Making it through another year, '23-'24

[Old Greenhorn]

Keep your eyes open, they are popping up in some areas again and I have seen several 3 or 4" diameter trees. When they hit 6" or bigger, the EAB find them and it's all over.

[Old Greenhorn]

Well today, being the 3rd Wednesday of the month was our monthly food shopping day. But I had to alter the schedule a bit so a client could pick up their logs. A new client, nice sized order, they brought a 10K box truck and 3 people to load.   They were here on time at 9:30 and loading went quick. We enjoyed our conversation and hey were out by 10AM. I had run to Bill's before they go here to pick up more rigid foam board to work on the trailer while I waited for them, but they were on time, so I didn't get much done.
 We did our food shopping about an hour later than normal. Unloaded, had lunch and I was freed up by 1:30. By that time the weather had returned to 'snotty', the theme for the week. SO cutting was not in the cards. I went back on the trailer work. I cut the rest of the insulation panels and fitted them. I had to open up the 'wall switch' hole for a 3 bank switch and cut a wire trench in the insulation. I have not thought much about this wiring stuff and what those switches are for. One was existing for two lights, but comes off the truck power. The other will be for the 4 LED strips that are there, but were run off a jump pack with a cigar plug. I want to put a tractor battery inside with a solar maintainer, but that's a little later. I need to finish off the walls first, then make the joint trim and repaint. Remaining is the front wall, which I haven't started and has other stuff I have to tackle while it's open, like changing Sheetmetal screws to nuts and bolts because the sheetmetal screws keep shaking loose. Tedious, but I think that's the right way to get it done for good. The roof/ceiling I can doo after all the other work is done because that will always be accessible. I can't put shelving and tiedowns in until the walls are all done.
 So anyway, I got some work done, collected some SGU's and we have food for the month. I am a little tired tonight, I (we) made the most of the day and I am not exhausted. Not great weather forecast for tomorrow with 20 to 40mh winds. I don' t really care to cut in that weather but I will try to get out there and move forward. I need to clear my trailer and get it staged out there 'someplace'. If I can't cut I will collect logs to the trailer. I need about 50 logs to close the next order and the client wants to come Saturday. That will be a real push for me. Another new client, but this one is 'higher maintenance' than most as I try to train him up.  One client at a time. After that I only have 180 logs to go and it feels like this season can't end soon enough.
 Tomorrow is another day and I hope I can attack it rather than the other way around.

[aigheadish]

Well, I'd like to see what baby Ash looks like, more From The Forest talk I've heard is they have methods to save them now, or at least increase the odds of survival.

You should make the "big truck and people to load it" a contingency of your mushroom log sales, seems like a treat!

[Old Greenhorn]

Actually my last 2 orders, and any orders over 40 logs I do tell them that. Mostly it's to give them a chance to arrive with a proper sized vehicle. That last load went out at easily 4,000 pounds. You can't throw that in a pickup. Besides, I have to run the counter to make sure they get a fair load.
 They have had treatments for EAB for years, but unless the tree is treated BEFORE the EAB arrives, there is little chance of saving the tree. They also have released these wasps that feed on the EAB, but the damage i already done at that point, and I haven't seen any results from studies in how thy are working. I don't know if it's ever going to be the same.
 I did a property consult about 2 years ago just 1.5 hours west of me and found a couple of nice ash trees, mature, that seemed healthy. A different eco system and not too far from Barge, but further west. All the foresters are saying those will go too, eventually. I warned him that if he wanted to save them, and it was still a small chance, now might be the best time to get the roots inoculated and I gave him a reference contact for better advice and application.
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 Well yesterday was cold and the wind help at 20-35mph all dang day. I waited until just before noon and against my better judgement I head into the woods. I took just 3 trees in a fairly open area where I didn't have to worry much about windfall. Even though I dropped those trees in the direction of their slight lean, it was into the wind, The wind would not let them fall and I had to wedge everyone over into the wind. Just under 20 logs and I bagged it. Stopped at the log yard where the boys were doing firewood and chatted for a bit, then up to the shop. Bill is pushing hard in a gentle kind of way to get me back on the mill to make siding and now a fence job order. At this point I really would prefer that, I just want to be done with logs for a while, but I have to get them done before another warmup. Then I came home and split shop firewood for a while.
 I am not making this weekends delivery, which is ok with the client, I am a week earlier than he wanted, but I have to keep cutting. I have a nearly forgotten chiro tune-up this morning so more lost time. The wind is holding between 10 and 15 mph so that is a big improvement and today's high should be around 38, which is fine with me. Tomorrow they are calling for around 1.5" of rain, so that is a lost day, Sunday should be nicer.

 I just have to keep pushing on for another day. One at a time.

[Nebraska]

url=https://forestryforum.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=353038][/url]






I was back home in Southwestern Nebraska at Dad's place took a picture of some of the Red Cedar that grows there, just saw it and thought of you.  I need to cut some and haul it home, but I need to saw up what I have first.  I will get a picture that shows the scale better this weekend as I am driving back this evening.  It's an old stand along a small creek drainage that goes 20 miles up in the hills to the north.  

[Old Greenhorn]

Gee, I have no idea why that would make you think of me.  Which reminds me, I have one the get milled up and drying. I have to get done with these dang logs and move to the mill, I'm getting pushed from all over and I need to move along on the trailer work too. Still have the front wall to do, then build a shelf unit for the front (need to mill lumber for it first) and also need to mill up some 3/8 x 2" trim for all the panel joints. Then I'll be halfway there.
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 So today was my monthly chiro visit. He worked on me for twenty minutes and in passing said "you must have finished up our mushroom logs early, you are looking pretty good. Usually you are a mess about this time".   I explained that I was past the halfway point, 500 logs done and about 180 to go. He was surprised. He thinks I am 'settling in and building muscle and working more carefully, and it is all working for me'. So instead of 4 weeks between visits, we are going to 6 weeks, and maybe we can stretch that out. I can call him and come in at any point if I do something stupid, which is only a matter of time.
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Cold and nasty by the time I got home and changed, but the wind was below 10mph finally, so out I went. The goal today was to find/make a trail into a large blowdown that probably has 30 to 40 logs on it I can take. But it's in a tough spot. I thought I had two chances to get in with the bobcat SxS (smallest rig available). So I got to Bill's, threw my gear in the buggy and headed out. I tried the track we did some clearing on Sunday, we didn't think the SxS would fit, and it didn't. Plus I lost the trail and could not make anything out that was workable. So I turned and tried the path I found in, which, at the time I thought would work. We didn't clear that, I just thought it would work. SO I got in there and was getting out every 20-30 feet and clearing more junk, dead stuff and windfall. But I got just so far and could finally see the tree I was working toward and realized the terrain was not gonna allow it. It was on the next shelf up and I could not see a path to that shelf. It looked workable on Sunday. Either that track in a non-starter, or I picked the wrong path. I don't know and didn't have a lot of time to debate it with myself, turned the rig around, got back on the good path and headed back out to the main skid path, then went up the hill and came around from the other side for option #3. I dropped down into the woods from the high side on a dozer cut, got to the turn off into the little path and there was one spot with a very steep short up cut. We we cleared that on Sunday, we could not tell if the SxS would fit, width wise between the trees and rocks. We were pretty sure that in 4 wheel lock, with enough diesel applied we could get it up that hump, then clear sailing about 100' to the goal. But no, I would have beat up the cab and the buggy something fierce. I didn't want to take out the offending tree without Bill's input and then still risk banging the buggy up anyway or getting hung up on the hump. So I was screwed on my plan for the afternoon. So I punted.  We have nasty weather coming in tonight through tomorrow. My trailer is already staged in the area, and I had a mess of logs cut that needed collecting. (readers might recall I was trying a new tactic this week, cutting and leaving them lay for collection). So off I went picking up logs. A little more work with the SxS because I have to pick up each log and load it, then reverse it at the trailer, as opposed to picking the majority with the toolcat forks and just throwing a couple on that dropped. But the SxS weighs a fraction of what that 7,500 pound Toolcat weighs and is more nimble and I can get right in op top of the logs where I dropped the trees and don't have to carry them out to the path/trail/track most of the time. So that was the test, could I save my legs from carrying logs to where I could get the toolcat? Well, I am calling it a winner. Yeah, I got in a LOT closer than I thought I could. I had to make about 4 runs to collect all the logs spread over about 15 acres, but overall a bit faster and more important, less wear and tear on me. So yeah, it's nice to add a tweak to the system that helps. They are getting harder to figure out as I dial it in.
 I filled the trailer, both weight and capacity wise. So I took the SxS back, got my truck and hooked up the trailer to bring it home before the storm. If that road going into the parcel washes out again, I would be cut off from the logs until we rebuilt the road AGAIN. I stopped and cleared some debris from the 2 24" culverts. They get clogged with debris and the swamp can't drain and it goes up really fast when we get an inch of rain. We are slotted to get over 1.5" tomorrow, all in. The town road will be awash down there, no idea what the woods roads will look like. I need less than 30 logs to finish the next order.
 I came home and cut up the rest of the firewood on the  pile. It still needs splitting. I also messed with the chainsaw a bit hunting another issue.
 Tomorrow is another day probably, but I have no idea what I am doing. I will decide when I decide. Let's see what nature brings. Either in the shop or in the trailer. Probably not in the woods.

[doc henderson]

sounds like you are getting acclimated to this work.  good for you.  use it or lose it.  we send some to work hardening, but you are doing that on your own.

[Old Greenhorn]

Yeah, well about that Doc, since you and my chiro Doc both said the same thing, it was apparently the kiss of death. That log collecting I did Friday afternoon and using the SxS instead of the Toolcat with forks to do the lifting work, did me in. So 2x lifting and loading each log, well, it did me in good I guess. Doing 60 logs in one quick session, I think, is where I went wrong.
 So Saturday dawned to back pain I have not seen in quite a while, walking stooped, a lot of pain, I make funny and involuntary noises, etc. Back to taking Advil every 4 hours. Glad I recently stocked up. With yesterdays rain I was working in the trailer doing insulation, back and forth from the shop all day. Stepping up that 18" into the trailer, and going down again probably didn't help, plus all the work done on my knees all added up to not improve things at all.
 I had hoped it would be better this morning with rest, but no. Worse today. Back out to the trailer but it got worse as the morning went on, I made better progress with no rain, it was a beautiful day, but I was getting more stooped as it went on. So when Bill called around mid-day and asked what I was doing, I said "whatever you want as long as I don't have to pick up or swing a saw".  I knew working on the trailer would just make things worse, and things seemed to ease up with walking.
 So I went down and we took the SxS back out in search of access to that big blow down. We got to the point where I turned tail on Friday and Bill agreed, that tree had to come out, so we did that and diced it up for the OWB and threw it in the buggy. (We try to never come out of the woods without something useful.) Then he drove up that steep bank, 4 wheel lock and guns a blazin' he popped over the top like nothing. I hope I can do that when my turn comes.  We did a bit more clearing of standing dead EWP which is Bill's favorite for OWB fodder. We filled the SxS up, did a 3 point turn. and loaded up and headed out, back over the WHOOP. Man, a driver has to be VERY fast to roll over that hump and make a really quick turn near the bottom to miss wrapping a particular tree. Glad we had a full load of (albeit very dry pine) to test with. It will be  about 300 pounds different with green Black Oak. I will definitely want to minimize the number of times I have to make that run. Eventually, somebody is gonna miss that quick turn coming out. On the way in going up that hump, you seeing nothing but sky and have no idea where the path goes, just have to guess or remember to sing the wheel at just the right point. But going out all you can see is ground and that tree coming up FAST. It's one of those 'do ya feel lucky punk, well do ya?" things.
 After that I was relieved we found a way in and Inga wanted to 'explore', so did Bill. We followed a creek bed up to the head to figure out the drainages better and found several easy fixes to prevent flooding out a meadow area quite so much and improve the flow of runoff, in some cases back to where we are pretty sure it was 50 years ago, before 'somebody' thought they knew better. In other words a correction of human intervention. Also found another property marker pin I had not visited. Working on my understanding of his lines and I am getting better. This particular area had been burned over more than 15 years ago, accidently by the 2nd owner back in time. I could see the hardwood regen was doing really nicely and it would be a beautiful area to set up camp for someone. Bill is thinking of doing some kind of rustic camping opportunities. This would be perfect for it.
 Anyway, after rambling around for a while my back was feeling a bunch better. We drove back to the house and I followed Bill and Inga to town with them driving the 750 dump and 20K trailer and and excavator to set it for a job this week. Then they jumped in my truck and I drove them home and came back myself. All in all a terrific afternoon with crisp temps, blue skies, and low wind. Could not be better. Then as I left his driveway I saw the truck clock said it was after 6pm. "OH, the wife is gonna kill me". She likes dinner between 5:30 and 6pm. So I humped it up a bit, then remembered, she is out to a movie and a meal with our daughter for her birthday (tomorrow). Phew! Got home, brought in shop firewood and my back had returned to 'messed up' status from sitting in the truck and driving. Pat was not yet home, so no harm. What she doesn't know won't hurt me. I made my own lunch/dinner at 8pm. She didn't eat, still full from the restaurant meal.
 So tomorrow, or the next day I will have to figure out how to minimize my run to get logs from this tree to my truck. I could stage my small trailer up in the clearing near the buggy trail, maybe I will do that. My larger trailer is all full of logs now. I can only get about 15-20 logs on the SxS at a time and weight over THAT trail is a concern. Overweight could put me in a bad spot. I only need a little over a dozen logs to finish the current order, but there are a LOT more logs on that tree and I am not going to waste them. I still have more orders (about 180 logs). Also, I need to get that tree out of the way of the trail that continues right through it. That will make Bill happy, which makes me happy. So I may be working on that tree for more than one day. My eye is seeing about 50 logs in that single tree, perhaps more. It's a blowdown, so I have to cut careful and in layers, there are a ton of spring poles in there to be aware of. Some of it is pretty high too. So it's like eating an elephant and I'll have to attack it that way. It's about a 70' tree with 4 main leaders heading up. Even Bill said, 'hey, be careful on this one' and asked how I was going to attack it. So I'll take my logs, dice up much of the small brush, stack long sticks that make good but small firewood, and save that for another trip later and cut the whole thing off the stump and save out the long big stacks for his skidder to grab sometime, Maybe one to three decent saw logs in there. Either way, it all gets used. I may even take some broom handle material out if the round trip isn't too hairy. When we run that trail right through, it might be easier coming in the other way, but that too is a really narrow path, maybe somebody could get a small ATV through there, but that is down the road, so to speak. (The only person I know with a small ATV in Inga.  ) It will be another loop tying to a different road out. All this is what makes it fun, right? "Be a Mushroom logger!" they said. "It will be fun and profitable" they said. "you get to spend all that time out in the woods enjoying nature" they said. Well that is all true for the most part, but..... Then there are trees like this.

 Ah well, tomorrow is another day and yeah, this still beats all heck out of sitting in a conference room arguing about chart colors, hands down, no contest. I try to never forget that, which is pretty easy, it turns out.

[Old Greenhorn]

Yup, the kiss of death, that's what it was. Always good to know what you are dealing with.  I had a miserable night, nothing was comfortable and a couple of times I tried to move and woke myself up howling.
 So I texted my Chiro earlier and he is going to make a hole and stick me in this afternoon. He is concerned that it is worse everyday, rather than improving. I kind of am too. I am wearing a weight belt and using a cane, so not as good as yesterday for sure. The belt helps keep my back straighter when sitting and that is very helpful.
 Guess I am not getting much work done today. I will have to hit it harder when I am adjusted.

[doc henderson]

make sure not to exceed 16 OTC ibuprofen 200 mg capsules per day.  If a little movement helps your back, ask you chiro about stretches and exercises.  after that maybe PT.  If it is sore muscles this should help.  If it does not and the pain radiated lower, it may be a disc protrusion.  If certain movements give a stabbing pain, maybe a muscle relaxer.  In liew of that, could take tums.  have you ever tried a back support for when you know you are pushing your luck.  might ask your chiro about that.  I am sure your chiro will have an explanation, but we speak different languages.

If they feel it is compression, maybe inversion.?

[Old Greenhorn]

Well, I believe it is just repetitive strain. There was nothing in particular that is the smoking gun, just a lot of lift and carry without a rest except to catch my breath.
 The main reason I am not waiting and going in today is to make sure it is just more of the same (Tom doing stupid things) and not, as you say something else, and B) to see if we can fix it so I can work and at least finish the current order, which will not take much. I gotta get that done. The weather looks 'iffy' later in the week.
 I am wearing a back brace/support, but it's a little small for me. It does keep my back straight while sitting and has helped quite a bit today, so it's on. It was the only one we had in stock at work on a day when I needed it years back. I ordered a proper sized one this morning and will try that out when I do lift and carry work to see if it helps.
 I would never do more than 16 Advil's in a day. As you may recall I hate any kind of medications and take them sparingly. AT max usage I do 2 every 4 hours, but usually forget or don't have them with me in the woods, so I have never made it close to 16. Probably more like 8-10. 
 I just got out of the shower and that was an exercise in biomechanics taking a lot longer than it should.  I'll ask my chiro about all those points you mentioned. Thanks.

[doc henderson]

sounds god.  good luck.  For what it is worth, I either take four or none at all.  the effects are dose related.  4 every 6 hours hits the max.  If you did you could do 4 pills morning noon and night and have an extra dose available if needed.  the anti-inflammatory effects are a day later.  so, if you cut back each time you get pain relief, the inflammation may remain/return.  not trying to push drugs, but if you take them, it may be best to maximize the benefit.  If you did daily exercise, then your workdays would not be so much out of the ordinary, and that may help.  just trying to help.  

[beenthere]

And here I thought taking one 200 mg Advil a day was on the heavy side. Hope you feel better soon and can cut back on the meds. 

[Old Greenhorn]

Well benthere, it might even be over the limit depending on what other meds you are taking or any conditions you might have. Always good to check first.
 Doc, thanks for the dosage correction. I waited a while and will try 4 now, then another 4 at 9pm.

 Well my chiro is a great guy. He sent me a text he could sneak me in before other appointments at 11am, so down I went. I was real tender going in, he worked on me for quite a while. He said he couldn't tell if I had a bulging disc without an MRI, but he did say 'Holy Cow' when he put his hands on my sacral spine.  Everything he did was somewhat helpful, but when he snapped my neck things got a whole lot better quick. That may have been the cause, all knotted on the left side. The spasms seem to be gone. So many bones popped at once I could count them, at least 5. I felt a lot better when I left for sure. I am not near as twitchy as I was before, but I am tender. SO I ain't doin' nothing today.  It's tougher than I thought, so nice out and so much to do. But frankly just keeping the stoves idling along is about what I can handle right now. I would just do a little on the trailer, but I know I will get carried away and mess things up. So I'll watch a movie or something.

[doc henderson]

we watched Oppenheimer last pm.  was good history, but not a real eye popper, other than some nudity.    yes, ibuprofen can be hard on the stomach and kidneys.  especially Kidney for the elderly on ACE inhibitor BP meds.  enalapril or lisinopril and others.  you need prostaglandin E for stomach lining health and compensation in old kidneys.  do not use any if you do not need it, but don't skimp if you do.  If you are 80 with renal insufficiency and DM, and high bp, not for you.  glad your back is back!

[TroyC]

Doc, just read your above post. I was recently put on 10mg/day of lisinopril. That's the only script I take. Anything else I should be be aware of while on this?

[doc henderson]

how old are you? and are you diabetic? (I assume not if that is your only med) use ibuprofen with caution if your kidney function is OK.  It is one med that should prob. be prescription.  Your doc will do labs each year.  We all lose 1% of our kidney function each year after 40.  that is if you have been healthy.  DM, HTN, and medications are all hard on our kidney.  There are two ways our kidneys compensate for our old age.  one is the afferent arteriole clamping down (like your thumb on the end of a hose) to increase the intraglomerular pressure and increase glomerular filtration rate.  the other is prostaglandin dependent, and it increases glomerular surface area and can also increase GFR.  this is blocked by NSAIDs like Ibuprofen.  age 80 and 30 year of diabetes and HTN, and those two meds can get you in big trouble.  All the really good drugs, have potentially serious side effects.

[TroyC]

Thanks Doc, I'll spend the rest of the evening on WebMD looking up all those terms

I'm almost 70, not diabetic but it does run on my dad's side. Far as I know my kidney function is fine. The lisinopril seems to be doing what was expected with the BP. I'm trying to lose some weight and targeting 180.

I only use the ibuprofen when I really overdo my back. Doubt I average 6 pills/month but I'll certainly be careful with them.

[Old Greenhorn]

Well since I am on the injured reserve list I had to do something to keep busy and away from stupid stuff. I remembered some video I shot yesterday when we were cruising for trees and other things. So I put this together:

Just some silliness, but I gotta tell ya, that Inga is a ball of energy out in the woods and always makes me smile.

[Nebraska]

Yep that was cute. 

[doc henderson]

Troy, old bad kidneys with DM and htn, using ACE inhibitor and Ibuprofen = BAD.  your only 70.  all things in moderation.

[doc henderson]

Tom, no wonder you get hurt all the time.  good times.

[SawyerTed]

I imagine it's hard to hold the camera when climbing elevator trees.  Tom, you just can't keep up with those youngsters anymore!  

Hope you have patience to let your back heal and that it heals quickly!  

An inversion table has done wonders for my back.  It's the best $100 I've ever spent.  Haven't had to see the spine doctor in 15 years and my chiropractor sends "we miss you cards."  I hope I've not jinxed myself.

[aigheadish]

I thought I posted that I've used inversion and a back roller (like for yoga, just a foam cylinder you lay on then roll back and forth) and the roller, though it feels like I may die when I first use it, usually tends to give me better results. I don't know, but assume, the roller could make things much worse, so it's probably worth it to keep that in mind, or ask someone that knows something. 

[Nebraska]

I've used two tennis balls in the same manner as the roller on my back and it's usually helpful.