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What is the best diesel injector cleaner.

Started by Kbeitz, November 26, 2017, 06:56:47 PM

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Kbeitz

Quote from: barbender on November 27, 2017, 08:40:08 PM
😂😂😂Because alcohol attracts water, and can cause moisture problems down the line. No personal experience, I read it on the internet so I know it's true😁

Add a cup of water to your can of gas and shake it up...
Remove the water and the junk added alcohol will be gone.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Peter Drouin

This winter I'm going to set up a jug to do that K.
Do you have one?
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

bodagocreek2

0ne ounce of atf for every gallon of fuel, 20 year old Kubota 2900.  seems to keep it running smooth.

GRANITEstateMP

A little bit of atf with every fill up keeps the doctor away, or something like that.  I add diesel  fuel treatment a couple times a year but do a splash of atf every time I dump 5 gallons into my Kubota.
Hakki Pilke 1x37
Kubota M6040
Load Trail 12ft Dump Trailer
2015 GMC 3500HD SRW
2016 Polaris 450HO
2016 Polaris 570
SureTrac 12ft Dump Trailer

coxy

so your saying 1gal of atf/2cycle oil  every week  is to much  never had any trouble

John Mc

Quote from: Kbeitz on November 27, 2017, 09:59:20 PM
Quote from: barbender on November 27, 2017, 08:40:08 PM
😂😂😂Because alcohol attracts water, and can cause moisture problems down the line. No personal experience, I read it on the internet so I know it's true😁

Add a cup of water to your can of gas and shake it up...
Remove the water and the junk added alcohol will be gone.

If it's E10 (10% ethanol) gasoline you are talking about, you'll also lose about 3 or 4 points off your octane rating by taking the ethanol out, so I hope you started with some premium grade gas, otherwise you've got some garbage on your hands (not a whole lot out of engines out there that specify 83 or 84 octane).

If it's diesel, I was not aware anyone was putting ethanol in that - except possibly as a fuel additive. Alcohol in fuel additives is most commonly used to help deal with water: it combines with the water and helps move it through the system. Alcohol becomes a problem when it has maxed out as far as the amount of water it can handle. At that point it settles out of the gas. That water/alcohol mix sitting at the bottom of your fuel can or tank is corrosive. It also does not mix well with the lubricating oil in a 2-stroke engine.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Peter Drouin

Is there a difference in on road and off road diesel other than a tax and color?
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

snowstorm


moodnacreek

2 years ago I got some dirty fuel in my generator tank. The engine is a C series Cummings. It started smoking so bad it filled the valley and people where stopping because of it.  The engine started making oil. The blow by was oil mist. I pulled the fuel lines out and put them in a clean  barrel of kerosene and several brands of inj. cleaner. NO change. Next I dumped out 1 fuel filter and filled it with sea foam. This fixed half the problem and I kept sawing [and smoking ] for 2 months with no more improvement. Next with the warmer weather I went to 50% vegetable oil fuel. After a few days it cleared up completely.

Runningalucas

Quote from: snowstorm on November 29, 2017, 08:04:07 PM
No it's the same

Can you explain?  In my area the off road diesel pumps read: Off-road Diesel
                                                                                              kerosene
Or something near that, and I've always assumed it to be truly kerosene rather than dyed on road diesel; I actually assumed it would be the older more lubricating stuff.
Life is short, tragedy is instant, it's what we do with our time in between that matters.  Always strive to do better, to be better.

starmac

What area are you in that sells kerosene for off road diesel. There is no difference between off road and on road diesel except for the die, we don't even have died fuel here. There is a difference in summer and winter blend and that is different from area to area, depending on average temps.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

Runningalucas

Quote from: starmac on December 20, 2017, 12:37:36 AM
What area are you in that sells kerosene for off road diesel. There is no difference between off road and on road diesel except for the die, we don't even have died fuel here. There is a difference in summer and winter blend and that is different from area to area, depending on average temps.

North Idaho, almost all service stations have an 'off road diesel/kerosene' pump; it's quite a bit cheaper, more so than no tax added.  I think something like 50 cents, to a buck cheaper.
Life is short, tragedy is instant, it's what we do with our time in between that matters.  Always strive to do better, to be better.

starmac

50 cents to a buck sounds right as far as price difference goes, depending on the state.

Winter blend probably has some kero in it, but never heard it advertised as so. The winter blend the state uses on the north slope is mostly kero, you get terrible mileage with it.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

thecfarm

Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Randy88

If its a kubota and smokes like that, if it were me, I'd pull the injectors and take them in to be cleaned and repaired before it wash's down the cylinder and you score a bore, thinking those engines have no sleeve's but I could be wrong. 

The injectors should be easy to get out, just take off the lines and unscrew them or take the hold down bolt out and twist the injector out.     

Anything less with a diesel is just a temporary fix and probably won't last long, I've never bought injectors or had them done on any of my Kubota's as of yet, but done about everything else and most injectors are pretty cheap to fix and have the worn parts replaced and then the fix it shop can do a poppet test on them to know if the spray pattern is right and it should run as many hours next go around as the last. 

You also might have a pump issue, not sure on that model of engine, but is there a screen or anything in the pump that might be dirty or in need of replacing.    By just doing the poppet test, the shop should be able to tell you if you have a pump issue or if its in the injector itself.     

I have several Isusu engines that have a banjo screen in the system that needs cleaning regularly, but don't recall any of my Kubota's needing that done.     

As for all diesel being the same, that depends on WHO your buying from and where they are at, diesel at the pumps are inspected regularly by inspectors, most all offroad fuel isn't, so what does this mean to you, it means any diesel that can't pass inspection, goes for offroad use, same goes for any fuel coming off a truck, most is not inspected, so in theory, the best quality fuel is at a service station out of a pump, the poorest is delivered to you at your home, shop or farm because inspectors don't come to your place to pull samples.       

All diesel is clear when its first made, only offroad is dyed red and no tax is supposed to be on it for road fuel, but sales tax applies in my state for anything not farm related on dyed fuel.     

Then there are grades of diesel, premium is the best, some call it by other names and depending on what fuel additives are in it, will determine what fuel you want and when.     There is also number one fuel, which is thinner and for winter use, but lowers hp and increases fuel consumption, but tends to not jell up as much or as fast in cold weather.   Number two is standard, and some use blends of number one and number two in the winter, some fuel stations use additive packages in the winter, some use different additives in the summer as well, just depends on who your buying fuel from and who they sell to and what those customers want for additives.      Then there is also bio fuels, or blends of bio diesel, not something I'd recommend in the winter at all.   

All diesel sold today is low sulfur to my knowledge, which has lower lube levels in it due to less sulfur, which can cause issues with older diesels, which might be part of the problem with your Kubota, and the reason why I'd pull the injectors and have them checked over by a good shop.       

I'm not fond of the crap in a can cures myself for diesels, for the cost of those additives I can pull the injectors and rebuild them over the live of the additives and I know what I have is good and should run x number of hours before needing attention again, best of luck on whatever you do.   

Kbeitz

I might have another problem. I'm now running cleaner through it but if I
pull back the throttle under anything but full throttle it drops one cylinder and
it's hard for it to pick it back up unless I give it full throttle and put it under
a load. It will smoke like crazy till it picks up the lost cylinder. If I keep it
full throttle it will run fine all day.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

woodmaker

I dont know if your Kubota  has hydraulic lifters  or solid lifters,but from its age I would guess solid(mechanical). If i had the problem  that you are having,I would remove the  valve cover and make certain that each valve had the specified clearance between the rocker arm and the valve stem. If there is too little clearance,a valve may not be closing completely,and without compression,a diesel wont make enough heat to ignite the fuel .  This is what is called "to run the rack",which was mentioned earlier
franklin q80,builtrite 40,husky 372,sachs dolmar 123, dozers,excavators,loaders,tri-axle dump trucks ,autocar tractor with dump,flatbed and detachable trailers, and 8  f350 diesels

woodmaker

Sorry,starmac called it "run an overhead" . same thing.
franklin q80,builtrite 40,husky 372,sachs dolmar 123, dozers,excavators,loaders,tri-axle dump trucks ,autocar tractor with dump,flatbed and detachable trailers, and 8  f350 diesels

Randy88

If its an adjustment issue with the valves, it should run terrible when its cold and improve as the engine warms up, or vice versa, as the engine warms up clearances or the gap in the valve set will change.    Running the rack is pretty simple and fast to do, just pull the valve cover off and take the measurements with a feeler gauge.   

I'd suggest you measure it first before doing anything, jot down the findings so you can look at them to compare what it should be, especially for the cylinder causing you issues, and if the gap is in relation to the other cylinders, or the wear is the same across all cylinders, adjust them to spec and start it up with the cover off, if no change, go from there.   

   

Randy88

Forgot to ask, does it drop the same cylinder ever time, or has this issue changed cylinders at all since the problem started??

A very fast and simple test for injector, provided the problem has always been on the same cylinder is to switch injectors in holes and see if the problem stays in the same cylinder or follows the injector and go from there.    If it stays with the same cylinder, then its the pump or in the head, if it moves to the cylinder you put the injector, then its certain to be the injector, if that makes sense.   Its a simple way to narrow down the problem, somewhat and really simple and fast to do.   

If this issue has changed cylinders, with no parts being changed or moved, then you have a different set of issues to content with.   

Also have you narrowed down which cylinder is causing the issue yet??

If not when the engine is cold, upon start up, the dead or not firing cylinder won't warm up as fast, and I'd use a heat gun myself, but your hand will work too, touch or point the heat gun on the exhaust manifold and the dead hole will remain colder that the rest, where the exhaust exists the engine.

You can switch injectors pretty fast and I'd do this before pulling the valve cover off to see if the problem moves with the injector or not, if it stays with the same cylinder, then its not the injector, run the rack, if that doesn't solve it, its probably the pump.      Sorry about forgetting to mention this before.   

If the problem has moved all on its own, with no parts being moved or any adjustments being made, that would change things considerably and I'd like to know right away, I'd have to think on that somewhat, its rare but happens, also how many hours have you put on it since this whole ordeal started.   

moodnacreek

Black smoke from a diesel is partially burned fuel.  Unburned fuel is bluish white and smells like diesel fuel.  As an example; a restricted fuel filter can cause black smoke. Some how the ignition changes timing because less fuel  and the diesel starts smoking black when in fact its not getting enough fuel.  I say, with diesels, forget everything you ever new about gas engines.

carhartted

Amsoil AMF. Run it 50/50 Deisel. Had a friend with a JD450 running very poorly and almost changed the pump. Sent him my 5 gallon pail of cleaner and it fixed the issue.
Here's to making sawdust.

woodworker9

I'm late to the discussion but thought I'd share my story.  It's pertinent. 

4 years ago, my 95' International 4700 (DT466) was really losing power up hills and just running poorly.  Long story short, I took it to my local diesel mechanic, who has a reputation in the area as being the best.

He disconnected my fuel tank, hooked up a pressure tank of straight ATF, and ran the truck on it.  I couldn't believe what a difference it made!  Full power restored, and the truck was running unbelievably well right after.  Inexpensive injector cleaning process.

He told me, from then on, to put 2 cans of SeaFoam in every other fillup (50 gallon tank).  I've been using that stuff ever since, and also in my boat (2 stroke), pickup truck, and lawn equipment, and it has made a HUGE difference for me.
03' LT40HD25 Kohler hydraulic w/ accuset
MS 441, MS 290, New Holland L185

pappy19

Marvel Mystery Oil, just use the recommended amount in the fuel.
2008 F-250 V-10
2007 Lincoln LT
1996 Ford Bronco
Kubota 900 RTV
Shindiawa fan

Kbeitz

Looks like a good find in the junkyard just at the right time...

buda hydraulic diesel nozzle tester

Wow... One just like it on E-bay for $400.00 + $60.00 shipping.



 
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

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