My mill is sick

[WV Sawmiller]

   Went to saw a small order of tulip poplar 1.5 miles from home for a friend today and sawed a small log into stickers with no problem then about a 14-15 inch 10' log into 1X6's and my mill head started shaking badly when I got to the first rail, about 2' in the cut. I was using 7 degree doublehards then replaced with a 4 degree and basically the same thing. Called WM and checked a few things like power feed belt which first thing I had already checked. Finally I went to move the head by hand and noticed it was binding so narrowed it down some from that. I took the chain off this afternoon and the sprocket and shaft seem to be turning freely so I don't think it is the bearings in there or the bearing that holds the chain against the sprocket. I'm thinking it is one of the rollers or the cam follower bearings but they all seem to be turning. If one would just lock up I could figure the one causing the problem but they don't. When I push the mill it seems to start binding sooner when pushing toward the front than the back. 

   Anybody had similar problems or any suggestions as to things to check? I have about 570 hours on the mill and the last issue I had was I replaced a drive belt due to a broken bolt. I don't see how that could cause the symptoms I am seeing as it does it when pushed by hand and not even running and with the chain and power feed motor/sprocket off the mill.

[Lawg Dawg]

How many years you been running this mill with no problems?

[WV Sawmiller]

   About 4 years and I had it serviced on the loop last year by the WM mobile team. He replaced the bearings in the idler belt wheel which had died a couple days before. I am diligent about the 50 hour service and check ups too.

[Southside]

It's the cam follower.  Mine did the exact same thing, I replaced all of them but only the bottom one was bad.  

[Cutting Edge]

 
x2  I bet good money on the Cam Follower too. 

Gonna be doing all 8 on a WM4000 in a few days that had one lock up solid, broke the shaft on (2) others - Peer brand (Made in China)

Do yourself a favor and replace with a good quality Made in USA - McGill or RCB

[WV Sawmiller]

   Thanks guys. Did yours ever completely lock up or did they just just bind at certain points? Any gotchas or special techniques involved in replacing them? 

[Southside]

The bearings had failed internally, so sometimes I could push it through, other times it was all but locked up tight.  I can't recall exactly what I did but I do remember removing the rubber bumper at the end so I had a bit more run to get at least one off.  That and you will need to gather up a couple of chickens, cut their heads off, and make the voo-doo sign on the mast with the blood so your fingers can fit into those spots.  

[WV Sawmiller]

Southside,

   Thanks. I will try the chicken.  I already discovered that swearing doesn't work when I took the end link off the chain and removed the bearing next to the chain drive sprocket that was so tight a socket head would not fit over it and I had to remove the bracket and loosen 1/8 turn at a time with a 15/16" end wrench. After removing the bracket I realized I had not needed to remove the chain end link.

[terrifictimbersllc]

Should roll very easily when the chain is off.  Good tip I got from a Woodmizer employee is that if the rails are lubed and a bearing is starting to go bad sometimes you can see the bearing just sliding along and not turning. 

[WV Sawmiller]

TT,

    I thought so but it does not. Pushing it by hand is how we narrowed down the likely causes to either rollers or cam follower bearings or something else in the feed system. Removing the chain and drive sprocket narrows it down even more. Thanks for the input.

[sparks]

Did you spin the power feed motor to make sure a magnet has not come loose and is binding the motor?

[WV Sawmiller]

Sparks,

  Thanks for the suggestion. I did spin the shaft on the power feed motor because I too the pulley and later the entire motor off ans they spin freely. The shaft with the pulley on one end and sprocket on the other also spin freely as well as the cam follower next to the sprocket the rolls over the chain. With the entire power feed unit off the head still binds although the first thing this morning it moved freely for about 3' then bound up when I tried to pull it back so it is binding with no feed system.

  Based on the info from Southside and Cutting edge I ordered 3 cam followers today and they will be here Monday. I will replace them starting with the one on the bottom. 

   Remember - the person who can smile during times of adversity has already found someone to blame his problems on. :D

[Southside]

WV -

If it turns out not to be the cam follower then my account was hacked and the answer was posted by an imposter.   :D

[WV Sawmiller]

   Reminds me of the old flow chart I used to see when working regular work. Started with "Was there a problem?" and went from there like:

1. Did you cause it - if yes back to front if no "No Problem."
2. Did anyone see you - if yes, back to front if no "No Problem"
3. Is there someone else you can blame - if yes no, back to front if yes no "No Problem"
4. Continues through many more steps with same loop till finally no more excuses and goes to a box that says "You're screwed"

[terrifictimbersllc]

1.  Did you make any money last year?
2.  How much?
3.  Send it in

[WV Sawmiller]

TT,

    Did you retire from the IRS? :D

[gdaddy01]

how much should we give ? the answer is more , more , more .   ccr

[moodnacreek]

Geeze, my sawmill was made before w.w.2 and it never done nothing like that.

[Bluejay27]

We had a cam follower seize up on our 70 super a few hundred hours in, made it stop dead on its track. Turned out someone forgot to grease it from the factory. All my replacements have grease zerks and get a weekly shot. If I forget, pretty soon I'll hear it when I'm backing up.

I also had a bearing go in the power feed shaft on our '98 40 super, but I only found that because the drive sprocket was so worn that teeth were breaking off. That was about 3000 hours in though.

[WV Sawmiller]

  New ones just came a few minutes ago and am fixing to go change them and lets hope that is all it was.

[WV Sawmiller]

   Well, if it was sick before its on life support now. :( :'( :'( I replaced the lower cam follower bearing and by all indications that was the problem as the old bearing will not turn and all the others (upper ones and rollers) will.

  However to access the top of the bearing shaft to hold it with an allen wrench while I took the hex nut off I had to loosen and move the plate down that it was connected to which happens to be the one connected to the lower rail . I got the old bearing off and the new one on but when I went to reconnect the plate I needed to lower the head just a fudge to line the bolts back up. When it moved it did not stop and the entire head assembly jumped completely off the mill. My little FEL on my JD 750 is not big enough to lift it so I have a neighbor hopefully coming in the morning with a bigger tractor and FEL and hopefully we can get it set back into place then I can see how much damage is really done. It is not a pretty sight right now. The last thing you ever want to see is your mill in 2 separate pieces. I will say this has forced me to learn way more about my mill than I ever wanted to do.

  If I ever have to replace the lower cam follower again I will have it under a big limb with a chainfall or a piece of equipment big enough to lift it. I still see no way to get the cam follower off without removing that plate.

[Magicman]

Must be different than the LT40.  ?? 


 
I lowered the head down onto a timber (seen behind the wipes) supporting the outside edge of the saw head which took all of the pressure off of the cam followers. 

[millwright]

Hope you didn't get hurt, keep us posted. I may have to do mine sometime

[WV Sawmiller]

Lynn,

   I can't see from your photo where the cam follower is. Look at it and see if you can get an allen wrench into the top of the bearing shaft without taking something loose. That was my downfall. I could turn the hex nut on the bottom with a 15/16" end wrench but without the hex wrench holding the shaft it would all just spin. It came off easily once I locked the top with the hex wrench. I had a timber (6x6) under the front like you show but I was using one that was 4' long so the head was much higher. When I got the new bearing on the holes in the plate did not line up and I needed to lower the head just a bit to get them straight. When I raised the head to take tension off the 6X6 the head rolled back then fell. There was nothing connected at the bottom to stop it.

MW,

   I got a bruised left shoulder vacating the area when it started to fall. Could have been much worse.

[Southside]

From what you can tell does it look like it survived the fall?  Glad you did.  

[Stephen1]

Glad it's only a bruise. If it came apart it will go back together. 

[Magicman]

Howard since yours is a single mast that I have never actually seen, I am sure that it is much different from the LT40.  I just figured that you would remove the saw head weight and have easy access to the cam followers.  Obviously I was wrong.  

[WV Sawmiller]

Lynn,

 That is not to say I removed it the correct way either but it was/is the only way I saw/see to do it. The scary part now is finally realizing that one bracket is all that holding the entire head on the rails. I guess during transport would be the most dangerous time for it to come loose and at that point it would be on its travel pin with the safety chain holding it down. A simple hole in the bracket above the bearing shaft would allow you to insert the hex wrench from above to lock the shaft so you could unscrew the nut below but I am not an engineer smart enough to figure something like that out (unless I drill one next time).

 I did have the head resting on the post as WM suggested and it did keep the weight off the bearing so it was free to move. I guess they assumed I would use a shorter post and I will next time.

 We talked way more about how to get the upper bearings off as you can't access the nut with a wrench. Turns out you don't need to - you just unscrew with a hex wrench and the nut locks against the side of the metal tube it is in.

BTW - Stephen1, are you talking about the mill or my arm? :D

Southside - I think it will. Can't tell what parts may be damaged till I can get it off the ground. I should have got the chicken!

[gdaddy01]

I hope you are all right , and get your mill back together without any other problems .

[WV Sawmiller]

   Thanks. I hope so too. I know I need a new air filter cover on my Kholer 25 engine as the corner of the one I have is broken. The handle on the lube tank broke. I may be able to superglue it back and if not replacing the whole valve will not be a big issue. I don't know what laying on it's side is doing to the oil in the engine but I bet it is not good for it. I know the aluminum guard that runs in front of the blade and rollers snapped out and is likely bent but that should be an easy fix.

   I had the power feed assembly and the chain off as part of my troubleshooting and that may have saved me some damage to it. I got the fuel and lube tanks off so the fuel would not run out and the connection to the tank looked okay. I am sure I will have to realign the blade guide rollers and blade tilt and such. Time will tell. If I can't fix it here I may get to finally visit the famous town of Shade Gap PA as the NC shop, while closer and where I bought it, is moving locations and out of pocket for such work for a while.

   I will let you know what I find and what I learn.

[YellowHammer]

I'm glad you survived the crash.  That could have been bad.  I never replaced my cam followers, I had the WM guy do it on his service loop.  I'm glad I didn't try, although he did it pretty fast with a piece of wood and a crowbar.  

Hope you get it back together with no more issues. 

[MartyParsons]

WOW!
Glad you are ok!!
M

[WV Sawmiller]

MP,

   Thanks. My son's best friend came up with his big Kubota tractor and FEL and we got my one flea market choker around the mast and got it picked up and walked it back into place and bolted back together. The up and down functions seem to work fine, the breakers did not trip which surprised me after that kind of jolt. The hydraulics don't work but I think that is just a matter of adjusting the contact on the power strip so that should not be a major issue.

   This afternoon I will be putting the chain and power fed units on and checking all the adjustments. I have not tried to crank it and want to let the motor sit upright a while first. I don't see any obvious, major damage yet.

   It rolls liked on greased ice so it was apparently just the bottom cam follower causing the binding issues that started this whole goatrope. The one I took off is clear binding when you try to turn it. Does WM want it back to check or anything? It failed at 567 hours.

   When you talk to the WM engineers you might suggest they include a lifting eye on the mast or wherever appropriate to lift and/or hold the head unit in place if needed. That would have real handy this morning.

   If I run into major obstacles I may be heading your way. Take care.

[WV Sawmiller]

    Latest update is Mildred is breathing on her own. Not sure if she will need physical therapy yet. After several starts and stops I finally got everything back together and she runs. The power feed was the most awkward piece to reassemble hook to the chain (It helps if you run the chain over the top before connecting it to the unit but if you don't you get more practice in how to take everything apart and reassemble it.) Once assembled it is heavy and hard to hold in place while you put the bolts back through the frame and unit. A handy plastic 5 gallon bucket helped immensely. 

   The power feed unit on the bottom was out of place so I had to loosen the bolts to depress the springs to get the piece into place on the bottom of the rail. I may have to adjust these but right now the hydraulics work.

   Once I had it all connected I put the key in and turned the switch and she took off on her own - the forward feed knob was down but at least she moves and she moves freely now so I am sure it was the one cam follower on the bottom.


 As mentioned the plastic cover over the air fiter is cracked and I will replace it.


 This was the culprit. Sorry for the sun but look above the nut and you see the black bearing. I misspoke when I talked about a bracket above, it is the rail. You have to stick a 5/16" hex key in to end of the shaft to turn that nut and no way to access it as it sits.


 You can see the nut here and the bracket you have to rotate to make room for the top. Unfortunately this is the bracket that holds the entire head to the bottom rail. Once removed only gravity is holding it in place.


 Aluminum guard rail at the front of the head popped loose from the white pastic fitting. Easy fix - loosen the bolt, slide it back in and replace the bolt and it is fixed.


 The safety pin for the debarker was in place but now moved to upper left. See where fall bent the brackets where the holes allign. Again an easy fix with a heavy set of pliers.

   When done I checked the oil then nervously tried to crank the mill. She fired right up! I did not run it long and only the fuel left in the system but all looks good so far. I will check alignment and maybe saw a log tomorrow if I don't find anything else.

   I did not take a picture of the mill with the dead on the ground. I also don't take pictures at funerals. Some things you just don't want to remember.

[Magicman]

So the next step after everything is good to go is to research and find out the recommended/correct way to replace the top cam followers.  ;D

[caveman]

Howard, I am glad that you have it back together and that you did not get hurt any worse than you did.  That is frustrating when one tries to take impeccable care of something and ends up damaging it while doing maintenance and/or repairs.  You will have it cutting accurately again soon.  

[WV Sawmiller]

So the next step after everything is good to go is to research and find out the recommended/correct way to replace the top cam followers.  ;D

Lynn,

   I may be overconfident but it looks like the top rollers are very easy to replace. Just lower the head on to a support enough to take the weight/tension off them, take a 5/16" hex wrench in a socket and loosen then replace and tighten. The nut is locked inside a metal tube and can't turn so turning the shaft with the hex key loosens the fitting. With two of them there is no way for the head to come loose unless you removed both at the same time and no need to do that. I will not replace them at this time. I don't think they get near the wear because there are two and the head rolls on the 2" wheels anyway. Same fitting upper and lower and the one beside the sprocket keeping the chain from slipping out so good to have spares for future needs.

[richhiway]

Glad it all worked out. If I lived nearby I would have came and gave you a hand. 

[Magicman]

   OK, just thinking about the future.  Good thing is that we all can share and learn from each other's woes.  :P

[WV Sawmiller]

   Yeah, if you have an LT35 or any similar single mast system and loosen the bottom bracket to replace any parts or make adjustments or such be dang sure the head is supported 6 ways to Sunday first.

   I am impressed the head unit held up as well as it did under these circumstances but I would not want to bet it would do so again. Nor would I want to be at risk or have anyone else involved in such a dangerous situation. Those head units are very heavy and they hurt when they bounce off of you.

   I was afraid my lumber sawing days were over and I was going to have to look for a new career like selling lady's shoes or such. :(

[millwright]

Glad it's working again, is there only 1 bearing on bottom?

[AK Newbie]

Happy to hear your about to be back milling and not "selling ladies shoes"   ;D 8)

[WV Sawmiller]

MW,

    It seems to be tracking fine now. Yes, only one bearing on the bottom. Remember the weight is mostly on the top 2 rollers and they also have 2 of these cam followers keeping it from shifting side to side. The only time there is tension on this one is if it tries to shift to the side or too much forward or back (I think).

    First thing this morning I bought a new faucet to go in the lube tank lid as the fall snapped the plastic handle off my old one. Readily available and just under $8. I told my wife my plans for the day then she corrected them for me and we went to town instead so I went by the local Kohler dealer and ordered a replacement air filter cover (About $31) and I got a new replacement air filter and will change that in case any oil leaked into it while it was on it's side overnight (About $21 or so for that). Hopefully tomorrow if weather and wife permit I will get out and check the alignment and saw a log or two.

AK Newbie,

   Thanks. Yeah selling women's shoes was not my long term career goal either. Where is Eagle River? My BIL lives in Anchorage but works with the FAA and does site visits to ever place up there with an airport with a beacon or lights I think. His youngest daughter lives up next to Sarah Palin :D and his SIL works on the slope.

[SawyerTed]

Howard I've arrived late to this thread, I'm glad you've got it back together.  It could have been so much worse but I don't have to tell you that.  Hope tomorrow's alignment goes well.  

[Southside]

You know the selling womans shoes worked well for Ted Bundy in Married With Children.   :D

[SawyerTed]

Except Ted Bundy was a serial killer, Al was the Married with Children character....... :D

[WV Sawmiller]

Ted,

Sorry I never got into that series and did not know it was patterned after a serial killer driven crazy selling women's shoes.

All,

I got out and replaced the air filter - it looked like it needed it with oil stains and such on it. I checked the blade guide tilt and alignment and got it within 1/32" which is supposed to be within tolerance (I think I read that somewhere or dreamed it in one of my recent nightmares which have been legion) and decided to check how it saws.


 I loaded this 11' something small RO log (I did not do the original bucking thank you very much!) and bucked it to 8'6".


 You can see the entire front of the head here. Slightly bent aluminum guard but those get bent often anyway (What do you mean you never bent one? I bet you never rolled a log across the mill either with the side supports down. Just wait!)

I sawed the small log into 5-1"X 6" and one 1"X 4" and they turned out very pretty at exactly 1-1/16" thickness throughout using 1-3/16" drops on my SimpleSet.


 I took the 30" cutoff and clamped it to make 10/4 square bench legs for my Lictenberg LE 8/4 pieces I have ready to use. If I'd been smarter I would have measured the rails before bucking the log as 1" more and it would have fit across the rails much better. Only had about 1/2" play on each side and the rounded surface made it a bear to stay put. I could just as easily cut and used 8'4" or 8'5" boards. Anyway I got 11 legs so I guess I will either make 2 benches and a 3 legged stool (I may try that) or cut some more legs.

The mill sawed perfect except for a couple of dead spots on the hydraulic power feed rail. I could just jiggle the power cord and get power but I will play with that some more. On mistake was I hit a live edge with an allen wrench and welded partially shut the opening in one of the bolts. Next time I send in blades for resharp I may reorder another one and replace it or check with my local hardware store who likely has them too.


 A whopping 37 bf out of that log but my confidence level is much better than 2 days ago when it was laying on the ground. I used the threatening weather as an excuse to pack up then instead of more sawing I weedate a marshy spot and a couple of hillsides the last hour or so of the say.

[YellowHammer]

I'm glad its back making wood.  

[WV Sawmiller]

   Me too. I had serious doubts there when that whole head first hit the ground and wanted to rush it to the nearest dealer and see if it could be salvaged. Its a lot tougher machine than I ever imagined - although I don't recommend anyone else try the same thing.

   One of my best friends down in N. Fla is retiring in 12 days after 38 years as a banker. He is a VP of our local bank down there just across the line in Ala. I told him come up and stack lumber all summer and learn to run it and we will make her into a snowbird mill and I'll saw lumber from March to November up here and he can saw with her down there from November through February while I am busy hunting and our weather is too bad to saw a lot of the time anyway. Maybe I should let him buy in a a junior partner for about $50K. 

[samandothers]

Howard,
Just saw this, wow quiet the experience!  Glad you were not injured worse in the fall.  Glad to know you have all this experience with the bearing replacement.  I'll know who to call when needed!  

Glad all is working fine so far.  Good luck with getting the funds from the banker friend!  ;D

[WV Sawmiller]

   Yeah, but you know how hard it is getting money from a banker. After 38 years at it he may be beyond hope.

   Well, the saga continues today. I took a couple of 8' maple logs to cut into 4/4 stock and a 3' section to make some 8/4 LE planks and my mill would not start. Sputtered once then nothing. I was afraid I had flooded it so let it rest an hour then went back and no luck. I grabbed a nearby ladder, removed the filter cover, took out the air filter and poured gas directly into the carb. When I choked it it would crank and idle but ever time I'd open the choke it would die and also when I gave it fuel it would die. I did that several times with the same results. This is the first time I have ever had a problem with it cranking or running. I assume it is an adjustment to the fuel air system but I don't know how to fix it. I will try to get my neighbor who works on small engines to come take a look at it. My mower would not start last week and it has a 23 hp Kohler engine. He looked and pushed the vacuum hose back on tight on and it runs fine. He did suggest I order a new hose as he said it will get worse and I have one waiting at the dealer. Hopefully he can diagnose and fix the problem. It cranked and ran great yesterday so I am thinking it is something minor. We will see.

[Southside]

Can you disconnect the fuel line after the fuel filter and give the tank a squeeze to make sure you are getting fuel to that point?  Then check after the engine mounted pump to make sure fuel is getting that far too?  The other day the little O ring in the quick connect on my fuel tank on the 35 let go and I could not get fuel to the engine, eventually found it was that $0.01 O ring after 20 minutes.  

Just a note, don't use a propane torch or anything like for light while you are checking for fuel flow.   :D

[WV Sawmiller]

SS,

   I will try giving the fuel tank a squeeze test in the morning and see if I see the fuel to that point. I will be sure not to use my propane torch for a light source too. I don't smoke and won't have others around smoking during such testing either. I am confident the fix will fast, easy and cheap. Finding the problem may not be.

[Southside]

I should clarify that if you are getting fuel to the pump you need to crank the engine to check the output side of the pump. The Charmin test is only good to the pump inlet. It is possible that the time spent on the engine side dislodged junk in the fuel filter and it's now pluged up or the carb bowl  is gunked up if the junk left the filter. 

I have taken the carb apart on my welder which has the same engine on it when the ethanol sat too long and it was not a horrible job to clean it. 

[Stephen1]

I'm glad your baby is back making Lumber. W all have issues, problems and in my words EDITED BY ADMIN but nothing better than solving them and moving forward.

[SawyerTed]

@Southside has pointed to a likely issue - fuel supply/fuel pump.

Last summer I got an edger on loan from a guy (I still have it). It has a 23 hp Kohler and had a similar problem. Turned out the fuel pump needed help getting primed.  Once it gets fuel it runs fine.  It has a portable tank so I used an outboard fuel line with a primer bulb to get the prime.

[WV Sawmiller]

SS & Ted,

   I am still convinced it is a fuel/air problem but have pinpointed it yet. I completely filled the tank (it already had about 4 gallons so should not have been anything there) and pulled the fuel hose off at the filter on the engine side and I had a very steady supply of gas coming out. I tried to crank and no luck, removed the air filter cover and filter and choked it. Had to choke it completely shut and it would crank, I could engage the blade (No blade on) to rev up the engine and it kept running but as soon as I open the choke back up it dies. Did this several times. My small engine repair neighbor has not been home when I checked so far today. Any other suggestions?

[Southside]

You are not getting enough fuel, which is why it runs on choke. Pull the fuel line from the carb side of the fuel pump and check the flow there while cranking the engine. If that is a strong flow then next is the carb bowl. Need to remove it and check for trash in the bowl and jets feeding the carb.

It's also possible the float in the bowl is stuck and not letting fuel in, removing the bowl and freeing the float would fix that. 

[Peter Drouin]

One reply 46 the gas tank looks all pucked up is the vent working??

[richhiway]

Running with the choke on means you are starving for fuel. If you take the line off the carb and crank the engine while holding it in a can you should get a good flow of fuel. Don't hold it near the plug wire a stray spark can make a little gas exciting! If that works then the carb is plugged up. You probably worked some gunk loose by knocking it around. 

Just remove the bowl and clean it, then spray some carb cleaner up the jet, it will shoot through into the venturi if it's not plugged.

Then move the float gently up and down and make sure the needle valve is moving with it. you can also spray some carb cleaner through the fuel intake when the bowl is hanging down to make sure it's clear.

Not much to a small engine carb. put the bowl back on and give it a try. watch the eyes with the card spray it goes everywhere except where you aim it.

I had clean the carb on my generator he other day it was doing the same thing took about ten minutes.

[WV Sawmiller]

  Thanks for the suggestions. My neighbor is supposed to come look at it tomorrow afternoon. He suggested I change plugs since it laid on its side overnight and he said could have a fouled plug. That's an easy check.

I pulled the fuel line off after the fuel pump (I gather that is it) and when I turn the key it pumps fuel steadily so it is getting that far.

Peter,

 I don't know what vent you are suggesting to check. I don't see one on  my tank like ones I have on my outboard motor fuel tanks. I did leave the cap on loose to make sure no vacuum there but no change. It still cranks with the choke out and runs till you push the choke in.

[AK Newbie]

WV good luck with the latest hiccup, like you said it will likely be something very simple...  Eagle River is 10 miles north of Anchorage, it's actually a part of the Municipality.  If you ever get up here to visit your BIL get ahold of me and we'll go catch some fish!  This little guy was from our girls only trip last summer.  ;D

 

[Chuck White]

Real nice Halibut, biggest I ever caught was 82#, mostly caught Chicken Halibut!

Either way, it's the best, and congratulations to the girls!

[WV Sawmiller]

AK,

   Thanks for the invite and the picture. Is that what people call a barn door or such? I went with my BIL the last time we were there but only caught one silver and a few small rockfish and a skate or two. We sure didn't get any like that. My BIL's daughter lives in Wasilla - I could not remember the name of her city the last time I wrote.

[Jim_Rogers]

Ok, so we were discussing how the head could fall off your mill, yesterday at the Northern Project, and we weren't sure if it fell off one end or the other or over the side.
Can you solve that discussion for us?
My mill has stops on both end to prevent the head from sliding off either end. Does your mill have them?
Jim Rogers

[WV Sawmiller]

@Jim_Rogers

I am glad I could provide thought provoking discussions to your get-together even though I could not be there in person. It looks like you guys had a good time and I'm happy for you.

IRT your questions my mill does have the stops on each end to prevent the head from running off the rails. That was not the problem. The problem is the head is held on the rails with an upper and lower bracket that the rollers and cam follower on top ride on (for the 2 rollers) or against (for the cam follower) and another bracket on the bottom with a cam follower bearing to ride against. Think of these two brackets like a wood clamp you use in the shop. My bottom cam follower/bearing seized and would stop rolling which set the head to shaking violently as it skipped along the rail. To remove the bottom cam follower I first lowered the head on to a 4' long 6X6 stood upright to take the weight off the bearings. Then I went to loosen the cam follower/bearing which has a held on with a nut. I don't remember shaft size but the nut uses 15/16" end wrench. When you turn the nut the shaft on the bearing spins too. The end of the bearing shaft is slotted to fit a 5/16" allen/hex head wrench but when installed, there is no space between the bottom rail and the top of the cam follower to put your wrench so I loosened the bottom bracket and rotated it down an inch or so till it tilted the cam follower shaft enough I could get the hex wrench in, remove the nut and cam follower then I replaced with a new cam follower and tightened it. In the process the bracket shifted slightly so the holes in the bracket did not line up with the holes in the mast any more so I attempted to raise the head slightly to put pressure back on the bracket to line up the bolt holes. Once the weight was off the 6X6 the head rolled forward then just fell forward as the head was top heavy that high up and with bolts out of the bracket, there was nothing on the bottom to hold the head against the bottom rail so it fell. Think of the bottom jaw on your wood clamp missing - whats going to hold it in place? Looking back it should have been obvious this could happen so first I should not have had the head raised that high (but that was the height of the 6X6 I had handy) and the head should have been choked and secured to something stout above so it could not fall. It was actually very dangerous as the head unit may weigh 700-800 lbs of more. My little JD 750 with a small Bushhog brand 1646 model FEL would not lift it off the ground. I called a neighbor and he came the next morning with his big Kubota tractor and FEL and we choked around the top of the mast - there is no lift point provided and that was only spot we could find not to crush the motor or band wheel assemblies. It was off center but worked enough he could lift and rotate the head so the upper bracket fit on the rails then we rotated more till the bottom was flush against the bottom rail and we aligned and reinserted the bolts and both jaws of our clamp are now back in place. The head rolls on the top rollers and cam followers on top and bottom hold it right against the rail with enough space for the head to roll. After that it was just a matter of replacing a few damaged parts like the plastic faucet to my lube tank that broke and the plastic outer cover of the air filter unit on the motor and reattach and adjust the contact for the hydraulic power strip. This contact rides against the rail so it obviously jerked free in the fall and needed to be reinstalled and adjusted. After that it was just a matter of realigning the head tilt and blade guide rollers and such. Mine is a single mast mill. Your's may be different if a different model.

A little lengthy reply and probably should be over in the health and safety or such to keep someone else from doing the same thing. If that doesn't answer any specific question anyone has let me know and I'll answer as best I can. It was not the smartest thing I have done in my life, unfortunately it is not the dumbest either and I have the scars to prove it. If reading this helps prevent someone else doing the same thing then this has been time well spent and I will survive the embarrassment.

All,

Now back to my motor not starting/running. I bought new plugs today on advice from a neighbor who works on a lot of small engines. He thought the plugs might have gotten fouled when the head was on the ground overnight and they did look pretty sooted up. I removed them and turned the key and spun the starter to clear any debris present. I put the new plugs in and bumped the starter and got one grunt then absolutely nothing. My mechanic neighbor had just arrived. I took the plugs out but still nothing when I turned the key. He suggested a blown fuse so we started looking for a fuse box.


 I spotted this connection on the right side of the motor facing from front to rear. It was not as far open as I display on the picture but was very loose.


 I plugged it in tightly and my mill cranks and runs as it is supposed to. Apparently during the recent rough handling this connection (May be some sort of kill switch?) loosened enough it did not make a good connection but allowed some power. This apparently was all that was wrong.


 I sawed the short piece of maple on the mill into 4 LE 8/4 slabs about 3' long and 6-10 inches wide then I sawed the 8' split maple log on the arms into 6 - 1X8 boards and everything worked fine. Then the rain returned before I could cut the other log up.

Other than still needing to fine tune the adjustment on my power strip connection I think I am back in business.

[Old Greenhorn]

ANd life is GOOD again. I love that feeling! I hope you do too. Never made a comment here, but I have been reading along and had nothing valuable to add, so I just watched and felt badly for you. Glad you are off to the races now. Congrats! 8) 8) 8)

[terrifictimbersllc]

Same here. Didn't know what to say. Glad you're both ok and not much worse for the wear.

[WV Sawmiller]

  Let's just say I now know more about some aspects of my mill than I ever wanted to know. Is has been both a humbling and an empowering experience. The weather cleared and I went back out and sawed the other maple log in the pictures above. In the process I discovered my bent guard that runs in front of the head (The aluminum one that popped out of the plastic fitting) was too low and hit the bunks on the bottom 4/4 board. Two whacks with a 3 lb hammer and it is back where it is supposed to be and that put that little chip deflector closer to the roller guide where it belonged too.


 Mostly 1X10 maple. I saw one with some wane that would make a clean 1X8X8 or a clean 1X10X6. The eternal question to edge them longer and narrower or shorter and wider. I left it wide and figure I can always rip it later if necessary. Lets see - a 1X8X8 is about 5.3 bf or a 1X10X6 is 5 bf so no big difference either way.

[Peter Drouin]

 8) 8) Good to go now.

[YellowHammer]

Good news.  

[samandothers]

All the stars are back in alignment! 8) Well at least the connectors!

[WV Sawmiller]

   Still doing a little PT on my mill since our accident. Did an alignment and learned more about adjusting the head. The idler side was about 1/4" off and I got that right and spent way more time with the blade guide rollers than should have been necessary. The drive side outside adjustment screw is a bear to reach. Monkeyed with them several times up and down, in and out, etc. had to relevel the tilts several times but that got to be real fast process after enough practice. Then checked the rails and found one loose on the loader side. Quick and easy fix to adjust and tighten. All checked out at the correct level/height compared to the head. Checked drive belt tension as put new belt on about 10 hours ago. Tried to saw a 10" RO log and band surfed all over the place and got stuck in the log. Replaced a couple times checking to see if was a bad blade. Called WM and discussed and tech said tighten drive belt so I tightened (Too much) then loosened and looks about in line with specs in the manual. The blade would still rise as soon as entered the log. Was about to try adjusting the blade guides/rollers downward tension again when I noticed the arm going to the aluminum blade guard I'd straightened was touching the bottom of the bands under the idler side roller which explained black marks I was seeing I'd thought came from the belt. I adjusted downward half inch or so, replaced the blade and it cut fine. Turns out what I was doing was knocking the set off the bottom teeth on the band which caused it to cut upward when entered the log. Worked fine after that and I cut the small RO and a 4' piece I'd bucked earlier into 8/4 for benches or such. A whopping 53 bf day! May be a new record. When I got in I called WM and left a thank you message for 2 techs I'd talked to and an explanation. They probably never thought to ask if cerebral flatulence could be the cause. Oh well, I definitely understand a lot more about mill than I did a week ago. Final thing I adjusted was the pointer on the number scale- boy is that a joy to adjust. Get a cant good and square on the bed, just kiss the end with the spinning blade, measure the height of the cut then loosen the 2 phillips screws and move the pointer up or down to the height you just measured and tighten.

[WV Sawmiller]

   Did not get a chance to saw any today because of other conflicts in my schedule. I did pick up the replacement air filter cover from our local Kohler dealer. I also dropped him off a free sample - a 50 lb feed sack full of fresh cut sawdust and told him to try it as oil spill media. He seemed real happy to get it and said his mechanics love to spill oil while working on the mowers and such. Maybe I can develop a market for a current waste product.

   My son mentioned something that might have saved me so much grief here - an impact wrench. If I had just used my impact wrench to spin the nut off the lower cam follower I might never have had to loosen the lower bracket from the rail or hold the head of the cam follower shaft with a hex key/wrench to remove the nut. If the occasion arises again or if any of the rest of you get in the same boat that might be the simple solution.

[Southside]

From what I remember I don't think you can get the follower out of the bracket even if it was loose. 

[SawyerTed]

I appreciate you sharing this experience start to finish.  I'm learning a lot by reading this thread and comparing to my owner's manual and my mill.

[WV Sawmiller]

SS,

   I will find out if/when it happens again.

[terrifictimbersllc]

SS-does the LT70Super have the same liability as the LT35 (single post mast both), with respect to changing the cam follower bearings?  

Bigger they come the harder they fall? 

[Southside]

TT -

I have only peeked at the cam followers on my 70 and actually only spotted one of them.  There is a whole lot of "stuff" in and around there so I am not sure how it's all put together.  

[SawyerTed]

No need to "borrow trouble"......

[Bluejay27]

The 70 super has one cam follower and bracket toward the front and a second bracket with two cam followers at the rear. The rear bracket has a pivot so both apply pressure evenly. And the cam followers are the same 1-1/2"

[Southside]

Top and bottom the same?

[Crossroads]

Glad you got if figured out and are back to making sawdust. 

[WV Sawmiller]

   I can definitely say I now know a whole lot more about the design and operational features of my mill. I also learned if you knock the set off the bottom teeth your blade wants to climb which might be a handy reminder/troubleshooting tool for others to remember.