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Author Topic: Oil leaking around clutch sprocket cover  (Read 1486 times)

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Offline Chefblair

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Oil leaking around clutch sprocket cover
« on: October 16, 2018, 09:05:48 PM »
Restored an old Stihl 028 WB and it seems to run fine except it leaks oil down the top of clutch cover seam just behind the sproket.

I donít have any experience with vintage saws like this. Is this normal?

oil pump seems fine and there is no oil in the cavity surrounding the pump so it's all coming off the chain I suspect. The chain is throwing off oil from the tip as well

Thanks

Offline Mad Professor

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2018, 10:04:43 PM »
What do you mean by pulley cover?  The cover that holds the bar on , or the one which covers the clutch assy?

If you take the bar off does it oil normally from the orifice in the case which feeds the bar?  Is the hole in the bar clogged with crud?

If oil is coming from the cover for the oil pump/clutch then the pump is leaking.

P.S. do you have an IPL for the saw?

Online sablatnic

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2018, 09:12:27 AM »
If oil is coming from the cover for the oil pump/clutch then the pump is leaking.

Or you could have a leaking oil pump gasket.
If you run it without sawing, the chain will splash oil all over the saw.

Offline Mad Professor

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2018, 09:59:39 AM »
1) I would consider a leaking oil pump gasket a leaking pump.

2)  If the saw is running , at idle, a 028 should NOT pizz oil as the pump is driven by the clutch drum, NOT the crank.  If idle is too high or clutch is bad it might pizz oil due to pump being driven by clutch drum.

Offline Chefblair

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2018, 11:04:22 AM »
Sorry I meant the clutch /sprocket cover. When i took it off the oil orifice and bar seemed clean and there was no oil in the cavity behind the clutch cover. the oil pump gasket seems to be holding.  The chain seems well oiled as well as the bar groove and bar tip sprocket so i guess she's just a heavy flow oiler as some have previously mentioned.

Thanks for the help! 


Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2018, 04:07:38 PM »
I believe the 028 oil pump is similar design to the 038's pump. I remember back in the mid 1980's I had problems with a plastic plug blowing out of the 038 pump housing and leaking.
Found out the Windsor bars that came with the saw were plugging up at the oil hole causing back pressure on the oil pump.
At the same time my 034 was blowing the rubber oil line off the pumps too. Went to Oregon bars and problem stopped.

So check that 028 pump and see if it has  a plug like I mentioned.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Mad Professor

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2018, 06:32:40 PM »
There is a gasket, plug and a sealing ring on the 028 pump. 

The 038 pump is similar in the way it drives from clutch but has an adjustable oiler so it has some extra parts: spring, o-rings, washers, control bolt,.....

On saws like the 034/036/066....... should not use rubber/tygon tubing for line from pump, use OEM tubing w/internal spring (so it don't kink).  

The tubing is stiff as a sailor on shore leave and a PITA to install but holds up real well. 

To install you need to heat it, gently, a bic lighter works.  The kits come w/internal spring and enough tubing to do two saws, or enough if you screw up on first try here are some pics from a 036

 

 

Offline Chefblair

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2018, 06:45:03 PM »
Thanks Mad Professor! 

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2018, 06:59:24 PM »
Yes I know my 1986 064's have that type of braided hose.
But my 034 was a first year from 1984. Just a plain rubber line from what I remember .
But check that plug on the 028 and mad professor if you have access check the 038 pump too.
I got one somewhere in my parts.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline bandmiller2

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2018, 08:16:28 PM »
Many chainsaws even ones in good shape will on occasion leak bar and chain oil. My old 365 husky does, I make a point to lay it on its side bar up. Sometimes its just the way the saw stops that lets the oil pump leak. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Offline Mad Professor

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2018, 08:34:46 PM »
The 034/036 oil hose I mentioned is not braided, it's a thermoplastic.  That is it becomes pliable with heat then takes a set when cooled.  Maybe the real early 034 were braided?  The hose kit is a common part for many of the post 028/038 saws that have the worm drive oil pumps.

To get it over the nipple on the pump you need to heat it, you also need to heat the other end to insert the brass thimble that holds the outlet side in the case via friction fit.  You can do one end or the other first, but don't forget the metal spring that goes inside the tubing.

I've been inside the 028 and 038 , I own a bunch, and have IPLs and shop manuals.  

They will pizz oil on standing if the plug or the sealing ring is bad.  Also if piston or pump body is worn out.

I store my saws hung by the handles on spikes driven into a tie beam in my TF barn (with a logging chain through handles around beam w/lock).  I've taken a 038 down and found most the bar oil in bar scabbard; time to fix the pump.....  

That can make a mess if you don't know the oil has leaked then set the saw horizontal and/or take the scabbard off.  Reminds me of the old Harley Davidsons that "marked their spot" when parked.

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2018, 11:45:11 PM »
Mad Professor, here's a little history lesson for you.
I dug out my old 064's and 038 Mag to display the oil pumps and oil lines.

In the first pic is the oil line hose on my oldest 1986 first year 064 serial#116468370 , same rubber hose hose as on my 1984 first year 034 (which is long gone.) There is no spring inside and with needle nose pliers I can tell it's soft rubber. It's the original hose that was never replaced.

Couldn't find the brown interior colored braided hose that's on my newer 1986 064 serial# 117584561.
I parted out that pump and saw a couple of weeks ago.

The early 034 didn't even have a aluminum hose clamp as the 034 service manual shows in the second pic. And no heat shrikange on those hoses either.

Last pic shows the black plastic plug on my 038 Mag oil pump. These plugs were notorious for popping out and leaking if there's enough back pressure when the bar pad channel to bar oil hole was plugged.
The older Windsor bars that has both rails drilled oil holes jammed up with chips and sawdust easily.
The Oregon one rail blind drilled oil holes didn't have the same problem.



 

 

Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Al_Smith

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2018, 09:37:33 AM »
If I recall correctly there is a pick up hose from the oil tank .With age they can get stiff and leak .I'll check one later on today .As far as leaking some do some don't --as much .I might be a big deal if you store the saw on a fire place mantle .Mine  are happily leaking  away in my shed .Might help preserve the plywood shelving might not . :)

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2018, 10:10:07 AM »
Sooooo.. Youre saying get a husky then?  


;D           smiley_devilish sling_shot
Revelation 3:20

Offline sawguy21

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2018, 11:21:25 AM »
 :D :D
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2018, 12:11:13 PM »
Just checked the 038 Mag oil tank pickup hose.
Saw has been sitting in a box for 32 years since last used. Hose looks good, still soft and pliable . Must have been from using that good Texaco  ClingTex bar oil. ;D
Sure wouldn't want to change it through that tiny oil cap hole.

Last pic is another pump and pickup hose from a 064 that hasn't run for 32 years. Still in good shape.


 

 

  
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Al_Smith

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2018, 12:11:28 PM »
Well I'm not partial,I've got leaky Stihls,leaky Husqvarnas ,McCullochs,Poulans and an Echo or two .I've even got an old Mall that most likely would leak if it had any oil in the tank .It probably ran at one time and may again --maybe .Good stout heavy duty door stop .Too large for a paper weight and not large enough to anchor a battle ship .

Offline Mad Professor

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2018, 01:30:34 PM »
Mad Professor, here's a little history lesson for you.
I dug out my old 064's and 038 Mag to display the oil pumps and oil lines.

In the first pic is the oil line hose on my oldest 1986 first year 064 serial#116468370 , same rubber hose hose as on my 1984 first year 034 (which is long gone.) There is no spring inside and with needle nose pliers I can tell it's soft rubber. It's the original hose that was never replaced.

Couldn't find the brown interior colored braided hose that's on my newer 1986 064 serial# 117584561.
I parted out that pump and saw a couple of weeks ago.

The early 034 didn't even have a aluminum hose clamp as the 034 service manual shows in the second pic. And no heat shrikange on those hoses either.

Last pic shows the black plastic plug on my 038 Mag oil pump. These plugs were notorious for popping out and leaking if there's enough back pressure when the bar pad channel to bar oil hole was plugged.
The older Windsor bars that has both rails drilled oil holes jammed up with chips and sawdust easily.
The Oregon one rail blind drilled oil holes didn't have the same problem.


(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)
 
(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)
 
(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

I have a first year 064 w/dogleg bosch coil, no extra boss on case for newer coils.  It is 3/4 apart for R + R now.  When I pull the clutch I'll see what sort of hose the pump has, and post ser# too.
If stihl changed the composition of the hoses at some point it was WAY back.  It's not what they use now.
The 038 oil pumps have not changed since way back.  I don't have any 038, but have several 038S I converted to 038M, and a 038M.  The plug or sealing rings can be a problem, and the body/piston can wear out.
Not a pizzing contest here just stating what I've encountered and repaired


The 066/064/044/036/034/026 pumps are supposed to have a wire coil inside so they don't kink, as in the picture I posted.  The hoses are not rubber nor braided.

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #18 on: October 18, 2018, 05:20:27 PM »
The 066 never had a oil pump discharge hose, it's the same as the 660.
Wish I kept that 064 braided hose, and just to make sure we're both on the same page when I say braided I mean the layer under the black covering has a fabric composition to it. 
It basically deteriorated at the pump nipple underneath  the aluminum clamp.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline Mad Professor

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Re: Oil leaking around chain pulley cover
« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2018, 06:33:25 PM »
The 066 never had a oil pump discharge hose, it's the same as the 660.
Wish I kept that 064 braided hose, and just to make sure we're both on the same page when I say braided I mean the layer under the black covering has a fabric composition to it.
It basically deteriorated at the pump nipple underneath  the aluminum clamp.
Whoops! You are right on the 066 not having outlet hose.  I forgot they changed around the drive and flywheel side from the 064.  I appreciate your insights from years of working on saws.
I need to R + R my 064.  It's well used but has a dead bosch coil; I plan on making a bracket so I can use the universal stihl coil.  I got it cheap, P/C is good and it's been updated to newer HD air filter.  I also have a NOS/OEM Mahle P/C if I ever need it.
My 066 is the only stihl I ever had new; I got it with a logosol M5 sawmill.  I've never had to tear that one down, yet. 
All my other Stihls I got either free or as scrap and have rebuilt them.  There are a bunch I don't have time to fix right now.
I have CAD (chainsaw addiction disorder)......


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