It was a late start this year

[Kingcha]

The last of our snow was gone on May 7th I think.  After getting a few projects out of the  way and a poker trip I finally got sawing.   I am selecting my biggest Red Pines to cut down for future flooring in my next house.  Unfortunately my trees are not all that big and have to settle for anything 14" and bigger at the base.  I hope to air dry them until the end of August then I will throw them In the solar kiln.

My biggest mistake this year was letting myself get so Fat and Out of shape this winter.  ;D and I am paying for it now.   I have a busy summer planned but I think the Mill should whip me into shape by the end of summer.   :( 

I had a bunch of Questions but did not write them down.   I need to have that pad of paper & pencil by the mill.

I hope to get a permanent air dry/ wood storage unit up before the snow returns.   My present air drying area is a metal pole structure with a tarp that has to come down each November.

Matt

[red oaks lumber]

are your pines in a plantation? if so,the lumber will most likely want to cup,twist, and bow.plantation wood just dosent behave very well.especially red pine

[Chuck White]

are your pines in a plantation? if so,the lumber will most likely want to cup,twist, and bow.plantation wood just dosent behave very well.especially red pine

Hmmm!  I didn't know that!

Good info!

[LaneC]

I did not know that about the plantation pines. What makes them react differently than not being plantation pine? That is scary. How much worse do they react? Is there anything you can do to counteract the bad behavior of the trees?

[WDH]

Plantation pines generally grow faster than natural pines.  Faster growth creates more stress.  Also, faster growth makes the juvenile core bigger proportional to the total diameter of the tree.  The juvenile core has wood that misbehaves very badly.  Again, plantation pines, because they grow bigger, faster, are usually harvested at a younger age than natural pine.  Younger means that more of the wood is in the juvenile core and there is less mature wood in the tree to offset the effects of the juvenile wood.

Juvenile wood, because of the orientation of the cellulose and the type of cellulose in the cell walls, will shrink just a bit longitudinally.  Mature wood on the outside of the juvenile core will not.  This creates bow, twist, and warp when the board has a high proportion of juvenile wood.   

[thecfarm]

I have some red pine here. pinus resinosa It is just a little ways from the sawmill. Close enough for me to cut and carry it to the mill. I used it for 4 posts,8x8 for the women Cave. I say only 4,because they started to twist on me. I went back to hemlock.This is not plantation trees,thses are old trees grown in a forest. My Father and me did thin out some fir back in "93. I was not impressed by it. But you may have very good luck with it.

[Kingcha]

They are planted in a small 2 acre patch.   Because of the soil I would say they are slow growing.   So far of the ones that have dried I get more cupping then twisting.   Though not to bad on the cupping.   I will just hope that the ones I am cutting will dry fairly flat.    I almost cut them thicker so I would have more to plane them flat but I went will 1" thick.     

I am watching them as I cut them and I am not seeing much movement, they are laying flat as I finish the cut.   I have seen some that want to jump up in the past.   Not sure how much that has to do with them as they dry.   

Any secrets to deal with the cupping, more weight on them when stickering.   Should I just let them air dry and not put them in the solar kiln???   

Thanks
Matt

ps we are guessing that they are at 50+ years

[WDH]

Just try and cut the boards with the pith centered.  As you cut off the four slab sides, try to keep the pith in the center as much as is practical.  If there is an even amount of wood on each side of the pith in a board (growth ring wise), then the board will be more stable.  Not always possible to do this, especially if there is sweep in the log.

By balancing out the amount of wood on each side of the pith, you balance out the bad stuff that happens in the juvenile wood.  If the juvenile wood is all to one side, it is Katy-Bar-The-Door-Side-Bend-City.  Your boards will end up like this:

"C"

[47sawdust]

I cut about 3000bf. of plantation pine about 3 years ago.I was not very happy with the the lumber that I produced.It looked good coming off the saw,but after drying under cover it twisted.

[Kingcha]

Thanks WDH I will work on that.

The wife says the trees are from at least the late 40's making them 65+ years old.

Matt

[Dad2FourWI]

Kingcha,

Please let us know how this turned out....

I was planning on using 60+ yrs plantation Redpines as well for all the walls!!! If they do not "behave well" then I will have to come up with a backup plan!!!!

Thanks,
-Dad2FourWI

[barbender]

It can depend on the stock the pines came from, too. Some tend to have a spiral grain longitudinally. WDH is giving good advice- try to keep things centered to the pith. Red pine won't make very good flooring, at least not by normal standards. It is pretty soft compared to most wood that is typically used for flooring. If you wanted a "distressed" looking floor and don't mind dents and marks it might work fine, but it would probably work better for T&G paneling, or 2x4 and 2x6 material.

[Dad2FourWI]

OK, that makes sense.

I milled a whack of Red Pines that had been attacked by bark beetles for my chicken coop and they behaved very well. They were 3"x6" so they were quite "beefy"...


 

The ones I am looking to use for the walls will _not_ be "dead-standing" and will need to spend some time drying.... but I really hope they do not cause any troubles! Yes, T&G is what we are shooting for.

Keep us posted...

Thanks,
-Dad2FourWI

[red oaks lumber]

our climate here produces anything but fast growth i think just growing in tight quaters it creates alot of stress. i've bought 4th thinning pine 18" 24" dbh. still cupped twisted and bowed so, size dosent seem to cure the problems. yet take native stand red pine, its real nice to work with.

[LaneC]

Does the cupping and twisting happen also in timber? Would say 6x6 or 8x8 beams twist and cup much also or is it mainly in boards? Also the species I am talking about is loblolly.

[Magicman]

It's possible to have a "bad actor" occasionally, but as a general rule, SYP is very stable and dries nicely.  Out of the hundred or so logs that we sawed for dablack during the Goodwill Sawing project, I remember only one log that showed signs of stress and had to be flipped 180°.

Proper sawing technique is also very important with any species.