Bar & Chain oil

[Deadwood]

The problem with this post is that I agree with everyone. I am quite certain the higher priced oils are better, but considering the fact that the bar of a chainsaw is a consumable, I would have to have some pretty good data for me to switch to high priced bar and chain oil.

As for maintenance I file the rails, seldom throw chains, but use the motor to get the burr off as another mentioned, and never, ever grease the tip. I'm an accomplished logger so I don't try to drive the tip of the saw into the ground, but the first time I do, I've just impacted that grease with dirt. Kiss that tip good bye because the ports aren't big enough to purge the dirt out of the bar. In the 15 years I have been logging (some of those years professionally) I have only smoked one tip.

I guess if I am guilty of anything, it would be my use regular lube oil causes me to throw more oil into the environment. I'm not an environmentalist, but that is about the only bad thing I can say about my use of free oil.

[mike_van]

Hey Hoop - I've heard that Jeep Cherokee drivers get genuine Jeep air in their tires -  :D  And, they change it for winter or summer drining -  :D :D

[1953greg]

sounds like a tossup.  here's the tiebreaker.

for me the ultimate test for bar oil is milling.  i use an 066 w/ 42" bar cutting 36" red oak slabs.  certainly i have not used all oils (maybe 6 or 7) but the one that markedly keeps the bar the coolest is citgo mystic @ $5/gal.

less heat = less friction = better lube.  how much better, i dont know.

i have not made a quantative analysis but feeling is believing.

dont know whats in it but it works best for me.    good day

[Gary_C]

I buy and use a lot of bar oil. In a full day of cutting with the harvester, I will use about a half gallon of bar oil. Here in Minnesota we need both summer and winter oil because you cannot open up your oiler enough in the winter temps with a high viscosity summer oil.

I am a firm believer in using the best oil you can buy for engines, transmissions, gear boxes, and hydraulic systems because it has to avoid thermal breakdown, maintain film forming ability, and suspend dirt and deposits for a long time. However, bar oil just has to be reasonably clean and just stick to the bar and chain just briefly and then I need to see some fly off the chain as I am cutting. Any bar oil that I have bought seems to work just fine. I usually buy cases of six gallons of a generic packaged bar oil and recently I grabbed 4 gallons of Poulan bar oil in Walmart and it worked just as good as the generic packaged oil I usually buy at the equipment dealers.



As far as bar and chain life on a chainsaw, I think how well you care for your saw will determine the life of bars and chains, not the brand of bar oil. Cutting stumps too low, cutting up logs that have been laying on the ground, and leaving your saw in the back of your pickup while driving down dusty roads will shorten bar and chain life far more than the brand of bar oil you use. However if you are convinced that your name brand bar oil is better than others, the marketing people have done a good selling job on you.

It's you money, spend it as you see fit.   8)

[rebocardo]

> oil viscosity

Once the saw is hot, so is the oil, at least on my Huskies. So, I think when I am using 20w-50 it is a good thing in the hot GA weather  :D

Seriously, I have used everything including car oil when I have run out or forgotten my bar oil.  The only difference I have seen is cost. Even when using my chainsaw mill I saw no extra bar wear. I have been using the same 20" and 28" bar for years now. The 28" is getting a little splayed, so I might get a bar rail closer, though I clean it up with the bar file when it gets a burr.

[Dan_F]

I use Motion Lotion from baileys. It works great in normal cutting conditions and doesn't gum up like some other oils. It does dry out in real tough cutting conditions but that is rare.

[Max sawdust]

I use a cheap generic kind.  I do notice differences in bar oil.  Find one you like and stick with it.  I too feel that bars and chains are consumable items, so personally I do not buy the most expensive bars or the most expensive bar oil.  I flip the bar when I put a new chain on, I file my bar on the flip.  I grease the bar tip but after reading this thread I may stop. :-[

If I were slabbing with a big expensive bar I might consider more expensive bar oil. :

Again they are consumables safety and not overheating/overworking the saw is my goal. ;D
Max

[jokers]

Stihl, and all the other brands, don't make their oil, refineries do on contract to their specs. If the Stihl oil is that much more expensive I'd believe they are adding things their competitors aren't.

They sure are! More profit!

:D :D

[inspectorwoody]

Looking through some old threads and thought I would add some information to this - The following information comes from a gentleman whom I spoke with and gave me permission to post the information here.

I've seen lots of posts where it's stated that all bar oil is the same and that it's just refinery junk... So I asked the question of Stihl... "why is your bar oil so special (expensive)" and here's what they say (paraphrased).

Stihl bar oil is Napthetic based, and most other bar oils are typically Parafinic (meaning wax based).

There are only 3 refineries in the US that produce Napthetic base oil. Only One produces Stihl bar oil - Omni. Omni offers a closed system meaning no other products flow through this line except Stihl. The napthetic base Stihl uses is a virgin base and is not re-refined or recycled oils since these types will always contain suspended contaminants. They also use twice as much paratac, (sticky) as anyone else. Paratac is the most expensive additive in bar oil which is one of the reasons Stihl more expensive.

Parafinic means wax based, so it gets thin when hot, thick when cold. Temperature does not have the same marked effect on napthetic oil while giving them a much broader operating range (bar/chain temperature is part of this)

Stihl is virgin oil base - and the other have up to 10% junk because they don't use a dedicated line like stihl does. Not sure it make for a significantly better bar oil, but Stihl thinks it is...

If anyone is interested in a good paper on basic oil types, napthenic, parraffinc etc... etc..


http://www.pdhengineer.com/Course%20...0Additives.pdf

Other:

Stihl's choice of napthenic base seems be based on not requiring the inclusion of additives to reduce the pour point - just virgin napthenic Base and Paratec. They believe it works better across the temperature ranges of bar/chain needs, and that their winter grade is only required at temperatures less than 20F, if that's a valid data point in this discussion.

Whether Stihl bar oil works better than another brand or other base chemistry will always be debated , but the single point packager (distribution costs) and limited USA refiners definitely makes the oil more expensive to them, and to us. Obviously they think it's better than brand -x, but..

[sawguy21]

Interesting read. Thanks.

[sharp edge]

I would like to add here the way i take care of the bar, might make people think if nothing else. I use a belt sander (1'x2') to keep all sides square and makes it easy to see a bow. Hammer on the full side takes it out. Also sand off the slippery paint on the clamp end and put a .030 tapper on it so the blade can't back up. I thought the chain was getting longer, but was the bar backing up is why i did that. I haven't seen much differents in bar oil. The one i liked the best was diesel rated oil and a little power graphide ($3.00 a # at farm&fleet) mixed in. The diesel oil keeps the hole open
between the bar and saw, graphite once it gets on steel it stays there.
We have to be careful with are monies, there is a lot of "pie in the sky"sold all the time. If Stihl sells any i don't  know one way or the other.

[4woody]

i ues hydralikefluid i get it for free  an  i have found for milling the chain dnot gum up sometimes i might put a litle deisal in the oil

[oldsaw]

I primarily use Quaker State ($3.88 at Menard's), but have a few gallons of the old (better) Poulan oil in the tall jug, and some of the thinner Poulan oil in the short jug (cold days on the Aux oiler for milling), and have been buying some Husky oil at the local farm supply store, until they raised the price from $4.59 to $6.59.  Now I'll have to stick with the Quaker State.  Not too thin, not too thick, very sticky.  I've also got a couple of gallons of transmission fluid to get rid of, that may be my Aux Oil thinner someday.

Mark

[Corley5]

I've been using Poulan oil from Wal-Mart at $4.38 a gallon.  Works for me  ;D

[PB Logging]

This is a question that has raged around here for years.  It extends to all of our lubricants.  With 14 pieces of rolling stock plus non-highway equipment the difference of $1 per gallon of oil has impact.  So whats the value of a brand name.  To date, no one has satifactorily answered that question around here be it bar oil, 15w40, 10w40, hydraulic, 90 weight, etc. 

Such being the case we use the cheapest oils available and are religous about fluid changes and maintainence.  With a fuel budget approaching 6 figures annually we are not seeing a down side to our lubricant policy.  I love talking with the AMS oil guy - I enjoy the science.  However, the economics of the situation support our cheap lube policy.  Perhaps, I sound like I'm getting off track here but this policy follows thru to the bar oil we use.

Bulk (55 gallon drum) oil purchase is no longer the deal it used to be so we buy 5 gallon Shell's Rotella 15w40 buckets for about $9.50 / gallon.  Our bar oil (who's brand name escapes me) costs us about $3.5 /gallon.  I have found that the O'Reilley's auto parts store in this area is kicking ass on their pricing when compared to the theiviing 8!@#%^&* at NAPA (average of 40% less on wholesale parts).  I mention this because O'Reilley's has ordered in this bar oil for us too with great pricing.

This is a subject very near and dear to me.  I'm looking forward to lots more opinions and science to back them up.

[jokers]

Hi PB,

I assume that when you state that you use the cheapest lubes available that you mean that you use the cheapest lubes that meet the specs for the particular equipment that you are using, no? I agree with this mentality, I don`t buy John Deere oil or New Holland oil or whatever anymore than I would insist upon going to the dealer to buy an OEM oil filter(unless mandated by the warranty). I always buy an equivalent replacement though. I do buy OEM two stroke oil from Stihl, Husky, and Echo since these are excellent oils and not significantly more expensive than their Wally World counterparts. I also have used Mobil MX2T for my saws because it is an outstanding oil that has an added benefit of decarbonizing a dirty engine. Every so often I`ll run a  batch of MX2T mixed gas through my saws.

Not all bar oils are equals in my experience, but I am not saying that you have to buy OEM. Just find a good one and stick with it. A non-OEM that I`ve been pleased with is Itasca which is available in both summer and winter weight.

I buy my Rotella at Sam`s club or BJ`s for ~ $46/case of six which comes out to roughly $7.66/gallon right? I just did the math in my head so hopefully I`m close, sometimes my head lies to me.  :D

[floorboy]

I have found that a soy based oil from e.l.m. company seems to work exceptionally well. in the time I've been using it the paint hasn't even worn off the bar!
As far as the post on parafinic base as aposed to napthenic base oil there are some major differrences. The biggest draw back to a napthenic base is that it has the tendancy to dry out rubber seals. A large majority of the high end lubricants market uses a parafinic base or a synthetic base. The other major differrences come from the additives that are added or ommitted. In my opinion if you were to set down with an open mind and a sharp pencil you would see that the cheap oils you use in your equiptment are costing you more than you realize.  just my two cents.

[Corley5]

I've been using WoodsmanPro two cycle mix from Bailey's lately and after many gallons of gas through the saws they haven't blown up.  Guess it's good stuff  ;) ;D  I've got some Jonsered mix on the shelf with fuel stabilizer that I use if I'm not going to use the whole batch of mix right up.  It costs considerably more and is why I'm using the stuff from Bailey's.  We run Rotella in all the farm tractors and Cummins trucks.

[parrisw]

I use Canadian Tire bar and chain oil, summer & winter, seems to be  working well for me, it does stick to the bar and chain very well, the chain is always very oily after cutting, it has good adhesion to the bar and chain.  But I do believe in useing high quality oil for the gas mix.  I run Amsoil Sabre professional at about 45:1

[snowman]

Changed the hydrolic oil in my tractor last summer, 10 gallons.I filtered it through a tight screen and used it in my saw all summer. Good stuff, no problems and FREE!!!!

[PB Logging]

How about some input on snowman's hydraulic oil use?  I'm all for recycling and we utilize a great deal of hydraulic oil.

[jokers]

I was using hydraulic oil for winter grade b&c oil for awhile until I had it pointed out to me by a lubrication engineer that hydraulic oil isn`t very slippery, or atleast by his account not a very good lube under those conditions, it is formulated for other properties. To be honest I`ve forgotten all of the particulars that he cited but I do know that once I stopped using the hydraulic oil the problems I was having with bar tips on laminated bars mostly went away. Coincidence? Could be, I don`t know.

[timberjack240]

i can tell a difference between husky oil and used motor oil the one 288 we have revs up faster with used m o  husky oil seems to make it hesistate a little nothin that slows production just a little noticable. i personally liek usin motor oil that way whille im sawin i can water proof my boots at the same time  ;D  :D

[arojay]

For cold weather I use my "waste" TGH oil and mix in some Husqvarna summer oil(30 WT).  I mix it with one of those paint mixers that are powered with electric drill.  Usually about one liter of bar oil to say 10 liters of TGH.  I use ESSO Hydraul 50 for the transmission/hydraulics and winch on my JD skidder and dozer.  Draining on recommended intervals gives me enough for the cold days of winter.  This seems to work for me from about -5 to -10 down to about -35 C. Then I stay home.

[mike39chef]

I have to agree with >parrisw<  i use the crappy tire oil for the bar and chain, but never for the 50:1 mix.  I use dealer oil exclusivly, plus the Husky oil has a stabilizer in it, great for my winter conditions in the great white north.