Blade-Save it or Scrap It?

[SawyerTed]

A customer brought this blade to be resharpened!  Woodmizer 7/39 158" Doublehard, it's approximately $21 to replace. It's been sharpened once and hit a nail on the first cut afterwards, in spots the burr from resharpening wasn't even gone.


We had a conversation about it.  He wanted me to save it.  I explained the cost of multiple passes and that heavy grinds are counter productive.  Where his blades occasionally need two passes, most only need one.  This one probably several. 

I told him about Forestry Forum and told him we'd get pretty straight answers here. He's agreed to scrap it but I have a feeling I'll see it again.   

Did I say this customer can pinch blood out of a penny?  I just don't think it should be my peenies he's squeezing! 

[CCCLLC]

Totally  agree with  Sawyer Ted.  Needs .100" of grinding and that all comes from the body of the blade. Not to mention that the tip hardness  has diminished . Scrap in my opinion. 

[GAB]

If he had been sawing faster there would be no decision to make.
GAB

[jpassardi]

Yeah - scrap metal. You'd get through the hardness and about bring the gullet to the roller guides to get it sharp. I suspect he doesn't know the cost of a CBN you'd be wearing out either...

[Gere Flewelling]

I use grind rocks on my sharpener and I think I could reshape those teeth on 4 passes without too much trouble. I would go around twice prior to setting and then twice lightly after setting. De-burr it and call it good. I suspect 95% of the tips will be perfect with the rest shaping up on the next sharpening. For me that is a "been there done that" situation. Happens often on the wide mills cutting those big old monster yard trees. Just another opinion  to add to the conversation. 

[thecfarm]

How many passes you make with a "normal" blade? If you do at times make 2 passes and this one takes 4 to make it right, charge him double the sharpening price.    

[Magicman]

Blades are consumables and have a limited lifespan.  They are also a vital element for producing quality sawn lumber.  Of course I do not resharpen, and I also do not send anything to ReSharp that has been compromised in any way such as metal/stone strike blades. 

I had a nice phone visit with Marty Parsons at PA Wood-Mizer this afternoon while I was taking advantage of the 15% off and free shipping on blades that expires tomorrow.  I also shipped him a box of 10 for resharpening today.

[Gere Flewelling]

Two passes on a normal band after setting. I have found that any more than two passes will often affect the set, so I shape up the teeth with a little heavier grind and finish up with a light grind after setting. As far as charging more for the extra grinds, I think that is a great way to end up with one less customer. It's not that big of a deal to let the machine go around a couple of extra times in my opinion. Keeping the customer happy and coming back is the top priority for me. So far it is working out.

[SawyerTed]

Sometimes some customers aren't worth the headaches they bring...

I'm in the Magicman camp on blades being consumables.

Some are consumed sooner than others. I think my customer needs to gain a better understanding of that.  Did I say he's a cheap sake and tight with his money by choice?  I'm sure he doesn't care what it costs me to fix the blade.  I'm not worried that he may read this since I have said those exact words to him directly.  He agrees and laughs.  

I agree that charging more for one blade is a good way to shed customers. But eating the costs difference between reviving one blade or sharpening 3-5 in the same time is a good way to go broke @ $8-10 per blade. 

Another way to lose customers is to send out blades that are destined to be poor performers.  I dont have confidence that blade would cut well for long.  

[customsawyer]

Simple solution is to charge more to fix it than a new one cost. Explain to the customer that you could sharpen 3-4 blades in the time it would take to fix that one, so it will cost $40.00 to sharpen it. He can then decide if he wants to pay that or he can pay $21.00 for a new blade. It's very rare that I ever tell a customer no. I will put the "I don't want to do it" price on something in a heartbeat. This way if they still have me do it, I will be making some bank. 

[Magicman]

In the past I have sent "metal hit" blades back to ReSharp.  Some were rejected but some were resharpened.  Sometimes some of those that were resharpened cut OK but they left irregular saw marks on the lumber.  Sure, I know that it is "rough sawn" but anything less than smooth lumber is unsatisfactory with me.  If I have to explain saw blade marks to a customer then I feel that I am not doing my job.

I solved my metal strike blade situation by charging $45 per metal strike blade and trashing them.  That pays for the blade plus my time for digging the metal out.  Problem solved.

[Stephen1]

Scrap the Blade. If the customer wants to go somewhere else, great! The customer is not always right. Dean I agree, price that job so you are making serious bank! 
I have tried too many times over the years to salvage metal strike blades, only to find it didn't really work and I spent a whole bunch of time and effort for nothing but aggravation in the spring when I put those metal strike blades on and they didn't work. I used to keep metal strike blades on a special hook in the shop and during the winter I would try to sharpen them during my slow time. Now I have an extra hook in the shop. 
I am glad I am getting older and smarter and just throw them out! 

[Magicman]

I compare metal strike blades with junk knotty logs.  I tell the customer that knotty logs make knotty unusable lumber and that sawing them results in expense to him and wasted time for me.  "If I saw it I'm gonna scale it" will usually lay that conversation to rest.

With bad blades and bad logs, let the dead die and rest in peace. 

[scsmith42]

I would consider resharpening it (2 passes) and then saving it for a suspected metal log.

[Bradm]

For a good customer who rarely sends in blades looking like this, I'd probably try to salvage it and let them know it would be best to use on a suspect log.  Anyone else, it gets the NWS (not worth sharpening) label.  If you tell me your just being cheap and prefer that I don't make money on it, that's the last time I'll do any work for you without adding PITA, PEBKAC and ID10T charges.

[SawyerTed]

My customer decided after talking with his sawmill partner to scrap the blade. 

Here's another one.  This one is mine.  

https://youtube.com/shorts/85W8Kk-NXvo?si=nR9c7caCl1MRobgV

I didn't see the missing tooth during my pre-sharpening inspection.  I have no idea when it broke and the blade shows no other problems.

I'm inclined to try it opening a log.  If it works okay then I've lost nothing.  If not, it's scrap.  

[Magicman]

I spend no time fretting about blades that may compromise my lumber.  When I uncoil a blade that feels flimsy I know that this will be it's last sawing.


This one sawed well today and it probably could be resharpen again, but instead it goes to the trash.

[jpassardi]

Ted: Good thing you didn't walk away - you'd come back an hour later and wonder: why is the sharpener still running?? 

[SawyerTed]

While I didn't go out of earshot, I was just outside the shop roll up door.  I heard the change in rhythm of the sharpener immediately.  It probably ground 4 or five times without advancing.  

[Stephen1]

Heck I've had  it where it ground down a new gullet. It's usually you've walked away and doing something else, and then realize it should have stopped sharpening by now. I've had a few over the years like that. 
I do lots of my blade sharpening when changing out my kiln. The sharpening room Is next to the kiln, so pop in and change the blade and then back to the kiln load. 

[barbender]

 I would explain to him that it will take 4 passes at least on the sharpener, instead of one. He's paying for one pass at the normal rate, each additional pass is $xx. It will cost you more in time and machine wear than the blade is worth, but if he wants to pay $30-$40 to sharpen a $21 blade let him. We all know he won't, the only reason he likes the idea of resharpening it is that the $30-$40 is supposed to come from your donation of skill, time, and  equipment. 

 I abhor cheapskates.

 I admire frugality (though I lack it😊). To me, frugality is like a former boss of mine. Worth millions, but lived simply and drove older vehicles etc. But always generous to others.

 Now a cheapskate on the other hand, always wants to use someone else's time and money for themselves. Gag.

[SawyerTed]

barbender, that hits the bullseye!  I too respect those who are frugal and wisely make expenditures.

A cheapskate rubs my fur the wrong way, especially one who "looked on the internet" and has deemed himself an expert!  He said he saw on YouTube where blades can be sharpened with a chainsaw chain grinder and asked why I didn't do it that way.  I asked, "Why don't you?"  All I got was a dumb look.   A drawer full of hammerheads has more going for it.    I'm hoping his sawmilling partner will start bringing blades.