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Lubrication that is not toxic

Started by Arkyrick, December 20, 2015, 05:40:15 AM

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Arkyrick

Good morning everyone! Up to this point I have only used straight water for my blade lubricant. Reason why is because I and others use the sawdust from the mill for gardens, I want to use the best lubricant available but I don't want to pollute the saw dust. I am considering adding dishwashing soap in small quantities any opinions?
LT 35 hydraulic portable "73"Ford 335 tractor - lots of chains

Percy

I did it for a while years ago...it works better than strait water but you have to use lots if your wood has alot of sap. I was goin thru 10 gallons of water a day when cutting hard which meant alot of soap
GOLDEN RULE : The guy with the gold, makes the rules.

Chuck White

Try using 5-6 table spoons of liquid dish soap to 5 gallons of water!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

terrifictimbersllc

I was using 10 gal or more a day for a while until recently I looked at my lubemizer system and found the lower pressure check valve defective. This is the valve that allows back flow over 3 psi but was allowing it all the time. Result was a lot of lube was dribbling out at lower pressure, no spray, running it full on all the time, until I fixed this now I'm back to 5 gal or less even with pine.

PS i use cascade gel in water like others and don't think that is a candidate for polluting sawdust.
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

Magicman

I too am a Cascade user.  Another plus is that it does not make suds during filling and mixing.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Dave Shepard

1 pint veggie oil, two tablespoons dish soap in five gallons water.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Magicman

Dave, do you use an emulsion with all of your sawing?
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Dave Shepard

I actually don't use much, if any, lube on fresh logs. Sawing older logs is where I need it the most. In the winter I run WW in place of water.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Ga Mtn Man

Dave, does the oil stay in suspension on it's own or do you have to occasionally give the jug a good shake?
"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

Chuck White

I used to use your recipe with used and screened cooking oil, Dave!

The only trouble I ever had was when it started to get cold outside, the oil became more solid and wouldn't mix with the soap and water.  Normally with the feed and return motion of the sawhead, the tank would stay mixed pretty good!

Then one day, I looked at the lube tank and realized it was over ¾ full of oil, that's when I stopped using it, now I just use soap and water.
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

Larry

Soap works well but I'm not a big fan of it.  Soap is really hard on paint, and washes the grease out of bearings.

Yellowhammer posted he uses a spindle oil mix.  One day while talking with a WM tech, he also suggested spindle oil.  It was interesting concept, but spindle oil is not available here, I guess because were not cotton pickers.  In any case I had some water soluble machinist oil on hand.  The recommended mix is 4 ounces to a gallon of water.  The first time I tried it I found I could cut my water flow way down.

Most water soluble machinist oil is 100% synthetic and biodegradable.  Safe for people and machines.  I get it at Enco by the gallon.  Wait until its on sale and if the moon and stars align I use a coupon for 30% off and free shipping.

The only drawback is it is slightly more expensive than soap.  I think if I had something similar to a Lubemizer I could cut my use even further cutting expense.  With my limited sawing the expense is not a consideration for me.

The machinist oil is just another tool in my toolbox.  If I think the timber needs soap and water I don't hesitate to go that way.
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Tom the Sawyer

Larry,

I, too, considered using cotton picker spindle cleaner but I am even farther north than you are.  I went to the local John Deere dealer (they sell it on their website) to see if I could get it and, after they realized I wasn't joking, they looked it up and said they could get it - $100 for 5 gallons.  I can find it on-line for about $40 per 5 gallons but shipping doubles that.  A lot to spend if you don't know if it'll work.

I started looking for "water soluble oils" and found some, including bio versions.  Most were called "water soluble cutting oil" or "coolant", at prices of $25-$60 per gallon.  I don't use that much but it would be nice to find something that would reliably keep blades clean of pitch.  A lot depends on finding a dilution rate that works effectively.

Has anyone used any of these "water soluble oils", as an ingredient in their lubes?
07 TK B-20, Custom log arch, 20' trailer w/log loading arch, F350 flatbed dually dump.  Piggy-back forklift.  LS tractor w/FEL, Bobcat S250 w/grapple, Stihl 025C 16", Husky 372XP 24/30" bars, Grizzly 20" planer, Nyle L200M DH kiln.
If you call and my wife says, "He's sawin logs", I ain't snoring.

dustyhat

Which water soluble oils are you guys referring to. i found that rustslick 50/50 cuts it almost immediately. never used it in my lube spray because i dont know what it will do to my belts , but when i take a gummed up blade off i started brushing it on before sharpening it and setting. it really dissolves the pitch , turns it into a gel that wipes off.

dustyhat

And i mix it a little strong maby a once to the gallon.

millwright

I use cascade with a little pine sol , that seems to work ok

dustyhat

Been researching rustslicks toxic properties dont know if i will recommend it . it has been reported to cause skin rash in certain people. wouldint want someone to get sick for something i said. 

Larry

Tom, that was what I was talking about in my post.  Should have explained better.

I've been using Kool Mist Formula 77 coolant.  Its $29.00 a gallon at Enco but I wait until they have a 30% off sale and free shipping.  Usually a couple times a year but you have to to be on there email list, as it is only a one day sale.

Even on sale it is higher than the online price you found for spindle oil.  Of course we have to compare dilution ratios and I don't know how guys are cutting the spindle oil.  I'm using 4 ounces of Kool Mist to a gallon of water but that cuts water usage down by half.  I wonder if I could use less Kool Mist but have never tried.



Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Kbeitz

List of water soluble oils....

AquaEm
Olive Oil PEG 7 Esters
Cromollient SCE
Raspberry Dimethicone WS
Shea Butter WS
Holbein Duo Aqua
water soluble linseed oil
orange and grapefruit peel oils
modified vegetable oil
Soy oils
Holbein Duo Aqua Oils
mineral oil
Rustlick Ultracut Aero
Flowering shoot biomass



There are two ways to make water soluble oils -
you can mix an oil with an emulsifier
(usually polysorbate 80) to make an oil water
soluble or you can esterify them
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Magicman

Your list looks like "what's for dinner".   :D
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

YellowHammer

It's a shame that the spindle oil isn't more readily available, because it's all I use now, mixed with water, and has been for years.  It's specifically formulated to lubricate and clean vegetable and plant residue from extremely expensive cotton picker spindles while not harming the fields.  It contains both oil and detergents and is extremely effective at keeping bands clean.  I've used the Deere brand, and several others as well, including generic Farmers Coop brands.  It mixes very readily with water and is odorless.  I get it for about $40 a five gallon bucket, and use maybe 2 buckets a year.  It costs a little, but it's only a fraction more than the band I destroyed today sawing into a hidden ceramic insulator.  Unfortunately, the spindle oil didn't help much there.   
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Kbeitz

What ever you use be real careful that your lube does not have silicone oil in it if your cutting
for finishing lumber. The silicone will really mess with your finishes and stains.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

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