was woods ready.  Pulled two hitches to find out it has a blown head gasket. Now I am not sure what to do.  Did he get it hot & do unseen damage?? Cylinders , warp the head.   I just don't know . Should I pull the motor & have it rebuilt? New clutch  then if your in it that far should you go through the transmission. Then your going to spend ten grand but you would know what you have. I just paid 20k for this skidder .   Or should I sell it for 15 or 16 & be perfectly  honest about the head gasket.i cannot believe people can live with themselves knowing the screwed someone out of there hard earned $. Any thoughts would be  appreciated

[David-L]

That is bad news. makes me just want to keep my Jack as I know what I have. always a risk in this used equipment. good luck.

[millcreek40]

I still have my jack. Good thing. I didn't get to run the Deere much but I don't think I would have  dared to put it on the steep hill I was on today. The Deere looks nice sitting on the landing. Just not sure what to do with it

[snowstorm]

how many hrs on the motor? deere dosent usually have head gasket trouble except on a high hr motor the reason being the liners are worn. the gasket seals on them. why pull the motor to rebuild?? if the rear seal is not leaking and the crank is fine do an inframe. they are an easy motor to do. what makes you think the gasket is bad??? as far as the head goes that would need to go to a machine shop to be surfaced and grind the valves. and all this is just part of owning equipment    it all breaks

[millcreek40]

I say head gasket because it's building pressure in the radiator. Not sure of hrs. No  coolant in the oil. I had a  mechanic look at it today. He said head gasket. I am not a mechanic & don't pretend to be. Lol. Motor does have some blow by but I had a cat with a lot of blow by,it was still running great when I sold it

[snowstorm]

it may be head gasket if its making pressure in the coolant. call deere and price liner kits gaskets and maybe rod bearings depending on what they look like have the head done and you will have a new motor. i would buy deere parts

[North River Energy]

Condolences on that. >:(  Some people like to use the rationale of 'buyer beware' as a license to steal.

[treeslayer2003]

it may be head gasket if its making pressure in the coolant. call deere and price liner kits gaskets and maybe rod bearings depending on what they look like have the head done and you will have a new motor. i would buy deere parts

i did mine with deere parts. it didn't cost any more than after market if you buy the whole kit. i had one tiny pinhole in a liner that filled the base with coolant over night. good thing i check oil every morning.
i agree, they are easy to inframe.

[lopet]

Years ago I worked part time for a guy who just bought a older 440B. Same story, it came off the truck and he did a few hitches, getting hot and losing power, it kept stalling on him, changed the fuel pump,but that wasn't the problem .  He ended up having it rebuilt, was around 4K.
Thought that wasn't that bad.
I bought mostly used except a very few items.   Made my fair share of mistakes, but also made some pretty good deals. I think it evens out at the end.

[Spartan]

Welcome to the club.  There are reasons people sell their stuff.  I kinda got burned on a "woods ready" skidder too.
Pull the head and look at everything you can, do what you need to to get it making money.  Put as little into it as possible nothing more.  It doesn't have to be perfect it just has to work.  About the time you rebuild the trans, or engine especially if it doesn't  really need it, the hyd. pump will fail, or you'll lose a ring gear.  Don't play the fearful precautionary game.  If you are not a mechanic, and you don't plan on learning, be prepared to pay through the nose for everything.

If he told you it was woods ready, and it wasn't, more stuff will show up.  You do not want to be another 20K in debted to this thing do you?
Fix what breaks when it breaks.  and not much more than regular maintenence.

That's just my .02 as an owner operator on a budget.  I could write a book on all the stuff mine needs, but, it still pulls wood til the end of the day.

Make sure there's no oil in the coolant and rule out an oil cooler failure.  (if it has one, not sure on the deeres)

[millcreek40]

In the two hitches I did pull with it. I have yet another question.  If you are in first gear pulling a decent hitch up a steep hill . Say half throttle  the tires would stop turning and the machine would sto. Step on the throttle hard & it would spin.  Is something slipping ?  Just seems to me if the clutch is  disengaged it should be spinning or stall.  Not sure on the power shift

[donny hochstetler]

it should stall the engine one way to check the clutches   set the brakes start in your higher gears put in gear if the brakes hold it should stall the engine be sure n use the clutch to do this these 540s are good skidders if they are right you will run circles around the jack on decent ground the jack might b more stable when it gets rough but its all in knowing how b sure n watch the diff lock when pulling heavy in a turn in a straight no prob  in a turn drop your load n winch up to it keep your wheel seals lubed up

[millcreek40]

If it doesn't stall it ( it didn't). Would it be the cluch or the clutch pack in the transmission  good thing I reread before I posted. *DanG auto correct had a couch pack lol.

[Maine logger88]

Sorry to hear of your bad luck some people have no conscience. It is most likely the transmission clutch packs slipping the clutch you push with your foot is hydraulic. It's possible that your regular clutch could be slipping but unlikely as it isn't used and is constantly engaged unless the cold start lever is pulled up. The first thing I would do is pull the filter on the side of the Trans then in behind is a cover with 2 (I think been awhile) bolts take that out and there is a screen if that gets plugged it will slip then clean the screen and re install. Make sure to drain the oil before removing the filter. As far as being less stable I have a 225 and a 540b the 540 isn't as tippy as it feels just you sit up Higher so you feel it more when you go over stuff. It takes a lot to actually tip one over

[millcreek40]

Thank you. I will give it a try.  I think it's going to rain tomorrow   So probably won't get to it till Friday

[donny hochstetler]

if I'm not wrong there are two clutch paks the first four gears are on one and the upper four gears are the other if the first four slip and the upper gears would stall the engine would mean the pak for the lower gears is bad also wana add as an encouragement get it right n don't abuse it I think you will like it b sure n load them back tires or you will need clean underware daily but with back tires loaded they are a very nimble machine once you r up to the diff lock you will like it they climb very well especialy with chains

[millcreek40]

Well I got the new head gasket set from Deere. Also a water pump rebuild kit. The water pump has some play in it. My guess is he ran it low on  coolant and got it hot. It has a upper noise in the head area. Going to have to rip into it and see what we find. Ever buy something you wish you never saw?  Lol

[stihltoomany]

If it doesn't stall it ( it didn't). Would it be the cluch or the clutch pack in the transmission  good thing I reread before I posted. *DanG auto correct had a couch pack lol.
Sounds like tractor type set up, might want to check the hyd pressure for the transmission. Low pressure would allow the clutches to slip. As mentioned filters a good idea. Try everything before diving into the transmission, gets pricey very quickly. The clutch on a powershift is just releasing the pressure on a clutch pack in the transmission. As mentioned above the dry clutch is only for cold starts. Usually never a problem.  GOOD LUCK

[Nemologger]

I still have my jack. Good thing. I didn't get to run the Deere much but I don't think I would have  dared to put it on the steep hill I was on today. The Deere looks nice sitting on the landing. Just not sure what to do with it

I've had Jacks before...ran a lot of them. I'd  put my 440d on any slope a jack would climb.