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Author Topic: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards  (Read 726 times)

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Offline Ruffneck

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Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« on: July 30, 2018, 10:57:25 PM »
Hello my Forestry Forum Friends,

It has been a long time since I've checked in. It has been a crazy year that has found me hustling to make some big moves. The old house is moving forward and I need to get things wrapped up ASAP to make it "safe, sanitary and habitable" for an appraisal. 

I've decided to put cedar drop siding on the garage and screwed the siding with stainless steel screws. I had just enough to do the job. I have read that the siding should be stained on all sides before installation. Is that the right way to do it? 

While installing the siding I leveled the bottom row and just stacked the siding and face screwed two screws per stud. Should I have left any space between the siding for expansion? The siding is a couple years old and well dried. 

I'm installing a privacy fence. The cedar boards a very dry. How far should I space the to allow for expansion?

Thanks in advance! I'll keep you all updated as I progress.

Ruffneck




    

Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2018, 12:59:26 PM »
I'm spacing my boards using 16d nails and fastening with stainless steel screws. I think letting them weather grey would match the house OK.
Hope that's enough space :-\








 

Offline florida

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2018, 03:01:23 PM »
One nail per stud is the standard. It should be low on the siding so that it is free to expand and contract. I know it's too late but don't use screws on siding. 
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Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2018, 01:28:58 PM »
Thanks Florida,

Why are screws bad? I've used stainless steel screws for the cedar siding, just enough to hold them in place. I wasn't sure if I would have enough to do the job after sorting and trimming knots and all. I plan on removing it and staining all sides now. 

This is a side view of the old siding, it appears to have been spaced apart during installation. What I've found on the installation of "Dutch Lap" siding is to start from the bottom and stack and secure the siding as you go, trying to match up the "shadow line" of adjacent walls.


 

 Another thing about the old siding is, it was face nailed with two nails at each stud. This is the pine siding I'm installing, again just tacked up, I'll remove again to prime all sides before final installation. I'll nail one nail per stud down low on the board. will 8 D galvanized nails be sufficient? 


 

I've continued to install my cedar fence boards , spacing them one 16 D nail width apart, hoping it's enough  :D

Thanks again for any and all input!

Stay safe,

Ruffneck


Offline florida

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2018, 01:41:06 PM »
Wood siding needs to be able to move so it doesn't crack or separate. The screws have to pull the siding so tight to get the screw heads to sink that it locks the siding in place. When the siding tries to move, and it will move, it will crack around the screw. By all means use SS but next time use ring shank nails.
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Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2018, 02:10:59 PM »
Thanks, that make sense. I added more to my previous post after your reply, I accidentally posted it before it was completed. Oops. Stainless steel ring shanked nail sounds like the way to go. 8 D? Could I use galvanized nails for the pine siding? It'll be painted. Or some other cheaper fastener then stainless? 

Offline 47sawdust

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2018, 06:20:21 PM »
6d galvanized boxnails work just fine.Maze brand nails are best if you can find them in your area.We also call that type of siding Novelty siding.Very popular for camps and garages.It goes up quick and looks great.I just finished a garage for a customer and it looks really sharp.
Mick
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Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2018, 01:17:11 PM »
Thanks for the input gentlemen. This is a picture of the old siding, it looks like they left a space in between. The siding I'm replacing it with isn't 1/4 sawn. As I've mentioned, they used 2 nails per stud to fasten it. the siding is 7 1/2 inches wide. With only one nail per stud wouldn't the siding be more susceptible to cupping? 


 

Offline 47sawdust

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2018, 01:45:09 PM »
Good point on the nailing.The siding I put up is typically 5''.I think the old siding in your picture may have shrunk.I don't know how you would go about creating a space between the courses,unless you had snapped lines to go to which seems like a real pain.
Mick
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Offline WDH

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2018, 07:43:06 AM »
Looks like the old siding boards were installed green and they shrunk as they dried in place.
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Offline Magicman

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2018, 05:30:43 PM »
But they were allowed to float underneath the lap which prevented them from splitting and also from cupping.  :P
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Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2018, 01:29:49 PM »
I've taken down the cedar siding so I can stain it. It's recommended to stain all sides with an oil based stain. I tacked the siding up using #10 stainless steel screws. I'm thinking I could replace the screws with the right type of nail.
I thought galvanized nails shouldn't be used with cedar. Any suggestions on the type and size of nails to replace the screws with?

But they were allowed to float underneath the lap which prevented them from splitting and also from cupping.  :P



When I reinstall, I'm thinking I'll nail it on like the old siding and put two nails per stud and just face nail them. There are no nails at the laps. Is that what you mean about floating underneath?

As far as spacing dry cedar fence boards. Will my spacing of one 16 nail be sufficient on a untreated board. That's what I've been doing so far, and using the #10 stainless steel screws :-\

Thank you so much for all the input.  
 

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #12 on: August 13, 2018, 02:09:14 PM »
Correct. If the fastener went through both pieces and any shrinkage occurred, something would have to split.
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Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2018, 10:47:48 PM »
Thanks for all the help friends!

It's hard for me to commit the time to research information with all the irons I have in the fire right now, but I was just able to track down the info I was looking for from Real Cedar. 

They described the installation of 8 inch wide siding: 
"Lap siding can be installed horizontally or vertically. For horizontal applications, start with the bottom course and work up with the channels pointing upwards. Allow a 1/8 inch expansion gap between pieces if the siding is air or kiln-dried. Do not nail through overlaps. For siding up to 6 inches wide, use one nail one inch up from the lap. Face nail with two nails per piece for 8 inches patterns and wider, keeping nails 2-1/2 to 3 inches apart to allow for dimensional movement without splitting. For vertical applications, siding should be nailed to horizontal blocking or furring strips."

This addressed my concern about leaving room for expansion. I'll have to leave an 1/8 of an inch. That'll make things more fun.  ::)

Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Installation of 105 Drop Siding and Cedar Fence Boards
« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2018, 10:31:33 PM »
I've read to install my fence boards with the #10 stainless screws. Shouldn't there be concern for movement, like the siding?  


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