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Author Topic: Are We Customers?  (Read 3674 times)

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Offline WDH

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2015, 06:53:28 AM »
If you hid junk in the middle of the load, we always ended up finding it.
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Offline Cedarman

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2015, 07:07:51 AM »
Pete, most of the 2" and 3" are bundled and sold to people who make furniture.  I double to triple my money on those.  Cost is unloading, laying out, sorting and bundling.  Usually have 70  2" or 50  3" to a bundle.  Handle those with forklift.
4" or sometimes bundled, sometimes sawn on the scragg. 
2", 3" and 4" and some 5" are run across the German peeler and sold to people making furniture.  Not a steady market, but enough of one that we need several thousand poles per year.  Next load of poles out to Wisconsin includes 250  4" to 5" x 10' and 100 4" x 8' along with some bigger 12' and 10' sawlogs.

Like Danny, we have seen lots of tricks, but most people that bring logs in want to do a good job and treat us fair.  They will point out some logs that are not full 8', or have a little rot at the butt end. (We measure a lot of loads on trucks with small end one direction making it easy to measure while standing up).  A very few will put mud on the end to cover rot, turn a log or two around so that we measure the big end, etc. , but those are the rare birds and we watch them closely each time they come in.  You could say most of them treat us like customers and want to please us, so we will pay them well.

I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

Offline SPD748

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2015, 08:43:48 AM »
I'm still looking for a logger of whom I can be a customer  :-\

I've talked to dozens of loggers in my area, all of whom either want to sell entire trailer loads (currently I have no way of unloading) or nothing at all. It seems that none are willing to allow me to bring my truck and trailer to the harvest site, even after offering cash at the time of pickup. I suppose the hassle of the "little guy" outweighs the relatively small amount of business I can offer. Perhaps it's a safety thing? I don't know. Anyway, I am able to purchase logs from another mill in my area so I'm not dead in the water.

As others have stated, I'd rather not have loads of junk dumped on me. I'd definitely not be a repeat customer if that were to happen.

-lee   
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Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2015, 08:52:38 AM »
When I was scaling logs, I figured out who you could trust.  We had one guy who always argued about grade or scale.  He was one that I never trusted.  One day he brings in a log that had mud covering the one side.  I didn't like the looks of it, but he convinced me that it was good.  So, I gave him a top grade and scale.

As luck would have it, I happened to be in the mill the day it was sawed.  A big rotten spot under the mud.  I got him back.  Although he argued about grade and scale, he never saw what I wrote down.  I got him a little at a time until I figured he paid us back.  For the most part, he brought us good logs, so we didn't want to tell him not to bring them in.  He just had to be watched harder.

Buying and selling of most forest products depends on the integrity of the parties.  Some foresters overscale timber, and others underscale.  Buyers know how to bid on those sales.  Some log buyers have a fair stick, some don't.  Same goes with lumber buyers and lumber sellers.  Some firewood sellers put junk in their bundles or short a cord.  Buyers know who are the honest ones and who to keep an eye out for.  Same goes for sellers. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2015, 08:55:26 AM »
I'm still looking for a logger of whom I can be a customer  :-\

I've talked to dozens of loggers in my area, all of whom either want to sell entire trailer loads (currently I have no way of unloading) or nothing at all. It seems that none are willing to allow me to bring my truck and trailer to the harvest site, even after offering cash at the time of pickup. I suppose the hassle of the "little guy" outweighs the relatively small amount of business I can offer. Perhaps it's a safety thing? I don't know. Anyway, I am able to purchase logs from another mill in my area so I'm not dead in the water.

As others have stated, I'd rather not have loads of junk dumped on me. I'd definitely not be a repeat customer if that were to happen.

-lee

Could be a liability problem, or could be they don't want to be bothered at the site.  I wouldn't want someone coming onto one of my logging sites with a small trailer and tying up the operations for a few logs.

You need to have someone come in that has a self unloading truck.  They can put all the logs on a pile in your yard.  But, they aren't bringing just a few logs.  Too much cost in transportation. 

How do you handle logs once they're in your yard?
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Offline Jeff

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #25 on: May 16, 2015, 10:14:29 AM »
Trust is a big thing, and sometimes it can be very subjective. Case in point.

We usually had a pretty big log inventory. Up to and some times more than 1000-1500 cord in the yard at any give time. (and it is still possible to run out!) So, when you have that much log inventory, its hard to say if there is ten cord added to a pile, or taken away. Its just impossible to tell.

One of the loggers that had been around for years, the owner trusted.  I did not, and one of my co-workers that also scaled wood did not. We told the owner our suspicions that he was not all that he thought he was, but we were told he had known the guy for years and he was a good guy. The owner would let this guy come in and deliver logs after hours or on weekends, use our loader to unload, and then put his scale in the door of our break room.  There were times when there would be a scale there, and we could absolutely not figure out where he put the logs.

One Friday afternoon, our knuckle boom broke down. It was inoperable. Needed some parts that wouldn't get there until the next week. That following Monday we came in, and there was a scale slip in the door from "Doug" for just a tad over 10 cord of mixed hardwood. About $1000 bucks at the time.  We looked around, trying to find which pile the logs were added to and could not.  "Doug" came in later that day to see if he could get his log check early. The owner was not there, so he came over to us to see where Ray was and when he would be back.  We asked Doug, how he unloaded that load of logs over the weekend.  He said, "I used your loader like I always do".

Well guess what Doug. No you didn't. 

I don't know how many times he may have done the phantom load scam over the years, or how much he may have stolen from the mill, but he was able todo it because he had garnered the trust of the guy that counted.  Of course after we told the boss about it, Doug's story changed, that now there was nother truck that had been there unloading, and they threw his load off. Actually, there had been another truck there, but he never off loaded anything. Ray never went after the guy, and continued to buy from him, but we changed the policy of letting anyone deliver when we were not there.
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Offline barbender

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #26 on: May 16, 2015, 10:40:03 AM »
I have a fair amount of experience on the hauling end. I think it comes down to, what are you paying for? I recieved a flyer from one mill, they said they want everything off of a job that is above pallet grade, all the saw logs and any veneer. Well, that would be fine, but they only want to pay sawlog prices for the veneer logs. I have to basically give them money so they will buy my saw logs? I also had the pallet mill complain that the sawlogs were getting sorted and sold elsewhere, they wanted everything. And at pallet prices. I understand where Cedarman is coming from, too- I would do the same thing as him, turn it away if it doesn't meet your specs. My point is, some of these outfits are advdrtising and paying for hamburger, and get upset when they don't get the steak.
Too many irons in the fire

Offline Cedarman

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #27 on: May 16, 2015, 11:03:19 AM »
About 15 years ago a logger was bringing in 3 or 4 big straight truck loads of logs a week.  I checked the log tickets and there seemed to be one extra.  I asked the guys who unloaded him and when.  We accounted for 3 loads , but not the fourth.  Doing a little detective type work if figured he put a fake ticket in the box because that one load was about 15% bigger than any other load he brought in.  Well, on Friday which was payday for loggers he came in with his girlfriend to pick up his check.  This guy was scraggly bearded, tatooed and shirtless as usual in summer.
AND wearing a gun on his hip as usual.  If you think I was nervous about confronting him, I was.  I asked several guys to come over and we had a chat.  Logger denied, but when confronted with the facts, confessed he did it.  It ended well.  I called him later and said not to bring more logs in.  About 2 years later I did buy from him again. About a year later, his body was found floating in the Ohio river.  Rumors abounded about why.  Never did find out what happened.
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

Online Dave Shepard

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #28 on: May 16, 2015, 11:11:34 AM »
Must be he tried floating the river on one of his phantom logs. :D
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Offline Jeff

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #29 on: May 16, 2015, 11:14:33 AM »
 :D
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Offline Ox

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #30 on: May 16, 2015, 12:06:11 PM »
I think karma is a very real thing.  Sometimes it takes longer than we would like to work but I think it comes 'round every time.  We may not know what really affects different types of people but we all have to deal with our choices in the end.
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Offline SPD748

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #31 on: May 16, 2015, 02:39:17 PM »
I'm still looking for a logger of whom I can be a customer  :-\

I've talked to dozens of loggers in my area, all of whom either want to sell entire trailer loads (currently I have no way of unloading) or nothing at all. It seems that none are willing to allow me to bring my truck and trailer to the harvest site, even after offering cash at the time of pickup. I suppose the hassle of the "little guy" outweighs the relatively small amount of business I can offer. Perhaps it's a safety thing? I don't know. Anyway, I am able to purchase logs from another mill in my area so I'm not dead in the water.

As others have stated, I'd rather not have loads of junk dumped on me. I'd definitely not be a repeat customer if that were to happen.

-lee

Could be a liability problem, or could be they don't want to be bothered at the site.  I wouldn't want someone coming onto one of my logging sites with a small trailer and tying up the operations for a few logs.

You need to have someone come in that has a self unloading truck.  They can put all the logs on a pile in your yard.  But, they aren't bringing just a few logs.  Too much cost in transportation. 

How do you handle logs once they're in your yard?

Ron,

I move logs around with farm tractors/pallet forks. I totally understand the issues with a small buyer tying up operations for a few dollars here and there. Self loading trucks are like hen's teeth around here. Everyone, I mean everyone in my area runs straight trailers, no loaders. I did find one gentleman who lives in South Carolina, about 30 minutes from me. He has a tandem truck with a loader and said he can haul 2-3 mbf. Problem is, he really doesn't like the North Carolina Highway Patrol. In fact, when I got around to telling him that I'd like the logs delivered to NC, he loudly explained his disdain for the NCSHP then hung up on me  :D

I'll keep searching. Perhaps one day I'll find the mythical self loader.

-lee
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Online Bruno of NH

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Re: Are We Customers?
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2015, 04:09:53 PM »
Lee
In my area I find the small loggers will sell me logs and load my trailer  . But at the end of the job when there's not a full load left for the truck to haul to the mill or when the roads are posted and they need the cash .
They also tell me the mills don't like 8 or 10 ft logs so I buy them .
Jim /Bruno
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