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Author Topic: How to tell whats inside  (Read 2335 times)

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Offline rjwoelk

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How to tell whats inside
« on: July 06, 2018, 10:58:36 AM »
I got a load of logs from my supplier and in the process of cutting them for projects.
The problem is i have a good looking log nice and clean,ends are good no indication of problems till i get into it a couple of slabs. Then the rot shows up from lightning strike or something. Out of 18 48 ft logs i have had 3 that had bad areas in them . Hope i just got the garbage done. 
I am cutting western hemlock. When we did the cabin, out of the 2 loads only lost maybe 6 ft. 
Had one made into a 8x12 and just needed to make it a 8x10. Next cut and out of 24 ft log salvaged  10 ft the rest rot. Yesterday should have got 4  2x10. Got nothing. All trash except for the outside 1x and the slabs. :(
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Offline Jim_Rogers

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2018, 01:02:31 PM »
I keep track of the lumber yield from a log and only pay the logger on what I get that's good. If a log is junk you shouldn't be paying full price.
I don't know if your guy will do that or not but you should at least take pictures of the rot and show him next time and ask for credit.

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Offline moodnacreek

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2018, 01:06:37 PM »
If these defects cannot be detected from the outside then some deduction must be estimated from experience. Often the location where the logs [trees] grew tells the mill what to expect. If you don't buy often it will be hard to learn this.

Online Southside logger

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2018, 03:19:10 PM »
It is common to deduct either grade or footage from logs when scaling them, but you need to know what to look for. I personally have not heard of a mill that does it the way Jim described above, but if both parties agree, then it works.
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Offline CX3

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2018, 03:21:13 PM »
Jim I don't think many logs are bought and sold the way you have described. Any sawmill I have ever known buys the good with the bad. Especially if no defects are present. Logs like that are far and few between or we'd all be out of business.   

 
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Offline JB Griffin

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2018, 08:27:46 PM »
I keep track of the lumber yield from a log and only pay the logger on what I get that's good. If a log is junk you shouldn't be paying full price.
I don't know if your guy will do that or not but you should at least take pictures of the rot and show him next time and ask for credit.

Jim Rogers


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Offline Peter Drouin

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2018, 06:54:55 AM »
You get to tell good from bad by doing it. The rot spot came in on a branch. 
I got a load in yesterday, [Easter Hemlock] I bet there's some rot in there too
I do have to pay for all of it, less the defects. But if I miss something It's mine.


 

 


 
Then the rain came, wet trucker.  Just when he was done, the sun came out.  :D :D :D :D :D


 


 
24 footers too.
Had a customer buy 24'-22' and some 20' 6x8


 
After a while, you will have exray eyes.  ;D
Then just when you think your good at it you will miss some junk on one. :D :D
Good luck.

Offline rjwoelk

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2018, 09:52:41 AM »
Thanks Peter
 The one had a small scare on it maybe a ft long. That was the one on a 24 ft and it was gone inside except for 10 ft.
The others were close to were there was damage to the outside.  Some heavy checking was another. Like you say it will come with experience. Its just that its expensive.  My logs are coming 750 miles one way. But the price is right. Around 350 mbf. Logs and trucking. I hire the compny I drive for and I drive the truck and get payed to do it. 
 
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Offline mike_belben

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2018, 11:52:56 AM »
Dang yer kinda far from the woods buddy
Revelation 3:20

Offline rjwoelk

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2018, 02:34:30 AM »
Yup if you google map countrysidefirewood, thats were I am. Out in the bald prairie. ;D
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Offline PA_Walnut

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2018, 07:12:09 AM »
It's painful. Most of the loggers I get material from will make it right. Some, it's on you.

This big walnut yielded some nice slabs...until it didn't. Noted a dark section on one, then the next was bzzzzt....bzzzt...bzzzt. That infamous sound.  :-[

I've sawed walnut that huge holes in the middle too, with piles of ants dropping out.   >:( :o

Let the buyer beware.






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Offline Peter Drouin

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2018, 07:25:14 AM »
That stuff is easy to find. Why stick the rotting stuff?

Offline petefrom bearswamp

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2018, 08:46:11 AM »
Any shake in Western hemlock?
I deduct for obvious shake when I buy but it sometimes doesnt show up for a week or so.
Sawed only 7 8' logs last week in the oppressive heat and all had some shake but still managed-to salvage scale.
750 mile haul seems excessive to us easterners.
I scale and pay as Peter does, if defect doesnt show, I have to eat it.
Peter my trucker would be sweating bullets here with a heavy load  of Hemlock like that.
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Offline CX3

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2018, 09:57:21 AM »
You guys are putting blame on the wrong person. It is not the loggers fault that you bought and milled a rotten log. It's yours 
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Offline mike_belben

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2018, 01:01:17 PM »
I think its just part of the game and no one needs to point fingers.  

how many rotten trees does a logger buy on the stump and cant do much with?  Probably more than the sawyers.  I know theyve ruined my day plenty of times. 
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Offline Brad_bb

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2018, 01:33:20 PM »
Trees are like a box of chocolates....you neva know what you're gonna get.  I think you just have to factor in a certain percentage of loss due to rot/defects to what you pay or sell for.  If both parties have been doing it for awhile they understand this.  With that in mind you either buy at an acceptable price or you don't.  If you have such long trucking distance as Bob has and that cost involved, having more loss  than normal really hurts I'm sure.  It's a lot easier dealing with without that cost.  I offered him clear walnut, but he didn't want that cheap inferior US wood. ;D
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Offline rjwoelk

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2018, 07:01:16 PM »
Not blamin anyone just need to look at my logs with a better eye.

Not much for shake in our hemlock.

Brad i am going to surprise you one day.  :D
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Offline PA_Walnut

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #17 on: July 09, 2018, 06:29:24 AM »
That stuff is easy to find. Why stick the rotting stuff?


On a 10' flitch with a 2-3' rotten spot, there's still plenty of usable material. I disagree that rot and metal is easy to find. Both logs pictured, exhibited little/no sign of it. Scanned the log, but metal was too deep to pick it up. Rot was under a knot and couldn't be seen until 2 or 3 slabs came off.

I neither blame nor expect loggers to take responsibility, but the major ones I deal with do, and try to make it right. Just as I would if someone purchased lumber from me that exhibited a defect after it left my possession. I view the risk as mine, yet appreciate a concession when appropriate. If I wanted lesser risk, I'd purchase sawn material instead.
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Offline Peter Drouin

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #18 on: July 09, 2018, 06:40:45 AM »
That stuff is easy to find. Why stick the rotting stuff?


On a 10' flitch with a 2-3' rotten spot, there's still plenty of usable material. I disagree that rot and metal is easy to find. Both logs pictured, exhibited little/no sign of it. Scanned the log, but metal was too deep to pick it up. Rot was under a knot and couldn't be seen until 2 or 3 slabs came off.

I neither blame nor expect loggers to take responsibility, but the major ones I deal with do, and try to make it right. Just as I would if someone purchased lumber from me that exhibited a defect after it left my possession. I view the risk as mine, yet appreciate a concession when appropriate. If I wanted lesser risk, I'd purchase sawn material instead.


 ... Good luck.

Offline Just Right

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Re: How to tell whats inside
« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2018, 06:58:12 AM »
PA. . . with that rotted slab . . . and all the current resins and epoxies that people are using. . . . That one should make a fine piece of work.  But where do you get those stickers?  Make them?  Thanks.  JR
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