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The Old Dodge Needs New O2 Sensors

Started by firefighter ontheside, December 10, 2023, 09:10:52 PM

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firefighter ontheside

My 1998 Dodge V10 has had running issues for a year or so.  My mechanic put a new PCM in it and hoped it was fixed because he drove it numerous times with no issues.  Well a week after I got it back it had issues again.  Then Thursday when I drove it, it started making some new loud sound.  Then the check engine light came on, so I drove into O'Reillys to have it scanned.  It was saying O2 sensor temp high and motor running rich.  That was evidenced by the smell.  I ordered new O2 sensors from Amazon, but couldn't put them in until today.  I got the driver side changed without issue.  That was the side in the check engine code.  I pulled the pass. side and grabbed the "new" one to put in.  It turned out what I had received from Amazon was someone else's junk sensor.  I guess that guy changed his out and then "returned" his old one for a refund.  The seller, which was an Amazon associate and not actually Amazon.  It seems that seller did not actually look to see what was returned to them.  To say I was annoyed, upset, and some bad words I can't say here is an understatement.  I put my old sensor back on and will change it later this week when I get a replacement sensor.  Before I started working on the truck I disconnected the battery to clear the codes.  I only started the truck and moved it out of the way, but at least for that time period the light didn't come back.  I'm hoping the new sensors will solve my running issue.  Fingers Crossed.  I'm tired of spending money on this truck.
Woodmizer LT15
Kubota Grand L4200
Stihl 025, MS261 and MS362
2017 F350 Diesel 4WD
Kawasaki Mule 4010
1998 Dodge 3500 Flatbed

TroyC

I use a cheap OBDII scanner tool that plugs into the vehicle and connects wirelessly to my cell phone. Download a free code scanning app and you are good to go for about $15-20. It reads most all basic manufacturer's codes and it will display all sorts of info on your phone screen. Not really sophisticated but certainly does O2 sensors, coils, misfires, and such. Diagnosed a faulty thermostat in an Altima last week. Saves many trips to the parts store.

Wlmedley

From working on heavy equipment for years I learned a few little tricks for checking sensors.Best way I found when you have two identical sensors and one is showing a fault is to make up a couple temporary (test harnesses) so you can switch wiring from right to left and then run it.If fault on pcm switches sides it's probably sensor.If not ,sensor is just doing its job and problem is elsewhere.I didn't want to be labeled as a parts changer and tried to make sure that when I did change out a part that it fixed the problem.Hope this helps.
Bill Medley WM 126-14hp , Husky372xp ,MF1020 ,Homemade log arch,Yamaha Grizzly 450,GMC2500,Oregon log splitter

chevytaHOE5674

Hopefully that fixes the issue.

But a great many O2 sensors have been changed when they were merely doing there job and reporting data out of range. Often because of a fuel or air issue on the intake side.


rusticretreater

Having a bit more knowledge of OBDII than most folks I feel I can chime in on this.  Do you have the trouble codes that were found? 

There is no high temp code for an O2 sensor, so I surmise you mean high voltage reading.  A high voltage reading indicates a rich fuel mixture and you say the code for rich fuel mixture was also set. This is a confusing situation in that the O2 sensor high voltage tells the computer to lean out the mixture and yet the computer still adds fuel into the system.

This alone is not enough to tell what is occurring with your truck.  Clogged air filter, vacuum leaks, bad temp sensor, map sensor, maf(mass air flow) sensor, bad injectors can all cause codes like this to be set.  Also an imbalance from side to side can cause the computer to get confused. It wants everything in designed parameters and when things are not, the computer default behaviors can make confusing things happen.

Changing the O2 sensors is not a bad thing.  They lose their effectiveness over time(get sluggish) due to the temps they are exposed to and how they generate the voltage reading.  And you did right in changing them as a pair.

I order most of my auto parts from Rock Auto and I usually get the best within reason.  These are curated auto parts and most are of good to high quality.

So put the sensor in, clear the codes and give it a whirl.  If the codes reset, post it here.  I will put a follow alert on this thread so I know when you have posted new info.
Woodland Mills HM130 Max w/ Lap siding upgrade
Kubota BX25
Wicked Grapple, Wicked Toothbar
Homemade Log Arch
Big Tex 17' trailer with Log Arch
Warn Winches 8000lb and 4000lb
Husqvarna 562xp
2,000,000th Forestry Forum Post

firefighter ontheside

Rusticretreater, you were correct.  I must have made up the idea of the high temperature.  The codes were these,
P0132 Lambda sensor circuit high
P0172 Fuel system 1/1 rich

Guy at Oreilly told me lambda was driver side.
Woodmizer LT15
Kubota Grand L4200
Stihl 025, MS261 and MS362
2017 F350 Diesel 4WD
Kawasaki Mule 4010
1998 Dodge 3500 Flatbed

rusticretreater

P0132 says bank 1 sensor 1 -- lambda is high.  Lambda is a mathematical function that returns a single value, in this case a voltage reading.  It is usually somewhere between .2 and .8 volts.  Bank 1 is the drivers side. Sensor 1 is the uprange(closer to the engine) sensor.  Some vehicles have downrange sensors(near the catalytic converter). 

P0172 says bank 1 fuel mixture too rich - misunderstanding this can lead to an erroneous conclusion.  It might have too much fuel OR there is not enough oxygen.

A likely cause of the second condition is the Mass Airflow Sensor is returning a wrong reading on the air entering the intake or the O2 sensor is bad.  If replacing the O2 sensor does not solve the problem, cleaning the MAF sensor may help. 

You can buy MAF cleaning solution at the auto parts store.  Usually the MAF is located just aft of the air filter and will have wires running to it.  You want to remove the sensor and clean the exposed wire inside the unit. Handle this part carefully.
Woodland Mills HM130 Max w/ Lap siding upgrade
Kubota BX25
Wicked Grapple, Wicked Toothbar
Homemade Log Arch
Big Tex 17' trailer with Log Arch
Warn Winches 8000lb and 4000lb
Husqvarna 562xp
2,000,000th Forestry Forum Post

Resonator

QuoteI guess that guy changed his out and then "returned" his old one for a refund. 


Must of thought they'd get a core charge if they put the old one in the new box.
Under bark there's boards and beams, somewhere in between.
Cuttin' while its green, through a steady sawdust stream.
I'm chasing the sawdust dream.

Proud owner of a Wood-Mizer 2017 LT28G19

firefighter ontheside

Thanks Rustic, that's great info.  I will look for the MAF tomorrow.  The other engine trouble I have had with the truck is that it will start and run great for a long time.  Then if I stopped for a short time and then restarted the truck while still hot, within minutes of restarting it would begin to backfire and buck while accelerating.  I could stop and lightly rev the motor up and down and it would usually go back to normal running within a minute or two.  During those times it would not go up a hill.  This week is the first time that the check engine light has come on though.

Resonator, core charge, yeah I'm sure that was it.  Lol.
Woodmizer LT15
Kubota Grand L4200
Stihl 025, MS261 and MS362
2017 F350 Diesel 4WD
Kawasaki Mule 4010
1998 Dodge 3500 Flatbed

hedgerow

firefighter ontheside. Its been six, seven years ago I had a 1995 Dodge Dakota with the V-8. It had been sitting for some years with the transfer case out. I fixed that and started driving it. When I bought it I saw the ECM had been changed. Year or so into driving it I started having the same issues you are having. Not all the time but it would get to bucking, and act like it was misfiring and no power. Some times check engine light would come on sometimes not. Then it would come out of it and be fine for a while. Long story short after many sensors and tune ups it turned out to be the catalytic converter had came apart inside and and the parts that were loose would would partly plug the exhaust some times and cause the issue. I found it by accident. I had it up on the lift changing oil and bumped the exhaust and heard the rattle. Put a new converter on it and my issues went away. Maybe not your problem but something to look at.

firefighter ontheside

Granted that I haven't replaced the passenger side sensor yet, but I drove the truck 25 miles this morning with shutting it off and restarting after 2 stops and it didn't die out on me and the check code didn't come back yet.  Fingers crossed, but I'm not convinced yet.  I will replace the other sensor tomorrow as long as I don't receive another junk sensor.
Woodmizer LT15
Kubota Grand L4200
Stihl 025, MS261 and MS362
2017 F350 Diesel 4WD
Kawasaki Mule 4010
1998 Dodge 3500 Flatbed

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