Red Oak for Horse Stalls

[WV Sawmiller]

   If it were me and you offered me WO instead of RO for this purpose I would be a real happy camper. Good luck.

[nativewolf]

Huh, 50% more expensive at a min.  I would increase the price on him.

[nativewolf]

If I had scaled the logs like Lynn asked about, I would have known they were white instead of red.

Ok, put another way, if they don't want it for the stalls sell it for trailer decking.  WO is just a more desirable wood and the RO market is flooded right now.  Pricing on RO has gone to heck in the log market and lumber is not much better.

[firefighter ontheside]

We know that white oak is more valuable in general, but the guy asked for red.  After talking to him last week I think he wants red because he feels it is better for stalls.  I will understand completely if he says no.  In that case, I will cut the white oak and sell to someone else.  There's a few real nice logs that I will cut for woodworking and the rest as something like trailer decking as native wolf suggests.  It's a shame I can only cut 10 feet long.

[Lawg Dawg]

It's a shame I can only cut 10 feet long.

No Kidding! If youre kinda handy with metal, you could slap an extension together right quick, but I think you can get an extension from WM for about $700.  If your sawing for $$$, can't not have it!

[firefighter ontheside]

Yeah, I'm not a metal guy.  That's why I do woodworking and sawing.  I have a friend though.  Eventually I will either buy one or have one made. Probably wait til I build a new home for the mill.  

[Lawg Dawg]

Bigger is better! As far as sawmill extenisons go!

[firefighter ontheside]

I would like to be able to cut 16' lumber.

[nativewolf]

I would like to be able to cut 16' lumber.

20' opens up lots of markets like trailer decking, beams, etc.  17' gets you to horse fencing.  Both of those are important for us but do require equipment to move the lumber, a bobcat with forks or tractor.  Roller tables are hugely helpful, don't have to be powered just have rollers.  

[Brad_bb]

Is the guy doing any metal framework around the wood?  That can help stop a lot of the chewing.  But even if horses only have access to the face of a board, they can still dig their teeth into a flat face if they are so inclined.  Not all horses chew, in fact, a lot don't.  If they have access to proper food, get exercise, and stimulation, less likely to be a chewer.  

[Don P]

Has anyone tried ailanthus? The bark is one of the most astringent, bitter things I've ever tasted. I mentioned that to a forester and he said "don't do that again, some people really react to it"... so not sure what the possible problems might be if they do crib on it.

[WV Sawmiller]

Don,

   We call it stink tree around here. I have not cut any for lumber. I did knock out power up and down the creek for several miles cutting a big one over the creek and crossing our power line. I was worried would get my fence like the one beside it had done. It seems to be pretty soft wood and I can't imagine it being much count. Plus did I mention it stinks?

[curved-wood]

My dog was eating the posts of the gazebo just for the fun of it. I put some Tabasco sauce on it...the dog stoped right away. I dont know if it could work for horses. Might be the opposite if the horses have some mexican genetic 

[Banjo picker]

Just like curved-wood's dog eating his gazebo...that 10 foot mill bed is gona eat your lunch if you are going to buy long logs.  If you could cut those white oak into trailer decking you could just about pay for your extension with that one whack of logs you bought.  Const. companys are regulary having to replace trailer decks.  I have one cut waiting on the customer to pick up now.  I hope you do well with your adventure.  Banjo

[firefighter ontheside]

Yeah, I have had to turn down one trailer decking job, because I couldn't cut long enough.  Also, I'm as busy as I want to be right now, so I don't need to expand too much.  That will just put me behind with jobs.  When I retire from the fire department, I may need to bring in more business.

[Don P]

The local welders need decking and can make extensions whenever you want to go that way.

They did a study at VA Tech on tree of heaven, turns out it is comparable to red oak in bending strength, stiffness and shear. Then they gave a bunch of wood to local cabinet and furniture makers who generally gave it high marks, comparing it to ash. I did saw up a few thousand feet of it a few years back. It has lots of tension but did make some nice lumber, the client used it for paneling and trim. I was delighted to get away from it after about a week of playing in that smell though!

[olcowhand]

I feel like we've gotten off in the weeds on this, and taken FireFighter with us.
FireFighter...
We don't have to dwell on every stable vise (cribbing) or horse that's chewed on some wood to give you
the advice you need. Everyone who has owned or been around horses can cite an example of how they can be destructive to a fence or a stall. The decision to expose these particular horses to a particular type of wood is your customer's decision.
Your customer has asked for Red Oak; in good faith, you negotiated for Red Oak, and got White Oak. You can present this fact to him (I personally feel that WO would be a better structural wood, but that's his choice...), and explain that the WO is more expensive. If he still wants RO, you still have all these wonderful ideas of what you can do with the WO- but you'll have to find him RO.
As stated earlier, some- or all of his horses may crib, chew, kick, eat, lick, rub or otherwise abuse the fence as they wish (or the boards will last for twenty- five years)- and he'll have to live with that..... after he pays you and drives away.
I hope this helps. You have a sale to make.
Steve

[firefighter ontheside]

Thanks olcowhand.  I've texted him with the WO option, but haven't heard back.  I will call him tomorrow and talk it over.  As you say,if he wants red oak, I will get him red oak.  He wasn't in a big hurry either.

[Brad_bb]

There is a moral obligation to inform the customer that some types of wood and even certain finishes are toxic to horses.  Advise them to research on their own.  

[firefighter ontheside]

This guy appears to be very experienced with horses and stalls for horses.  I think he has always used red oak and intends to continue to use RO.

[barbender]

Just tell him from everything you know, the qualities he values RO for are all surpassed by WO. It's not as brittle, is more flexible and it is more decay resistant as well. In the end, if he prefers RO, give him that. But if it is just that he's using RO because that's what he's always used, you may be able to persuade him to the superior qualities of WO.

[firefighter ontheside]

That's exactly what I intend to do.

[Lawg Dawg]

Or you could quarter saw or make live edge slabs from the WO, and turn a pretty good profit


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Over the past few years I've done more of this with my oak logs and less of the decking and stall board stuff...but I'll take it anyway it comes!

[firefighter ontheside]

I finally heard back from him that white oak was ok.  He said he did some research and found out WO was good for stalls.

I think I have more than enough logs and will save the nicer ones to make some woodworking lumber instead of horse stalls.  May even qs some of it.

[barbender]

Good deal!