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Author Topic: 2051C and 066 "red light"  (Read 1704 times)

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Offline Spike60

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2051C and 066 "red light"
« on: March 20, 2018, 06:36:38 PM »
With Auto-Tune and M-Tronic being a fact of life now, being able to complain about having a computer in your saw is something that you actually could have done 30 years ago.  :)

Jonsered and Stihl both tried some electronic carb adjustment ideas a long time ago. I've never actually seen the Jonsered version other than at trade shows way back. I've seen a red light 066, but never took a close look at it. I really don't have a lot of info or knowledge on these saws. Wilard, I'm betting you can fill in some of the blanks here, so please step in share what you know.

I'm guessing these saws used a similar set up that invloved tuning the carb until a red lamp came on to indicate the saw was properly tuned. I'm also assuming that since in neither case did this idea last long or migrate to other models, there may have been some issues. One factor is that neither saw offered a significant advantage over the standard model and required an investment in special tools to service them. The 066 was way more popular in any form than the 2051, so I assume more guys will have had experience with them.

I do have some Jonsered service manuals from 1989 that describe how to work on and test the 2051C. There was a special testor that was necessary to test the microprocessor in the saw. The MP unit was in the lower part of the rear handle and there was a pair of magnets in the trigger that must have acted as a throttle position sensor. The MP was involved in tuning the saw both for idle and hi speed. It would actually cut out the ignition in both cases if you went to high. 3000 rpm for idle and 14,800 for hi. (2051's spun up that high).

From the service manual: "The green lamp is lit when the tester is connected to a 12v supply. Connect the cables from the MP to the tester. Then connect the sensor cable to the upper side of the MP. Set the speed check to zero. If the sensor cable is not functioning the spark will be interupted at 3000 rpm and the red lamp will extinguish."  Now why do you suppose this saw wasn't more popular?  :D 

OK Willard, you have the floor. But did any of you other guys have these saws, and what was your experience with them?
Husqvarna-Jonsered
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Offline ZeroJunk

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2018, 07:09:46 PM »
I had a Red Light that I bought cheap with a bad module. So, had to change the flywheel since mine only came with one slot, and buy another module.
They were not rev limiting. The red light just lit at a certain RPM. Which wandered over time, usually down.

Put a piece of tape over it and just tune it like any other saw.

Offline starmac

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2018, 09:14:00 PM »
A friend bought the red light, the very first one sold in New Mexico. The way I Understood it was that the light was just an indicator to tell you when it hit 13,500 rpm. I seem to remember when the coil went out a few years later, there was something aboyt they were no longer available, so you had to change flywheel and all to get them back up and running, but I do not remember the specifics. I will say they red light was a beast of a saw back then.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

Offline ZeroJunk

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2018, 10:52:56 PM »
They made some that were 1122-400-1209 and 1122-400-1214 depending on which slot you used, the 1209 being the Red Light flywheel.  I surmise that was in the transition away from the Red Lights. If you are lucky you will have one of those when your Red Light pukes and save you from having to buy another flywheel.

Either way they were a strong saw which the Red Light had nothing to do with.

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2018, 10:59:35 PM »
Bob, I saw your thread here at supper time 4.5 hours ago but this evening is the busiest day of the week for my family. Running 3 young kids back and forth to swim club training, basketball practice, fiddle lessons, guitar lessons. Dog had to go to the vet. ;D

I can't give much input on the 2051 Jonny but I know a retired Jonsered rep I might give a call tomorrow .

Yes the early 1991-92 Stihl 066 Mag (dual outlet muffler)Digital  LED.
I bought one brand new 2nd year they came out.
Was actually a pretty good design or should we say idea. It was designed to eliminate the need of a hand held tachometer to accurately set carburetor adjustment.

From my notes here it had a Prufrex CDIC #1122 400 1307 limited module with a LED lead going to the red light diode on the top cover beside the carb setting holes.

The LED was factory set to light up at 11,500 rpm.
So the proper adjustment procedure was to warm the saw up, turn the H screw fully in to the seat then back up 2 full turns. Run saw at full rpm and turn H screw in until LED light came on (at 11,500 rpm). Then finish by turning in H screw an extra half  turn.

Now the cool thing about this procedure is the saw is now set at the ignition limiter cut off speed of 13,500 rpm at the barometric pressure and climatic condition at the operating site.
If the saw moves to a different site higher or lower in elevation then the 2 turns out on H and half turn past LED coming on has to be repeated.

The saw was a beast and I had no problem with that LED setup but sometime a year later in 1993 my Stihl rep said they had a recall on the 066 LED module and he gave me a new  0000 400 1300 unlimited module and flywheel which deleted the LED.

Another cool thing about my 066 LED is it's also an Arctic with a heated carburetor as my picture shows .
2 heating elements on the exterior of the carb with a built in thermostat that keeps the carb warm at a constant 77F all year long. Stills work great today, probably why I never changed the original factory diaphrams now 27 years old.
Never had its cylinder off and still runs like a beast. Only needs a new PTO bearing.


 

 


Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Canadiana

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2018, 11:31:04 PM »
Does this pic show the 'flat top?'
The saw is more fun than the purpose of the wood... the forest is trembling 🌳

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2018, 11:42:00 PM »
Does this pic show the 'flat top?'
Yep that's my flattop 066.
Here's a few pics of it and and my 1986 064 and a newer 1996 066
All flat tops. Rebuilding all 3.


 

 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline ZeroJunk

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2018, 07:01:56 AM »
Well, Stihls technical bulletin says they did have an "electronic speed governor".

So, I was wrong about them not being rev limited.

Maybe the governed speed wandered down with the Red Light, which may have been their downfall ??

Offline Spike60

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2018, 07:41:09 AM »
Am I seeing a metal air filter cover on that 066? Cool decal on there.

Somewhere I have a copy of an article on the 2051C when it was introduced. Found it in one of those books from a dealer buy out I did. But I "set it aside" somewhere to keep it safe, and have no idea where I put it.

The tuning instructions are similar to what you guys are saying about the 066. So, I guess these modules act more like a tach than anything else, while providing an ignition cut out to prevent over speeding.

I'll have to check some IPL's but I don't know of the 2051C using a different flywheel or coil than the regular model. When those components had to be changed out on the 066, did the saw run the same or did it lose a little power? Different coil/flywheel combos can make a huge difference in the way a saw runs. I have a friend who ran them and swears "nothing ran like those red lights".
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Offline HolmenTree

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2018, 11:10:30 AM »
Bob, yep that's the original magnesium  filter cover. Yes as the decal says welcome to the digital age.
Yes that LED 1307 module was basically a tachometer. I still have it and the flywheel ....nothing wrong with them.
The upgraded Iida unlimited module actually gave the saw a little more top end power and rpm. This module will fit a 024 and up, now a days one of the most common aftermarket generic modules on the market. But nothing beats these NLA OEM Iida modules for reliability.
The 1122 series since 1986 had a crazy amount of different module/flywheel combinations, somewhere in the neighborhood of 20.

1994 the 066 h.p. spiral decline started with a new thick base cylinder, beefed up crank.
1995 OHSA banned the dual outlet magnum muffler.
1996 the crankshaft was beefed up heavier again with new crankcase volume.
1998 it was pretty well game over when the 066 went to the round top design with EPA labelling and carb limiter caps.
By 2002 it was a MS660.

Here's a short 5 minute video from Oct 1995 with me demoing and showing 5 of my saws. 1989 044AV  1994 090AV  Yamaha bikesaw 1992 066 Mag and the "new series" 020T the forerunner of the MS200T .
This video is missing a minute or so of run time.....20 years ago my VCR ate the tape and I had to cut some tape out and resplice with crazy glue.
Talk about "cut and paste" :D
A few years ago I recorded this video off my TV/VCR with my phone and then had my 12 year old daughter put it on YouTube for me. ;D

Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Spike60

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2018, 04:21:58 PM »
First class Willard! Enjoyed that. 1995 just keeps getting farther away, doesn't it? That was the year I opened the store after several years of selling OPE on the road. Surprised that those dual port mufflers were axed that long ago too. I had about 8 of them in a box of Stihl parts from one of those dealers we bought out 2-3 years ago. Just gave them to a buddy who runs both Husky and Stihl saws. His "Oh Wow!" reaction when he saw them told me how sought after they are.
Husqvarna-Jonsered
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Offline Maine logger88

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2018, 09:43:11 PM »
Why would OSHA ban dual port mufflers? I cant imagine it was a safety issue...
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #12 on: March 22, 2018, 10:18:58 PM »
That was info I got what OSHA did in the U.S. They are pretty loud.
But here in Canada it didn't affect us with our CSA standards .
I actually bought a new OEM magnum dual outlet muffler for my 066 a few years ago.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Ed

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2018, 10:29:11 PM »
My 046 is a factory dual port saw, it ain't quiet and cuts like something possesed......think it enjoys a 36" bar.

I've had the pleasure of running a 066 redlight, NO comparison to the later models.

Ed

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2018, 11:29:50 PM »
So yesterday I removed my 066 Mag Red Light's cylinder for the first time since assembled in the factory 27 years ago.
Here's some pics of the piston and cylinder which only shows a light scuff on the intake side of the piston.

The cylinder looks very clean except for metallic sludge from the failing PTO bearing breaking down attracted to the spark plug.
The sludge actually bridged the plugs electrode gap and hardened after the saw was shut down and cooled off. The next day it wouldn't start but after clearing the plug's gap it fired right up.

This saw always burned 40:1 Stihl Premium mix with premium unleaded gasoline.
It never had a HD air filter on it, only the low profile nylon filter.  No need for the air compensator, the filter was always regularly cleaned.

One tough saw....  so valuable that I'm rebuilding it with new OEM parts and putting it back into my companies fleet. Maybe go for another 27 years.
Hope I do too, I'll then be 87 years old
:)


 

 

Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #15 on: March 24, 2018, 10:16:29 AM »
First pic is the 066 Mag red Light in a bin ready for cleaning and rebuild.
Notice the smooth bumper in my hand that will replace the saw's HD dual dogs.
The saw will be sporting a 20" ES lite bar, along with the narrow 064 flywheel and rewind housing.

Last pic is my newer 1996 066 which will have the HD dogs and with its heavier crankshaft and bearings will handle 28" and 36" b/c.


 

Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Spike60

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Re: 2051C and 066 "red light"
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2018, 07:07:17 AM »
Piston, rings, combustion chamber, and what we can see of the exhaust port are remarkably free of carbon build up! If anyone doubts that fresh fuel, good oil, and a clean air filter in a properly tuned saw is important, there's your proof right there. 

There is one local guy who is still cutting and selling firewood at 91, (be 92 in July), so there's a chance for us too.  :)  Had breakfast with him a short time ago. Sombody comes in with a post card from the town in the early 1900's, and asked him what street was in the picture. Ralph identified the street and then went on for 20 minutes telling stories about who owned what building, what they did, when they were torn down, when the bridge went out. 8-9 guys sat there without saying a word taking it all in. It was amazing.

Husqvarna-Jonsered
Ashokan Turf and Timber
845-657-6395


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