The Forestry Forum is sponsored in part by:

iDRY Vacuum Kilns


Forestry Forum
Sponsored by:


TimberKing Sawmills



Toll Free 1-800-582-0470

LogRite Tools



Norwood Industries Inc.




Your source for Portable Sawmills, Edgers, Resaws, Sharpeners, Setters, Bandsaw Blades and Sawmill Parts

EZ Boardwalk Sawmills. More Saw For Less Money!

STIHLDealers.com sponsored by Northeast STIHL


Woodland Sawmills

Peterson Swingmills

 KASCO SharpTech WoodMaxx Blades

Turbosawmill

Sawmill Exchange

Michigan Firewood, your BRUTE FORCE Authorized Dealer

Baker Products

ECHO-Bearcat

iDRY Wood Lumber Vacuum Drying for everyon

Nyle Kiln Dry Systems

Chainsawr, The Worlds Largest Inventory of Chainsaw Parts

Smith Sawmill Service



Author Topic: RR Ties for $40  (Read 43450 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline WV Sawmiller

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 10778
  • Age: 68
  • Location: Hinton WV
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
    • Green's Sawmill Services
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #300 on: December 22, 2014, 07:20:59 PM »
Ron, et. al,

    Following is a quote from a US EPA document listing proposed recycling methods for old tires. Other sources I reviewed indicated the grip of nails and such as comparable to wood. When I first heard of it I thought it was a creative use of a problem asset. I do not know the cost to manufacture or what other environmental problems they may create but it did seem like a good method to get rid of old tires. I do not know if they are more subject to fire/burning than wood or other issues. They would seem to be more resistant to rot and insect damage. They would seem to have flexibility to resist some of the problems associated with rigid materials like concrete. They look like they would be preferable in very wet environments.

"Railroad Ties Highly durable, rubber-encased railroad ties are being produced using scrap tires. These railroad ties have a steel-beam core filled with concrete that is then encased in 80 pounds of ground-up scrap tires and discarded plastic bottles, held together with a special binder or glue. These railroad ties are over 200% stronger than creosote-soaked wooden ties, enabling railroads to use fewer ties per mile. Moreover, rubber-encased railroad ties could last 60 to 90 years versus 5 to 30 years for wood."

    I am not advocating their use over wood. Just advising the technology is in the works and does help dispose of a problem waste product.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Offline rooster 58

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1029
  • Age: 63
  • Location: Florissant, Co.
  • Gender: Male
  • GRIZ, the sawmill mgr.
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #301 on: December 22, 2014, 08:14:32 PM »
7 ' s are 33.00 here

Offline rooster 58

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1029
  • Age: 63
  • Location: Florissant, Co.
  • Gender: Male
  • GRIZ, the sawmill mgr.
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #302 on: December 22, 2014, 08:17:48 PM »
Oops. 7x9's

Offline sandsawmill14

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2756
  • Age: 49
  • Location: tn
  • Gender: Male
  • love my job (most days)
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #303 on: December 22, 2014, 08:24:17 PM »
most of us will never know if they last 60-90 yrs. :D  but seriously as a nation we do waste so much it is crazy  i am a big supporter of recycling anything possible.  Thats one of the reasons i run a band mill in stead of circle. I could have bought a circle mill for 10000 less than my b 20 less than 10 miles from my house but it took 5 men and about 40 bucks an hour for diesel add in the extra kerf and you saw 1000 ties per week and make the same amount of money as with my b 20. just makes no sense to me
hudson 228, lucky knuckleboom,stihl 038 064 441 magnum

Offline Ron Wenrich

  • Forester
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 14411
  • Age: 72
  • Location: Jonestown, PA
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #304 on: December 23, 2014, 06:53:04 AM »
I did some searching on the rubber RR ties.  Seems that they came up with it back in the early '90s.  Another was a company that was going to produce them.  Went to their website and there was scant information on it.  Seems if it was a big marketable product, they would have it plastered all over the place. 

I think there are several things in play.  Just because you have a product, doesn't mean you have a market.  Recycled ties have a place, and they may even be more desirable.  It doesn't mean that they can crack the market.  Tried and true often outweighs new technology.

Economics can be another factor.  Getting material to recycle is relatively cheap when there isn't much of a demand.  When I did work recycling urban timber, we could get logs for free.  We could have gotten them for a tipping fee if it was allowed.  But, there were no other mills in the area.  Our competition was mulchers who did charge a tipping fee.  We got plenty of logs.

If they could produce a tie cheaper, then demand would rise, but so would the demand for the base material.  And, if profit levels would be high, more producers would come on line.  That would make demand for the base materials even greater, and costs would go up.  We have to pay $5 to have tires recycled.  What would base costs be if they paid $5 to buy the tires?

In addition, you have the market force of the entrenched current suppliers.  Would supply dry up if they dropped price by $1-2?  Probably not, since there isn't an alternate market large enough to take in the supply.  That drop in price would be driven back to the stump.

I'm not overly concerned about recycled material coming into the marketplace, at this time.  We can grow trees and mfg ties rather cheaply compared to the capital outlay to build a recycling plant.  Maybe sometime in the future they will be able to make it cheaply with a big 3-D printer. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Offline Leigh Family Farm

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 756
  • Age: 40
  • Location: South Eastern Pennsylvania
  • Gender: Male
  • Live life the way you want. You only get one.
    • Share Post
    • Isagenix
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #305 on: January 06, 2015, 12:22:54 PM »
Not about rubber ties, but when I was in France over the holidays, I noticed that they use concrete tires for nearly all of their railroad ties near Paris. They have huge piles of concrete ties like we have wooden ones. Just interesting...
There are no problems; only solutions we haven't found yet.

Offline goose63

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2724
  • Age: 71
  • Location: Hankinson North Dakota
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #306 on: January 06, 2015, 12:28:42 PM »
I have seen some concrete ties up here
goose
if you find your self in a deep hole stop digging
saw logs all day what do you get lots of lumber and a day older
thank you to all the vets

Offline SawyerBrown

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1092
  • Age: 64
  • Location: Central Illinois (Peoria)
  • Gender: Male
  • If you're gonna be stupid, ya gotta be tough!
    • Share Post
    • Saw It There
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #307 on: January 07, 2015, 02:05:01 PM »
... when I was in France over the holidays, I noticed that they use concrete tires ...

No wonder French-made cars aren't very popular!   :D
Pete Brown, Saw It There LLC.  Wood-mizer LT35HDG25, Farmall 'M', 16' trailer.  Custom sawing only (at this time).  Long-time woodworker ... short-time sawyer!

Offline Okrafarmer

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 6461
  • Age: 43
  • Location: upcountry SC-- Sweetgum capital of the world!
  • Gender: Male
  • Back again....making multi-colored sawdust
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #308 on: December 12, 2015, 01:48:28 AM »
... when I was in France over the holidays, I noticed that they use concrete tires ...

No wonder French-made cars aren't very popular!   :D

Ha, nice!

Well, I'm not sure what price ties are going for, but my parents are having their fifteen acres or so of hardwoods logged off right now (heavy selective cut, leaving as many small trees and a few selected favorite species as possible) and I'm glad they waited until now instead of back when ties were $20. Not sure what ties are in their part of western Kentucky, but the logger said tie logs were a major driver for them as they do the job. They are using chainsaw and cable skidder. I think they're getting mostly oak but some other hardwoods as well. Dad was pleased with the price he's getting, and it sounds like the logger is being considerate with the land (Dad keeps an eye on him and pokes around with his D-2 to smooth up the trails and clean up after them a bit).
No matter how conventional wisdom may fly in the face of radical thought, it's still the most popular type.

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Wagner Farms, Dacusville, SC

Looking for the return of the Lord!

Offline stavebuyer

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1317
  • Location: KY
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #309 on: July 26, 2021, 12:12:43 PM »
As of today sawn 7x9s ties are bringing $40 in KY

Offline longtime lurker

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1746
  • Location: way south
  • Gender: Male
    • Share Post
Re: RR Ties for $40
« Reply #310 on: July 27, 2021, 05:21:46 AM »
Concrete ties have become the norm here over the last 20 or so years. They still use wood on bridges, points, in the yards... but the main lines are steadily going to concrete. Dedicated tie operations are definitely a thing of the past in my part of the world

There are also trials being done or recycled plastic ties now. The data looks good ( for plastic), the higher initial cost is compensated for by a longer service life/ less maintenance.

Thing being that in either case - concrete or plastic - you can't mix and match them with wood. So replacement of wood ties with wood ties is going to be ongoing even as a roll out of new materials occurs.
The quickest way to make a million dollars with a sawmill is to start with two million.


Share via delicious Share via digg Share via facebook Share via linkedin Share via pinterest Share via reddit Share via stumble Share via tumblr Share via twitter

xx
How To Cut RxR Ties

Started by plaindriver on General Board

7 Replies
1105 Views
Last post July 04, 2013, 10:39:10 PM
by plaindriver
xx
RR TIES

Started by mac on Sawmills and Milling

13 Replies
2657 Views
Last post August 10, 2005, 10:17:41 AM
by Bro. Noble
xx
RR Ties

Started by woodman58 on Sawmills and Milling

16 Replies
2089 Views
Last post February 11, 2016, 11:24:27 PM
by beenthere
xx
Used RR ties

Started by wolverine on Sawmills and Milling

10 Replies
2317 Views
Last post January 07, 2009, 07:11:58 PM
by ARKANSAWYER
 


Powered by EzPortal