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Author Topic: How would you do it?  (Read 3381 times)

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Offline CabinCreations

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How would you do it?
« on: February 06, 2019, 11:08:35 AM »
Hey guys, I am beginning to think/dream up a new building for a portable sawmill. I'd be curious what your thoughts are on a layout. 

Here is what I need/want the building to function as: 

1. Mill Shed
2. Kiln (KD150 size)
3. Equipment Storage (Tractors, Implements, etc.)
4. Sawmill Storage/Sharpening Shed

A kiln and sharpening shed will (hopefully) come at a later date, but I would like to plan for it now so that I don't have to change things later. 

I have a separate, older building not far from where this building would stand for air drying lumber. 

Here is the catch, to avoid having to get a building permit I have to limit the building to 1,000 square feet. So am I thinking something like 32' x 30', but how would you lay this out? Or is trying to put all this under one roof not worth it? 

Below is my first crack at it: 



 

Thanks!
Kody

2011 LT35HD

Offline alan gage

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2019, 12:14:12 PM »
If you have to keep it under 1000 square feet the obvious answer to me would be multiple buildings. 

To me everything, with the possible exception of the sharpening room, looks too small. But it all depends on what you're storing, what you're sawing, and what your drying. But it also depends on what you might be doing in the future.

How much hassle does a building permit bring? Around here all it would mean would be $25 to the city.

Alan
Timberking B-16, a few chainsaws from small to large, and a Bobcat 873 Skidloader.

Offline CabinCreations

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2019, 12:34:36 PM »
Alan - Thanks for your reply. Multiple builds may be a better solution but I was hoping to cover as many bases as I could with the first build. This is a small operation with support equipment consisting of an atv/future tractor and a log arch. I got the kiln dimensions (roughly) from the build documented by Out the Woods (123Maxbars on the FF) who uses a KD150 kiln from Wood-Mizer.

A building permit around here also brings detailed plans and inspections throughout the build. I could go that route if I had to, but was trying to avoid it if possible.  

- Kody
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2019, 12:44:34 PM »
Hey CC.  In our town we need a permit over 100 sq. feet so a 10 x 10 garden shed.  I am sure you have done your homework, but just checking.  It used to be no big deal here, but they promoted a young kid and he likes to argue about everything to show that he is smarter than everyone else.  So I feel your pain.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline CabinCreations

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2019, 12:48:29 PM »
Hey Doc - I questioned the allowable square footage too because I thought that was a large building to not have inspected, but I did confirm it with the township so I am in the clear as long as the Zoning Permit is approved. But since they pretty much only look at setbacks from property lines for Zoning Permits, I should have no problem getting the go ahead. 
2011 LT35HD

Offline Iwawoodwork

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2019, 12:59:27 PM »
call it an "ag" building, in many areas there is very little requirements for ag buildings built for other than  human living quarters, see if that is less code issues.

Offline CabinCreations

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2019, 01:01:56 PM »
I'll have to ask about agriculture use. That may be a good work around. Thanks!
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2019, 01:10:41 PM »
Is any of this shop going to be heated or cooled.  Might want to consider having a free standing kiln to isolate heat and or moisture.  Would get more space and if there is no limit on building number or, percent of available land covered by buildings, you will gain a bit.  Also think about door size for equipment area and kiln.  Will there be large outside doors, or did you plan to bring everything through the building.  I assume the saw area is open faced?
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline Tin Horse

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2019, 01:17:07 PM »
I'll have to ask about agriculture use. That may be a good work around. Thanks!
I went the "ag" route here in Ontario for my shop ( 28'x 30'). I started last spring and still not done. I'm guessing my building inspector will not be happy when he sees it finished. Then what? :-\
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Offline CabinCreations

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2019, 01:22:40 PM »
The kiln would be the only thing that would be heated in the future. I was thinking that with all the insulation and wrapping that would be installed around the kiln the moisture wouldn't be an issue. Any thoughts on that? 

I was planning two doors on the equipment area (basically a very small garage) and two doors on the kiln. The saw area would be open on the three exterior sides to allow easier moving of the mill and log loading.  
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2019, 01:22:55 PM »
I do not know about Canada, but here they could in theory, make you take it down.. More likely make repairs, and poss. just tell you not to do it again.  If you sell a property and there is a building inspection, and your building did not meet code (at the time it was built), it might mess with a buyers financing or they may ask for money to fix/bring up to code.  Of course the municipality wants the tax revenue.  
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline CabinCreations

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2019, 01:25:05 PM »
Tin Horse - You have to get your 'ag' building inspected in Ontario? Our code says what Doc just mentioned. They could make me remove the building if it was completed before an inspector (if required) did their job. 
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2019, 01:29:22 PM »
Insulation only slows movement of heat.  According to recent posts a wood framed kiln structure should last about 20 years if properly built due to moisture and chemical liberated from the wood.  I will try to find some links for you but if you are in go mode you can search the forum.  the recent one was about using a mobile office trailer.  The wood Dr. Gene Wengert  has done research and written extensively in this area.  read or google Virginia tech solar kiln.  
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline CabinCreations

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2019, 01:35:30 PM »
That's really interesting. I never considered chemicals released from the drying wood. I may re-consider placing the kiln under the same roof then. I sure would be disappointed if that part of the building only lasted 20 years and then the whole building had to be retrofitted. A stand alone kiln may be more reasonable. 

I will dig into that a little bit more, but that you for bringing it to my attention. 
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2019, 01:36:51 PM »
read Office Trailer Kiln.  also we can see if @GeneWengert-WoodDoc will weigh in.  
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2019, 01:54:01 PM »
My mill will cut up to 21 feet, so when I build my kiln it will be at least 20 feet long to get say 18 foot boards in there.  Then depending on your design, prob. 8 or 10 feet wide.  You can go to Nyle and find there detailed plans on line.  They are a sponsor and have a tab on this page.  to the left side.  click resources, manuals, then n200 or the 53.  the first 20 pages are all about recommended construction of the chamber.  Their are Nyle reps on this site.  I called them the other day and the guy on the phone is on this site.  There is a welcome Nyle post that can get you to him/
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline DPatton

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2019, 01:57:32 PM »
CabinCreations,

As it's been said on this forum many, many times. You can never build a shed too big. 
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Offline CabinCreations

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2019, 02:03:51 PM »
Doc - I will take a look at the Nyle site. I have look there before but must have overlooked the chamber construction in the manuals. 

DPatton - I agree. There is no such thing as a shed that is too big, so I guess my wallet is just to small  :'(
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2019, 02:07:38 PM »
CC.  that is why I had to call.  I assumed they reserved the plans for after you bought.  The chamber plans are part of the manual for the dehumidifier unit.  Best regards.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline tylerltr450

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Re: How would you do it?
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2019, 02:23:52 PM »
I  think the sharpening shed is to small, those darn blades take up a lot of room when trying to sharpen and set next to each other. For my area I need a lot room and there is a lot of dead space due to the way the sharpening tools are setup. I converted my bench top to a mobile stand and I would never go back.
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