The Forestry Forum is sponsored in part by:

AVAILABLE


Forestry Forum
Sponsored by:


TimberKing Sawmills



Toll Free 1-800-582-0470

LogRite Tools



Norwood Industries Inc.


Sawmill & Woodlot Magazine



Your source for Portable Sawmills, Edgers, Resaws, Sharpeners, Setters, Bandsaw Blades and Sawmill Parts

EZ Boardwalk Sawmills. More Saw For Less Money!

STIHLDealers.com sponsored by Northeast STIHL


Woodland Sawmills

Peterson Swingmills

 KASCO SharpTech WoodMaxx Blades

Turbosawmill

Sawmill Exchange

BRUTE FORCE Authorized Dealer

Woodshax Outdoor Vending Solutions

FARMA


Council Tool

Baker Products

ECHO-Bearcat



Author Topic: Seeking source for education in "sound" bandsaw mill design and construction.  (Read 4935 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3563
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
We may be twins.  I was in the marines, i sold my business to up and move, and i like coffee with my daily junk to build today so i can get out of the camper life list.  


Ill try to get a post and some pics up for you later tonight.  Im just a phase ahead of you in the curve right now, running a basic chainsaw slabbing track rig to learn the ropes and ponder my big sawmill build.  All diesely and hydraulic-ee and such.  If youre ever on your way to knoxville PM me and stop by. im 3hrs east, few minutes off 40. 

Structural shapes are important and i have some commentary on where i went wrong with that.  Clamps too. 
Revelation 3:20

Offline MikeySP

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Age: 50
  • Location: Middle, TN
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Crusarius, 200 lbs weight savings is nothing to laugh at. As I consider this, I will be driven partially by what I have available. I happen to have some 3x3x.1875 @ 6.87lb per foot. I thought I could stitch weld two together and have a 3x6 tube. It will be 13.75lb per ft though.  I do have some .125 stock, but it would have to be half and half. The .125 thickness is 4.75lbs per square foot, so the total would be 11.63lb per square foot. 

mike_belben thanks for the invite. I look forward to hearing about your lessons learned. Semper Fi!



Offline Crusarius

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1768
  • Age: 41
  • Location: Canadice, New York
  • Gender: Male
  • Lost in....
    • Share Post
    • RockModified.com
that is definitely a big challenge. I had a bunch of stuff laying around I could have used but I ended up buying a bunch of new stuff to get the materials I really wanted to use instead of always wishing I had just done it to begin with.

The other lesson learned that I had that I need to start a new thread on is actual cost to build the sawmill. Its not just the cost of the materials (ignore labor its a labor of love) but in order to actually mill logs I needed to get, Blades, Cant hook, Metal detector, Moisture meter, Chainsaw, PPE. I am sure there is a bunch of other stuff. Oh yea, I ended up building a set of forks for my tractor so I could move the pieces of the mill around as they got to heavy to man handle. 

It all adds up. I had a budget to stay under and I did very well building the mill. Unfortunately with all the other items I needed to buy to use my mill it put me over my total budget.
I knew what I thought I meant.

Offline MikeySP

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Age: 50
  • Location: Middle, TN
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Noted. Fortunately, I have a decent chainsaw, a pretty stout skidsteer with very heavy duty grapple. Picked up a bunch of 24" 20-30ft pine logs I felled a couple months ago. I have some forks too, but need to make a quicktach for it. Have the PPE also. I will need the blades, and the ability to sharpen/set teethe I imagine. I started your thread and am a few pages through it so far. Maybe you will answer this in the thread, but why do you want to build the LT15 copy? If this is answered in the thread, disregard, I will find out.

I am on a VERY low budget, so using the stuff I can get free, or very cheap will be a priority, as long as it will not effect performance. My truck can haul a tank, but it has to cut like it should and be easy to set up and use.

Offline JB Griffin

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 945
  • Age: 28
  • Location: N.C. Arkansas
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
How heavy you build it depends on how portable you need it to be, portable or just movable.  

Also as Crusarius stated, heavy don't always equal stout. And what I should have said is build it STOUT. 

Are you lookin to build a walk along or remote console mill?
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota, 160 Prentice, Frick 2 saw gang edger, Wright W-37 ABG, Suffolk dual tooth setter, Cat claw single tooth setter,'96 F-250 7.3 PSD 4x4, CS-590 Echo, MF 20c, M681 Memo.

Over 2.5 million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator and counting.

Offline thecfarm

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 27313
  • Age: 57
  • Location: Chesterville,Maine
  • Gender: Male
  • If I don't do it,it don't get done
    • Share Post
MikeySP,Thank You for serving our country.
Welcome to the forum.
I have a Thomas mill. I had them build it so I could cut a 20 foot log. I never have yet. But little did I know how much easier it is to load a 16 foot log onto a mill that is set up to cut 20 feet. The mill gives me four feet to play with,not 6 inches. It also allows me to get the head out of the way too. Just a thought.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Offline Crusarius

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1768
  • Age: 41
  • Location: Canadice, New York
  • Gender: Male
  • Lost in....
    • Share Post
    • RockModified.com
Cfarm is absolutely right about the length. I made mine 24' with the expectation of doing 20' cuts eventually. The truth was the steel came in 24's lengths so I decided to keep them that length. But I also did not want to limit myself.

as for why I want to build the LT15 wide copy, every time I have played with one it felt amazing. everything moved real smooth, had a nice wide cut that my mill will eventually get modified to. from what I could see the lt15 wide should be easy to adjust for true. My biggest complaint with it is the cheezy bed they use. but they were intended to be lightweight and portable but they do not offer a trailer package for it. I would love to buy just the head and carriage and build the rest.
I knew what I thought I meant.

Offline MikeySP

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Age: 50
  • Location: Middle, TN
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
I have added the extra length for log space to my notes.

Crusarius, I am indeed intrigued by your commentary about the LT15 being so smooth. What seems to be the key? Is this more because you have a manual w mill and would be null if it were a power feed, power raise lower? What seems to be the key from your perspective? This may unlock some design philosophy. 

Offline Crusarius

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1768
  • Age: 41
  • Location: Canadice, New York
  • Gender: Male
  • Lost in....
    • Share Post
    • RockModified.com
they have a gas charged cylinder in the mast to assist with raising the head. the crank is very easy to turn and locks in I think at 1/4" increments. it rolls on the track effortlessly.

All items mine needs work on :) I do have power raise lower but with the acme threaded rod it takes alot to raise it. I think I am going to try to add a garage door spring and see if that helps.

it is still a cantilever head design with 4 post carriage. on my carriage I did 2 post and I think that was a mistake. I feel I get twisting in the carriage making it harder to push. Also my guides are metal sleeves on metal masts so the bearing used on the LT15 roll so much nicer and hold it tight where mine is sloppy and does wiggle around. it does not seem to effect the cut though.

I may think of other things as the day goes on.
I knew what I thought I meant.

Offline MikeySP

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Age: 50
  • Location: Middle, TN
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Well, it turned out I have two friends from Church that own substantial sawmills: A 15-20 year old Cooks AC-36 w/50hp perkins diesel and another with older LT40HD. 

I just visited the Cooks owner and spent an hour to discuss and take a ton of photos for analysis. 

I knew they owned mills, but because they didn't make any money with them, I assumed they were little push mills. The Cooks owner said he couldn't compete with the local mennonite or ammish sawyers who will saw if you bring logs for about .20 a BD FT. I asked if he could do 2000 BD FT a day and he said no problem, but that stuff breaks pretty regularly from neglect and being weather beaten for so many years, especially hydraulic hoses. He also said he doesn't have the business sense side. Doesn't market, etc...

The machine is pretty serious, but man that thing had a ton of hydraulic hoses. I wonder who makes a more simplistic designed mill and still has the capability?  I plan to look at the LT40HD, but the owner was at the Cooks Owner's house working. 




Offline Crusarius

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1768
  • Age: 41
  • Location: Canadice, New York
  • Gender: Male
  • Lost in....
    • Share Post
    • RockModified.com
you can get electric hydraulic pumps and place them at each location but that will get very costly. Would still need short hoses.

I would think just finding a way to run the hydraulic lines so they are out of the weather would improve their lifespan exponentially. can also run hard piping to fixed items with short rubber hose to connect them.

hmm keep giving myself ideas :)
I knew what I thought I meant.

Offline ljohnsaw

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3308
  • Age: 59
  • Location: Northern California
  • Gender: Male
  • Happily retired... Working harder than ever!
    • Share Post
Well, it turned out I have two friends from Church that own substantial sawmills
  Do either of them sound like they want to sell?  Maybe that would be the easier route - use their mill as a base to improve upon from all the ideas here!
John Sawicky

Just North-East of Sacramento...

SkyTrak 9038, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 42" capacity/32" cut Bandmill up to 54' long - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

Offline Roland

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 32
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Texas
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
The first thing I would do is decide what length  blade you want to use. Then pick out the size wheels you want to use. With those items layed out on your garage floor you can now start designing.
Very easy and cost efficient
Sketch up a plan with measurements and just do it.
Adopt the pace of nature her secret is patience.
RWE

Offline Southside logger

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3048
  • Age: 46
  • Location: Wilsons (Dinwiddie County), VA
  • Gender: Male
  • Have a plan to saw every log you meet.
    • Share Post
That is significant competition at a bottom dollar price point. You really need to consider that in your plan. 

Perhaps there is a market in drying and planning wood if nobody is doing that in the area. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.

Offline PC-Urban-Sawyer

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1443
  • Age: 69
  • Location: Panama City, Florida
  • Gender: Male
  • Been wasting time for sixty-eight years...
    • Share Post
Will YOU be able to saw logs to lumber for $.20 a board foot? (and don't cheat and say your labor is free...) If the answer is no, you really need to reconsider your business model and get the Amish to saw for you at those prices...

Herb

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3563
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Go meet the amish, tell them youre going to make a go of the sawing business and dont want to compete with them in any way.  Ask what their specialty is, so you can avoid it, and what they refuse to do, so you can go after it.  

Theyll appreciate you being a straight shooter and may be a help in the future.  You can each refer customers to the other.  I have never had anyone give me a bad response to this sort of inquiry.  
Revelation 3:20

Offline MikeySP

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Age: 50
  • Location: Middle, TN
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Much to consider. I have been thinking what I can do differently. Also at the .20 rate, that is you bringing the logs to him. Still cheap.

I did read the entire 50 page thread by @kbeitz  and his build. That man knows how stuff works.  While not the machine I want to build, it was interesting. http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=82853.msg1264270#msg1264270

The guy with AC36 is planning to sell it in a couple months after his house is finished. $23K. I will not even countenance spending that, though that perkins 50HP diesel sure is nice. 

I am looking forward to seeing the older LT40HD and how that cantelever works as well as the apparent lack of a million hydraulic hoses. 

Offline Hilltop366

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2237
  • Location: Nova Scotia
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
the apparent lack of a million hydraulic hoses.


It has hoses and wires and electric motors and switches...... there is no free lunch. If you want to stand over here and have things happen over there it going to have something.

Offline MikeySP

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Age: 50
  • Location: Middle, TN
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
I understand, just looking for the most simple solutions. Budget and time to fabricate are huge factors for me.  

Offline Hilltop366

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2237
  • Location: Nova Scotia
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
I figured you did, Pardon me if I sounded abrupt it was not my intention.


Share via delicious Share via digg Share via facebook Share via linkedin Share via pinterest Share via reddit Share via stumble Share via tumblr Share via twitter

xx
Bandsaw mill "must have/highly desired" features

Started by Parafiddle on Sawmills and Milling

21 Replies
9108 Views
Last post December 14, 2014, 08:33:58 AM
by dgdrls
xx
1- Twisted Sister or "Walnutz!" and 2- "Pre-Bent" or "Saw Mill Nightmare?

Started by MbfVA on Sawmills and Milling

5 Replies
1118 Views
Last post September 08, 2017, 12:33:17 PM
by MbfVA
xx
"Another" Bandsaw Mill Build

Started by FloridaMike on Sawmills and Milling

16 Replies
1007 Views
Last post January 19, 2017, 10:40:03 PM
by Joe Hillmann
xx
Horse Logging education "Healing Harvest Foundation" Raphine, VA

Started by MartyParsons on Shows, Events and Places to meet

0 Replies
1036 Views
Last post October 15, 2012, 10:30:38 PM
by MartyParsons
 


Powered by EzPortal