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Author Topic: Setter  (Read 3837 times)

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Offline ladylake

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Setter
« on: December 30, 2017, 05:27:19 AM »
 

 After setting maybe 7000 blades my old Dino setter is wearing out so what to do or get, replacement parts for the Dino around $300  or a new Cooks or Suffolk, also on Ebay they have a new older model Suffolk for $650 shipped. Both the new model Suffolk and Cooks are around $1200  shipped.  Steve
Timberking B20 12000 hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Dino setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Offline xlogger

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Re: Setter
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2017, 07:17:39 AM »
At the $1200 price if you do it again that's around $.17 each set.
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Offline JB Griffin

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Re: Setter
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2017, 09:58:08 AM »
Don't buy a cooks. The Suffolk setters are much more accurate.
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Offline gmmills

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Re: Setter
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2017, 10:04:14 AM »
From the two setters you mentioned the Suffolk setter is the most accurate. This is based on the fact that it has the ability to clamp deflection from the blade prior to the anvils contacting the tooth to set it. The Cook's does not do this. The setting anvils are bending the teeth prior to the setter jaws even contacting the blade. The blade is actually twisting between the jaws as the teeth are being set. The WM dual tooth setter is another option to consider. It also clamps the blade deflection prior to bending the teeth.

   Out of all the dual tooth setters on the market the Cook's is the least accurate of all. The blade body has to be held static prior to bending the teeth to assure accuracy. 

  The Suffolk also has less moving parts to wear over time compared to a Cook's.   
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Offline ladylake

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Re: Setter
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2017, 10:38:56 AM »
 
 Sound like Its going to be a Suffolk .  Thanks   Steve
Timberking B20 12000 hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Dino setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Offline PAmizerman

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Re: Setter
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2017, 11:36:57 AM »
I looked at the one for sale on eBay about a month ago. It does not have the capability to backset and does not have the guage to check set. Suffolk does have an upgrade kit but I'm not sure if it will fit that one. I thought pretty hard about the one on eBay but I'll just be buying a new Suffolk.
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Offline barbender

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Re: Setter
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2017, 12:13:19 PM »
Steve, I gave the EBay old model Suffolk, I haven't set but maybe 50 blades with it but I am very satisfied with the consistency of the set, and the sawn finish of freshly set blades. In fact, I had one blade I set, I almost didn't bother with it as it looked like it had hit a nail. It was missing a few teeth, but what the heck. Well, then I ended up having that on my mill when a guy showed up and wanted some cedar sawn, I figured I'd have to get another blade but even missing the teeth that blade sawed with a beautiful finish. The cedar was being used rough sawn for paneling so the appearance was important. The customer was happy, and so am I👍🏼
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Offline Chuck White

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Re: Setter
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2017, 12:45:55 PM »
From the two setters you mentioned the Suffolk setter is the most accurate. This is based on the fact that it has the ability to clamp deflection from the blade prior to the anvils contacting the tooth to set it. The Cook's does not do this. The setting anvils are bending the teeth prior to the setter jaws even contacting the blade. The blade is actually twisting between the jaws as the teeth are being set. The WM dual tooth setter is another option to consider. It also clamps the blade deflection prior to bending the teeth.

   Out of all the dual tooth setters on the market the Cook's is the least accurate of all. The blade body has to be held static prior to bending the teeth to assure accuracy. 

  The Suffolk also has less moving parts to wear over time compared to a Cook's.

If this is the case with your Cooks setter, you really need to do some adjusting on it to make it right!

I have the Cooks setter and the blade "is clamped before" the anvil contacts the teeth!

I suggest that you call Cooks and ask for help adjusting your setter properly!
~Chuck~
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Offline Cutting Edge

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Re: Setter
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2017, 02:00:25 PM »


Chuck,


Both the new model Suffolk and Cooks are around $1200  shipped.  Steve

gmmills is referring to the Cooks Dual Tooth Setter... also what ladylake was comparing at approx $1200 investment.

It was not stated as such, so I figured a little clarification might help. 




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Offline kelLOGg

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Re: Setter
« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2017, 06:49:48 PM »
Early on I experienced an insufficient clamp force on my Cooks single tooth setter but found out I didn't have it adjusted right. Corrected it and it really clamps the blade body tightly and has need no readjustment in 10 or so years.
Bob
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Offline Chuck White

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Re: Setter
« Reply #10 on: December 30, 2017, 07:42:45 PM »
Thanks for the clarification Cutting Edge!

Wasn't quite sure, but I knew my single tooth setter worked very well!

Thanks again!   :)
~Chuck~
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Offline irvi00

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Re: Setter
« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2017, 08:03:46 PM »
My cooks dual tooth setter works great. When adjusted properly it does clamp securely before setting. Very accurate.

Offline xlogger

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Re: Setter
« Reply #12 on: December 31, 2017, 05:04:08 AM »
On my suffolk setter I've really not use it to down set when setting blades, maybe I should. Does anyone use this much?
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Offline Grizzly

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Re: Setter
« Reply #13 on: December 31, 2017, 11:42:33 AM »
My cooks dual tooth setter works great. When adjusted properly it does clamp securely before setting. Very accurate.

Thanks. I've been a little confused reading here. I'm no where near a seasoned pro like a bunch of you guys are but I've run about a hundred or more bands through watching closely (trying to learn from Cutting Edge's teaching and all the forum info). And that was my observation. It clamps, brings up the setters and dial gauges, then sets and measures. I then cycle it to the next ones. But I'm pretty ignorant compared to the average guy here on the forum and not near as experienced.
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Offline Percy

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Re: Setter
« Reply #14 on: December 31, 2017, 11:52:49 AM »
On my suffolk setter I've really not use it to down set when setting blades, maybe I should. Does anyone use this much?
When I first got my Suffolk, I used it as you do, just for setting teeth as in increasing set. I did not even have the down setting anvils installed .  It was a tad finicky and my accuracy was not very good.  On the advice of someone here, cant remember who, (Im a siv-head), I installed the down setting anvils, set them correctly for the thickness of my blades, yaddayadda and ...wala.....the thing became very consistant and accurate.....not as accurate as my old slow poke single tooth setter, but acceptable.
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Offline 4x4American

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Re: Setter
« Reply #15 on: December 31, 2017, 12:05:44 PM »
I made this video about 4 months ago when this same question came up on here, I think it will help clear things up a bit:


Boy, back in my day..

Offline 4x4American

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Re: Setter
« Reply #16 on: December 31, 2017, 12:10:29 PM »
Percy what is the difference in the up-setting anvils vs the down setting anvils?  Is it just the location in which they are mounted which makes it so you can double down-set in one go round da jimmy-do?  I use my Cooks DTS mainly for down setting teeth as it's quick and works good enough, but you can only do one side at a time and have to set the anvils distance for each side each time cause you have to take one away to do one side...if ya foller what imer sayin...The DTS is faster than the STS cause it has the feed arm and you don't have to invert the blade so it is my weapon of choice for downsetting.  I try to downset it to my target set on the first shot and if I have alot of blades to do that are the same ting I'll set it up to do say the outside teeth and I'll put one blade on, do the outside, take it off and do the rest of them all on the outside, then I'll set it up for the inside and go go go.  Helps keep it consistent as well as less fiddlefarting around with the settings.  But if you get it wrong on this then that'll put ya in a vlasic jar eh.
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Offline Chuck White

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Re: Setter
« Reply #17 on: December 31, 2017, 02:28:25 PM »
4x4, I see it now, the dual-tooth setter actually does the clamping and setting at the same time, compared to the single-tooth setter clamping and setting in two steps!
~Chuck~
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Offline Percy

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Re: Setter
« Reply #18 on: December 31, 2017, 02:51:43 PM »
Percy what is the difference in the up-setting anvils vs the down setting anvils?  Is it just the location in which they are mounted which makes it so you can double down-set in one go round da jimmy-do?  I use my Cooks DTS mainly for down setting teeth as it's quick and works good enough, but you can only do one side at a time and have to set the anvils distance for each side each time cause you have to take one away to do one side...if ya foller what imer sayin...The DTS is faster than the STS cause it has the feed arm and you don't have to invert the blade so it is my weapon of choice for downsetting.  I try to downset it to my target set on the first shot and if I have alot of blades to do that are the same ting I'll set it up to do say the outside teeth and I'll put one blade on, do the outside, take it off and do the rest of them all on the outside, then I'll set it up for the inside and go go go.  Helps keep it consistent as well as less fiddlefarting around with the settings.  But if you get it wrong on this then that'll put ya in a vlasic jar eh.
in this pic, the large anvils are the uppers and little ones the downers. Just back off the appropriate ones.

 

 

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Offline 4x4American

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Re: Setter
« Reply #19 on: December 31, 2017, 03:34:41 PM »
So you can upset and downset both sides of the blade in one pass?
Boy, back in my day..

Offline ladylake

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Re: Setter
« Reply #20 on: December 31, 2017, 04:19:41 PM »

 Yes.  Steve
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Offline 4x4American

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Re: Setter
« Reply #21 on: December 31, 2017, 04:35:52 PM »
I might have to trade up the old red dts for one of these units hot dog!
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Offline ladylake

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Re: Setter
« Reply #22 on: December 31, 2017, 04:46:41 PM »
 Shouldn't break your bank, just over $1200 shipped.  Steve
Timberking B20 12000 hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Dino setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Offline Percy

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Re: Setter
« Reply #23 on: December 31, 2017, 06:28:26 PM »
So you can upset and downset both sides of the blade in one pass?
Ya...I guess, if you had some teeth that got overset by metal or somthing, this would push them back, part way atleast. To be honest, Ive never downset a blade, but I use those downset anvils always as they seem to make the unit more accurate. The key to accuracy of this setter, IMO, is accurate setting of the blade height using  the little plastic gauge/thingamajig/ what came with the unit, and consistant pressure on the "bidness" handle, and using the downset anvils as they seem to make/keep the set within 2 thou. I can live with that. What I dont like about the unit is the clamp on dial gauge. That cooks one and the WM one seems to have a dedicated gauge for each side. I have to do a few teeth, then clamp the gauge on the blade to check my work on one side, then reclamp the gauge on the other side and check my work again. On the positive, if you are real careful setting the blade height before setting, the results are pretty good/consistant. I run alot of set and when I get a new box of blades, I set the height to the first blade outta the box and just do the other 9 right off. Sometimes without checking....heh...I like to live dangerously...pretty much always works out.  *stands infront of wavy boards with missing tooth grin*
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Offline PAmizerman

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Re: Setter
« Reply #24 on: December 31, 2017, 08:23:45 PM »
Perxy, how much set do you run?
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Offline 4x4American

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Re: Setter
« Reply #25 on: December 31, 2017, 08:41:55 PM »
Interesting, must be different up there in Canada cause it's metric, but I tend to run as less set as possible.  I tend to prefer about .025" with my setup in unfrozen hardwood...in frozen hardwood I'll run around .015" +/-


With the LT40 and 36hp yanmar it liked .020" in unfrozen logs and .012" in frozen wood.  .012" worked really well for me in frozen doug fir too..that was either with 4 or 7 degree blades I can't remember.  With the more power on the 70 it seems to fancy a bit more set. 
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Re: Setter
« Reply #26 on: January 01, 2018, 04:23:00 AM »
Perxy, how much set do you run?
.038 ish ;D
I cut mainly sitka spruce, WRC, and Alaskan Yellow Cedar. Soft woods seem to like way more set as they are springy for lack of a better term, compared to hardwoods. I cut about 100,000 bdft of birch waaaay back and I still used the 13 degree blades. Feed rates were scarey fast and I just never bothered setting right out of the box or ever for that matter. While hardwoods are obviously much harder than the softwood, the birch hardwood seems to be more consistant in density than softwood and cuts cleaner ,,,less springy and generally more fun to cut than sitka...sitka is related to Hickory by marrage :D :D :D :D
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Re: Setter
« Reply #27 on: January 01, 2018, 06:45:11 AM »
I have had a Cooks single tooth setter. It had some week points, in my opinion, but easy to adjust so it was a good setter for me. There are more things to observe about setting than I have seen here on the forum. All setters I have seen on the market bends the teeth against a horizontal edge. That means the side of the tooth is parallell to the blade body. In other tools you want to see a relief angle in this area. If you are careful and have the setters anvil to push the tooth on a point close to the face, you will have a little better result. If you would press the tooth, on a point close to its back, it can result in a negative relief angle for the side of the tooth.
The teeth on most blades has a back angle about 30 and the back is shaped straight up to the tip. That means the tip, on the outside of a tooth with set, will cut a little wider in the kerf. It is what you need but the margin to bad behavior can be low. I hope you can see it can be critical to perform the set in the best way. I have made some tests to first "pre-twist" the teeth a little and then perform the set in my S.T.S. So far it has been positive.

Online terrifictimbersllc

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Re: Setter
« Reply #28 on: January 01, 2018, 08:40:06 AM »
Interesting. To confirm, is one thing you are saying, that it should be better to have  the blade clamped deeper so less of the tooth is protruding above the clamp?
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Re: Setter
« Reply #29 on: January 01, 2018, 01:13:49 PM »
I have not been able to add photos on this forum yet. A photo would explain better than my words.
If you are looking down to a blade, clamped in your setter the normal way, or a little higher, you can see the teeth in "set groups", left, right and no set. With an adjustable spanner you now can "twist out" the front (face) a little. On the left tooth to the left  and on the right tooth to the right. You can in the same moment with the spanner, "down-set" a little. Then you have to "calibrate" the set in your setter the normal way. Grind the blade the normal way. Now you have a blade with a relief angle also on the outside of each toth with set. (That means you have a possibilty to go so far that the outside of the face can cut not only on its tip.) For the blades I have tested this method on, I have a combination of normal set and "pre twisted" teeth. I think the twist can be about 3. The pre-twist procedure is enough to performe once, it will last for many grind and set operations.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #30 on: January 01, 2018, 01:39:15 PM »
I have not been able to add photos on this forum yet. A photo would explain better than my words.
If you are looking down to a blade, clamped in your setter the normal way, or a little higher, you can see the teeth in "set groups", left, right and no set. With an adjustable spanner you now can "twist out" the front (face) a little. On the left tooth to the left  and on the right tooth to the right. You can in the same moment with the spanner, "down-set" a little. Then you have to "calibrate" the set in your setter the normal way. Grind the blade the normal way. Now you have a blade with a relief angle also on the outside of each toth with set. (That means you have a possibilty to go so far that the outside of the face can cut not only on its tip.) For the blades I have tested this method on, I have a combination of normal set and "pre twisted" teeth. I think the twist can be about 3. The pre-twist procedure is enough to performe once, it will last for many grind and set operations.
Very interesting. I never spent any time thinking of relief angle in the manner you describe. Looking at the photo of my setter here, I could grind the setting anvils appropriately for achiving what you describe/recommend?
 

 
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Offline 4x4American

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Re: Setter
« Reply #31 on: January 01, 2018, 09:25:11 PM »
Very interesting..I do believe Im picking up what youre putting down.  Percy I think that it would have to do both sets on each tooth at the same time so that they can kinda push against each other to put the twist in to the tooth so looking at your setter I think you could do that, but wud prolly have to replace the plastic anvil with something more substantial.


Pabene how do the twisted teeth perform compared to normally set teeth?
Boy, back in my day..

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Re: Setter
« Reply #32 on: January 02, 2018, 12:56:09 PM »
Percy, You can grind your anvils so it will hit the teeth on its face edge. It was the way I started. If you have a dial indicator on your setter it is a good way to go. If you dont have a the possibility to check every tooth it means it is more critical to stop the teeth in correct position in the setter for each set stroke.
4x4American. It is a long story about my steps to how it is for me today. I started to check the cutting angles on new blades many years ago. I wrote here on the forum, last fall, about parts of it. Your question if my blade is better with twisted teeth: yes, I think its better but it is in combination with a back angle of 12, just at the top of the teeth.
I discovered the need for a relief angle, on the outside of the teeth, when I checked my blades dullness with a magnifying glass. That way is good to see how the wear looks like around the top of the teeth after some hours in the mill.
I think the most important is to avoid, by mistake, to let the setters anvil hit the teeth at the back side. It can result in negative relief on the out side of the teeth.   
 

  Here is a photo (the first time I was able add a Photo here.) on a blade. The twist is not visible but how I like to grind the back angle.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #33 on: January 02, 2018, 02:09:21 PM »

 Pabene 
   Any problem with it feeding with only a 12 angle at the tip of the tooth, seems like lately the rage has been a 40 back angle which to me don't take a nail hit very well.   I'd bet your 12 would take a nail hit good.  Steve
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Re: Setter
« Reply #34 on: January 02, 2018, 02:41:02 PM »
I think I got your idea about twist in tooth and the relief angle, but to be honest I 'm not sure.

Just to be correct I think "anvil" is the part that contacts the body of the blade, and "pusher" is the part that pushes the tooth (against the anvil). 

I am also uncertain that pushing just the tip of the blade enough to bend it outwards by a few thousandths of an inch, is going to take the "twist" out of the tooth, isn't this twist part of blade manufacture?

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Re: Setter
« Reply #35 on: January 02, 2018, 03:51:23 PM »
Terrifictimberslic, I am sorry for my English. I missunderstod the text in an other thread. Here "anvil" would be "pusher". So, it is important to let the pusher hit the tooth close to its face. In my singel tooth setter, I set the pusher to push on a point at the middle of the tooth height and close to its face. If the teeth is "pre twisted", the twist remains after many set procdures. I have checked the relief angle, on the outside of the tooth, on some new blades. There are blades with very little relief angle. If you are uncareful it is easy to make it worse. When you are looking down on a blade with the teeth grinded to 30 back angle, all the way up to its tip, you can see it looks like there is a relief angle, but it can be false. If you take a 0.1" drillbit, hold the drillbit to the side of the tooth, just under the tip and horizontal. Now you can see the real angle, the drillbit shall point out, I think at least 3. (You can also use a caliper, pinch the tooth tipp and you can judge the relief angle.)

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Re: Setter
« Reply #36 on: January 02, 2018, 08:45:30 PM »

 Pabene 
   Any problem with it feeding with only a 12 angle at the tip of the tooth, seems like lately the rage has been a 40 back angle which to me don't take a nail hit very well.   I'd bet your 12 would take a nail hit good.  Steve

Steve, the guy that sharpens ( really he just grinds at em) blades for work ground a bunch of 7/39s for us but with a 35deg back angle.  Absolutely ruined the whole lot. Feed rate was 25-50% slower, would wander in the cut, blades would "push off" the cant leaving a hump on the cant. Junk.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota, 160 Prentice, Frick 2 saw gang edger, Wright W-37 ABG, Suffolk dual tooth setter, Cat claw single tooth setter,'96 F-250 7.3 PSD 4x4, CS-590 Echo, MF 20c, M681 Memo.

Over 2 million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator and counting.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #37 on: January 02, 2018, 11:56:30 PM »
With a normal blade speed in a mill and a very good feed rate, say 75 Feet/min, the blades tooth tips are moving through the log at an angle of about 1. A relief angle of 12 would be enough for much higher feed but impossible in most mills for other reasons.
When I have cut a 4" nail, it is blue steel chips from the nail on some tooth tips. The steel chips are burned to the tips as the cutting speed is to high for steel. It is about 20 teeth with chips and I take it away from the tips before I starts to resharpen the blade. The blade works as normal after a such mishap.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #38 on: January 03, 2018, 05:23:19 AM »


 I'm really getting confused here, one guy says they wont cut good unless their a 40, the next says only 12 at the tip is needed for 75 lf per minute while I'm perfectly happy with the 30 back angle I run.  Steve
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Re: Setter
« Reply #39 on: January 03, 2018, 06:52:05 AM »


 I'm really getting confused here, one guy says they wont cut good unless their a 40, the next says only 12 at the tip is needed for 75 lf per minute while I'm perfectly happy with the 30 back angle I run.  Steve


Hes not talkin about the whole back angle, hes grinding just the back trailing edge of the tip of the tooth to a little 12 degree ramp.  Look closely at the picture he put up you can see it. 
Boy, back in my day..

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Re: Setter
« Reply #40 on: January 03, 2018, 07:01:15 AM »
 
 I can see that perfectly, there is a huge difference between his blade and one  with a 40 back angle and both say they saw great.  Steve
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Re: Setter
« Reply #41 on: January 03, 2018, 08:59:02 AM »
Steve you are not by yourself on the confused part.  I am gonna go back and reread the whole thing.  Banjo
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Re: Setter
« Reply #42 on: January 03, 2018, 01:11:37 PM »
Steve, I have the main part of the back at 30. It is only the top of the teeth as have 12. The gullet stays in nearly the same volume as the original. I am checking the relief angle at the outside of the teeth. The result is: for a tooth with a hook angle of 8 and a relief angle of 12,  the  EDGE-angle is 70. The advantage is there is more steel as supports the edge. There are more steel to transfer heat from the edge down to the body.
I am sure that the blades keeps its sharpness better, it cut with a softer sound and the finish is smother.
If you compare the teeth on a circular blade with my blade, (see the photo in the thread above), you can see the angles are similar.
I am not sure I understand everything here but in my opinion would a back angle of 40 results in a to pointed tooth. The edge angle for such teeth would be 42, it is to week and brittle.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #43 on: January 03, 2018, 09:41:07 PM »
A lot I don't understand in that last post too. But I KNOW this, the Kasco 7/40 is the smoothest cutting blade I have ever tried, and that profile went through at least two designs before being put on the market. That being said Kasco spent a lot of time and money on that EXACT profile and when our sharpener dude changes it the blades won't run nearly as good.

Your mileage may vary, as no two mill or sawing situations are exactly alike.

How thin a point of a tooth can be and still hold up is purely a matter a metallurgy and heat treatment not profile.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota, 160 Prentice, Frick 2 saw gang edger, Wright W-37 ABG, Suffolk dual tooth setter, Cat claw single tooth setter,'96 F-250 7.3 PSD 4x4, CS-590 Echo, MF 20c, M681 Memo.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #44 on: January 04, 2018, 04:45:07 PM »
JB Griffin, I have now seen how the Kasco 7/40 looks like. There is a photo here on the forum from two years ago. I am not the man to say it is good or not without to been able to test it. The most important on that blade, in my opinion is, it has more volume in the gullets. I believe it is made in very good steel, it is sharp and they have very good finish on the grinded surfaces. I think Kascos reason for the 40 back angle is it was necessary to give it a steeper back to be able to make a deeper gullet.
I am waiting for blades with gullets like this but the pitch would be 1.25 or more for 1.5 wide blades. For us with mills with less than 10 kW motor it would help to cut big logs.
!.5 wide blades with 7/8 pitch and also with 1 pitch, has gullets as are filled up with saw dust already when you cut boards about 8 wide. To much sawdust and chips in the kerf creates o lot of problem.
I also think the miss behavior you had after your sharpening process was caused by bad grinding.
I would like to test such 7/40 and I would allow my self also to try 12 on the tip at the first sharpening.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #45 on: January 04, 2018, 05:21:09 PM »
 
 (How thin a point of a tooth can be and still hold up is purely a matter a metallurgy and heat treatment not profile)

 No way are those little pointy teeth are going to hold up to a nail hit as good as one with some metal behind the tooth.  Steve
Timberking B20 12000 hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Dino setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

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Re: Setter
« Reply #46 on: January 04, 2018, 08:50:17 PM »
Pabene, I have no doubt that your method of sharpening must work for you. But I seriously doubt that it is answer to all sawing woes. You are most very likely sawing much different sizes and species of wood than the red and white oak, hickory, sweet and black gum, and shortleaf pine that I saw on a daily basis.

Ladylake, band mill blades are made for cutting wood ;), I will stand by my statement. For more than 12 years I have forged knives and other tools and never once did I send anything out to have someone else do the heat treat for me. Do I claim to be an expert on the subject... never, but I know way more than the average bear.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota, 160 Prentice, Frick 2 saw gang edger, Wright W-37 ABG, Suffolk dual tooth setter, Cat claw single tooth setter,'96 F-250 7.3 PSD 4x4, CS-590 Echo, MF 20c, M681 Memo.

Over 2 million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator and counting.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #47 on: January 05, 2018, 01:58:31 AM »
 
 JB  So then put a razor blade on the edge of a knife with very little metal behind it and see how it holds up, I'll stand by common sense.  Keep in mind that you switched from a low quality blade that I tried and no way would it saw straight to a high quality blade.  I think the quality of the blade made more difference in sawing than those little pointy teeth.  Another thing how many sharpening can one get out of those little pointy teeth, seem like after a few sharpening's most of the original tooth would be gone.  Steve
Timberking B20 12000 hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Dino setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

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Re: Setter
« Reply #48 on: January 05, 2018, 07:16:59 PM »
Steve,  I have gotten as many as 14 resharps out of those silvertips thats around 14mbf sawn with that blade. But that blade was exceptional. Most averaged around 6-7. Thats with 36" bandwheels. The main problem with the silvertips are low consistency,  some do good, others are junk right out the gate.

The Kasco blades are upto 4-5 resharps now and are still going.

If you aren't grinding the entire profile accurately the original tooth will be gone from any blade in a few sharpenings.

At this point I will refrain from this thread.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota, 160 Prentice, Frick 2 saw gang edger, Wright W-37 ABG, Suffolk dual tooth setter, Cat claw single tooth setter,'96 F-250 7.3 PSD 4x4, CS-590 Echo, MF 20c, M681 Memo.

Over 2 million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator and counting.

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Re: Setter
« Reply #49 on: January 10, 2018, 08:33:34 AM »
I have had a Cooks single tooth setter. It had some week points, in my opinion, but easy to adjust so it was a good setter for me. There are more things to observe about setting than I have seen here on the forum. All setters I have seen on the market bends the teeth against a horizontal edge. That means the side of the tooth is parallell to the blade body. In other tools you want to see a relief angle in this area. If you are careful and have the setters anvil to push the tooth on a point close to the face, you will have a little better result. If you would press the tooth, on a point close to its back, it can result in a negative relief angle for the side of the tooth.
The teeth on most blades has a back angle about 30 and the back is shaped straight up to the tip. That means the tip, on the outside of a tooth with set, will cut a little wider in the kerf. It is what you need but the margin to bad behavior can be low. I hope you can see it can be critical to perform the set in the best way. I have made some tests to first "pre-twist" the teeth a little and then perform the set in my S.T.S. So far it has been positive.



 I have my Suffolk setter up and running, works great. The push block is angled well so it hits the tip of the tooth first bending it out a little so no need to worry about the relief on the side of the tooth on this setter.  Steve
Timberking B20 12000 hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Dino setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader


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