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Author Topic: 240D Jack  (Read 2595 times)

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Offline KyLogger

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240D Jack
« on: April 19, 2018, 06:41:36 PM »
Been a while since I've been on here! Anyhow, I recently (read last week) bought a 240D to replace "Peanut" the old 440 I sold a year and a half ago. Of course I got a deal on it and I am having to iron out some bugs on the old beast as well as learn a whole new machine and all it's quirks. I'm completely new to TJs and Detroits for that matter. I always had older Deere's, so I have a few questions. Number 1: Running it a little with very light turns in black pine the engine (4-53) would get up to 220ish and as low as 195ish. It was in the mid 40's and summer is coming on so.... Where should these motors be running at? Number 2: Everything else I need to know about Timberjacks..... Lol! No really I would like any info on the 240Ds that anybody has. Dates of production, manuals (can't find any online) winch (Eaton) info and manuals... as well as any advice anyone has on for them, hold the "check the fuel and fill up the oil" jokes lol!!  It's been a little over a year and a half since I had my own show and I am happy to be back to gyppoing Appalachian style once again. As always, thanks in advance.
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline Maine logger88

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2018, 09:48:40 PM »
220 is too hot for a 4-53 preferably no more than 190 any over 210 you risk cracking the head. Check the fan belts make sure there good and tight make sure the rad is clean if thatís all good maybe it needs a new thermostat or rad. Iíve had my 3-53 in my 225 up around 210 a couple times but it was on 90 degree days working the guts out of it with big hitches id have to stop part way out and hold it at a elevated idle for a minute or so to cool down then go again. I donít know when the 240d was introduced but it was made until 79 then they went to the E series. I bought a 85 240A this winter it seems to be a decent machine so far
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2018, 10:11:44 PM »
I had been doing some research on it and have seen a couple mentions of cracked heads. Are they really that prone to it? The 4 cylinder Deere motors would take some overheating on occasion without any trouble. I can clearly see where someone has been into the thermostat housing once or 15 times from all the multi colored, and layers of silicone. The belts seemed pretty good, and from the outside at least the radiator looks clean. I popped the cap on the radiator when it was at 220 or so and the water wasn't moving a bit. I am thinking a stuck thermostat or bad pump. If you left it idle for a bit it would return to 195ish. Also, I am used to putting around on a Deere with a turbo, do you really need to run these Detroits at WOT all the time? Like I said, this thing is a whole new animal to me.


Thanks!
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline Maine logger88

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2018, 10:20:59 PM »
I would definitely check the thermostat then it could be stuck or someone may have removed it which Can also make them overheat. They arenít prone to cracking if they are kept in there operating range but they wonít take being overheated like a Deere will. The needing to be wot never really bothered me going back and forth from my timber jacks to my 540 cause I run them all wot most of the time the hydraulics on my 540 work better that way. I do like my Deere skidder but all in all itís hard to beat a jack!
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Offline OntarioAl

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2018, 10:36:54 PM »
KyLogger
1/ drill a 1/8 hole through your flange of the thermostat It prevents an air lock from forming.
  These engines will crack a head in an eyewink if air is trapped in the head.
2/ Like others have said clean rad, belt tension, proper thermostat, and check the calibration of the Temp gauge.
3/Unfortunately Detroit's have a narrow power band so its wide open throttle (they love it) your neighbours won't.
Hope this helps
Al
Al Raman

Offline mike_belben

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2018, 10:50:33 PM »
I highly suggest pulling the lower radiator hose and looking up in there at how much sludge it has.  I did teardowns at a diesel shop few decades ago and they can get pretty nasty.  Ive seen radiators where the bottom outlet was almost plugged with rust and goo.


If it dont have a bypass coolant filter, do a few flushes and plumb one in.  
Revelation 3:20

Offline Maine logger88

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2018, 11:40:30 PM »
I agree on the lower rad hose seen a 3406e once someone put too much radiator stop leak in and it pretty much plugged it. Coolent filter is a good idea too!
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Offline mike_belben

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2018, 11:51:32 PM »
They should call that junk radiator stop-flow.


My dt466 took atleast 8, maybe 10 flushes with Dawn or CLR running it hot, plus running garden hose until clear in between.  it didnt fully clear up the rust until i did new heater core, hoses and a out of frame rebuild with a ton of time in the caustic tank.  Coolant filters really help keep the green stuff green instead of brown.
Revelation 3:20

Offline Maine logger88

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2018, 12:04:17 AM »
Hahahaha thatís for sure! Is your 466 mechanical or huei? Iím doing an inframe on a 530 right now if the works kit ever shows up. Could have gotten a aftermarket kit beginning of the week but the customer wanted oem 
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Offline mike_belben

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2018, 08:38:40 AM »
Mine is an 87 466C with a 10mm MW pump and quite a bit of hotrodding.  


Those motors can make a lot more cylinder pressure than the studs can keep in.
Revelation 3:20

Offline Maine logger88

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2018, 10:10:48 PM »
Hard to beat a good ole machinical although the 466e and 530 seem pretty good too. 
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2018, 05:06:02 AM »
I think I have it narrowed down to the radiator. I took the thermostat out, and ran the engine to 190F it got up over 200 again but ran cooler than yesterday. Took the cap off and revved motor with buddy watching, no circulation, no increase or decrease in volume in rad. Talked to my brother in law who is the mechanic at my father in laws excavating company and he agreed the radiator was probably in need of a good rodding out. Hopefully that's all it is and I can get back to work!

Tom
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline teakwood

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2018, 08:09:17 AM »
I came to the conclusion that if a vehicle overheats it's most likely the radiator which year after year start building up sludge inside the cores and gradually  reduces cooling capacity
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Offline Skeans1

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2018, 08:40:35 AM »
That almost sounds like a water pump to me, no movement of any water still overheats with no thermostat:

Offline mike_belben

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2018, 09:42:24 AM »
When back at the shop.. Drain coolant into buckets and park them in a corner to settle the trash to the bottom for later.  Do not disturb.  Siphon off the top or atleast scoop it out with a cup later on.  

Refill radiator with garden hose.  With cap off and thermostat out, pull the top hose at radiator and fire it up.  If you dont have a firehose worth of water coming out, its the pump.  If you do, its the radiator.  Ive never seen it but your water pump impeller may have fallen off the bearing spindle i guess.  

Im still betting on the botton radiator outlet nozzle being literally blocked with orange mud.
Revelation 3:20

Offline Skeans1

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2018, 10:14:02 AM »
Iíve seen the impeller spin on the shaft before not a fun deal to replace on that engine.

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2018, 08:33:12 PM »
The impeller on the water pump I assume? The pump itself is easy to remove and a rebuilt pump is relatively cheap. Judging by the amount of blue goo on the water pump it looks like somebody has already been inside the pump.
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline wildwoodfarmstead

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2018, 12:38:03 PM »
I had a JD backhoe that overheated like you describe. Radiator ran clear when trying to flush and cab heater cores had been removed by previous owner. Pulled water pump to find all fins worn right off the impeller, it just looked like a rounded off nut. Could not spare several paychecks for a pump from the dealer but for just one paycheck they sold me a new impeller and seals. The new impeller had blades about 1.5" long!! Suppose it was cavitation in the pump housing that caused it because coolant that came out was old but clean. Good luck!

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2018, 09:59:08 PM »
After wracking my brain and eliminating everything I could think of (radiator is in the shop) I finally found the previous owners number. Called him, he said he went through the same thing and had the radiator rodded, rebuilt the pump (which I could tell) and put a new thermostat in it. So.... that kind of disheartened me. But!!! Here is where I am either gonna beat my brains out some more trying to find the problem or kick myself in the hind end for overlooking something so simple. The temp gauge sensor lead was running against the exhaust manifold elbow..... Would it pick up heat there and give me a "false" reading on my gauge? Or is the temp only read by the sensor?

Here's to hoping I was just an idiot!
Tom
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline Oliver05262

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2018, 10:10:20 PM »
  I think you found most, if not all your problem. Temp gauge works by expansion of a fluid (mix of ether and alcohol)in the bulb-and since the lead is a tube filled with the same fluid, it would expand more of the fluid when heated.
  If that is your problem, you will wind up with a cooling system in top shape,  and a few less hairs on your head.
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Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2018, 10:28:42 PM »
Here's to hoping! The previous guy said it ran just fine and dandy for them, said if they gutted it with a big turn in the summer that she'd get to 200.

Tom
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline mike_belben

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #21 on: April 27, 2018, 01:25:09 AM »
 the gauge would get to 200.  Coolant may have been 165.  Verification of an actual issue is next step here. 

200 isnt an issue IMO.   Honestly the hotter it runs the better the fuel efficiency.  Fuel makes heat.  Heat goes 3 places.  Out exh, into water jacket and toward creating the pressure rise that will be applied to the piston crown in order to drive the rod down and spin the crank.  

If you wrap the exhaust and raise the stat, youve got 2 less places for the same amount of energy to be dissipated.  Guess where the remainder goes?  Into the crank.  

Best mileage:  highway in summer. 
Worst mileage: short trips in winter.  
Revelation 3:20

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #22 on: April 29, 2018, 07:20:28 AM »
After much angst and hours of wracking my brain.... I am 99% sure I have it figured out. I was running out of ideas when it hit me.... It was not circulating water, but the pump had just been rebuilt.... Blockage? Air lock? OrÖ some moron put a RH pump on the motor! Gonna order one tonight or try to find one relatively local. If this doesn't do it (it will) I'ma gonna have a cheap TJ for sale! Lol.  
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline mike_belben

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #23 on: April 29, 2018, 10:13:45 AM »
thatll do it
Revelation 3:20

Offline bigred1951

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #24 on: April 29, 2018, 10:14:44 AM »
Good to see you back on. Hey if itís cheap enough let me know lol

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #25 on: April 29, 2018, 05:43:56 PM »
Glad to be back!
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline bigred1951

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #26 on: April 29, 2018, 05:50:11 PM »
Not to many people close to me on here

Offline East ky logging

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #27 on: April 29, 2018, 08:07:34 PM »
Hey big red I seen that you went to the stave mill awhile back howís that working out. Iím in magoffin co. I used to haul in there quite a bit. I seen on the news that they are going to start building barrels I hope it works out because we can sure use the jobs around here.

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #28 on: April 29, 2018, 09:17:39 PM »
The only fault I had with the stave mill coming to town was their minimum diameter on white oak logs. In 10 years there won't be a white oak over 10" dbh left in 8 counties.
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!

Offline bigred1951

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #29 on: April 30, 2018, 05:38:50 PM »
Yea I worked there as a security guard for a couple months. Then one night they called and said the contract over your all out of work pretty much. Do drawed unemployment for a couple months now Iím working for a general contractor doing construction

Offline KWood255

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #30 on: May 10, 2018, 09:15:13 AM »
Just another idea here, but hopefully you have it solved. Those Detriots had both left hand and right hand rotation coolant pumps. Any chance yours has the wrong one? I just replaced one on my 3-53 last fall. Easy job on mine, so I'm assuming it's about the same on a 4-53. 

Offline KyLogger

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Re: 240D Jack
« Reply #31 on: May 10, 2018, 07:28:30 PM »
That was exactly the problem, no coolant flow. Someone threw a RH pump on this motor and it needed a LH. Like I said, I am a virgin to a Detroit, but after some research and hair pulling and talking to you all I finally figured it out. A three hour round trip drive and a new $150 pump and the ol' Jimmy runs cool as a cucumber! Thanks!
I only work old iron because I secretly have a love affair with my service truck!


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