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Author Topic: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.  (Read 8401 times)

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Offline customsawyer

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WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« on: December 05, 2011, 12:20:00 PM »
This is the sharpeners that I use.

Here is the two sharpeners side by side.

 

 

This is the WM sharpener.



 

This is the cooks sharpener.

 

 

This is how I clean the blades.

 

 

 

 

Once the blades are clean I hang them here each side of the post goes to one sharpener. The blades are kept separate since even though I get the profile very close it is not perfect on the cooks sharpener. Thus if I took a blade from the cooks sharpener, then the next time run it on the WM it would put excess wear on certain parts of the CBN wheel.

 

 

This is the setter.

 

 

 

 

This is the band roller.

 

  
Two LT70s and to much other support equipment to mention.
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Offline Bibbyman

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2011, 12:40:36 PM »
Thanks for the pixs!

I just came in from sharpening and setting 8 blades.   The building is not heated.  Its below freezing and snow is lightly falling.  Im done for now and in by the fire!

But,  I have come to the conclusion that one of the keys to a good cutting blade that Ive sharpened is that the blade needs to be clean.   Not only clean on the body but especially on the teeth.  I have taken great pains to scrape the tarter off the sides of the teeth before setting.  I think it leads to a much more uniform set.

I guess to support this notion that the sides of the teeth need to be clean,  I was setting a tooth and noted that a flake of tarter came off after the striker had pushed the tooth.   I checked the set.  It was .024.  I checked the tooth going the other way and it was .025.  I found some junk on the back side of that tooth so I cleaned it.  I took the little set correction tool and bent a little bit of set out of the two teeth and put the blade back in the setter and stroked it again.   This time the set came out .021 and .022.  The junk buildup had accounted for .003 of false set.  Itd be ok if every tooth had the same thickness of junk but even then youd not get the set you were expecting.

I noticed how you are wire brushing your blades.  Are you brushing them before or after grinding?

I think what the band blade sharpeners of the world needs is an affordable blade cleaning station.  Im thinking something like two bicycle tires mounted on a tube frame with some kind of spring tension.  Mount the blade like you would on the mill.  Then there would be one or more motors with brushes to clean the blade.  And maybe a hand crank to move the blade through the brushes.  One time around and its clean.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDE25 Super 25hp 3ph with Command Control and Accuset.
Sawing since '94

Offline redbeard

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2011, 12:48:57 PM »
Great ideas! I was told by the outfit that sharpens mine locally that he will not be resposible for set on dirty blades. That my blades have to be clean on the next go round. . So I will be soaking them in a solvent tank and keeping them clean and free of rust. Something I have neglected in the past.
Whidbey Woodworks and Custom Milling   06 B-20 Timberking 30hp gas.  Hud-son 60 Diesel wide cut bandmill    86 F-700 boom truck    JD 2240 50hp Tractor with 145 loader IR 1044 all terrain fork lift  Cooks sharp

Offline customsawyer

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2011, 01:00:36 PM »
When I first started sharpening I worried about having the blades super clean but the more I sharpen the less I worry unless they are super dirty. I set my blades between .027 and .030 on the .055 blades that I use. The first time I sharpen a new blade I will check the set and it is almost always right at .027 so I rarely set on the first sharpening.
I think that the cleaner blades and the strive for perfection in setting has a lot to do with the thickness of your blades and the size of the engine you have pushing them. I tend to get a lot of forgiveness with the blades I run.
Two LT70s and to much other support equipment to mention.
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Offline WH_Conley

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2011, 01:15:59 PM »
I clean mine by running the mill at cutting speed and turning the water lube wide open and sticking a long handled wire brush against the blade before taking the blade off. Very little junk left on the blade.
Bill

Offline Bibbyman

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2011, 01:20:10 PM »
We're using .045x1.25 WM DoubleHard blades. Right now using up the 9 degree blades and have 8 left. Going to use only 7 degree from now on.
Setting to. 024+/-.001.

Running on LT40HDE25-RA.

I'm still not getting as good a performance out of my blades as with the re-sharp but I'm using up old blades.
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Offline customsawyer

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2011, 02:01:46 PM »
We're using .045x1.25 WM DoubleHard blades. Right now using up the 9 degree blades and have 8 left. Going to use only 7 degree from now on.
Setting to. 024+/-.001.

Running on LT40HDE25-RA.

I'm still not getting as good a performance out of my blades as with the re-sharp but I'm using up old blades.



I find that interesting as I get far better results with my sharpening then with resharp.
Two LT70s and to much other support equipment to mention.
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Offline barbender

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2011, 03:26:20 PM »
I just bought a Cook's sharpener while they were on sale. It hasn't arrived yet, but I'm looking forward to it getting here Wednesday or Thursday. I decided on the Cook's sharpener because I want to custom sharpen for others, and the Cook's seemed more versatile. (I learned that from customsawyers comparisons of the two elsewhere). Thanks for the pix.
Too many irons in the fire

Offline bugdust

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2011, 04:29:13 PM »
Since my sawing does not justify a personal sharpener, I depend on Marty's resharp service in Shade Gap, PA. I have received excellent service and the blades are returned just like new. Regardless, I enjoy reading your posts and find resharpening interesting. I've read several ways you clean blades, just wondering how Wood-Mizer cleans blades in comparison to your process. However they do it they sure shine like new.
Since I retired I really like work: It fascinates me. I can sit and look at it for hours.

Offline NMFP

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2011, 04:37:17 PM »
I made a band cleaner out of 2 dewalt 6" bench grinders with wire wheels.  It works well and removes most of the build up and makes rusty bands shine.  I now need to make a device to quickly remove buildup from the gullets other than doing them by hand.  Years ago, we used to use Lye water to clean circular saws.  We could clean any saw that would fit in our parts bath and they all were clean when they came out.  just had to make sure you didnt get the lyw water on you or you would be missing some finger nails at some point.  :D :D :D

Offline Bibbyman

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2011, 05:17:08 PM »
Got any pictures of your blade cleaner?
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Offline Banjo picker

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2011, 05:31:01 PM »
Customsawyer would you tell us what % of your bands you use the Cooks roller on?  Banjo
Cooks AC 36--Prentice 210C--Morgan edger--Kubota M7040 with loader--Case 580 K with extendahoe--Case 850C dozer--Int 1700 series twin cylinder dump/log/flatbed truck--logging arch--2 Logrite mill sp.--Cat claw sharpening system--And a bulldog to make sure it all stays here.

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2011, 05:53:28 PM »
Do you brush every blade or just the cruddy ones?   

How do you do the inside?  Flip the blade inside out?

Looks like the Cooks grinder is a dry grinder.  Does it just have stone wheel?

What size grinding wheel does the Pro series use?  Our WM CBN grinder uses a 7" wheel.

What profile are you running?
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Offline customsawyer

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2011, 06:18:28 PM »
Banjo I don't roll a blade until I run into a dive or rise in a blade. I will check the set first and then lay  a utility blade knife on the blade from the bottom of the gullet to the back of the blade and check for a crown or cup underneath the utility blade.

Bibby

1. Just before I take a blade off I run the lubmizer at full force. This makes it to where I clean less than 3% of my blades. The ones I clean usually come from sawing heavy pitch pine.

2. To clean the inside of the blade I just put it up on the band roller and clean it there.

3. The cooks grinder is a dry grinder. I have been told the it is a ceramic wheel but I am not sure of this as it looks like a regular stone wheel to me.  The other side of that, is that I don't know what the difference is.

4. I have not measured the stone on the WM grinder but 7" sounds about right. The main reason I went with the pro series over the shop series that you have is the size of the drive motor and thickness of the blades that I use. I figured that I would need the extra motor strength.

5. I run the 10 degree blade. The mill in Hazelhurst has the edger in line and I usually have hired help so I run the 1 3/4 by .055 by 7/8 to get the max production. On the mill that I do portable work with I never figure I will get it to max production so I just run the 1 1/2" blade.
Two LT70s and to much other support equipment to mention.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Offline bushhog920

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2011, 08:23:35 PM »
I use a cooks works great. to clean my blades I drop them in my automotive parts washer full of mineral sprits then wipe them with a rag. leaves an oily film on them and they go through the sharpener and setter much better. really recommend useing mineral sprits to clean with.

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2011, 08:34:18 PM »
customsawyer: you must have built that shop before you got a sawmill. All that roofing on the walls instead of B&B.
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Offline WDH

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2011, 09:52:42 PM »
Jake sharpened some blades for me, and they were the sharpest blades that I have run.  Jake knows how to do things right, with blades, and a lot of other things as well. 
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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2011, 10:37:06 PM »
I do not have any pictures of my machine but it works on the same principle as the 2 bicycle wheels theory. 

I roll bands when they need it.  Typically, the .045 bands need rolled before .055 bands and so do many simonds bands.  purchased a roller from cooks years ago but have also made some electric powered ones as well.  Not difficult at all.

As far as grinders go, I believe cooks and WM are the best, both have pros and cons and it all depends on what you like to use.  If I only sharpened wm bands, I would always use a cbn sharpener but since I do alot of different brands and compositions, I stick to using cooks.  Have 3 grinders online, 2 dual tooth setters and a single tooth setter along with 1 manual band roller and an electric roller. 

I am in the process of designing a sharpener that traces the exact shape of the tooth without any dressing to a wheel except rounding a corner for gullet removal. Also does not need cams for different profile spacings and shapes.   Have built 2 prototypes and working on the 3rd right now which I feel will be completely refined and work great. Can sharpen a 158" band in 8 minutes.

is anyone running a wright sharpener these days?

Offline bandmiller2

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2011, 07:26:08 AM »
NMFP,tell us more about the band rollers you made and a picture if possible.What did you use for the convex and concave wheels?? Frank C.
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Offline 5quarter

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Re: WM pro series sharpener and Cooks sharpener with pics.
« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2011, 11:28:22 AM »
Customsawyer...Excellent post on your setup! You might recall from another thread that I've been fighting buildup under the teeth for some time. I do as WH_Conley does, which helps, but now that I see how you use the brush wheel, I think that problem will now go away. ;)
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