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Author Topic: Husqvarna 372xp Original Edition vs. 372xp Current Edition "X-Torq" Saws.  (Read 9257 times)

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Online weimedog

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They are completely different saw designs, share the names and superfluous "support" stuff like chain brake guts, pull starters, bar oil pumps etc. But little else....

A common question see talked around as if they are the same, even similar saws. Figured while I have a junk pile that has to be turned into running saws I could do a few video's articulating the major differences...first video some of the more obvious parts. ( Subsequent video's on running characteristics, ignition differences, weight, and other observations running them side by side. )

Husqvarna 365sp/372xpw Blend, Jonsered 2171 51.4mm XPW build,562xp HTSS, 560 HTSS, 272XP, 61/272XP, 555, 257, 242, 238, Homelite S-XL 925, XP-1020A, Super XL (Dad's saw); Jonsered 2094, Three 920's, CS-2172, Solo 603; 3 Huztl MS660's (2 54mm and 1 56mm)

Offline wild262

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    Good morn. Weimedog;  This is the video I have been hoping to see from you.  I'm fixing to start on a couple of 372's shortly.  Thanks a million for pointing out the differences.  As always, I love watching your videos and the vast knowledge from you & Bob on the subject of saws in general.  I like to tinker as well.  Mainly with Huskys, and a few Stihls.  Love the Jonnies too, esp. the older ones.  Sure wish I lived a bit closer to you guys, as I would be delighted to met you folks.   Were all the same age and old school about a lot of the same things, motorcycles, chainsaws, small farm operation, ect.  We would have a lot of fun together.          Watching the weather, it looks like your getting hammered by a bad nor-easter up there.  We don't get those of course in NE Missouri.  But once in a while we get a dousy of a snowstorm, mostly in spring.    Best just hunker down and stay inside till it ends.  Go opportunity to make a new video or to isn't it?  Bet your doing that right now.  I've rambled enough, but thanks again to you and Bob for sharing your knowledge and ideas and keep them coming.  I'm a big fan! 8)

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We are in the 14-20 inch forecast for today's storm, but from what I'm seeing, we are going to be getting the low side of that. Still, a foot is a decent storm to run the old Ariens in.

Original 372 is one of the best saws designs ever made. Walt and I differ a little bit on how far the XT has strayed from the original though. I think it's pretty close; he thinks they kind of ruined it. Did take me a while to warm up to the XT myself. But a 372XT is better than no 372 at all. :)



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Online weimedog

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LOL

I think where we differ is simply terminology. You call the 372xp XT a...372. I don't, its a 372 X-Torq. A completely different saw! See? Make sense? And I like the 372xp better. Not that the 372xp X-torq is a bad girl...just the 372 is ...better.  8)
Husqvarna 365sp/372xpw Blend, Jonsered 2171 51.4mm XPW build,562xp HTSS, 560 HTSS, 272XP, 61/272XP, 555, 257, 242, 238, Homelite S-XL 925, XP-1020A, Super XL (Dad's saw); Jonsered 2094, Three 920's, CS-2172, Solo 603; 3 Huztl MS660's (2 54mm and 1 56mm)

Offline starmac

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The way I see it, all 372's are good, just some are mo better.
I have always heard that the original xp's are better, is that a power curve thing, rpm thing, and do you consider it to be a longevity thing?
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

Offline wild262

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We are in the 14-20 inch forecast for today's storm, but from what I'm seeing, we are going to be getting the low side of that. Still, a foot is a decent storm to run the old Ariens in.

Original 372 is one of the best saws designs ever made. Walt and I differ a little bit on how far the XT has strayed from the original though. I think it's pretty close; he thinks they kind of ruined it. Did take me a while to warm up to the XT myself. But a 372XT is better than no 372 at all. :)
        Wow!  The last time we had that much was about 3 yrs ago in Feb.  I believe it was 16" and drifted due to high winds.  I had to feed my 15 head of cows with square bales on a wooden toboggan.   Terrible day.  I feel for you guys.     Regarding the 372's, I have never run any of them.  I got these two out of a trade deal.  One a original old style, and other is the XT.  The later has a bad crank bearing on the clutch side.  Closest I've ran to it is a 272xp.  Have 2 of them.  I hear the 372's are a heck of a saw.  Guess I will find out, huh.

Offline wild262

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LOL

I think where we differ is simply terminology. You call the 372xp XT a...372. I don't, its a 372 X-Torq. A completely different saw! See? Make sense? And I like the 372xp better. Not that the 372xp X-torq is a bad girl...just the 372 is ...better.  8)
                                                                                                                                                                          
I tend to see that terminology as you do Walter.  Easier for me to keep track on which one were talking about.  Never ran either yet.   So does the X-torq have more low RPM torque, or just a lower curve?

Offline ButchC

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372, 372 XP, 372 XT, 372 Ex Torq, did they make a 372 Ex Wife too?
I got a 576 because it's less confusing??? ;D
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Offline Woodcutter_Mo

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 Good video, I didn't know there were that many differences between to 2 versions of the 372.
- WoodMizer LT25, Kohler, all manual, old "drag" style WoodMizer sharpener, cat claw single  setter
- Husqvarna 372XP X-Torque/24" bar, 455 Rancher X-Torque/20" bar, 550XP/20" bar, Stihl 024AV/18" Oregon speedcut
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Offline wild262

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         I think there power may be out due to the storm there having in the northeast since there not answering there posts :-\.   Quite a storm up there.

Offline mike_belben

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Ive been porting saws (well, anythingg with ports really) for about 14 years.  The one time an X torq came to me i tore it down,  looked real hard, studied up on theory of operation which ive since forgotten and said no, i dont wanna mess this up.  Put it back together with a muffler mod and retune.  

The standard saw, i dont care what brand, is pretty straight forward and porting them is not much different than a banshee, blaster, moped or outboard.  Sorta one size nearly fits all.  Yeah you can refine it to tweak timing and overlap a little different by model or dimensions, maybe it makes more power for real or maybe its only in your head or ear.. that 1* difference in blowdown that makes sense on paper.  

short of a dyno.. Who is to say?  You ever see a chainsaw dyno?  Probably not outside of a manufacturer.  There is no chainsaw nascar or prostock or indy to pay for the equipment.  Cutting cookies on vid with a stopwatch is about as scientific as saw hot rodding gets which is better than nothing, i admit.  

The X torq jug is complicated enough that when i looked inside i said to myself, ill mess up 5 of these before i make it any better.  This aint like the 50 other jugs ive ground on.  So i leave them 100% alone.
Revelation 3:20

Offline Nate Fether

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372, 372 XP, 372 XT, 372 Ex Torq, did they make a 372 Ex Wife too?
I got a 576 because it's less confusing??? ;D



If you buy the first four you get Xwife model for half your stuff......What a deal.

Online HolmenTree

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I really liked my old edition 372XP, main reason why it was the first Husqvarna I ever bought. Very versatile saw from sporting a 16" to 24" b/c.


 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Maine logger88

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I might be the odd man here but I like the xt saws better than the early saws. The ones Iíve had the xt had better power and seemed to bog less wot with the bar buried. I also like the fact that I can save 200 bucks by getting a 2166 and making it a 2172 for no money just a little time. 
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Online HolmenTree

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Yes the old edition 372XP is touchy in the wood. When I switched from the older Stihls (066 064 044) I found the 372 only had good power at WOT. Let off the throttle a bit in the cut while felling with the bar buried and the  chain would seize with chips jammed in the bar rails.
Keep the 372 rpm high and it was a laser in any size wood the 22" b/c could handle.

Interesting thing I  noticed when a few years later when I bought a 272XP which is 13 years older then my 2006 372XP.  The 272XP cylinder design didn't have the top end only high power capability. But more like the modern 372XP X Tork power with some grunt also on the lower midrange revs.

Ideally the older 272XP power band may be more user friendly with room to modify the porting and compression for more top end power, but in the end buying a new 372XP XT EPA regulations rules.

But later this year of 2018 we have the new Husqvarna 572XP available to buy.....Then all we can do is then is say good bye to the 372XP, so the experts say. ;)
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Online weimedog

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Think the 372xt hangs around for a bit ( probably because they are still in the warehouses) and the 576 goes away..:( I liked the 576's. AND to draw fire.... I can't argue with the saws capabilities. They are heavier than the OE's. Since I've had the 390's w/ light bars  in the truck, for me for the weight & vibration addition vs. OE...just run a 390. Especially with the longer bars. Just my opinion and what I in fact do so don't bother me with numbers..:) I do have a variety of XT's as well. So now the work saws in the truck are (2) 562's, a "Home built" 560 for the smaller stuff, and 390's right now. Suspect the 572 will turn all that upside down...but I've got way too many saws...and those 562's are doing everything I need..and I like them. Took me a while to warm up to them.

Two projects on the bench though, building a 441 same as I did the 562's with a increase in compression and a few tweaks to the intake and transfers. And going back to restoring a 375 (372xpw)  with the torque oriented XPW top end with a little compression jump. Goal is to keep the weight down with a light B&C and some other things. even though those Oregon laminated aluminum cored bars aren't "pro" rated or "pro" level strong for bore cutting, think one of those setups will grace both the 441 and 375.

Now please stop the snow so I can get the time to finish these things..

Husqvarna 365sp/372xpw Blend, Jonsered 2171 51.4mm XPW build,562xp HTSS, 560 HTSS, 272XP, 61/272XP, 555, 257, 242, 238, Homelite S-XL 925, XP-1020A, Super XL (Dad's saw); Jonsered 2094, Three 920's, CS-2172, Solo 603; 3 Huztl MS660's (2 54mm and 1 56mm)

Online HolmenTree

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I kept my 562XP as I had some people waiting in line for it.
Going to need it for my tree service spring startup in a month or so when our snow finally vaporizes. BTW the majority of our snow blows in from a Colorado low and a Alberta  Clipper.  :D

I got the MS261CM handling the 50cc chores with a 16-18".
562XP will be running a 22" Windsor Speed Tip in .325 23RS chain.
My 1992 066 Arctic Mag will come out of retirement and sport it's original 28" ES bar.

I'm putting my also retired 1986 064AV back into service . I'll swap its race ported cylinder with 084 carb for a 1995 066 P/C. Will run a 20" .050  bar on it with Oregon 50AL. 404 chisel bit chain.
It will be a super lightweight 90cc powerhouse of a tree service saw, weighing under 14 1/4 lbs powerhead only.

562XP will then be a backup until when the MS462C shows up and hopefully the MS500i shortly after. :)
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Online Spike60

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576 goes away with the arrival of the 572. 372XT will continue to be manufactured for a year as the 572 gains acceptance, so it should run through 2019 and that will be it. I glad they are doing it that way, as I don't have to guess as to how many 372's I should bulk up on before it goes away.

Personal opinion: From the experience with the prototypes I had, I think the market changeover to the 572 is going to happen pretty quick. Yes, there will be those "I don't want a computer on the saw" guys, but most are anxious for the new one. Guys who tested them say it's no comparison and they are hounding me with the "when's it gonna be here" questions. And we sell so many 562's that there's a lot of guys who really want the next size up. Going to be fun when they get here. 8)
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Husqvarna 572XP looks like a very impressive saw. I mentioned in my last post about a MS462C and MS500i.....but I'm not ruling out a "Official 572XP/MS462C test".
Would be fun in my day to day Tree service adventures :laugh:

I always think YouTube videos of cookie cutting saw comparison is just down right silly.
But for entertainment here's one posted 2 weeks ago from somewhere in Europe. 572XP versus 372XP.

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Offline starmac

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It does sound like these newfangled computerised saws are working out well. I also know it doesn't matter, we will be forced to go with them in due time, and that time is coming up shortly, so I got to ask you guys that have been messing with them a question.

Some of us old reprobates keep our stuff forever, I mean I still use a 266se, when I could have and probably even should have replaced it with a 372 years ago, how do you see the electronics holding up 20 or more years down the road?
Myself I keep things forever as long as it works, but wince I don't have that many years left using a saw, it is sort of a mute point, but there will be other guys like me that would, if they hold up.
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I agree that cookie cutting is pretty silly, and proves practically nothing. Yet it's amazing how much weight people put in them. I also find myself in complete agreement with your earlier 272/372 post, so I've made an appointment with my doctor to make sure I'm OK. :D

Your tests are indeed interesting, and well done with lots of details, but I don't know about applying the word "official" on any of them. :)  Nothing all that official when comparing a single example of each saw. What happens, and has happened forever on these sites, is that guys tend to apply whatever happens on one such comparison to every single saw on the planet. That's another downside to the cookie racing. If X beats Y, then guys think every encounter has the same result.

Your test ended with the 261 being the clear winner, which is fine as that is the one you preferred, based on your experience with them. (not to mention the first 550 was a complete lemon) But it's a matter of your preference more than it is any measurement of test data.

At about the same time you were conducting your test, a large tree company near me bought 24 550's as they preferred them to the 261's they had tried. Does their opinion carry more weight than yours does, because they are a big company? No, I wouldn't say that at all. It's still just a matter of preference. The regional manager was up here last week. Lots of storm damage and he had 50 guys and 20 bucket trucks in the area. Came in for supplies and wanted to grab a few more 562's. In the conversation he says, "I'm not a big Stihl fan. I've always been a Husky guy." It's safe to assume that some of his 50 guys would rather run a Stihl, but the boss is a Husky guy and that's what he buys.

Most of us would have to confess to a little bias in our opinions, and I'm certainly guilty myself. Saw brands, truck brands, maybe even Skippy vs Jif. But these saws are all so good that the hair splitting hardly matters.

 
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Online Spike60

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It does sound like these newfangled computerised saws are working out well. I also know it doesn't matter, we will be forced to go with them in due time, and that time is coming up shortly, so I got to ask you guys that have been messing with them a question.

Some of us old reprobates keep our stuff forever, I mean I still use a 266se, when I could have and probably even should have replaced it with a 372 years ago, how do you see the electronics holding up 20 or more years down the road?
Myself I keep things forever as long as it works, but wince I don't have that many years left using a saw, it is sort of a mute point, but there will be other guys like me that would, if they hold up.
That's REAL good question. And it needs a little thinking cause there aren't any Auto-Tunes that have been around as long as the 266SE. (I have a couple 266's myself.) Could be like any other electronic component, such as the coils in a 266. Most will probably last a real long time, with the occasional screw up. So far the evidence is that I can hardly think of a single AT module failure. Some need to be reset but they really don't fail. The coils in the AT saws are a little more complicated than older saws, and they are connected to the module. The days of a coil with just one wire are over I guess. But even though they are more complicated, the failure rate is no different, and truthfully it's lower than what I see on 372's and the homeowner saws. There have been a bunch of coil changes/updates. I think the 550 is on something like it's 5th coil? :laugh: But the changes were due to improving the starting and running characteristics, not a failure type of issue. There's a lot more to a coil these days than spark or no spark. There's advance curves and start curves and what not. The 576 AT has to be closing in on 10 years and they have been fine. So there's really nothing out there yet to indicate that there will be problems with this stuff down the road.
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Offline starmac

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Good info and insight Spike.  As far as the changes made so far, that is to be expected when they are trying to get a handle on new technology. Like I said It doesn't matter that much for my own use, heck I am getting to where I am having a hard tome starting the 266, so it's days are numbered, through no fault of it's own. It would be nice if they came out with electric start, that has no bulk or weight. lol
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Offline Maine logger88

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Good info and insight Spike.  As far as the changes made so far, that is to be expected when they are trying to get a handle on new technology. Like I said It doesn't matter that much for my own use, heck I am getting to where I am having a hard tome starting the 266, so it's days are numbered, through no fault of it's own. It would be nice if they came out with electric start, that has no bulk or weight. lol

Something like ski doos shot starting maybe?
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Offline starmac

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I have just heard a little about skidoos system, and not 100% sure how it works. My skidoo is electric start, but it is a lot bigger starter than my 4 wheelers and I have modified it to use a full size battery, sure wouldn't work for a saw. lol
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Thereís a few vids on you tube showing how it works basically it has a capacitor that collects the energy while running then when the start button is pushed it uses the magneto as a starter motor. It would only with efi engines the etec engine  starts on only a third of a revolution of the crank. Also you have to pull start the first start of the day or if the sled sits for over a half hour. My ski doo has the regular electric start as well I donít do enough extreme riding that I need the weight savings. But on a saw in the future who knows?
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I've never held a x-torq in my hand, so I can't speak intelligently about it. However, my old XP is a real blue collar saw, durable and tenacious. I can't imagine the x-torq changing my opinion of the XP. At one time, if someone were to tell me you can have one saw and one saw only for the rest of your life I would have chosen my 044av. Now I'm not so sure. I may choose my 372xp. The x-torq would have a hard time convincing me otherwise, but I am looking forward to obtaining one from the grave yard so I can go through the saw.

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Knuckledragger, I totally agree the 044AV the one saw to own .
I owned both a 1989 044AV and a old edition 372XP which I just sold both of them a few weeks ago.
I hated to see the 044 go more then the 372. That 044 was a good fast compact saw. So simple to operate and work on.
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Offline wild262

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I agree that cookie cutting is pretty silly, and proves practically nothing. Yet it's amazing how much weight people put in them. I also find myself in complete agreement with your earlier 272/372 post, so I've made an appointment with my doctor to make sure I'm OK. :D

Your tests are indeed interesting, and well done with lots of details, but I don't know about applying the word "official" on any of them. :)  Nothing all that official when comparing a single example of each saw. What happens, and has happened forever on these sites, is that guys tend to apply whatever happens on one such comparison to every single saw on the planet. That's another downside to the cookie racing. If X beats Y, then guys think every encounter has the same result.

Your test ended with the 261 being the clear winner, which is fine as that is the one you preferred, based on your experience with them. (not to mention the first 550 was a complete lemon) But it's a matter of your preference more than it is any measurement of test data.

At about the same time you were conducting your test, a large tree company near me bought 24 550's as they preferred them to the 261's they had tried. Does their opinion carry more weight than yours does, because they are a big company? No, I wouldn't say that at all. It's still just a matter of preference. The regional manager was up here last week. Lots of storm damage and he had 50 guys and 20 bucket trucks in the area. Came in for supplies and wanted to grab a few more 562's. In the conversation he says, "I'm not a big Stihl fan. I've always been a Husky guy." It's safe to assume that some of his 50 guys would rather run a Stihl, but the boss is a Husky guy and that's what he buys.

Most of us would have to confess to a little bias in our opinions, and I'm certainly guilty myself. Saw brands, truck brands, maybe even Skippy vs Jif. But these saws are all so good that the hair splitting hardly matters.

 


     Very good post Spike.  You hit the nail on the head.  Sure wish I could explain myself like you do.  Wiemedog does to, but sometimes takes "the long way around the barn" :D                 You can 2 NEW identical saws, same mix, tune, B&C, same 10x10 wood, and have a fast one and a slower one.  Even experienced this with newly "broken in" saws.  So what gives!  But nevertheless, I've done it, and still do on occasion, just for fun, but not to prove anything really.         Thanks to this video and others, I completed a successful build on a X-torq.  Had the ceramic bearings as I suspected.  Many thanks to all.

Online Spike60

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wild262, I hope Walt catches that "long way round the barn" post!  :D  I think sometimes the only thing that gets us to stop talking is when the battery in the camera runs out.

And you add a VERY good point to the discussion: If you compare 2 identical saws, one will likely beat the other. So what conclusion do you draw then? Many pro guys will own several examples of the same model saw throughout it's production run, which is often 15-20 years. Most will say that one of them was the best of the bunch, or that one of them wasn't as good as the rest.
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Online weimedog

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I did , its funny...:) The video I just posted could literally be.. a posting "cool saw" and a picture..:)
Husqvarna 365sp/372xpw Blend, Jonsered 2171 51.4mm XPW build,562xp HTSS, 560 HTSS, 272XP, 61/272XP, 555, 257, 242, 238, Homelite S-XL 925, XP-1020A, Super XL (Dad's saw); Jonsered 2094, Three 920's, CS-2172, Solo 603; 3 Huztl MS660's (2 54mm and 1 56mm)

Offline Grandpa

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I agree, cutting cookies has nothing to do with cutting in the real world, but a lot of guys make a big deal out of it.

Walt may "take the long way around the barn", but there is a lot of information in his ramblings. He and Spike make a good team with their different approaches.

Also, Walt, if you see this, a while back you made a video called bars, cut locations and different worlds. That was probably the best saw related video I have ever seen. I didn't comment on the video but should have. Thanks.

Online weimedog

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Thank you. Speechless..:)
Husqvarna 365sp/372xpw Blend, Jonsered 2171 51.4mm XPW build,562xp HTSS, 560 HTSS, 272XP, 61/272XP, 555, 257, 242, 238, Homelite S-XL 925, XP-1020A, Super XL (Dad's saw); Jonsered 2094, Three 920's, CS-2172, Solo 603; 3 Huztl MS660's (2 54mm and 1 56mm)

Offline wild262

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      Hea Walt,  Just want you to know I wasn't making fun of you when I said that about "around the barn bit".   ;)  I don't want you to change a thing with regards to your video making.  Your very complete and you cover every angle.  Yes, you and Bob make a very good team.  So don't stop what your doing, and on behalf of myself and many others on these chainsaw sites, WE DO appreciate the time, and efforts you guys put forth in making all these for our enjoyment and education.   I can't wait to see your next one  thumbs-up.

Offline mike_belben

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I hope i didnt ruffle any feathers mentioning cookies.. Im too new to know who each of you are and what yall're up to.  Im not sure which videos are being discussed.  


Cookie cutting would be a fine test if we could control for temp and humidity and knots.  Its a poor mans dyno.  I like hotrodding saws for the sake of hotrodding but i dont think it really puts much more wood on the trailer for most of us.  I like a quick saw but if i finish a cut 3 seconds faster i just look around and pick my nose for 5 extra seconds anyway. 
Revelation 3:20

Offline Grandpa

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No ruffled feathers here.

Online HolmenTree

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I made 3 cookie cutting videos a few years ago and the first and last I ever made.
Only for demonstration minus the stop watch. But I did have consistent wood (except for 1 long knot).
But to prove anything with the stop watch you need everything including saws, bars, chains shown being changed over for the test throughout the video.
Here's my attempt demonstrating a 7 tooth small bore .325 rim sprocket and Stihl 23RS chain on my Husqvarna 562XP.


Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline XP_Slinger

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Thatís a good question but it can only be answered in time.  Personally, I think the AT systems are going to be pretty dang reliable.  While AT may complicate DIY trouble shooters like many of us here, it simplifies day to day operation and provides truth data for how the engine is running when servicing is needed by a dealer.  Iím excited to see how the 572 does in the long run, a lot of lessons learned from the 562 were applied to the 572.  Im also very happy they built the bottom end so tough.  6203 bearings and a full circle crank, mama husky pulled out the stops on that one.  The carb vs AT discussion reminds me of when fuel injection was introduced on vehicles in the 80ís.  Many scoffed at the new tech not willing to give up their carbs.  And now the fuel injected auto industry is producing muscle cars that would make a big block chevelle from the 60ís tuck tail and run.   Saws are in the throttle body injection stage but port injection is rapidly approaching with the 500i.  Exciting times.
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372XP/XT...ported by A. Burr
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Offline XP_Slinger

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Oops, sorry fellers.  Apparently I didnít refresh the page before responding
346XP/NE
357XP...ported by MeDremel
372XP/XT...ported by A. Burr
Homelite (Solo) 340

I'd rather be in the woods than on this computer.

Offline knuckledragger

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I came into this world 1960 on a U.S.M.C. base hospital in North Carolina. Impressionable young man in the late '60s early '70s. Muscle car years. I was one that didn't care for throttle body or electronic ignitions. I was wrong because I wasn't educated. The point is, electronic ignition and fuel injection are the best thing that could've happened to anyone purchasing a vehicle. I suspect one will be able to say similar things bout chainsaws in the very near future.


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