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Firewood chopsaw- for the small user

Started by DMcCoy, October 27, 2014, 12:43:26 PM

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DMcCoy

As much as I would like a processor I could never justify owning one.  I cut just for myself.  I burn between 5-10 cords a year.  Cutting firewood gets less exciting the older I get.

I was given a section of lumber yard roller conveyor, had an old trailer, an extra chain saw, and a 12' electric belt conveyor.

This helps with the nuisance wood 4-12" in diameter.  I can load the log deck with the tractor forks.  Roll them onto the conveyor by hand and advance them to the saw by hand.


 


 
The counterbalance is a paint bucket filled with gravel, 3 pulleys and some 1/8" cable.  Hanging chain determines length -12-24".
This assembly must be removed and the saw lifted and tilted over to fill the gas and oil - a simple process.


 

Belt conveyor takes takes the rounds to a pile that later gets split (hydraulic) then back onto the conveyor into a pile to dry.

ckhenshaw4

Your setup is like I would like to do.  I am getting TOO old to continue cutting on the ground, but too poor to purchase a "real" processor. I am looking for a "free" conveyor that I can get to make something like you have. Nice work. Would you happen to have any close-ups of the bracket you made for your saw ? 

;D
Getting TOO old to "man handle" wood anymore. Looking at building a firewood processor.

DMcCoy

I can get you a couple of pics.  I made a plate with holes, same as where the guard would fit - very secure.  Damaged some internal clutch parts of the saw from heat because the plate had bur/ridge that pinched the blade (chain) to tight. All better now.

Philbert

Interesting set up!

Add some 90° nipples to the oil and fuel tank so that you can fill in place?

Philbert

DMcCoy

Here are a couple of more pics.   
Plate for connecting saw to frame.  Standard 4"door hinge.  Welding not so good - low gas pressure  >:(


 
Because it tilts for refueling I had to add an adjustment 'stop' bolt so it will cut square(vertical)


 
Lots of pulleys to get the counterweight to hang free and clear.


 
Philbert - I wondered about making adapters for gas and oil.  Wasn't sure if fuel tank is pressurized or not.

ckhenshaw4

Thanks DMcoy,
Great set-up.  I will probably be a "copy cat"
A powered Log Conveyor would be nice also !!!!!!!!!


Thanks again.


Getting TOO old to "man handle" wood anymore. Looking at building a firewood processor.

Hilltop366

Great Ideas for making it easier!

I wonder if you could run separate tanks for your gas and bar oil with some longer fuel and oil lines?

DMcCoy

Thanks for the compliments - this forum has been helpful to me it was time to return the favor.

Saddle tanks - I agree.  Does anyone know if the fuel tank on this saw is pressurized? That is the only thing that stopped me from doing that.  It would make construction easier. 

A couple of other details-
1) The saw blade intentionally comes down between two rollers so I didn't need something to hold the log end.  You see a lot of processors with hydraulic holding arms on the log side of the saw but no outboard roller.
2) It needs back fence on the roller conveyor side.  Wood gets pulled against the metal tube that supports the chain for determining the length, but on the roller conveyor side there is no back support.  After a couple of times getting your hand smacked against the conveyor frame....->back to the shop for some modifications.  A guy could make some dogs for either side of the saw to keep small wood from spinning too.



ckhenshaw4

Sorry to be a PAIN, but would you happen to have any pics of your pivot point for the saw to go through the logs ?  I see the hinge that lets your saw pivot to the side for re-fueling.
Thanks.

Getting TOO old to "man handle" wood anymore. Looking at building a firewood processor.

Hilltop366

I doubt if the tank is pressurized, I have never seen a pressurize file tank on a chain saw.

The fuel pump is on the carb, I think all you would need to do is remove the existing fuel line and route a new longer one to your larger tank (don't forget to put a fuel filter on the new line). I'm not sure how much pulling power the pump will have so you might have to experiment on how low the tank could go if it ha to be below the saw.

I have made a fuel tank before by using a regular gas can and drilling a hole in the cap, I made the hole smaller than the fuel line so the line fit tightly and formed a good seal. It was the style of gas can with a separate vent so  when using the engine I would loosen vent cap. The best part was that when I needed more fuel I could unscrew the cap and pull the line out and swap in a full tank.

Philbert

Most modern chainsaws that I have seen have a vent in the fuel tank.  If you extend the fuel cap opening with a 90° 'L', that would not be a problem.  If you are running off of a separate, external tank, you will have to factor that in.  And, of course, you are dealing with gasoline, so be careful.

Philbert

DMcCoy

Here are the pictures you requested.  Big sq tube is mounted to roller conveyor.  Saw frame pivots on 1/2" water pipe inserted into some DOM tubing I had laying around.  All very crude - first ever.

 

Looking toward the hing you wanted to see from the operators position.


 

Swatson

I like it...Ive gotten to where I dont cut wood in the woods anymore.  I drag the tree home and work it there.  That thing you made would be perfect for that.
I cant figure out which one I like better: working with wood or making the tools to work with wood.

r.man

Nice setup, I too would like something to help with wood and that is a nice design you have. I like the flop over for the saw but can certainly see that filler adapters would make the build easier. I am surprised you need a counterbalance. Did you try using weigh at the rear of the saw? Cables, pulleys and I don't get along well.
Life is too short or my list is too long, not sure which. Dec 2014

Husky562

562xp, John Deere 4310

DMcCoy

r.man 
I tried it first without a counterbalance and found myself getting a blister on the top of my R thumb from lifting even wearing leather gloves.  The lift wasn't so heavy that a guy couldn't do it but it is worth the the effort to counterbalance it for comfort and ease of use. Having it counterbalanced also let me leave it 'up' so I can use both hands if necessary to fuss with odd shaped logs.  Little details that I didn't foresee until I used it. 
It might be hard to see in the pictures but there is a metal bar facing at an upward angle toward the operators position.  When the saw is raised the saw bar is behind it hopefully preventing an accident. It probably should be covered better - next trip to the shop.

If I had saddle tanks for oil and fuel I think weighting the saw frame would be better - fewer moving parts.   It still needs some modifications.

Ivan49

 It looks good but if you would have found the balance point on your saw and made the pivot point just ahead of it the saw would stay up on its own and you should be able to lift it without the cables or blister. But what ever works for you is all that matters

DMcCoy

Ivan 49
You are correct that could be done.  It would require @ 90 degree swing on that short of a bar (14").  I have some 24" bars which would be less motion, using your suggested pivot point. I will have to see how much time I have.
Edit: There would be 2 factors or balance points.  One with the saw completely up and the other down.  Pivoting forward of both of these as you suggest would be the spot.  Having saddle tanks would make fabrication easier.

r.man

I was actually thinking of a solid weight attached behind the pivot point and behind the saw just to get rid of the cables. Like they do with what turns out to be called " Boom gates". Had trouble finding a picture because I didn't know the name. Here is one. http://england.all.biz/barrier-with-aluminium-boom-g50926
Life is too short or my list is too long, not sure which. Dec 2014

DMcCoy

It would be interesting to see what you come up with -> pictures. 
So far I'm finding the thing overall to be really helpful.  The belt conveyor needs redoing to make it adjustable for height at the output end.  At @4' the pile isn't very high.

birdmandog

Very nice and simple. I just purchased a couple rollers for the same type of system. We have a old hay elevator for the split wood. Just working on the splitter parts now. Thanks for posting the picks of the chainsaw attachment.  I have been looking for a design I could copy.. Or at least try.. Happy New Year.....

DMcCoy

This guys firewood machine is interesting, well worth a look.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iDiC8UJeCI

What I see with most small processors is the need for a holder on the log end.  I used an outboard roller for underneath support and the metal that supports the cut to length chain holds the outboard backside, similar to the base and fence on a chopsaw.  Because it is supported on both sides of the saw I haven't felt a need for a holder on the log end. 
I think there is room for improvement as this was my first trial.  I plan on a 2x6 or 2x8 on the backside of the roller section.  Also a good attachment for the conveyor.

r.man

I like the look of the type of system that cycles the log forward with the splitter. Very simple and it would make processing both faster and easier.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4LNgparQ8o
Life is too short or my list is too long, not sure which. Dec 2014

DMcCoy

Now that is a smart design! 
It's hard to see all the little details.  A trough on good rollers would be almost effortless for log advancement.  Some metal fingers to hold the log while the trough retracts.  Tied to the splitter cylinder =less hydraulics, less headaches, less expense. Nice!
Good find!
A splitter, a chain saw, and a conveyor. Hmmmm....

bandmiller2

Very clever designs but chainsaws are an expensive high maintenance machine, and a pain in the butt to file in position. What about replacing it with a large electric cutoff saw and carbide tipped blade. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

hedgerow

Quote from: bandmiller2 on January 01, 2015, 08:28:21 AM
Very clever designs but chainsaws are an expensive high maintenance machine, and a pain in the butt to file in position. What about replacing it with a large electric cutoff saw and carbide tipped blade. Frank C.
I like the circular carbide blade cut off saw Idea. I run a 36 in on my gas engine power buzz saw but you are limited to the size of wood you can cut. I looked at one in a 60 inch size to cut big logs but the cost of the blade and the hp to run it runs into a lot of money. If you were cutting wood for a living the circular blade would be the way to go a lot less sharping.

Philbert

Quote from: bandmiller2 on January 01, 2015, 08:28:21 AM
Very clever designs but chainsaws are an expensive high maintenance machine, and a pain in the butt to file in position. What about replacing it with a large electric cutoff saw and carbide tipped blade.

Does not have to be a 2-cycle engine driving the saw chain.  Could be electric or hydraulic.  Make the chains easy to swap out for filing.

Philbert

DMcCoy

The slippery slope tilts ever farther toward building a processor...  :laugh:
If my log supply was all consistent diameter all decisions would be easier. 
Going from @28" to 8" is such a difference.  I have modified my splitter and built a new conveyor (pics and descriptions later) so I'm comfortable with the splitting and piling process(s). 
I'm leaning toward some sort of elevated table for cutting rounds off big logs and a ramp to the splitter, or do you just put a 32" bar on the end of the roller conveyor and find some way to advance the heavy logs? Do you sort your logs to sizes sending them to different areas until cut and then back to a common table be split.
:)   

DMcCoy

Had a very close call.  The cable system that holds my saw up came loose dropped the saw with chain still turning.   No injury but a bruised forearm from the guard and bruised sense of security. 
I will be making some modifications, this was luck, no need to push it.

sawyerf250

@DMcCoy what about putting a cover over your chain that pivots when you start cutting into your log, serves two purposes 1 being it keeps you safe and 2 it keeps wood chip off of everything. Also what about using a large spring instead of the cable and bucket system?
Massey Ferguson 375 w/838 loader, Wallenstien Fx 90 winch, 3 Husqvarna chainsaws

lopet

I have a similar outfit. Anything less than 5'' I won't split and  run it through the "poor man's ctl processor".
Like others said , if the saw is balanced at the "right" point you wouldn't need counterweights and pulleys.



 

A hair pin is holding the saw bracket in the tube. Easy to remove and fuel up.

 
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

DMcCoy

Lopet-   Looks like a nice setup you have, and very similar.
Thanks for the pictures.  So simple! <- that is a compliment.
Mine needs some modification for safety - I got lucky.
Thanks again

lopet

I ve read about your close call, but I don't understand why the saw was still turning.  Throttle stuck ?

Thanks for the compliment. As you can see in the picture my bracket is attached to the bar screws and and has a piece of shaft welded on a ninety degrees angle underneath the saw for your pivot point. Then  you weld on a piece of tube to your cutting table where the shaft fits through. It has to be a tight fit or the saw will bind as you're cutting. A bit of grease once a season makes things even smoother. At the bottom I made a stop with a threaded rod, so the saw does not cut any deeper as it has to.
Maybe that will help you to improve yours.  I ve built countless things and most of them needed to be modified or improved. A few things didn't work at all and got cut up again.  ;D
I use my 372XP for that job, as she has plenty of power and a bigger fuel tank as my Stihl saws.
If you need a better look, I can take a picture of the bracket alone.
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

DMcCoy

Yeah the throttle is sticking a little and I was just wanting to get a small pile cut up.  Dumb-dumb.
I attach my saw with a plate and the bar bolts and there is plenty of room to do what you have done.
Me too - I've built plenty of stuff that doesn't work out. 
The ones that work the best are usually simpler designs.

ckhenshaw4

Hey lopet,
Was wondering if you could take a couple of close up pictures of your saw mount bracket that you made ?  Am working on making a firewood processor, and would like to see your mount.
Also, is your infeed rollers powered at all, or do you move the log forward manually ? 
Thanks.
Getting TOO old to "man handle" wood anymore. Looking at building a firewood processor.

lopet

No, rollers aren't powered. Wish they were.  It works better with two people, as I don't have enough  mmmpf in my left arm to pull them ahead, while my right hand  runs the saw. That's usually the only time of the year I am asking my wife to assist.
Unfortunately  last year she told me that it was last time. Ended up spending $ 250 for chiropractic treatment :( . May as well hire somebody to help from now on, as I have to pay for anyways. ;D
We may do 15-20 cord this way and the heavier stuff runs trough the processor, which I can run easy by myself.

Will try to get some more pics tomorrow. 
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

lopet

Hope that will give you a idea.


  

  

 
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

Hilltop366

Lopet, would adding a hand winch (or electric if close to a source) to pull the log ahead be practical?

I was thinking a cable to pull the log or perhaps one like this if your wood is straight enough.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM3GHS08x30

lopet

As I just chop them and don't split, they go trough a lot faster.  Still think paying somebody to help works the best, at least for me. If I really had to do it myself I think I would have a feeder roll on top and a live deck with only one layer of logs on it. But like I said, it doesn't make sense to me for such amount.  For me it's just a way to salvage the limb wood, which I mix   with the split body wood while I am loading it.  Customers don't mind 10 or 15% limb wood, some actually asked for higher percentage for whatever reason.
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

ckhenshaw4

Quote from: Hilltop366 on March 12, 2015, 07:59:27 PM
Lopet, would adding a hand winch (or electric if close to a source) to pull the log ahead be practical?

I was thinking a cable to pull the log or perhaps one like this if your wood is straight enough.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM3GHS08x30

This winch type system, is how I am looking at building mine.  Looks rather simple to construct. 
Lopet, do your end rollers still roll then with it like that ?  Can't really tell if your bracket it on top of the rollers or up a little ?
Getting TOO old to "man handle" wood anymore. Looking at building a firewood processor.

lopet

Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

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