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Author Topic: My Timber Frame Home  (Read 5726 times)

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Offline flyingparks

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My Timber Frame Home
« on: December 03, 2017, 08:40:54 PM »
Wondering if anyone knows what this is. I discovered it when I pulled my last timber to cut my last rafter. A mold of some kind? The wood is Doug Fir from the west. I also included a few photos of the frame. No more joints to cut.  :'(

  

  

 

Offline SPDM

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2017, 08:54:06 AM »
Beautiful frame

Offline logman

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2017, 09:18:36 AM »
It looks almost the same color as the anti blue stain dip they use on the white pine I get during the warmer months.  I wonder if they dip douglas fir also, it is on the sap wood.  Will it sand off? 
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Re: What is this?
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2017, 09:54:49 AM »
Thanks. It's a weird thing. It's the same color as the heartwood. Obviously it's all spotty. It won't sand off. Seems to have permeated. Luckily I was able to use it on the outside of the frame so it won't be seen. But i am just curious. I haven't seen it before.

Offline MbfVA

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2017, 09:58:00 AM »
 My bet is some kind of red mold / fungus. I would take a sample to be analyzed. Could be trouble.  You could try Clorox treatment on some of it.

Offline Don P

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2017, 03:58:03 PM »
Thanks. It's a weird thing. It's the same color as the heartwood. Obviously it's all spotty. It won't sand off. Seems to have permeated. Luckily I was able to use it on the outside of the frame so it won't be seen. But i am just curious. I haven't seen it before.

My bet would be extractives from the heartwood, something trapped that tea there for awhile.

Offline MbfVA

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2017, 04:28:20 PM »
if a dash of Clorox didn't faze it, I think that would prove Don's point  depending on the color fastness of the heartwood?   The splotchiness makes me think of mold.   I looked at the photo again, and the reproduction is kind of poor so I'm not really sure what I'm seeing.  I have definitely seen mold or fungus that color.

Offline Don P

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2017, 05:45:03 PM »
From pg 38 here, there is a bad pic;
https://fpinnovations.ca/media/publications/Documents/wood-discoloration.pdf
Quote
A distinct blotchy red/pink stain in hemlock and Douglas-fir is caused by Cephaloascus fragrans or C. Ibidus. Sometimes it is also found on green lumber.

The section on extractives held promise as well  :D. What you have there is a stain.
Pg 31 has an interesting section on "sour felling" trees to help dry them a little, reduce bluestain and ambrosia beetles.

Offline Peter Drouin

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2017, 06:58:32 PM »
A new JLG Lull, nice. The frame is nice too. :D
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Offline flyingparks

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2017, 08:24:41 PM »
Thanks for the replies guys. After doing some research and contacting the supplier. It appears the man Don P has done it once again. Pretty cool. I love learning new things!

Offline MbfVA

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2017, 01:19:02 AM »
I am saving your reference links, Don.  Thanks.  Pretty soon I'll have a wood library, perhaps somewhat sad and ironic in that the shelves will be digital rather than wood.

The usual Latin style scientific names are revealing.  One seems to be penicillin related; another suggests cephalosporin, which if memory serves is a treatment for anthrax (could not immediately verify that in Wikipedia, but I didn't dig too deep).  It's amazing how many different fungi/molds have been found useful as  components of life-saving drugs.

Not as much fun when they get on our lumber.

Good thing that red stain was only on one side that could be turned away.   I didn't see any suggestion that it could be gotten rid of easily except by planing, not easy or good for big timbers or cosmetics, in my book.  At least it was noted as not structurally harmful.

In our restaurant we use a lot of what is called quaternary sanitizer, based on ammonium chloride,  which is not hugely chemically different from table salt, sodium chloride.   I tried using it on large hay bales (old baler, no bale wrap etc),  to avoid the need for the expensive agricultural chemicals.  Mixed results, and I did not continue trying since we gave up on our own haying several years ago.  Perhaps the right concentration might be helpful with wood?  In typical concentrations, quat sanitizer won't kill much (most antibiotics don't kill, they merely prevent growth so the host body's white cell army can do its thing), but it will clean up & prevent the growth of some bugs.  Very good on odors, too, and safer than bleach.  Not toxic in at all in usual concentrations.  Sam's Club sells a version made by Economic Laboratories (they used to own KitchenAid, part of Hobart) for about $5 a gallon, which makes well over 100 gallons of solution for our use.

The authors didn't mention bleach or any ordinary chemical preventative  other than soapy water  (I did see mention of  some agents that are illegal in Canada and the USA, but not in New Zealand, wow).  Leaves me wondering why.

 Editing siri mistakes on a phone is killer.  I hope I caught everything stupid, and that nothing changed just as I hit send.   Too bad the new tax law doesn't mandate better voice recognition--it hits a bunch of other stuff not directly related to taxes.

Offline Don P

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2017, 06:44:21 AM »
Yes that is the same quat used in food service. It is the Q in the newer preservative treatment ACQ.

Offline flyingparks

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2017, 08:53:59 PM »
A new JLG Lull, nice. The frame is nice too. :D

Its a Gehl.  ;)

Some more photos... First time using SIPS. Really enjoyed using them. They really go well with the frame. The box is taking shape! Neighbors are a little bummed they can't see the frame now.
 

  

  

  

 

Offline DPatton

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #13 on: December 14, 2017, 08:18:48 PM »
That Gehl has amazing traction being able to work upside down and all! ;D ;D ;D
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Re: What is this?
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2017, 08:36:39 PM »
That Gehl has amazing traction being able to work upside down and all! ;D ;D ;D

Haha. Are the pictures upside down? They are all facing the right way on my computer. And I'm not standing on my head.

Offline flyingparks

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2017, 10:48:14 PM »
 Roof SIPs going up.


  

 

Offline samandothers

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2017, 10:12:49 AM »
Wow, how thick are your roof SIPS?

Offline flyingparks

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #17 on: December 18, 2017, 10:26:39 PM »
Wow, how thick are your roof SIPS?

Roof SIPs have 11 1/4" of foam. Half inch osb on each side

Offline Clover

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2018, 01:51:11 PM »
What is the R value of your roof SIPS? I like your build!
The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls looking like hard work. --Tom A. Edison

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Offline FalconFan

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #19 on: January 31, 2018, 02:10:40 PM »
Awesome stuff! Please keep us updated! I imagine your home will be very warm!

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #20 on: February 01, 2018, 09:40:21 PM »
What is the R value of your roof SIPS? I like your build!

R24 in the walls. R49 in the roof

Offline Jim1611

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2018, 05:18:14 PM »
I'm really looking forward to seeing your progress!!
"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath."

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2018, 09:59:55 PM »
Here's a bit of an update: SIPs on, windows in, doors in. Plumbing, electrical ready for rough inspection. I decked the second story in 1 1/2" Doug Fir T&G. I am very happy with the way it looks as a ceiling for the downstairs. I'm pouring 1.5" of lightweight concrete on the first and second floor. After its sealed this will be my finished floor. 

  

  

  

 

Offline Brad_bb

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2018, 09:32:24 AM »
How dry was your DF T&G?  I had an issue with some I got from out west, pre finished it, it had been out in my shed in ambient conditions for awhile.  Installed it and over the winter it shrank and I have some gaps to deal with.  I should have let it acclimate in heated conditions for a couple months first.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #24 on: February 04, 2018, 10:35:02 AM »
How dry was your DF T&G?  I had an issue with some I got from out west, pre finished it, it had been out in my shed in ambient conditions for awhile.  Installed it and over the winter it shrank and I have some gaps to deal with.  I should have let it acclimate in heated conditions for a couple months first.

It averaged 8%, but I was only checking end grain. This particular batch had been sitting in the local lumberyard for a few months so it acclimated enough I hope. Colorado is extremely dry, and my experience is that it really doesn't take too long for lumber to acclimate, especially 6 quarter lumber. But I guess we'll see!

Offline Don P

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #25 on: February 04, 2018, 10:42:35 AM »
I have run into that here Brad. We'll get KD15% delivered for those kind of materials but the house can bottom out at ~8%emc in winter. If at all possible I like to go through at least some of the heating season on sticks before applying.

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #26 on: February 22, 2018, 09:24:28 PM »
Need to build some stairs. Any thoughts / opinions on this? I created this in sketchup. It complies with codes. Treads are 2". Risers are 1/2". Two stringers. 3 feet apart. I guess my main question is if 2" treads are enough to span 36" Material is Doug fir.

And since we like photos, here are a few of the radiant floor heating. 

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #27 on: February 22, 2018, 09:52:40 PM »
Looks real nice. Sure glade we don't need that here in the south. Hit a high of 89F today.

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #28 on: February 22, 2018, 10:00:09 PM »
Looks real nice. Sure glade we don't need that here in the south. Hit a high of 89F today.
Thanks. 12 degrees today and sunny.

Offline jason.weir

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #29 on: February 22, 2018, 10:34:31 PM »
 I guess my main question is if 2" treads are enough to span 36" Material is Doug fir.
I'd be surprised if code doesn't require a middle stringer, even if it doesn't I'd certainly add it - maybe it's overkill but it's cheap easy overkill.

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #30 on: March 10, 2018, 04:25:35 PM »
Floor heat in. Rough inspections done. I poured lightweight concrete upstairs and downstairs. This creates a thermal mass which increases efficiency for in floor hydronic heat. It' s a fairly complex system by my standards, but I think will be worth it. It's a 1400 square foot home and there are 12 zones in the heating system. If you don't make enough zones, radiant floor heating can get ugly quick. Some DIY friends of mine have a bathroom that is too hot to walk in when the heat is turned up during cold days. Anyway, I really like the look and simplicity of raw materials and I love the way the concrete looks with the timbers.

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #31 on: March 21, 2018, 08:01:35 AM »
A friend's place. Helped him with some raising.  Beautiful day and a beautiful frame. Grove crane sure helps. I think the crane could lift the entire frame.


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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #32 on: April 12, 2018, 08:34:42 PM »
Finally moving again. Sheet rock and paint. Also, put some more tung oil on while I had scaffolding up

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #33 on: April 12, 2018, 10:32:20 PM »
After the house is done, I'll get a better camera.

Offline NorcalMatt

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #34 on: April 13, 2018, 10:39:58 AM »
Great job!  You will be enjoying all this work for decades to come

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #35 on: May 13, 2018, 05:32:30 PM »
Here's a little update. I cut down a nice straight fir tree and milled it up for stair parts. It was amazing how fast everything dried.

  

 

I planed everything last week and cut to rough size. They turned out really beautiful. Now I can show my grandpa why I didn't just go to the lumber yard (he asked why  :D).  

 

I hooked up the boiler just in time for summer. It's been really cold in the house and the season changed the day I installed this boiler. It's an all in one unit. It supplies the hydronic floor heat and the domestic hot water. It even has connections for solar thermal which is further, a lot further down the line.

 

I had a random foot of snow and some little moose stopped by. The snow was completely gone the following day.

 

I put in the wood stove but won't get to fire it until fall. Or maybe I'll sneak one in

 

The stucco crew has done their first coat. The color will ultimately be a light gray.  

 

  

I had two windows break. It was determined there was a mistake at the factory and these windows were charged with argon gas...something you can't do at 8600 feet. Luckily the window company is taking care of everything.

 

A few electrical and plumbing odds and ends and I can think about moving in. The dog is ready for summer.


 

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #36 on: May 15, 2018, 09:42:29 AM »
Thanks for the update!  Really looks good.

Offline TimFromNB

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #37 on: May 15, 2018, 10:36:51 AM »
Looking good!

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #38 on: July 31, 2018, 09:52:17 AM »
Been busy with timber frame barn but the house is done...as far as the county is concerned. I'll post some interior photos when I get around to it. A friend took a nice photo of the frame with a professional camera.



 

 

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #39 on: August 01, 2018, 09:48:27 AM »
You're probably already past this point, but 2" DF spanning 3 ft for stair.  No.  Will flex, be creaky, not enough support.  YOu need a stringer in the middle or you need heavy timber stringers on each side and 3-4" thick treads with at least 3/4 or 1"  risers.  1/2 is too thin for riser especially in softwood.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #40 on: August 01, 2018, 11:24:18 AM »
FP,
How are your stairs doing (3' span of 2x)?

Brad,
I've designed my stairs the same way - 3' span of 2x11 (full dimension) with 1x8 risers - and the county was fine with it.  All pine.  My cabin is going to be a bit more rustic than FP's so a little stair creak would add to that ;)

I'm not even near putting them up so I could make changes.  The underside of the stairs are not visible from inside the house so I could add more later to stiffen them up - like a 2x4 cleat (on edge) across the length, glued and screwed.  But if FP says he wished for thicker, I could do it now.
John Sawicky

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SkyTrak 9038, Davis Little Monster backhoe, Case 16+4 Trencher, Home Built 38" cut Bandmill up to 54' - using it all to build a timber frame cabin.

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #41 on: August 01, 2018, 12:04:41 PM »
Happy Birthday flyingparks!

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Re: My Timber Frame Home
« Reply #42 on: August 01, 2018, 04:48:41 PM »
FP,
How are your stairs doing (3' span of 2x)?

Brad,
I've designed my stairs the same way - 3' span of 2x11 (full dimension) with 1x8 risers - and the county was fine with it.  All pine.  My cabin is going to be a bit more rustic than FP's so a little stair creak would add to that ;)

I'm not even near putting them up so I could make changes.  The underside of the stairs are not visible from inside the house so I could add more later to stiffen them up - like a 2x4 cleat (on edge) across the length, glued and screwed.  But if FP says he wished for thicker, I could do it now.
My stairs have been fine. My structural engineer friend said they would be fine. Although he shared Brad's opinion that it wouldn't hurt to throw something in the middle. I would have thrown a middle stringer in, but I ran out of lumber. So long answer is that I don't have any regrets. I even picked up the dog and jumped around with him on the steps. I should also state that one stringer is glued and screwed to a SIP wall and I know that adds significant support. Risers I will do again... Brad said 1/2 would be to thin. I agree.
Happy Birthday flyingparks!


Thanks!


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