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Author Topic: Vacutherm iDry input  (Read 23101 times)

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Offline C_Koon

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #340 on: July 20, 2019, 12:02:10 PM »
Ok.  Iíve been saying Im gonna start posting and quit stalking yall so here we go.  
   I got my idry about 6 weeks ago.  Mostly been drying walnut and oak thatís been air drying for 4-16 months. So far so good. 
 The last load to go in the kiln was some 4/4 pecan for a customer. Iím charging 15 cents per bf per day. What are your thoughts on the pricing.  Is it fair to both me and the customer?

   Also just want to say thanks for all the knowledge and wisdom on here.  Really good stuff!

Offline Just Right

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #341 on: July 20, 2019, 02:10:03 PM »
WDH . . . NC Daniel nailed it.  That is exactly what I am seeing.  If your tired of waiting on the 9/4 it won't take long to throw it in and finish it up for you.  Plus you need to come visit anyway.

C Koon I like the price per foot per day math too.  I am just trying to settle on .10 and .15. . .. . seems to me that telling a customer .15 a foot per day is A LOT less sticker shock than 1.50 a board foot.  Some of the other considerations are type of wood and how long has it been air drying.  So 3 inch slabs that are at 12 percent and basically only need a good heat treatment won't cost a customer a nice lil chunk,  When they only need a couple of days.  There is sure a lot to learn and figure out for sure.
If you are enjoying what you are doing,  is it still work?

Offline C_Koon

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #342 on: July 20, 2019, 10:13:22 PM »
I just canít see charging a flat bf price. Ex.  Green 4/4 white oak vs 4/4 air dried walnut thatís 20% moisture. Very different drying times. 

Offline busenitzcww

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #343 on: July 20, 2019, 10:26:08 PM »

The lumber stack for my model can be 13' L x 48" W x 55" T. So if you loaded had 1 1/8" lumber and 3/4 stickers you could get 29 rows of lumber at 52 bdft a row in a perfect world, that comes to 1508 bdft. My average 4/4 load is more like 1200 bdft. The lower bdft is from not every board being 13' long, having some live edge pieces where you can't put boards perfectly side by side, and I prefer to load with a forklift on pallets to cut down on labor (similar to your pic above actually). The pallets cost a couple of rows of lumber unfortunately. My current forklift can not lift a full of green for the kiln so I have to use two pallets unfortunately.
The bdft per load increases with thicker lumber since the lumber to sticker ratio is better.
So they advertise it at 2000 bf capacity... is that the perfect load of 12/4 ?

Offline Just Right

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #344 on: July 20, 2019, 10:35:54 PM »
I don't know about a perfect load.  I rarely do 13 ft board/boards.  I have done several loads of big slabs and they just take up space.
If you are enjoying what you are doing,  is it still work?

Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #345 on: July 21, 2019, 10:09:52 AM »
That's exactly what I found by calculation.  If I assumed 12ft long 42" 8/4 slabs and 3/4 stickers, I get 1680 BF.  If I assume 8' plus 4' long 5/4 boards with 3/4 stickers, I get 1440 BF(perfectly packed 48" wide layers).  You have to figure realistic numbers into your payback calculation.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Offline busenitzcww

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #346 on: July 21, 2019, 02:21:36 PM »
That's exactly what I found by calculation.  If I assumed 12ft long 42" 8/4 slabs and 3/4 stickers, I get 840 BF.  If I assume 8' plus 4' long 5/4 boards with 3/4 stickers, I get 1440 BF(perfectly packed 48" wide layers).  You have to figure realistic numbers into your payback calculation.
Shouldnít your bf rate go up with thicker stock? Lumber to sticker ratio should go down not? Or am I thinking backwards?

Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #347 on: July 21, 2019, 02:36:50 PM »
Theoretically, but logs you slab are not necessarily consistent.  You Can't get 48" wide slabs consistently.  Say your slabbing a 38" log.  Your top and bottom slabs may only be 24" or less? while your center slabs will be 38.  I was very optimistic/liberal by assuming that all slabs were 42".  I've only had 2 logs that were 48 at the widest point(where the crotch starts to flare).  36" is not unusual.  So you won't be making a solid stack with live edge.  If you have 8/4 boards to fill some of it in, great, but it still won't be tightly packed due to live edges.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Offline busenitzcww

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #348 on: July 21, 2019, 04:36:09 PM »
Theoretically, but logs you slab are not necessarily consistent.  You Can't get 48" wide slabs consistently.  Say your slabbing a 38" log.  Your top and bottom slabs may only be 24" or less? while your center slabs will be 38.  I was very optimistic/liberal by assuming that all slabs were 42".  I've only had 2 logs that were 48 at the widest point(where the crotch starts to flare).  36" is not unusual.  So you won't be making a solid stack with live edge.  If you have 8/4 boards to fill some of it in, great, but it still won't be tightly packed due to live edges.
Oh gotcha!

Offline NC Daniel

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #349 on: July 22, 2019, 10:38:15 AM »
@Brad_bb For 12'L x 42"W x 8/4 with 3/4 stickers I get 1680 BF, one of us is off by a factor of 2. 

A perfect 12/4 load comes to 2184 BF, if my math is right.
Woodmizer LT40SHDWide, iDRY 2.0

Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #350 on: July 22, 2019, 02:56:37 PM »
@Brad_bb For 12'L x 42"W x 8/4 with 3/4 stickers I get 1680 BF, one of us is off by a factor of 2.

A perfect 12/4 load comes to 2184 BF, if my math is right.
You are correct, I forgot to multiply by 2 for the thickness.  Still, it's only 1680, just a bit better than a 5/4 load.  And that 1680 assumes an average of 42" slabs, which is a liberal assumption in my opinion.  Reality would probably be lower.  And have 8/4 boards to fill it out, will not always be possible.  My whole point is to do your own math for payback to determine if it's worth it for you.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Offline Stephen1

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #351 on: July 25, 2019, 07:26:57 AM »

I am drying 3 loads of 4/4 pine for my son in law right now and it was dry in 3 days. it is 800 bd ft of 4/4 per load with 4 large 3" x 32" 13' sugar maple slabs on top also. I just keep lifting the maple off and replacing. I can switch it out in 15 minutes. 
IDRY Vacum Kiln, LT40HDWide, BMS250 sharpener/setter 742b Bobcat, TCM forklift, Sthil 026,038, 461. 1952 TEA Fergusan Tractor

Offline E-Tex

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #352 on: September 02, 2019, 08:19:49 PM »
@Stephen1
@NC Daniel
@Just Right
@Glenn1
@C_Koon
@Busysawyer

It's been 5-6 weeks since any updates on this thread.

I'm curious of your drying successes/challenges.
Have you come up with prices for drying for others?
How many loads are you running a month?
Average bf size of loads
Making money?
Any cool pics?

Any problems with the unit or other unforeseen issues 

Thanks

LT-50 Wide, Mahindra 6065
L2 Sawmill LLC

Offline Stephen1

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #353 on: September 03, 2019, 08:36:14 AM »
I have done quite well with the IDRY. I have people comng from 2-3 hr away to have thier wood dryed, especially furniture makers who have airdried their wood and now need to build with it. I can give them back kiln dried, sterilized wood 6-8% in under 10 days. They love it.
I run 10 day cycle, prorate the 2nd or 3rd cycle dependiing on how green and thick the wood is.
I dried 1800 bd ft  of pine for my son-in-law and had it ready for his project in under 10 days. The pine had been sawn in april, it was in and out of the kiln in 4 days per load. we had to split the load to make it fit as it was 8-10-12' long so it all did not go in at once. Each bundle was dry in 2-3 days
We average 12-1500 bd ft per load. We have had paying lumber in the kiln since the 2nd load.
The 2000 bd ft comes from a fulll load of 4/4 13' long. We haven't  run into that yet.
I also put in big thick slabs with other wood and monitor as I empty and fill the kiln. 
I mix loads of wood all the time. 
IDRY Vacum Kiln, LT40HDWide, BMS250 sharpener/setter 742b Bobcat, TCM forklift, Sthil 026,038, 461. 1952 TEA Fergusan Tractor

Offline C_Koon

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #354 on: September 03, 2019, 10:18:35 PM »
So far Iíve been pleased with the iDRY.   I mostly dry my own lumber and slabs to sell.  It seems like Iím getting better results when i start the kiln off at 130 degrees for several days rather than 160.   Mainly less checking.  Trying to maximize space in the kiln can be a real challenge with slabs. 

Offline Stephen1

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #355 on: September 04, 2019, 07:31:49 AM »
So far Iíve been pleased with the iDRY.   I mostly dry my own lumber and slabs to sell.  It seems like Iím getting better results when i start the kiln off at 130 degrees for several days rather than 160.   Mainly less checking.  Trying to maximize space in the kiln can be a real challenge with slabs.  
Are you taking the lumber right off the mill and using the low power setting? 
Is it just the slabs? or are you using the LP for the lumber also?
IDRY Vacum Kiln, LT40HDWide, BMS250 sharpener/setter 742b Bobcat, TCM forklift, Sthil 026,038, 461. 1952 TEA Fergusan Tractor

Offline NC Daniel

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #356 on: September 04, 2019, 01:37:02 PM »
I have only dried my own lumber so no pricing, but I think the $0.10 per bdft per day that's been thrown around is a good starting point. I did have a part fail on my machine and I received the replacement next day under warranty. So A+ on the customer service there. Took 5-10 mins to replace the part.
To me the big advantage of the iDRY that is not really directly been talked about much is how it allows you have less/turnover faster your inventory. From what I see the most efficient practice for DH Kilns is to let your lumber air dry and then finish it off with the kiln. That means maybe 6 months to a year (maybe even longer for thick slabs) before you can sell the lumber for maximum value. It also means you have to have a tremendous amount of wood sitting around air drying in order to keep your DH kiln busy. There is a hardwood mill close by to me that has mountains of lumber air drying, every time I drive by I'm glad I chose to go with an iDRY. Being able to go from a tree to sellable kiln dried product in a couple weeks is priceless for me. These problems are alleviated if you are drying for other people because then you aren't sitting on the inventory. However, my interest is in producing the highest quality lumber I can to sell, not drying for other people although I may in the future. For me the lumber business is currently just a very labor and capital intensive hobby/side business. I have a different full time job but I hope to be able to build up the reputation and clientele to make the swap to full time lumber business sooner than later.
Woodmizer LT40SHDWide, iDRY 2.0

Offline Just Right

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #357 on: September 04, 2019, 04:30:35 PM »
ETex

I am sure the rest of the guys are like me.  Loading and unloading the IDRY.  Been running mine wide open since I put it in service and have a waiting list already.  I have only had 4 small slabs of my own wood dried in it so far.  The rest of the time it is full of customers wood.  I haven't had any failures with the machine so to speak.  But  . . . .down here in GA with the summertime thunderstorms . . . . . if there is any power spikes or hiccups it will need to be checked and I'll have to reset circuit breakers on the machine. Pricing . . . . well I start at a dollar a BF and go up from there. . . . a quarter increase in price for every 1/4 inch.  No body has had a problem with that so far.  I try to run mine as full as I can get it.  If not full I will put some baffling in it to force the air thru the stack.  Power bill for it has been running about 350 or less monthly.  I have had good success with walnut pine pecan sassafrass china berry birch white oak poplar and probably some more that escapes me right at the moment.  The 2 inch white oak that I just unloaded today took just under 4 wks to dry.  Had about 2.5 to 3 weeks air drying before going in the kiln.  Since I only started this business last year,  my biggest challenge is getting enough buildings and sheds built.  I run out of covered space ALOT.  I am thrilled with mine and would love to buy the big boy.  Just can't stomach that price tag!

 

Book matched quarter sawn Sycamore that I cut and dried for a customer.  40 inch wide and 10 foot long.
If you are enjoying what you are doing,  is it still work?

Offline NC Daniel

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #358 on: September 04, 2019, 04:39:09 PM »
Just Right, That's some beautiful stuff!
Woodmizer LT40SHDWide, iDRY 2.0

Offline E-Tex

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Re: Vacutherm iDry input
« Reply #359 on: September 05, 2019, 11:04:06 AM »
Thanks for all the updates 👍
LT-50 Wide, Mahindra 6065
L2 Sawmill LLC


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