Next year's wood.

[Kwill]

Been working on next year's wood today. Bout got the shed full. 

 

 

 

 Another tree and I think I will have it full

[WDH]

I have been working on next year's wood too, courtesy of Hurricane Michael . 

[Old Greenhorn]

You read my mind Kwill, I just started bucking last night, not a lot. I am still working on setting up a new 'processing area' down in the woods where I have the logs stacked. Last year I cut the trees, then skidded them into the shop driveway,bucked a few logs, then split and either piled or stacked, Then I would load the splits in the mule and move them to the house pile and stack. I needed to cut down on handling, so this year I will cut and split right where the logs are stacked and throw the splits onto a forwarding trailer as I go. When the trailer is full, I pull it up to the house and stack. I hope it will save me some time, and leave the mess in the woods. Last year my goal was to get it all done by June 1st. Let's see if I can beat that goal this year. I need more time at the mill, and I have some nice saw logs to pick up that will take some time. I have the forwarding trailer down there, and need to move down the splitter. Before all that, I have to re-stack the leftover wood from this year so I have a place for the new wood. Still looking to do 5 or more cords. I think I will end the season, which was a month longer than normal with just under a cord left over. But it's not done yet, so.... ANd this year is different. It used to be everything was firewood, now that I have the mill, I have to make choices, so I may not have enough logs to split 5 cords if much of it becomes saw logs.

[AZ_builder]

The highway dept. in AZ cuts and trims trees along the freeway and exits every year. They spread the small stuff but the bigger stuff gets cut to fireplace length. They stack it real nice and let it sit. I'm sure one of the workers is wanting to go back and pick it up but I usually grab it first. Public road way. I'll get 3-4 pickup loads a year of green mesquite. More than enough for our winters

[thecfarm]

Not fair!! I can only get to certain places on my land because of the snow. Where I made a trail before we got all the snow is easy. Now where I have not been takes a little time. Don't like to chatter.  Hard on equipment.

[Kwill]

This is all split red oak with a little post oak. No limbs or rounds. There is 4 rows. Not sure how much is in there but it will give me a good start next winter

[Old Greenhorn]

This is all split red oak with a little post oak. No limbs or rounds. There is 4 rows. Not sure how much is in there but it will give me a good start next winter

Easy to figure LxWxD in feet = cubic feet. 1 cord = 128 cubic feet. That's how I figure my work anyway.

[Old Greenhorn]

Taking a guess looking at the photo, if it is 5' wide, 6' high and 12' deep, that is 360' cubic feet, divide by 128 and you have 2.8 cords. Not a bad load.

[uplander]

 I have been too. Well three years from now that is. I have a fair bit to go but the ground has just been so wet to work on.

[hedgerow]

Its too muddy yet to get into were my logs are stacked to start processing wood. We had a fair amount of washing around here when we had rain and the the big snow melt. It washed the crossing out on the farm were my logs are stacked and the firewood equipment is store on that farm in a shed that I can't get to because of the crossing missing. It finally got dry enough yesterday to run the Cushman out in the CRP and pasture and start cutting small cedar trees by hand. Looks like we have more rain coming in tonight and then for a few days. We need some dry days so we can get the dozer, tractor and scraper out and get those wash outs fixed. We hope to be planting corn in two weeks. 

[John Mc]

Taking a guess looking at the photo, if it is 5' wide, 6' high and 12' deep, that is 360' cubic feet, divide by 128 and you have 2.8 cords. Not a bad load.

I was going to guess 4'w x 6'h x8'd = 1.5 cords. Hard to tell from those shots.

[lxskllr]

My next year's wood is the same as last year's wood for the most part. I started with 6+ cord of black oak, and still have 4+ cord left. In addition, I have a bit more than a cord of cherry I got from work this year. Been considering splitting more wood at work, and stacking it in the woods. Not sure I'm that motivated, and hot weather's just about here.

[Babylon519]

I go through about 7 bush cords a year keeping the house warm as well as the shop. Normally, I'm not too particular about the shop, but we inherited a 12-yr-old cat last fall, so I kept the shop a lot warmer than usual this winter. 
I was back to the woods last weekend, and in again tomorrow. The ash just keeps falling over. Last weekend, had to buck up a tree just to get in to the woods, and another huge one a hundred yards in. Because of the ash die-off, I can't remember the last time I had to fell a tree - the wind is doing the work for me. Anyway, 1 cord in the shed and 6 to go!
-  Jason

[GRANITEstateMP]

I try to stay at least a year ahead on wood, but man I'd rather stack it in a shed vs my pallet system.  Well, add another item to the wish list, 3 sided wood shed. ;D

[Old Greenhorn]

Well I got my new 'system' set up Saturday, but didn't have the whole weekend to work. I did two loops of bucking splitting, moving and final stacking, which put up just a little over half a cord. Not a lot, but I clearly see that I have eliminated a LOT of wasted handling time and effort. Hoping I get it done earlier than last year, which was an early record for me anyway. Yes, I would like a shed too, but that won't happen for a few years, at least, too many other projects.

[Randy88]

Worked about three half days in late march and got about 30 cords or more done for next winter, another weekend with the processor and we'll have more than enough to last all next winter and then some.   

[Old Greenhorn]

Well, I am fully into it now. I have around a cord and a half up. More distractions this year and less chance to cut and split after work, but I was out there stacking until about 9:30 last night. The trailer is clear again and ready to fill. Rained all night and still dripping. But I am going to hit it hard today. I have a bunch of logs spread around the woods to gather and buck as I have now just about finished off the logs I had stacked since last March. I am sorting out the saw logs from firewood as I go. The goal was to clean up the woods and it is really starting to show. I expect it will take another year or two to really get all the dead fall out.
 3 or so cords to go, then back to milling.

[Old Greenhorn]

Well, I don't have a processor. I use 4-5 cords a years. I have a splitter and a saw. My operation is under way and its all hand hand work, so it takes time. Today was a long day and my back is a bit sore. The photo is 8am today, it's all cut split and stacked now. I have run another group of logs through today also, bucked a few after that to end my day. On the one hand I think I am ahead of last year, on the other I feel like I am very slow. It is what it is. It sucks to get old, but I have to give it to my chiropractor that I haven't had this little working pain since I was 40. I hurt and ache right now, but I expect I will be pain free in the morning. I sure wish I could find a 16 year old kid in the neighborhood that wanted to work for a day or 5.



 

[John Mc]

I go through about 7 bush cords a year

What does a "bush cord" mean to you? I've heard several definitions from various people, but they don't agree or are not specific. One guys definition is a "face cord" (4'x8'), but that's meaningless unless they give you the length it is cut to as well.

[LeeB]

 It sucks to get old, but I have to give it to my chiropractor that I haven't had this little working pain since I was 40.

I'll take getting old over the alternative any day.

[lxskllr]

Well, I don't have a processor. I use 4-5 cords a years. I have a splitter and a saw. My operation is under way and its all hand hand work, so it takes time. Today was a long day and my back is a bit sore. The photo is 8am today, it's all cut split and stacked now. I have run another group of logs through today also, bucked a few after that to end my day. On the one hand I think I am ahead of last year, on the other I feel like I am very slow. It is what it is. It sucks to get old, but I have to give it to my chiropractor that I haven't had this little working pain since I was 40. I hurt and ache right now, but I expect I will be pain free in the morning. I sure wish I could find a 16 year old kid in the neighborhood that wanted to work for a day or 5.

People pay good money for that kind of workout. You're getting it free(nominal cost of fuel, chains, wear/tear), with a bonus of free energy on top of it  ;^)  It also isn't pointless work. When you leave your gym, something got done. Beats moving weight around a room for no purpose.


I'm not a fan of "alternative" wood measurement systems. They lack specificity, and in a sales environment, lead to fraud, and hard feelings. Cords, fractions thereof, or cubic feet are the only acceptable measures imo.

[scouter Joe]

A face cord is 4' high X 8' long X the length of the blocks .( A single row of cut blocks ) A bush cord is 4'high X 8'long X4' wide .(3 rows of 16" cut blocks )

[lxskllr]

I wasn't familiar with the term bush cord aside from seeing it printed every so often. It's another name for a statute cord.

[thecfarm]

Never heard of bush,face cords until on here.
Still not wood cutting for me,in the woods. I have some wood that I brought up before the warm up. I still have snow in the woods. Don't want to rut the ground up.

[John Mc]

A face cord is 4' high X 8' long X the length of the blocks .( A single row of cut blocks ) A bush cord is 4'high X 8'long X4' wide .(3 rows of 16" cut blocks )

So by your definition, a bush cord is the same as a cord. If heard others define a bush cord as being the same as a face cord, with no defined number for the length, and still others define it as meaning a face cord with specifically 16" length

[WV Sawmiller]

   I don't find the definition on line to verify it but my dad used to speak of a strand of wood and basically it was 1/3 of a cord. It was 4' X 8' X 16". Has anyone else ever heard of that measurement?

[WDH]

The official measurement for the Forestry Forum is a "whack". 

[Logger RK]

I like the term "Rick"

[WV Sawmiller]

   I think a rick and a whack may be the same only our members in the northern climes when talking in subzero weather could not be heard clearly with all the mufflers and such around their throats and people misunderstood them while our southern members, between bites of grits and boiled peanuts, clearly elucidated the word properly for all to hear. :D

[John Mc]

The official measurement for the Forestry Forum is a "whack".

Is there a defined about of wood in a whack, or is it more like "that pile sitting over there"?

  I don't find the definition on line to verify it but my dad used to speak of a strand of wood and basically it was 1/3 of a cord. It was 4' X 8' X 16". Has anyone else ever heard of that measurement?

That's a new one on me. I can see the logic of it: the strand being a single row of wood.

[LeeB]

Rick is the common volume in the area I live in and to my knowledge it should be 1/3 cord (a face cord), but As far as I can see it can be anything from a light pick up load to a well rounded bed full. Not sure how many loads actually measure out to the correct volume. I bought wood when we first moved to the area but rarely do so any more.

[jmur1]

You know it must be a serious question when the government steps in.  They also agree 48"x 48"x 8'  is the "cord"

https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/mc-mc.nsf/eng/lm03963.html

jmur1 

[Rebarb]

I finished nexted years wood 2 years ago.....I like staying several years ahead.

[Old Greenhorn]

I finished nexted years wood 2 years ago.....I like staying several years ahead.

The more I read things like this, the more I wish I could do it, But I would have to store it 'somewhere' and that is the issue. Best I can do is cut and stack logs ahead, then buck and split each year for what I need. No idea where I would stack and store 10-15 cords and then would still have to move it to the house each year. Good for you, I wish I could do that.

[John Mc]

I finished nexted years wood 2 years ago.....I like staying several years ahead.

The more I read things like this, the more I wish I could do it, But I would have to store it 'somewhere' and that is the issue. Best I can do is cut and stack logs ahead, then buck and split each year for what I need. No idea where I would stack and store 10-15 cords and then would still have to move it to the house each year. Good for you, I wish I could do that.

When I manage to get that far ahead, I drop the trees, winch them trailside, and cut and stack them there. I just lay a couple of poles down to stack them on to keep it up off the ground. When I have the space at home, I bring my splitter into the woods and split them right into the back of my trailer to haul them home (sometimes I'll load the rounds in the trailer, bring them home and split right onto my storage stacks).
It doesn't dry as quickly stacked in the woods as it does out in the open exposed to the sun & wind, but that is generally not a concern if I am that far ahead.

[Old Greenhorn]

When I manage to get that far ahead, I drop the trees, winch them trailside, and cut and stack them there. I just lay a couple of poles down to stack them on to keep it up off the ground. When I have the space at home, I bring my splitter into the woods and split them right into the back of my trailer to haul them home (sometimes I'll load the rounds in the trailer, bring them home and split right onto my storage stacks).
It doesn't dry as quickly stacked in the woods as it does out in the open exposed to the sun & wind, but that is generally not a concern if I am that far ahead.

Well, I am close to that now. I pile up the logs between seasons, then buck and split right into the trailer, forward to the house and stack. Maybe I should think about bucking them and stacking as you do. It adds a handling, but would look neater and give me a better idea of what I have. I am almost out of logs now and am cutting up the larger branches too good to pitch into the rot pile. It takes more time, but wood is wood. I am driving around through the woods picking up hitches of small trees or deadfall I had forgotten. This helps to clean things up too, so it goes slower, but the place looks nicer. I will probably wind up dropping another tree or two before my stacks are full this year. Good idea and stacking the rounds. they will split easier in a years time and dry faster once on the pile, plus I can pull the splitter right up to the round stack and keep 'moving on down the line'. 

[John Mc]

Well, I am close to that now. I pile up the logs between seasons, then buck and split right into the trailer, forward to the house and stack. Maybe I should think about bucking them and stacking as you do. It adds a handling, but would look neater and give me a better idea of what I have. I am almost out of logs now and am cutting up the larger branches too good to pitch into the rot pile. It takes more time, but wood is wood. I am driving around through the woods picking up hitches of small trees or deadfall I had forgotten. This helps to clean things up too, so it goes slower, but the place looks nicer. I will probably wind up dropping another tree or two before my stacks are full this year. Good idea and stacking the rounds. they will split easier in a years time and dry faster once on the pile, plus I can pull the splitter right up to the round stack and keep 'moving on down the line'.  

I figure that at least cutting to stove length and stacking helps it start drying, since the logs don't dry out much when in long lengths. It is one more handling, but stacking the rounds takes me less time than stacking the split wood (fewer pieces to handle), plus it gets things up off the ground. And your right, splitting from a stack of rounds is easier: start at one end of the stack, split till it's no longer an easy reach, pull ahead a bit and split some more. My wife also appreciates it when the mess from splitting is left in the woods, rather than up nearer the house.

[SwampDonkey]

I can't get at mine for another 3 weeks, the road is still snowed in and of course muck under it. Dries real quick though once the snow is off.

I don't need any equipment to bring it out except chain saw and wheel barrel or arm loads. It's within 200 feet of the road for most I would be cutting for the next 10 years. I'll have a 4 wheeler before then to go back deeper. I'm just cutting the pulp grade out. I burn anything. My experience is that it all makes good heat. ;D

[brianJ]

Speaking of next winter's heat,   How do you guys handling trees that have ants in them?   Do these ants only infest trees?   Are they an issue for the rest of the wood pile?   If you were buying firewood with ants would you feel cheated?

I sell 30 something ricks a year and have 3 years of inventory in various out door piles.   Nearly nothing gets stacked.  Not worth my time.

[Willbillys]

Speaking of next winter's heat,   How do you guys handling trees that have ants in them?   Do these ants only infest trees?   Are they an issue for the rest of the wood pile?   If you were buying firewood with ants would you feel cheated?

From my experience carpenter ants will move into rotting crevices of the log that already exist and clear some of the rotted wood out to make room, not consuming the wood.  I would assume the firewood you have was left on the ground and started to rot, but it's possible the majority of the cord doesn't have ants as they tend to stay clustered together. 
I disrupted a colony a couple weeks ago in a 6 year old ash log that had been flat on the ground and just yesterday I found some of the ants had relocated just 5 feet away to the small pile of short stickers I keep at the end of the mill tracks.  I did end up getting a couple decent pieces out of that ash log, though.


 

[Old Greenhorn]

Speaking of next winter's heat,   How do you guys handling trees that have ants in them?   Do these ants only infest trees?   Are they an issue for the rest of the wood pile?   If you were buying firewood with ants would you feel cheated?

I sell 30 something ricks a year and have 3 years of inventory in various out door piles.   Nearly nothing gets stacked.  Not worth my time.

I agree with WIllBillys, I get them in partially rotting wood from time to time as I am splitting mostly, or the bad spot in a tree I am bucking. When I split the wood and hit a nest or large group I throw those pieces on the side and hit them with a little ant killer or whatever I have around and leave them in the weather for a few days to kill the ants and let the poison dissipate. I keep them away from the other wood until I know they are clean. I got a bunch in some wood I got from an arborist last year, none made it to the woodpile. Ants in the pile will spread, more importantly, they may spread to the adjacent house wall. If I do (very rarely) find them in the wood stack, they get removed immediately to the burn pile away from the house and stack. Carpenter ants can make a serious mess around these parts if they get hold and I attack with all my resources as soon as discovered. I've already had them in a house ceiling once, it was ugly. I killed thousands of them in one evening.
 And yeah, it I bought wood and some of it was full of carpenter ants, I would be more than pithed off.

[SwampDonkey]

I leave anything with galleries in it out in the woods. Don't need those critters around. ;D

[jimbarry]

We usually have a year reserve but we burned through it this year. We have logs cut over a year ago, so we need to get splitting for it to dry well over this summer. 1-1/2 cords done the other day. Need about 12 cords for this coming year and to prep for the next year. 



 

[Old Greenhorn]

Well I am coming up on closing this chore out for the year. Cut split and stacked another cord and a half today and figure I have about 1 cord maybe a little more, or 2+ loads to go. Got a surprise blow down last week that gave me 5 saw logs and some firewood, dragged some logs from odd places I had left them and keep finding a few more, they are getting smaller though. I may have to take one more tree, but I had a few standing dead ready to go.
 Here's the blow down load:


 

And here is the first load coming up early this morning. 


 

Then I drug up some more logs and bucked them up for a second load.


 


I ran out of energy to stack the 3rd load which was cut and split last year, but VERY green white birch. So the Grandsons showed up and we put them to work while I took a sit. My wife supervised and yes, these boys stacked up a half cord for me. The oldest is 6 years old. These boys do like to work though and stacked the whole trailer. When their Dad picked them up, they were asleep in his truck within 5 minutes after they left, I call that a winner all around.



 

 I need about a cord and a half to finish up and think I will have it done 2-3 weeks earlier than I did last year, which is good because I have milling work to do, which I did not have last year.

[Old Greenhorn]

Yeah, its getting there. I am bushed after yesterday, but I pulled a couple of turns up the hill for bucking. Raining off and on, but I have saws to sharpen first and fence posts to make for the wife and the raspberries. Always sumptin', right?


 

 

[Old Greenhorn]

Probably the only day this week it won't be raining after work and the wife is working to Polls for a special county election so I cut, split, and loaded the stuff I dragged up Sunday. I can stack it another night in the rain if needed. This is load number [I have no flippin' idea], well, I lost count but somewhere between 8 and 12.



 

 Getting near the end goal, but I am getting tired of doing firewood. Same thing every free evening and most of the weekend. I still have some deadfall to collect and buck into rounds, but I can spread that out between other tasks. That stuff will be for the following year. My cleanup work is progressing and I am running out of easy kills for firewood. I am ready to get back to setting up the mill area and make some drying racks and I have some logs to go gather across town that might take more than a weekend for an old dude without any heavy equipment. A windblown 30" DBH EWP.

[SwampDonkey]

Been a good drying week, might be able to get a load of wood Saturday if the road is free and dried up.

[Old Greenhorn]

It's not really drying as well as I would like here, every time it starts to dry, it rains again, but light spring rains mostly. Enough to keep things wet. However the ground water levels are dropping, so it is firming up a bit. I had stacked my last load Wednesday night and am now out of wood to process again. Last night I took a look in the lowest swamp which has been unworkable since January. I haven't done too much work down there, wet most of the year. I had marked a bunch of junk over a year ago, dead standing and mostly very tricky hazard trees. I was waiting until I felt up to it and the ground was a bit firmer. Well one came down in the wind storm 3 weeks ago and broke. About 70' of ash, turns out there is a BUNCH of solid wood in it. I winched out 3 good logs last night, about 20" x 12', I still have the butt log to drop (easy), and pull out. I haven't even looked over the top because it's in a tangle, but that should have some good wood in it too if I can get it out.
 Every time I think I need to cut a tree I seem to stumble on another one. It never seems to end. I believe these logs will finish my season of splitting and stacking. I will stack logs and bucks rounds for next year, but splitting and hauling are done. I think I hear the mill calling for me.

[petefrom bearswamp]

My son and I got about 10 percent of our needed supply out in the winter.
Been too wet to get anymore out.
We used to stay 2 years ahead but not lately.

[Babylon519]

I go through about 7 bush cords a year

What does a "bush cord" mean to you? I've heard several definitions from various people, but they don't agree or are not specific. One guys definition is a "face cord" (4'x8'), but that's meaningless unless they give you the length it is cut to as well.

My understanding is that a face cord measures 1' x 4' x 8' = 32 cu ft. A bush cord - or full cord - is 4 face cords and measures 4' x 4' x 8' = 128 cu ft.
-   Jason

[SwampDonkey]

It's dry here already, so I am going to check the woodlot access to get some firewood tomorrow.

My face feels like I walked across the desert in a dry wind. Red nose to go with it. :D

[Old Greenhorn]

Well that's it, I am calling it 'done'. Brought in my last two loads today in spite of the rain.
Here is the last short load going in the stack.


 

And then I started the next task, opening the mill. I got the tarp up so I can piddle along tomorrow in the rain we will surely have.



 
 Anxious to get back to the mill work. WHen I got it in mid October, I had not time to really set myself up. I got the mill set and started making lumber to build the shed. I just got that done on the very day the snow started for good in January. Now is time to build some racks and really figure things out. I have about 10 logs in the cue and next weekend should be 'opening day', just hoping to get things running and checked out tomorrow. But the firewood is DONE! I will add mill scraps to it over the summer, assuming summer does actually arrive.

[SwampDonkey]

Today I cut, split at the stump, loaded the truck by wheel barrow and stacked it in the racks at home. Two loads, which worked out to ~45 cu feet a load. My truck has a 6' bed and is a Tacoma, so 3 loads makes a cord. I try to stuff it full and I have a cap on the truck. But that isn't hard to fish out. I just use a garden hoe to pull the wood within reach. Nothing to it. The road was snow free and firm to drive on. Like I said earlier, ground dries up quick here once the snow leaves.

[SwampDonkey]

Picked up a new Husqvarna 555 at the shop for the firewood. I have not had good luck with them saws with a lot of plastic behind the bar and clutch. The old hermit in his videos mentions they are too much trouble for him to. He has an older Rancher 55, which is similar to the 555 I think. He put a wrap around bar on his, but I don't need anything like that. Big difference in price from a plastic 55 (Not the Rancher) to the 555, but now I have metal.

Apparently anything with a primer bulb is not made in Sweden.

[crazy4saws]

Great thread, seeing everyone's progress and storage methods is interesting. 3 years ago neighbors woods was logged, alot of RO, WO, ash, walnut and hickory left overs on the landing and the big stuff I dont mind. Brother and I are finally getting to it for next years wood. Hopefully we can get ahead on the following years wood too. Our woods is full of dead elm and ash, punky stuff.  So the good stuff is set back for colder weeks.   

 

 

[Pine Ridge]

I put 10 big pickup loads in the woodshed this Friday and Saturday, I figure about 5 cords. I'm thankful Sundays are a day of rest, I'm pooped, got home after church and I've not done much of anything. I've got about 4 more loads to haul in, I'll try and get them after work this week. I burned between 6 and 7 cords from October 14th to mid April this past year which was the first winter with the fire chief outside wood furnace, the 4 loads I've got left in the woods should be enough to get me through next winter.

[SwampDonkey]

I've got 6 more pickup loads I figure. I cut, split, haul and pile as I go, so two loads is all day because it has to be gathered up and brought to the pickup as well. I only burn one tank of saw gas per load and only 3 miles away. 3 loads to a cord, short box and a cap on the truck. Tacoma pickup.

[Pine Ridge]

Swamp donkey I've been working on this wood off and on since last fall, cut and split and stacked in the woods across the county road from the house. I wish I could just go cut a load and haul it straight to the woodshed, but I have to pick carefully when to haul it in so I don't make ruts in the yard, my wife has a fit if I try to haul it in when the ground is wet and soft.

[SwampDonkey]

Yep, I hear ya. We each get'r done in our own way.

We always just called it old cow pasture around here, but the ground is firm enough that the ruts might be 2" in max. when soft. Full of rocks here like gravel, so less compression than pure silty loam. ;D

I'll be hauling 2 more loads in today. Carpenters are coming today to start garage, so gotta hang around anyway, might as well cut firewood before and after we meet up. On the wet side today, but just spotty showers. I'd be wet on a dry day within an hour anyway. This time of year, no rain gear, too hot doing the grunt work. ;D

[jerry sundberg]

Wife and I finished wood processing last Tuesday. 14 cords Aspen, Balsam, and any thing that gets in the way of the chain saw.

[SwampDonkey]

Yep, I burn anything to. My grandfather had camps in fir/ white birch forest and that is what got burnt. Never froze.  ;D The resin in those fir blisters burns like kerosene, and it spits out on your glasses too when handling green. :D

[Al_Smith]

I only burn about 4-4 1/2 cords a year .I don't even fire the stove up before it gets in the 30's .I suppose I've got 6 cords stacked and an another 6 or 8 that needs split and stacked to clean it all up. I've got two sugar maples I dropped about two weeks ago that needs bucked ,split,stacked to get them out of my way .Might get on it this afternoon,might not .Retired now I can do anything I want when I want . 8)

[SwampDonkey]

I only burn about 4-4 1/2 cords a year .I don't even fire the stove up before it gets in the 30's .

Yep, but that's nine months up here across the snow line. So I need double that. But this year I only plan on burning about 5 cord and electric furnace for 4 of them months. I found that it only costs about $100-108 total on the electric bill on them months you just need a nudge now and again. Mid Nov to Mid March is when it is real cold up here.

[Al_Smith]

I have a geothermal .It's relatively inexpensive but it's certainly not free .If it's much above 30 the wood stove will about run you out unless you really choke it.I suppose my lady and I could sit around in our undies but old people don't look so good doing that .
I suppose my electric bill is higher than most but it's a total electric home with an aerobic sewer  system which that alone is 25-30 bucks a month .I just shut up and pay the bill .

[Pine Ridge]

2 more loads hauled in and stacked after work this evening, wood shed is full and I'm stacking it outside now, 2 more loads left in the woods to haul in and I'm done.

[SwampDonkey]

Al, we had a heat pump in Grafton, 2 in 17 years actually. And they are not efficient below 20F in our climate. So the backup and supplementary heat was electric furnace and a gas fireplace in case of power outtage (was hardly ever used). In our case they cost more overall than a wood furnace/electric combination. $400 electric bills in cold months. So if you burn a full cord that is $250-300 in wood. The only thing to gain is convenience that I could see. Heat pumps nowadays are over $10,000 installed, not including the duct work. My combo furnace here is around $5000 and will last years longer. And the electric side fulfills the convenience factor.

[Al_Smith]

The difference  between an air to air heat pump and a geothermal is the temperature on the gas exchange .For example in my case the water is 53.9 degrees F year round  .They will work in Alaska or Florida just as well .You have to size them according to the most load though ,heat or cool .I installed my own including making the duct work from galvanized sheet metal .My first one all told was $ 3400 .It did not have the correct heat exchanger and was a used unit which I refurbished and I only got 9 years out of it.My second one was brand new and cost $3400 .I did have to replace the compressor due to my own fault after about 8 years .It's a long story why it failed .I do my own work so looking for help is a non issue on this stuff for me .

It's odd this year as it  was only yesterday I shut the heat down .I hate cold .I'd never make it in Canada or Alaska ----whimpy,whimpy ,whimpy .

[gspren]

  I don't normally cut firewood this time of year but an extra strong wind knocked some trees down in my yard and into the soybean fields so since they need cut anyway I'm cutting cherry and maple. The soft maple isn't one of my favorite woods but if I have to cut it to get it out of my way I am going to burn it.

[Al_Smith]

With the mention of wind I could heat the house on just wind blown trees ,limbs  and tops about 1 out of 5 years just from stuff on the ground .Some years you have more than others  .Neat in a way ,most you don't even have to split .It's all hard woods and it all burns .As it is I might only gather up a face cord or so a year but it's every where .

[SwampDonkey]

I've been cutting trees from Arthur and any poor formed stuff and fir with evidence of something going on in the trunk. But I also had to thin a couple fir out to, growing too close in a patch. You can thin this stuff for ever and never worry about wood supply for heat. I have a nice 20" white birch with a big crown right beside the road. I'm not cutting that, even though there would be a lot of firewood in it. I have lots of low grade that can be cut, so I don't need to cut good stuff to burn. I don't mind cutting 6" hardwood, I don't have to split it. But with the Collins and being fresh cut, one crack and she's split. :D Maple grows real thick/close up here. There's probably 40 cords of aspen on the ground rotten from Arthur, will make new soil to feed the worms now. All I can get are the leaners that still have some leaves. :D Aspen can't take high winds. Never hardly touched the softwoods. Maple after 5 years would be full of toad stools to, but none of them blew down, no big ones around yet.


I've got about 3 more pickup loads to gather up.

[Allar]

I've been fairly busy with next year's firewood aswell.
Been splitting the firewood that i cut during this winter, made a quick video aswell.

My woodpile/splitting area - Next years firewood - YouTube

[DWyatt]

I normally start cutting firewood about a week after it gets cold enough for heat but this year I am turning over a new leaf........ or avoiding other projects, however you look at it.

The rounds are about 20-24" long for a size reference.


 

Yesterday I took the time to cut one of the two remaining piles from when I cleared the area in the woods to build my house. It was 85ish° and I inherited the gene of excessive sweating from my dad. I was soaked from head to toe after two tank of fuel in my old 039 and I remembered why I cut wood in the winter :D

[SwampDonkey]

I cut most of mine in May and I checked the moisture in the stack outside in my wood racks under the porch, 20%. I find the meter is not accurate when trying to check through bark, it is not the same density as inside wood.

[Al_Smith]

I made the mistake last winter of not tarping down a few cords .Usually not a problem because you just blow the snow off .However because of the freezing,thawing it didn't work out well,soggy wood ,what a joy that is .I won't make that mistake again .

[SwampDonkey]

Oh for sure. I always have my wood out of the weather here. Get a lot more heat from it.

I've got a small quantity of 6 year old dry wood in the barn which will top out the firewood supply for this winter and burn it first. I have some 2-1/2 year old wood at the back of the wood room in the basement that is around 10%.

[DWyatt]

I have only been burning wood for 5 or 6 years, first at Mom and Dad's house then when I moved out dad told me to take the OWB with me. I cut the wood for him and he said when I left he was never cutting wood again. I am going to try to get most of what I need for this winter cut early and let it dry some. Normally I cut and split as I need it, hopefully cutting early will help me burn a little less if the wood is partially dry.

All of the stuff in those two piles has been down for 2.5 years although not drying much in log form.

[Al_Smith]

It would take forever to dry out in the log .Fact takes a long time to dry out in rounds for that matter .

[DWyatt]

I'm hoping to have all of those rounds split and stacked by the end of next week, along with that other pile of logs. That should give them 3-4 months to dry out. Not ideal for many people who preach burning seasoned wood, but it's a hell of a lot better than 5 minutes of dry time I figure.

[Al_Smith]

Something like ash does not take long .Oak takes a while .

[Randy88]

Al, with your geothermal, do you use gas or electric to heat the water from the 50's to room temp or does it use the heat off the pumps, how does your system work?  

Around here there are several systems and different ways they do geothermal, from what we can tell, since nobody talks once the system is in, most are not happy with geothermal, due to the monthly bill they have and also what it costs to keep them going on repairs.      

A local church put geothermal in and once it was done, since it is a church, everyone knows what the monthly costs were, to sum it up, nobody was happy, when you take into account the cost upfront, plus the monthly electric bill, and the maintenance costs to keep it going, that church was very unhappy and the last I knew, they were considering taking it all back out again and it didn't help much when electric rates took yet again another hike in price.      Theirs takes the heat off the compressors, plus electricity to heat the water to room temp.  

[Randy88]

We stack logs in piles for up to four years before we cut them up, so basically it dries in log form before its cut is how we do it, which also helps to get the bark off which in turn eliminates most of the debris in the bark, like mud, rocks and whatever so cutting is really nice.

[Al_Smith]

I have an electric hot water heater .However my lady friend who now resides with me had a heat pump type of water heater which is supposed to be more energy efficient .
Under high water usage the unit  used resistance heat like a conventional water heater .Under moderate usage the heat pump could keep up with the demand .I'm not so certain  if the increased cost of  installation was justified in energy costs .
My first geo- thermal had the option for a water heater ,my present unit  does not .

[Al_Smith]

Some of those so called "incentives " for energy savings are a con game promoted by the electric  companies .They usually promote this stuff by suggesting local contractors to do the purchase and installation .
In my case ,big deal as it was supposed to be I get a huge savings of one lousey dollar a month of which they were reluctant to do because I do my own work .Nothing but hype and hoopla .

In my case I really have little choice other than electric .Natural gas would cost me over $7000 just to get it here .Propane which I call profane can be a rip off if you don't own the tanks .They can really turn the screws and have to me in the past .
If and I repeat  if I install a stand by generator in case I want to spend the winter months in a warmer area other than the frozen tundra of northern Ohio I will own the tanks  .Get me once,your fault,twice my fault .

[Randy88]

A friend of mine is an electrician and fixes a lot of the geothermal systems.    He does nothing but complain about them, I know its with certain brands having certain issues, but his advice was to set them up for cooling only, the heating side was too expensive in repairs and upkeep, plus the cost of electricity on top of that.    He told me to to be on the low side to figure at least 500 a month on electricity alone for the house, plus that much or more for upkeep and repairs, and on top of that, to avoid certain brands completely, can't recall off the top of my head which one's, its been about 10 years since we talked about it in depth, but I know his opinion hasn't changed because he was still grumbling this past winter about fixing them. 

A cousin of mine put geothermal in her house about 10 years ago now, the last we talked her electric bill was over 600 a month year round pretty much was all she said, and I'm sure with higher electric rates, its much higher now.  

I'm in a rural area so everyone has their own LP tanks anyhow, and I just booked LP for this year, its a buck a gallon, can't recall the last time its been that low, must be almost 20 years or so since it was that cheap, so many are putting in gas furnaces again, even many with geothermal are going back to gas in  order to cut prices on a monthly basis. 

[SwampDonkey]

Up here, wood and electric backup is far cheaper than any gas as well as any heat pump. The only thing to go wrong on a wood furnace is a limit control or motor, both less than $200 and rarely go out. I've been around them for a long time. I clean the stove and pipes all winter, and there isn't really anything to clean. Wouldn't fill more than cup full from 36 feet of chimney. In the baffles is hardly anything, I brush and vacuum it out. Only down side, if there is one, is wood handling. I don't know that we burn less wood overall if we was to burn straight wood, but we can by just using more electric. From what I have seen so far with mine it's no more than what wood would cost me. Some day I'll just have a cord for backup in power outages and flip the switch otherwise. I have seen more schemes over the years than I care to witness again. :D

[Al_Smith]

Something is amiss with those reports of geo-thermals .If I don't fire the stove my winter bill is about $300 a month .With the stove fired up about half that It's  a 5 ton unit,Water Furnace ,62,000 BTU .Brick house,single story,Anderson windows ,well insulated 2100-2200 sq feet .Summer cooling around $150-200 a month .

With any heat pump you have to size the unit to the largest demand you need,heating or cooling .Make certain you have enough air flow over the coil .My house if I figured it correctly has a 30,000 BTU heat lose per hour which in theory would be around 30 minute run time per hour  .It 's about that when I timed it under cold conditions,zero for example .

With all that you have to factor in the duct work design too .If it doesn't distribute the air correctly it won't cool or heat properly .You need to insulate the duct work too ,much better than gas heat . You have to keep in mind the average heat discharge of most heat pumps is 94 to 96 degrees .Not the higher heat of a gas furnace .Bare uninsulated duct work you are heating the basement or crawl space before it ever gets into house so it could run forever until the rooms heat up .Mean while the electric meter is spinning like a top .

[Randy88]

Just a few thoughts, first off much colder here than where you are, next is electric rates are higher here would be a guess, another is the size of the house and its location, I'm thinking these are much larger houses if your considering a furnished basement and a heated garage along with a new constructed house, meaning no tree's of any size to protect the houses from wind, couple that to more than one winter's killing off the tree's, so even today there are no tree's of any size to protect the house.

I don't know of anyone with that low of electric rate on any house, winter or summer and that's with gas or wood heat, certainly not electric or geothermal.    My folks have a larger new house than you have, theirs is 1400 feet on the main floor and the same footage in the basement and with central air in the summer, its still more than 200 a month, with gas heat in the winter he's doing more than that plus 1000 plus gallons of gas each winter, if its really cold he might be as high as 1400 gallons of gas.    Prices vary on LP, about ten years ago it spiked to over 6 bucks a gallon, then dropped into the 4 dollar range and now its down to a buck a gallon.    

In the old two story hotel of a house I rented for a few years, in the month of October alone we burned 800 gallons of LP in one month and it wasn't even cold that month, at 6 bucks a gallon, I started to burn wood, I was told to heat that hotel to mid 60's during the winter, 4-5000 gallons of LP wasn't uncommon a winter.    In the house before that one, where we lived for 18 years another two story house, dated back into the late 1800's and in poor condition, used over 2500 gallons of lp per winter pretty steadily.      I've never lived in any house that ever had any electric lower than 300 a month winter or summer, with the rate hikes now, they'd be much higher still.   

Where I own now, the house, shop and farm are all together, so I have no idea what the house itself is for electric, but would guess it close to 300 or more a month year round and we heat only with wood for both the house and shop, no other heat source even for a back up.   

My electrician buddy has told me on my size of house, my electric rate would easily double with geothermal and for heating he recommended using gas heat to bring the water temp up to room temp, not electric, but that was almost 10 years ago we considered it, now for a backup heat source and my kids all gone so nobody to fire the wood furnace multiple times a day if we're not here, I've thought I might need a backup heat source, so have started asking questions again.   I just got the price of a new gas furnace, but haven't asked how the geothermal has changed in the last decade, certainly want nothing to do with electric heat of any sort, my pocket book couldn't take that, I priced electric radiant heaters in the shop and just going off some charts and comparing it to btu conversions from wood heat, the salesman told me to forget electric altogether and to go with new LP gas heaters.    Right now we're hooking up a new waste oil burner for the shop to aid in heating it, which might help out somewhat in really cold weather.   

[Al_Smith]

Well you have to consider it all. The big farm house I grew up in was made in 1919 no insulation and 2800 sq feet .In the open.When I was a kid I shoveled every ounce of the 12 to 14 ton  of stoker coal it took to heat the place .After my dad got off some money and insulated it that was nearly cut in half .When the last kid moved out he had gas installed .

My house has radiant ceiling heat and using just that the bill could be $400 a month or more .I can heat my house with the wood stove but it has to be fired hard .Glass front LOPI circa mid 80's with a blower rated at 55,000 btu .The last few years have not been so cold and being surrounded by 100 foot oak trees and dense woods to the back it's sheltered from the wind so that helps too .
I spent the best part of one summer installing the geo .I had someone else design the duct work but I made and installed it because there is no commercially made stuff large enough .26 sheets of 24 gauge sheet metal all hand bent,insulated all joints sealed,in a crawl space  .I think the blower is 2600 CFM,3/4 HP .The air flow is just about the same on all the registers so my bud did a good job figuring it out .

When the price of gas climbed into outer space a few years ago my renter in a 1200 sq ft house had higher utility bills than myself .Frame house,well insulated new furnace ,in town .So it's kind of apples to oranges when you cut to the chase .BTW if I wanted natural gas just to get it here would be over $7000 .I don't think that's going to happen . ;)
If in the future I install a stand by generator so I might enjoy a more warmer winter in the south  I will own the tanks for propane .I've dealt with those pirates before on leased tanks,never again .

[Al_Smith]

Let me add something else .When I retired last summer one of my pensions,IBEW international was based on 46 years of service .Add my navy time as a tech on nuke subs that's 50 years  doing electrical work .I added some stuff to the gep thermal .One being an over run timer for the blower to evacuate all the hot air from a run and an over run for the water .Low temp shut down for heat on the discharge water and high temp on the cooling  cooling to protect the compressor and heat exchanger .

Why Water Furnace hadn't thought of it I'll never know but I did .I did however cook a compressor due to my own fault forgetting about a second set of air filters I neglected to change .Took me a few weeks to even find another replacement because it's an R22 system .I've got a Magnehelic differential pressure gauge now to prevent that .It's worked out for me all things considered with the options I have .

Another thing .Because the unit is sized for heat it's over sized for cooling .I just cut the fan speed down to get a longer run time thus to dehumidify the air more .It doesn't raise the water temp that much but is not as efficient of course .It's a compromise I guess . 

[Corley5]

  Our neighbors had a Well Connect system put in last fall.  Their house is a typical old farm house but it's been well insulated and had the windows updated.  As part of the plan with the electric co-op the new system is on a separate meter.  Their highest bill for the system last winter for heat was 109.00.  Cooling isn't a real issue here.  Usually just a handful of days a summer.  They also got a 30% tax credit.
  I'm tired of feeding an OWB and we're looking at our options.

[Al_Smith]

I'm using a well too .A ground loop in this part of the country requires something like 600-700 foot per ton .My goodness I can't see trenching up about a mile of ground .I do know a person who has a loop in a pond that works well .
Now in all this in my case I know how they work and do all my own work so I have no bills regarding maintaining this thing .The people who do this kind of work try to say it's rocket science but it is not .It's just water cooled refrigeration .Depending on which direction the reversing valve is set it either heats the air coil or cools the coil .That's it in a nut shell .

[Randy88]

How does the well connect thing work, around here they either do loops, or drill a dedicated well just for the geothermal.    

[Al_Smith]

A well works very well .As it worked out I have two wells .One is 180 feet deep,in the limestone .The other is around 110 in a vein of pea gravel .Both are high producing .Water source is not a problem in this part of the county .The water temp is 53.9 degrees  year round .
You have to remember that well drillers get paid by the foot .The deeper well was drilled with a rotary ,the second well ,in the gravel  was drilled by a thumper .On the second well which I had drilled I knew and the driller knew the water was above the rock .He just thumped it down until he hit a good steady flow .Testing with a 1 HP pump he could not draw it down .Both wells have 1/2 HP Goulds pumps at around 11-12 gallon per minute .The geo uses around 4.5-5 gallon per minute .I could probably throttle it down some but I just left well enough alone .I'd rather have too much than not enough .

My first unit which was used had a modulating  water valve that worked off of compressor head pressure .It was supossed to be more efficient on water usage .On my second unit I just used a throttling valve and using discharge water temp set it accordingly so on heat it didn't drop below 40 degrees and I think  80 degrees on cooling .It worked .
I'm somewhat of an electrical savant and have more safety devices and monitoring devices  on this thing than the factory designed it for .That last unit cost me $3400 and I want to get some mileage out of it Rather to be safe than sorry .
Now having side tracked on this thing almost forever I still cut firewood and have plenty of it .It's a bit warm out at the moment to do much of that this time of year .

[Randy88]

Far different than here, around me the wells range from 400 to over 600 feet deep, mostly to get to St. Peters sand and we're running if I recall around five hp or so on the pumps, to have a well drilled, you in that 25k plus range.    Most have about 30 feet of water in them running 1.5 inch pipe, just the pipe and pump this last time around cost me over 7k if I recall, the pump lasted about two months then needed to be new again, it was under warranty, so the cost was nothing on the second one, but we did it on the coldest day of the year, think the wind chill that day was nearly 40 below.

The last place I lived had two wells, both over 400 feet and really big pumps in them, since I left they were both abandoned and the owner drilled a new well and I think he went to two inch pipe to water all his livestock.    

There's a well near me about a half mile away, that's over 800 feet with eight inch pipe in that one for a packing plant's secondary well, their primary well is much larger still.    

Also might help explain how cheap your electric costs are to a certain extent.  

The loop systems they put in here, they did a trench and lay the waterline in loops the whole length of the trench overlapping, then cover them up, a part of a day their done, so in a 500 foot long trench, they might have quite a few thousand feet of pipe laid.   The well versions, they don't use antifreeze, they dig the well and run a loop of pipe down, with a u on the bottom and back up to the top, so they circulate the water instead of through the ground loops in the yard, down into the well so its in the water and back up out again, sounds like your using the water itself sucked out of the well, and what just dumping it when done back into the drain in the basement??

[Al_Smith]

You have to remember where I'm at,85 miles  south of Lake Erie .This area  has huge underground aquifers .The water discharge is just dumped .It eventually flows north right back into Lake Erie by the river system and out to the Atlantic to be sucked up into a rain cloud and essentially recycled  .The rain water might end up in a can of Bud light and make the return trip in a similar fashion .Water doesn't really go any where ,you just rent it .
I fully realize sources of water are not so easily obtained in other areas .I remember the Ford  429's and I 300's running with the exhaust manifolds cherry red pumping irrigation water in western Kansas and eastern  Colorado .Nobody irrigates  in this area of Ohio .If anything they try to get rid of the excess water .

[Al_Smith]

I might add with an 800 foot well in this area you would stand a chance of hitting oil .This area before the great Oklahoma strike was the hottest oil fields in the nation if not the world .90 percent of it is still down there .Problem being it's high sulfur content which although it is refinable  is not as profitable at this time .They know exactly where it's at and as such is just money in the bank for future use if needed .

[SwampDonkey]

Speaking of well depth, mines only 80 feet down, drilled before my time, never been without water in my 52 years. I'm on top of a ridge and lots of hard calcareous shale here below the soil. On the other hand, mom's uncle went down through sand and loam the same depth and his well was always going dry in summer when there was more demand. His place is 30 miles from here and on the opposite side of the river valley but also at the mouth of another river that joins the main river. The smaller river is big by European standards. And it had some of the biggest Atlantic salmon of any river to. Dams stopped that way of life. :D

Next house property down is on an artesian geyser. I suspected it was there because of the water coming to the surface just below a rounded dome, but the dome is not high, just a gradual one. Water shoots out the top of the well casing at times. I told the owner to build there and never worry about water. :D Well, it was land we owned, dad quit farming and sold the land. So I was well acquainted with the land. The place burnt two years ago, but my cousin's boy is going to build on it. He purchased it from the last owner.

[Al_Smith]

In Knox county Ohio ,where it was born the sub strata is sand stone ,wonderful filter .My uncle RIP had an artesian well that shoved water about 200 feet into a concrete cattle watering tank and the over flow to the river .The cattle always clean cool water and he didn't have an electric bill to pump it .BTW that's the best tasting water in the world in my opinion . 

[DWyatt]

Making progress, the two stacks are each 11' long x 5.5' tall and the wood in 18"-24" long. This is about a third of the wood that I have cut to length so far. hoping to make more progress by the end of the week. A tractor with a loader would sure make things go faster. I split, throw 20 feet, pick up and carry 20 feet to stack.