The Forestry Forum is sponsored in part by:

TURBOSAWMILL GIANT SALE ON NOW UNTIL OCTOBER 31st


Forestry Forum
Sponsored by:


TimberKing Sawmills



Toll Free 1-800-582-0470

LogRite Tools



Norwood Industries Inc.


Sawmill & Woodlot Magazine



Your source for Portable Sawmills, Edgers, Resaws, Sharpeners, Setters, Bandsaw Blades and Sawmill Parts

EZ Boardwalk Sawmills. More Saw For Less Money!

STIHLDealers.com sponsored by Northeast STIHL


Woodland Sawmills

Peterson Swingmills

 KASCO SharpTech WoodMaxx Blades

Turbosawmill

Sawmill Exchange

BRUTE FORCE Authorized Dealer

Woodshax Outdoor Vending Solutions

FARMA


Council Tool

Baker Products

ECHO-Bearcat



Author Topic: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees  (Read 2536 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Klunker

  • Full Member
  • **
  • Posts: 94
  • Location: SE Wisconsin
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« on: September 24, 2018, 02:16:31 AM »
 

 

We had some wind/tornado damage in our woods.
Lots of blown over trees and hung up trees.
Some trees are almost parallel with the ground and lots of them are up to 45 degree angle to the ground. The roots have pulled up with them leaving a big ball of soil.
Plan on turning some of the damaged trees into lumber.
Lots of heavy leaners/hung up trees.

This is one of the worse. A double tree that is hung up on a bunch of still standing trees.

Any words of wisdom on how to cut this type of tree.
I can't cut the tree/trees that it is hung up on.

Thanks in advance.


Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3321
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2018, 07:43:34 AM »
What do you have for equipment and whats your skill level?  What have you got for saws?
Revelation 3:20

Offline Klunker

  • Full Member
  • **
  • Posts: 94
  • Location: SE Wisconsin
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2018, 09:32:52 AM »
What do you have for equipment and whats your skill level?  What have you got for saws?
I have a 30hp tractor with a grapple.
Skill level, I'm not a "professional", but I'm also not a newbie.
I certainly know this is a very dangerous situation.
Saws, largest I have is a Husky 562xp, 20" bar.
My first concern is if the top of the trunk is in compression or tension.
Hard to tell at times if the crown is holding it up or the remain roots are.

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3321
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2018, 09:44:22 AM »
This thread had a lot of good info recently.  

Blow down salvage in Forestry and Logging

I can summarize most of my contribution by saying the unexpected is what causes injury and at times a saw should be used less for severing and more as an exploratory tool to predetermine the tree's condition by whittling gills or wedges out so internak tensions and compressions can relax and dissipate before severing.

Be careful and have a partner who can get you out or call for help. Wear your gear and think it thru, no 2nd chances.

If your tractor grapple can clamp a piece of log, use it like a joust to bust stuff you have pre-cut.  

Revelation 3:20

Offline lxskllr

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 229
  • Age: 49
  • Location: MD USA
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2018, 11:26:52 AM »
I don't know much about anything, but I like Mike's advice to make test cuts to relieve tension. I'd clean up the immediate area so it's virtually spotless(no tripping, plenty of room for escape), and then work on the problem trees. Light cuts, and go slow while watching everything carefully. Once it's free enough, you can then start pulling with machines.

Offline Hilltop366

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2202
  • Location: Nova Scotia
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2018, 12:23:45 PM »
An online resource may help.

https://woodlot.novascotia.ca/content/lesson-seven-bucking.



If unsure I do a bit of "nibbling" to try and see what is going on then proceed to jam my saw. :D


Offline John Mc

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 4838
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Monkton, Vermont
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2018, 12:56:01 PM »
If unsure I do a bit of "nibbling" to try and see what is going on then proceed to jam my saw. :D
 

Yes, exactly! It's important to do some exploratory work first so you can be sure that final cut will thoroughly jam your saw.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3321
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2018, 01:50:07 PM »
 ;D

If theres no kerf theres nothing to get jammed between.  Another issue the beaver has solved over the ages.  

Translation:  when a kerf starts getting deep, make another right next to it that intersects the first.  Pie slices will give you jam free clearance to whittle all day.  If it starts closing, more pie.  More pie cant be wrong.
Revelation 3:20

Offline Southside logger

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2875
  • Age: 46
  • Location: Wilsons (Dinwiddie County), VA
  • Gender: Male
  • Have a plan to saw every log you meet.
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2018, 02:01:54 PM »
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3321
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2018, 02:15:45 PM »
 musteat_1 digin1

I rest my case.
Revelation 3:20

Online Skeans1

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 808
  • Location: Rainier, OR
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2018, 02:19:20 PM »
One thing with blow down is run a long bar on a big saw you can use a face as mike is saying, an open would be a choice or a humboldt face. Best advice when cutting timber Ive ever gotten was if you have to ask how dont do it, you need a someone with the knowledge to learn from.

Offline Southside logger

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2875
  • Age: 46
  • Location: Wilsons (Dinwiddie County), VA
  • Gender: Male
  • Have a plan to saw every log you meet.
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #11 on: September 25, 2018, 02:37:14 PM »
Pie and jam in a thread about blow downs - it always goes to food around here.   ;D
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.

Offline mills

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 235
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Kentucky
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #12 on: September 25, 2018, 08:15:29 PM »
Hard to tell from this picture, so don't take this as gospel. 
I'm guessing that the bottom tree is hung tight at the top, and the top tree is holding it in place at the bottom. The top tree may or may not be supported well at the top, but looks like the root ball is going to be pulling back to the hole. I'd bore cut the bottom tree first starting at the center and working both ways until the tree tells you which way it wants to go. I'd then cut the top in the same manner with the expectation that root ball will put more pressure on the trunk than the top will. 
I will now go back to my corner and await the other responses. A lot of you boys have a lot more experience cutting blow downs as I do, so nail away. Got to have fun with it.
;D  :P  ;D

Offline John Mc

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 4838
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Monkton, Vermont
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #13 on: September 25, 2018, 08:51:30 PM »
It's going to take a lot more than a single picture of part of the trees for me to comment with much that will be of any help on storm damaged trees. Storm damage clean up is one of the more dangerous aspects of work in the woods. If you want to tackle this yourself, and do not have a lot of experience at this, I'd suggest finding a friend to walk you through things and make suggestions.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Offline Southside logger

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2875
  • Age: 46
  • Location: Wilsons (Dinwiddie County), VA
  • Gender: Male
  • Have a plan to saw every log you meet.
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #14 on: September 25, 2018, 09:36:47 PM »
Not knowing whats around and like John said - it would really take a lot more overview to assess the situation.  Is there any way to get a big skidder in there to hook a winch to these and either pull them out by the root ball, stand one back up, or even pull it down the rest of the way?  If not can you get a big dozer or excavator in there to work from the rootball side and get the stress out so it comes down?  

There are no really GOOD options that involve being on the ground with a saw in a mess like that - at least not to start, maybe once you have some place for stuff to go, but at first there are a lot of unknowns, not saying it can't be done, but in the safety of a cab perhaps it can be done with less risk of bodily injury.  

Many years back, I was a teenager, I watched a homeowner sawing away at a storm felled tree - it was a big one and honestly he did not belong working on it.  Well, he got the top off just as the main trunk vaulted him into the air as the rootball pulled it back up, he must have gone 15 or more feet straight up and just as far horizontally, I will never forget the noise he made when he hit the ground, I also remember that it took a very long time for the ambulance to get there.  I never found out how bad he was hurt, but it was bad for sure.    
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3321
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #15 on: September 25, 2018, 09:55:14 PM »
This may not go over well here and im not advocating it for anyone, but i walk up trunks like that and cut pieces off or set cables once or twice a year, 2, 3 , 4 trees stacked and tangled or propped into a pecker pole.  The last one i did was a bushel of bign's propped up  over some expensive headstones.  I walked up and whittled and winched it all apart.

Its hard to known whats going on inside a pinned tree in person, impossible to be certain through a photo.  The man with the saw has to be asking a lot of questions and considering a lot of scenarios and CANNOT BE PRESSED FOR TIME.  It takes as long as it takes and verifying your theory is important. Rushing it will cost you life and limb.   The risk doesnt end at pinch or stump stands.  You can be standing on a barberchair or under a log that rolls or kicks. Theres limb flings and hornets and rot and jammed together crotches, saw kickback, losing your balance and falling on a saw or into a limb pocket you cant get out of, getting a foot pinned. It all comes into play.  

I am self taught and always solo.  The good Lord probably got me this far, but being overly cautious probably makes the job easier on Him.  
Revelation 3:20

Offline Tramp Bushler

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 215
  • Location: AK
  • Gender: Male
  • I am blessed
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #16 on: September 26, 2018, 05:09:54 AM »
One thing with blow down is run a long bar on a big saw you can use a face as mike is saying, an open would be a choice or a humboldt face. Best advice when cutting timber Ive ever gotten was if you have to ask how dont do it, you need a someone with the knowledge to learn from.


 Blowdown is just flat Deadly. Fresh blowdown is the worst. Everything is loaded like a grizzly trap.
 You NEED a long enough bar so that your dogs never come close to touching wood. BECAUSE, you WILL GET HUNG UP !!!! No part of If you get hung. Just how soon after you start cutting and how many times.
 A 562 will pull a 28" bar. That's a short bar, but the longest small Husky mount.
 Perfectly straight cutting , razor sharp chains are necessary.
 
 Always start on the bottom tree. And if possible start at the top of the bottom tree And work your way to the butt.
 Sometimes I run 4 kerfs . more often I make 3 kerfs and run them all the way .  You need a spare bar of the same length and spare chains.
 
 Bucking Blowdown is really a job for a professional timber faller.
 Honest and true . Its just stupid dangerous.
You don't have to worry about brown bear when your power saw is running . But you better have something big with you if it's not .
 If your not wearing your hard hat when you need it. Well.

Online Skeans1

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 808
  • Location: Rainier, OR
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #17 on: September 26, 2018, 05:24:02 AM »
One thing with blow down is run a long bar on a big saw you can use a face as mike is saying, an open would be a choice or a humboldt face. Best advice when cutting timber Ive ever gotten was if you have to ask how dont do it, you need a someone with the knowledge to learn from.


 Blowdown is just flat Deadly. Fresh blowdown is the worst. Everything is loaded like a grizzly trap.
 You NEED a long enough bar so that your dogs never come close to touching wood. BECAUSE, you WILL GET HUNG UP !!!! No part of If you get hung. Just how soon after you start cutting and how many times.
 A 562 will pull a 28" bar. That's a short bar, but the longest small Husky mount.
 Perfectly straight cutting , razor sharp chains are necessary.
 
 Always start on the bottom tree. And if possible start at the top of the bottom tree And work your way to the butt.
 Sometimes I run 4 kerfs . more often I make 3 kerfs and run them all the way .  You need a spare bar of the same length and spare chains.
 
 Bucking Blowdown is really a job for a professional timber faller.
 Honest and true . Its just stupid dangerous.
Yeah it is and many good fallers have been killed over the years bucking the stuff. Hey now take it easy on my little 562 itll run a 32 its a large mount husky.
On a side note hows Tramp doing? Hows the truck been treating you these days?

Offline Peter Drouin

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 8688
  • Location: New Hampshire
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
    • A&P Saw mill LLC
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #18 on: September 26, 2018, 06:50:37 AM »
Cut some on the bottom of the tree near the stump, Cut from the top till the tree falls off the stump, watch the stump. Pull out with a tractor.

Offline HolmenTree

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3635
  • Age: 60
  • Location: Manitoba
  • Gender: Male
  • "Been there, done that........and still learning"
    • Share Post
Re: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees
« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2018, 07:06:16 AM »
D8 dozer with forestry canopy and a feller buncher on tracks if there's alot more then in pic.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.


Share via delicious Share via digg Share via facebook Share via linkedin Share via pinterest Share via reddit Share via stumble Share via tumblr Share via twitter

moved
MOVED: Cutting hung up heavy leaning trees

Started by chet on Ask The Forester

0 Replies
100 Views
Last post September 25, 2018, 07:30:05 AM
by chet
xx
Trying hard not to swear - guy cutting great trees for posts :( (photo heavy)

Started by asy on General Board

69 Replies
11982 Views
Last post October 10, 2005, 12:28:17 PM
by Gilman
xx
tripping hung trees

Started by murphy4trees on Forestry and Logging

24 Replies
6305 Views
Last post October 14, 2010, 06:35:13 PM
by beenthere
xx
cut used to remove hung trees

Started by murphy4trees on Urban and Community Forestry

13 Replies
11459 Views
Last post March 04, 2014, 12:52:52 PM
by LittleJohn
 


Powered by EzPortal