I was wondering what a good price was for Black locust logs, that are fairly good quality. I'm not sure but I was thinking maybe similar to the price of white oak?
Do you have a buyer for the logs? Many times, you don't know the actual condition of Black Locust until you open it.
I just got an order for 48-4x4's and 6-6x6's all 8 foot, and the customer wants the 6's to be black locust, the 4's to be anything rot resistant. I have black locust logs from our woodlot, I was just trying to give the logs some kind of price in order to price the posts.
You are competing against purchased 4by and 6 by posts out of any one of the box stores/lumber yards. Do some checking on what it would cost the customer to buy those, at the same time figure out if they are willing to pay anything additional.
Joe
The reason he is buying from me is that he didn't want to use anything with unnatural chemicals. He will be using these for grapevines in his garden. He wanted something natural that would last a long time.
I'd price them the same as white oak Ty.
Thanks norm, that's kinda what I was thinking, due to the rot-resistance and all. (and wear on blades ;))
I would probably be around the 1.50 bd ft for the finished product, thats on a true board foot basis. Depending on the quality of the logs, around 30-50 cents a board foot for the logs. The few black locust logs we have cut were all smaller; I really haven't seen a big one, so possibly the higher price if your using the Doyle scale and they are sound. Things might be different in your area. Black locust cuts hard, at least my experience with it. You really aren't competing against pressure treated lumber.
since you will be making a product that he cant get at lowes the price should be at least as much as the treated posts that size. here in ne ok hedge would be the rot resistant choice. they will last forever in the dirt but if you cement them in the water will get between the post and concrete and freeze and bust the concrete. i know some that have been in the ground for 40 years and are still good. the treated pine that the lumberyards sell will be rotten at the ground,cement or not in less than 10 years.
i sell a lot of oak trailer flooring this way.i price them the same as treated pine and sell them on the fact that it will last twice as long. i also learned to get a deposit if it is not someone i have dealt with before.
Kansas is right the lumberyard is NO competition for you. pc
I've cut locust before you're right it is hard, but I love the stuff. Just as rot-resistant as red cedar if not more, and it's hard as a rock when it's aged. It can get pretty big around here, 20"+.
Just remember when you are pricing it, That locust only lasts a little longer than granite .
Stonebroke
And it grows like a weed :D
Ty, Here in Southern IN it is pretty hard to find black locust of any size. It is usually pretty crooked as well. I found a few one time big enough to cut one side and use as posts. I could sell a lot of posts if I could find them big enough. We have lots of honey locusts, the ones with the big ole thorns. They grow pretty big and straight here, but don't last.
Faron, here in East Central Indiana, Honey locust is more common, but they grow to a good size also, and even faster. They like to try to take over our pasture every year. Black locust is not as common, but there is an area of our woods that has a lot of it.
I prefer the look of H. Locust over B. Locust, especially right off the saw, cause of the bright oranges and pinks. Whenever I cut one I feel like I'm cutting some kind of exotic.
I would think that selling a 4x4 black locust post for the same price as a treated pine 4x4 in the Box Store is pricing the locust way too low. They are a specialty product and should command a premium price over the treated pine, at least double.
Thanks for the helpful tips guys, and WDH, I wasn't sure how "specialty" black locust was considered, so thanks for the heads up! I'll remember that next time..
Finding a niche is what small mills are all about. We have a lot of black locust on the property at work, and have made a lot of fence parts out of it. Last year I made a corral out of 6x6 posts and 2x6 planks, all held together with Timberloks. Prices I've heard for various black locust products are around $1.50/ft. I don't know what PT is at the lumberyard, but I don't think it will last like locust. :D
PT posts are about $.85/bd-ft here.
I'm interested in getting four posts and some rails for a compost pile bin framework, and seek sellers and prices. I want to price 4 count of 8-10 foot-long 4"x4" posts and about 80 feet of 2"x2-3" horizontal rails,, so about 30-40 board feet of rail.
The posts could be squared on just two adjacent sides, with bark on the two remaining sides. This site is in Boston, MA.
Here I see prices of $1.50 a board foot(1"x1'x1'), elsewhere much, much higher. Someone, not a seller, mentioned $12-18 per board foot - at that price I'll have to use Pressure Treated.
Welcome to the Forestry Forum, Briancady413. Adding your location to your profile will help with future questions. :)
I would not sell mine for any less than PT timbers. I got on a clean up campaign year before last and cut a bunch of locust fence post. Sold a lady 250+ then she called and wanted 20 poles to build a pole barn so I cut them, found a neighbor to load and deliver 50 miles. She paid more than treated 6X6 poles would have cost. Then she referred me to a friend over on the coast of VA who ordered a load of post so I cut and split him about 250+ and he hired a trucker with a 36' gooseneck trailer to come get them. Same reason - did not want chemical treated and could not find Black locust in his area. What few I have left now I will keep for my own fence needs. Did build a pole barn last year using them. I see them all the time in local paper for firewood and I cringe every time I think of wasting good fence post and poles that way.
Here I pay anywhere from .40 bf for small logs and as high as .80 bf. You tell a lot about a Locust log by looking at the ends. Any defects and its a good bet the log is not going to turn out very well.
The low end price for lumber is 1.50 bf, a little higher for larger diameter and anything over 8" is whatever you can get. The reason the price goes way up for wider lumber is its rare for logs to be over 12" and be sound.
Quote from: stonebroke on June 03, 2010, 01:56:05 PM
Just remember when you are pricing it, That locust only lasts a little longer than granite .
Stonebroke
and a very little harder ;D :D :D :D
Quote from: paul case on June 03, 2010, 09:15:07 AM
since you will be making a product that he cant get at lowes the price should be at least as much as the treated posts that size. here in ne ok hedge would be the rot resistant choice. they will last forever in the dirt but if you cement them in the water will get between the post and concrete and freeze and bust the concrete. i know some that have been in the ground for 40 years and are still good. the treated pine that the lumberyards sell will be rotten at the ground,cement or not in less than 10 years.
i sell a lot of oak trailer flooring this way.i price them the same as treated pine and sell them on the fact that it will last twice as long. i also learned to get a deposit if it is not someone i have dealt with before.
Kansas is right the lumberyard is NO competition for you. pc
Hedge is like cutting rail road iron. I have a big one to cut up . Not looking forward to it.
I'll take that big hedge off your hands if you don't want it. I'm always looking for some good ones. I just got some 7 degree bi-metal blades I want to try out.
Ill agree that selling them the same as pt is way too cheap. The customer wants custom posts that will last forever without chemicals, he should be willing to pay for it. Theres a sawyer in Mass that specializes in it and he wont let anything go for less than 4.00 bd ft., last I knew he was talking about raising it even more. If you have quality logs, (rare) you might want to put some value on them.
$4 a foot for locust is nuts, but if he can get it......
If it is the guy I'm thinking of, he lives amongst the Sasquatch's and banjos. :D
Pressure treated 4x4 pine posts are cheap. I would not sell black locust posts for that price either. If they don't like the price, they can go buy the cheap pressure treated ones at the Box Store.
Black locust is more like oak than pine, I concede, and is therefore worth more than PT pine. It will probably last longer than PT pine, too. I'll have to predrill every screwhole, of course, whereas with cedar and PT pine I won't.
The arguement that those willing to avoid artificial poisons, and to use locust's natural ones instead, should pay more instead of being rewarded financially for ridding the world of spreading more arsenic, etc., seems as hole-y as swiss cheese to me, though.
Anyway, when you all have finished forming your locust cartel and fixed a price, let me know and I can decide whether to use locust, cedar or PT pine. I'd prefer locust, but I doubt I'll pay $12-18/bdft.
You are not paying more because you don't want the poison, you are paying more because locust does not grow as fast, straight or as plentiful as syp, nor does it saw as easily. I've never heard of anyone trying to get 12 to 18 a foot for it. I think it's more like a buck and a half, two bucks around here, but then I'm reminded of something my father used to say. "Finnegan's Franks. Ten cents a pound, but we don't have any". :D
tyb525,
Simple solution to determine the fair price is let the customer obtain the locust logs and go saw them for him at your normal sawing rate on site or at customer location and see what the final cost to the customer ends up being.
I don't normally saw on shares but I would for decent walnut, cherry or locust. My customers like locust for bridge timbers and poles for pole barns. When I squared my own locust poles I saved what framing lumber I could to use for building shooting houses and such that used to use PT lumber for. I like a 6X6 shooting house so 6' long framing is fine for my purposes.
Quote from: Briancady413 on March 20, 2016, 04:33:56 AM
Black locust is more like oak than pine, I concede, and is therefore worth more than PT pine. It will probably last longer than PT pine, too. I'll have to predrill every screwhole, of course, whereas with cedar and PT pine I won't.
The arguement that those willing to avoid artificial poisons, and to use locust's natural ones instead, should pay more instead of being rewarded financially for ridding the world of spreading more arsenic, etc., seems as hole-y as swiss cheese to me, though.
Anyway, when you all have finished forming your locust cartel and fixed a price, let me know and I can decide whether to use locust, cedar or PT pine. I'd prefer locust, but I doubt I'll pay $12-18/bdft.
Its a fact. This all got started with the green movement. People planting raised bed gardens don't want to have them made out of lumber with chemicals. You're also dealing with a species that is becoming more rare and doesn't grow very well in the first place.
Locust poles, UNSAWN, go for $1 a linear foot here, I would not sell sawn for less than $2.50 a BF.
Comparing the price of locust to treated pine is not a fair deal IMHO.
Frank
Quote from: Dave Shepard on March 19, 2016, 02:48:07 PM
$4 a foot for locust is nuts, but if he can get it......
If it is the guy I'm thinking of, he lives amongst the Sasquatch's and banjos.
Sounds like him,.. I wasn`t saying he`s right, I wouldnt buy it from him, but he seems to have a market in the "organic, all natural" area he`s in.
alanh,
I mentioned I sold a load of locust posts to a guy over on the coast. In addition to my prices for the posts he hired a trucker to haul them 400 miles. As mentioned by others they are becoming harder to locate. Around here people tend to cut them when 5-6 inches and they make perfect posts but few get big enough to saw. When they do get larger they get a blight of some kind and get punky spots in the trees and woodpeckers and such den in the them.
Hi Tyb,
I sent a PM about possibly picking up some BL posts for a garden fence I'm building this spring. I'm in St. Louis now but I often travel to Evansville. Send me a PM if you have any extra BL since I haven't heard back from my local sawyer.