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Author Topic: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit  (Read 2477 times)

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Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #20 on: July 13, 2019, 08:29:41 AM »
Since I have been 'out of the game' I have lost my sources. Gotta look for some of those hemostats. I may have some in an OB kit if I still have one laying around, but I thought they just had cord claps, not the same thing exactly :) . Never did get around to buying a CAT, I should do that, usually have stuff handy that will do the job. Is Stop Clot OTC now Doc? Last time I messed with it, it was new, and had a short shelf life with a big price tag. Our state had not yet approved it for field use and I forgot about it for a while. I always have a 'big kit' not too far away, but keep small ones with the right stuff handy.
 I am going to have to cultivate a source soon. Too may kits to keep up with. Each with it's own target purpose. My favorite is the StatPacks thigh bag I use for festivals now. Just basic initial stuff, a b/p cuff and steth, pulse ox, a few 4x4's, wipes, gloves, hemostats, roller gauze, tape, notepad, pen, glasses, bandage & trauma shears, antibiotic packets, and various band-aids. I give out lots of band-aids. Its a nice little pack, easy to carry. It is ALWAYS in my truck the rest of the year.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) I mill for fun and my mental health. NYLT Certified.

I ain't the woodcutter, but I can cut wood 'til the woodcutter gets here.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #21 on: July 13, 2019, 08:36:29 AM »
I think so.  I get samples.  fire carries it, and ems is about to start.  email the co and ask for a sample.  We used to save up hemostats and would have 5 gallon buckets of med tools.  I might try to save up a batch for who needs um.  I carry quick clot.  I thinks it uses some parts of crab/seafood to stimulate slotting.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2019, 05:30:36 PM »
@doc henderson ,

   May be a silly question but won't be my first or likely my last, but if the quick clot product you mention is made from shellfish is it likely to cause a serious allergic reaction to people allergic to seafood/iodine like my daughter? Or is it one of those cases where you don't care because you can always give epi later, if needed, and treat the allergy/reaction while not stopping the blood loss would be more serious or fatal?
Howard Green
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2019, 05:41:58 PM »
I think it is a processed protein, and I do not think that is a concern but let me double check.  A tourniquet is also a good thing to keep handy, or have to know how to make one in a pinch.  The R & D department (US military)  has found that most limb salvage is based on the wound, not from the tourniquet.  So only use if needed, but the leg won't do much good if you bleed to death.  if I put a tourniquet on my uninjured leg for an hour, it would hurt but my leg should be fine.  do not try this at home.  so if needed, do not hesitate to apply a tourniquet and seek medical help.  again more info at "stop the bleed"  including some active shooter stuff.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2019, 05:48:18 PM »
They refer to it as a mineral Kaolin.  Little to no risk of allergy.  I agree that the risk is so low that it should be used and ongoing treatment rendered as needed.  I assume and will verify that the Iodine is absent, and the risk may be to other things in the product.  
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2019, 05:59:52 PM »
there is a lot of stuff out there.  you can get quick clot on amazon or Walmart online. an ace wrap or dedicated compression bandage.  there is a medication called TXA we are beginning to use for massive bleeding in the usa.  It has been used a long time in Europe and the pills are sold over the counter for heavy periods.  on the highway, working with heavy equipment and chainsaws, this is definitely something to consider.  keep in your car, backpack, workplace.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #26 on: July 14, 2019, 06:23:17 PM »
I have been following t'quit usage and studies for over 20 years. Read them ALL (Boston Med was my favorite) and  still wonder why it took the AHA so long to endorse them given the evidence. Anyway, I should get a proper one. If you ever find yourself with excess samples of stop clot, I know an EMT that would like to have a few in his pouch. ;D ;D Mine long expired. When I get back, I will see if I can snag some directly, no time now. Who are the main producers now? I did have some samples from Moore medical when I handled the EMS account with them, but since I don't spend money with them now, I doubt they would help me out.
 WV that was a great question, I never thought of that! I assume we would all do what has to be done in the moment, but it's great when you know what to expect next and can be ready for it. Truthfully I have never had one that got to the point of using a stop clot like product, but I would be a fool if I were not thinking about it. I have had them either controllable with conventional methods or way past any clotting agents being of use (CTD). I have not yet seen it all, because nobody has. Right Doc? Looking forward to hearing if Doc gets a definative answer. I suspect his initial thoughts will hold true and it's not an issue. But it is still a great question I would want to know.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) I mill for fun and my mental health. NYLT Certified.

I ain't the woodcutter, but I can cut wood 'til the woodcutter gets here.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2019, 10:28:01 PM »
just so you know, (prob. already do)  most pharma items have a shelf life that is arbitrary.  so 3 years after the exp. it is still prob. fine.  It does matter to store properly and not damage the package.  the quick clot is dry and a mineral so it should be fine.  at least do not throw it out until you get some new.  there are a few drugs like tetracycline that can become toxic when old, most will loose a little efficacy, but most are fine even past the exp. for a while.  I get samples at training stuff, but if I get some extra, I know what to do.  can get some instruments as well,  @Old Greenhorn 
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #28 on: July 14, 2019, 10:48:11 PM »
here is what is in my bleeding pocket of my back pack.



 

In another pocket is a heavy froggs rain gear, safety glasses and gloves.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #29 on: July 14, 2019, 11:24:48 PM »
Philmont rules, right DOc? 'Be able to find all critical items in your pack in pitch darkness. That's the way I always packed too. Upper rght was always emergency med stuff, rear was weather emergencies, upper left was water. 
 Thanks. Headed out in the morning, just came in from doing a rush slab for our camp (long story) and I got pictures, but no time to make a post. On the road early in the AM, back in a week. Thanks.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) I mill for fun and my mental health. NYLT Certified.

I ain't the woodcutter, but I can cut wood 'til the woodcutter gets here.

Offline ManjiSann

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #30 on: September 26, 2019, 08:18:40 AM »
This has been an excellent read and reminds me I need to get started on some trauma kits for various activities I do.

I'd imagine it's obvious to those medically trained but what an average person such as myself use forceps for in the field? 

Thanks,

Brandon 
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Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #31 on: September 26, 2019, 08:59:59 AM »
Not sure where you saw forceps, unless you are referring to Doc's photo. Those are hemostats, they are clamps that lock in position. Likely he uses them for pinching off bleeders, or retracters. He could tell you more, and likely will ;D. That type of work is not within my protocols and I don't carry those in my bare bones kit, especially for logging type stuff. However I do carry them in my quick jump kit in the truck along with bandage and trauma scissors for car accidents, etc. They have many uses even if just for holding a tube in pace to keep it from pulling out of the patient. I don't have the training to use them to pinch off a bleeder and would be afraid of damaging the tissue. (But I do have some umbilical cord clamps and have not tried them out yet. ;D) Now in my back country kit I carry a lot of stuff you might consider over the top, but the further you are from a road (help) the more the 'rules' get flexible and you start to focus on triage, damage control, stabilization, and infection. Far enough from the road, and the only question is "Did he live?" and if the answer is 'yes', it doesn't matter much how that happened. ;D :D
 Knowledge is power.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) I mill for fun and my mental health. NYLT Certified.

I ain't the woodcutter, but I can cut wood 'til the woodcutter gets here.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #32 on: September 26, 2019, 12:33:30 PM »
that is specifically my "stop the bleed" kit.  the videos on line show you how to use a tourniquet.  Kelly clamps are used most commonly by nurses to get a "screw on nut" loose on IV tubing.  Docs may use them to explore a wound or remove foreign material.  there are all kinds of instruments all with names and subtle differences.  mosquito forceps are tiny, alligator ones have a straight portion with hinged opening at the tip.  Normal folks do not need them but like all tools, you can find uses for them.  In our suture kits we get a needle driver, Kelly clamp, forceps, and scissors.  due to insurance companies requirements, most EDs use a disposable kit and everything used or not gets thrown away.  I offer them to some Dads if I think they can use them.  We used to throw them in a 5 gallon bucket and send them overseas.  the quality of the disposable are not quite as good.  the old days, we got them from Pakistan and reused/sterilized them.  they work well to use on electronic fishing ect.  you can not ever have too many tools.  I think everyone should have knowledge on how to stop serious bleeding and do basic cpr.  not only for your family, but in case of disaster or accidents far from help.  @Old Greenhorn @ManjiSann.  the stop the bleeding programs started in response to mass shootings so people in a building can respond before help arrives.  we are teaching boy scouts, teachers and students.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline Ron Scott

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #33 on: September 26, 2019, 02:50:15 PM »
I used them quite often doing sutures on wounds when I was a combat corpsman with the Marine Corps during my Korean War days. I still have a set of the scissors and forceps which were indestructible and still carry them in my personal first aid kit. We could cut through barbed wire with the scissors. 
~Ron

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #34 on: September 26, 2019, 03:13:07 PM »
trauma shears are great.  get them on line for a few bucks.  I will try to save some instruments and bring to the next big FF event.  maybe Jake's, for the people that want them.  otherwise disposed of.  Kelly type clamps were the classic fly tying instrument, as well as used by a few for consumption of weeds that are still not legal in the state of Ks.  Although i hear it is now legal to go topless in the state!  Off 'top' ic a little, but it was legal on the lake up at lake George NY when I used to sail there.  In four years only passed close enough to another sail boat to get an eye full.  the woman in the other boat seemed quite proud of her self.  My girlfriend at the time, not so much.  now what were we talking about?   :)
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline JJ

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #35 on: September 27, 2019, 05:48:30 PM »
Doc,
I like to duck hunt by jump shooting from canoe in slow moving small streams.
your comment brought back a memory of one of those trips.   was floating under a roadway bridge, and on other side were 2 naked girls (maybe 18-20) sun bathing on the bridge embankment.
All I could think of doing was a little wave while I drifted by in camo and with dog, they seemed quite surprised but both waved back.

What was the subject?

       JJ

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #36 on: September 27, 2019, 06:11:12 PM »
it is the little things in life... or maybe the bigger ones too.  all in fun! :) :) :).  i do not expect many Kansas women will casually start running around naked anytime soon.  most states just do not see the point in fighting lawsuits by activists.  or swimsuits for that matter.   8)
Kansas is fairly conservative.  concealed carry was a thing that required a permit, but open carry with a gun in a holster has always been legal here.  a few cities have ordinances.  i think being hung for stealing a horse or cattle is still on the books!!  i have personally never seen it done.   ;)
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #37 on: September 27, 2019, 06:37:08 PM »
what you need in the kit is dependent a little on your knowledge.  i think all responsible adults should be trained in basic cpr, and cardio version, and know how to stop bleeding including a tourniquet.  the more you know the more you need and can use.  
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.

Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Trauma kit/logger's first aid kit
« Reply #38 on: September 27, 2019, 11:04:44 PM »
Maybe this explains why I have 3 kits in my trucks back seat? :D When on a 'job' I would throw my keys to somebody and have to explain which stuff to grab "The big red bag behind the passenger seat that looks like a suitcase, and the green round bag behind the drivers seat on the floor, also the medium sized black bag with the shoulder strap, not the other one." I should really downsize a bit. ;D This still happens at work from time to time, I send somebody out to my truck in the parking lot for gear when a co-worker goes down because the stuff I need is not on the 'approved corporate first aid list'. Very frustrating at times. (OK, ALWAYS).
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) I mill for fun and my mental health. NYLT Certified.

I ain't the woodcutter, but I can cut wood 'til the woodcutter gets here.


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