newby needs advice...Lumbermte 2000 vs. Lumbermate Pro MX34...

[sdoucet]

Hi y'all...I'm new to the forum and hoping for some wise advice before buying a new (or used) mill...
From my research so far, i think the norwood lumbermate will be a good mill for my needs...having
a hard timefinding a used LM2000 in my area so far and the new model seems a bit pricy...though
I do like some of the new features on this mill..

I'm guessing few have had a chance to try the new mill yet...so probably hard to give reviews...
maybe I should wait a while till some have actually had time cutting with one...
but any opinions on the pros/cons of the new design...what do you think about mechanical clutch
vs. a centrifugal clutch?ceramic blade guides?..."quick click" idexing setworks..
here's their marketing video... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pF_nSQkNo7Q

I'd really appreciate any advice from the more experienced sawyers..
cheers,
steve

[fishpharmer]

I can only offer a welcome to Forestry Forum sdoucet.  You have come to the right place for answers.  There are several members with Norwood mills.  They seem well engineered.  I don't think you would go wrong with either mill.  It really depends upon your  goals.

[Magicman]

First, Welcome to The Forestry Forum.  I noticed a good buy in the "For Sale" forum below.

[Fred]

Neat mill

[customsawyer]

Welcome to the forum. I don't think you will go wrong with that mill. I don't have any feed back for you as I have never seen one in person. You might want to give us some idea as to what your needs are and where you are located so we can help more.

[sdoucet]

thanks, guys...I'm on the west coast of canada and will be milling for myself, but plan on milling
for others on  their sites in the future.I've got mostly western red cedar and douglas fir here and
am planning on milling all the lumber to build 1400' of panel fencing, a goat barn, a woodworking shop,
deck for the almost finished house, and probably a few dozen other projects over the years...

[ahlkey]

I have owned the Lumbermate 2000 with the trailer package, 23HP Briggs engine, and toe package for a couple of years now.  Overall, I have been very happy.  The only thing you need to keep in mind is that everything is manual and that can be HUGE burden.  I am fortunate to have extra equipment to help in log loading but if you are loading everything by hand it can take it's toll on your body.  While I have done over 1,000 board feet in a long day you cannot consistently come anywhere close to that when working alone over an extended period.  That makes it pretty difficult to do high volume for others if that is part of your plan?  The mill can do more but the body gets tired with a manual mill.  Likewise, asking for the customer to help out has it own set of problematic issues.    

As far as the MX34 at 35% or so more than the LM2000 I find it hard to justify all the improvements.   It is probably a good mill though as Norwood is a first class organization with excellent warranty & service.   For me if I could find a good used model for even 25% off the original price you would be getting a solid model over 60% less than the MX34.  Likewise, the LM2000 is a proven model with all the bugs worked out.   Making things more complex is often the way products evolve over time but that doesn't mean they are better.  If you can keep it simple (hard to do) it is usually a winner for many years.  The LM2000 is simple, solid, and just gets the job done.  I doubt you will find too many LM2000 customers that feel differently other than the manual effort part.   However, if you go that route and after time you want to upgrade to an automatic mill the Norwood Mill does have good resale value.  My suggestion is to find a used Norwood LM 2000 if you can.   Good Luck.

[Apple farmer]

Just a few thougths from another newbee here. I visited the Norwegian sales rep (Logosol Norway) a couple of weeks ago. Their demo unit at that time was the good old LM 2000, and I tried a couple of cuts with it. Before I tried it, I was more or less convinced I needed the  electrical unit driving the mill back and forward they were offering as an extra, but it was surprisingly easy to push the mill. It felt like the blade worked itself through the timber;-) I ended up ordering the new model LM Pro MX34, called Logosol Lumbermate Pro here in Norway (and Sweden). I intend to use it stationary, and ordered it with their twin electric engine package (E-Twin 12 kW). My plan is to build a ramp for the timber and a small shed for the sawmill. 98% of the timber on my property is pine, I think it´s called Scots Pine in the US/Canada. I plan to saw for others as well, but since I have a dairy farm I´m in constant need for 2x4, 2x6, 1x6 etc. Lots of interesting info and folks  ;) at the Forestry Forum. My sawmill is scheduled for delivery in july/august...

rgds, Knut aka Apple farmer

[fishpharmer]

Apple farmer, welcome to the forestry forum.  Good info on the Lumbermate mills.  I am curious how they configure two electric motors on the mill.  Do both motors drive the blade at the same time?

Do you have a link showing such configuration?

Also, I read your profile.  Apple computer employee turned dairy farmer is quite a transition. 

Glad to have you.

[Hilltop366]

Hi Steve and Apple farmer an welcome,

I stopped and visited a guy with a 2000 a while back and he made me push his mill through a log just to see how easy it was and Apple farmer is right about little effort to saw, it might even be eaiser to saw than returning back for next cut. However with a manual mill cutting is not where you spend most of your time and energy (lots of foot steps), it is with loading, leveling, clamping, turning, reclamping, off loading etc. you get to rest while you push the mill. Just so you know.

With a name like Doucet you could be from the east coast,  if not I'm betting if you go back far enough there are relatives here.

Cheers

[Jeff]

I've sawed on Chet's 2000 and flat out enjoyed it. 

[Ironwood]

I REALLY like my LM2000, bought used from a guy here in the forum. I would REALLY scutinize the new one, the old one was GREAT. and like someone said finding a used one would be an excellent value.

Ironwood 

[sdoucet]

thanks everyone for the input...

ahlkey and I are thinking along the same lines..my plan is to try and find a used LM2000 before mid
august, as I won't have time to use it or money to buy it until then...I have a refundable deposit
on  the MX34 just in case I don't find a used one...but I'm pretty sure I'll find one..a couple have
come up but guys seem to be asking a lot...one for $7000 bare bones set up, which is more than they
were new(when they were avail.) and another for $13000 with everything but the kitchen sink, including
a $1500 bander which i don't want or even know what it is for that matter (I'm guessing it's for banding
stacks of lumber together, not anything to do with pressing blades?)

Thanks for the warning about how much work a manual mill is compared to a hydraulic...I've used
a little Jonsered mill years ago when I was building my house and milled some pretty big fir logs on my neighbours chainsaw mill to get a taste for it...but to me since don't have any equipment the hardest work has always been getting the logs to the mill...I've loaded quite a few fairly big 15' logs into the back of my truck by hand and am done abusing my back...I plan on getting a Logrite arch for transporting heavier logs and maybe even building a cherry picker for my pickup truck to load logs that are quite far
from the mill.

One more question...anyone used the log loading/rolling hand winch that Norwood sells?I was planning
on getting one of these for rolling heavy logs onto the mill and turning big cants on the mill...

I'm pretty keen to get milling in the fall...I'm still in my younger years and don't mind hard work,
so I think I've got a quite a few years left in me before I need to retire to a hydraulic setup(just
to give the older, I mean wiser ones a chuckle...)

and yes, I was born in the east... Quebec, a lot of my family still lives there...
pure acadian blooded grand parents from Cape Breton.

[Ironwood]

I bought my mill (LM2000) from a FF member a few years back, 23 HP Briggs, hour meter, axles set (trailer kit w/ lights), two extensions (21' milling), winch, w/ blade grinder. Only 200 hours. I have had a number of mills here, LT15, Norwood, LT70SH, Timber Harvester, Hudson Oscar 52 and I bought the NW because it best suited my use. I do mostly flitch edge stuff , and dont like my cambium damaged w/ an automated turner. While it is more labor, there are ways to set things up to make it easier. I have forklifts here, and if you didnt have a forklift a saw shed w/ a little trolly and hoist above would be (an will be here in time) the cats meow. You could even use a jib style crane on an end column (or both) w/ tongs would be REALLY handy and a labor saver.

I dont like the looks of the steel on the new NW deck cross members. I have not seen one in person, but like I said I would scrutinize the new design.

Ironwood

[Ironwood]

Looked at the video, I like the head, but not the deck. The vertical bunks look flimsy to me, like 1/8th thickness? Also, I dislke the cam style log dogs. One of the things I REALLY liike about my LM is the dogs. The continous threads make dogging the log very nice. My experience w/ other "cam" dogs is I run out of adjustment (tightening ability) before the cam bottoms. This is especially true on odd set ups (I do alot of these) curved, bent, twisted logs.

Looks like they fixed the #$%^ throttle cable this time  : I just put a REAL cable on mine, I used a vernier cable from Buyers Equipment catalog, it is a locking one, so I can just push the pin and set my throttle. and focus on milling as I often have to move around the mill abit to see what I am doing (I mill really crazy logs often). The cable was able to be mounted in one of the pre-exsisting holes in the gusset flange on the head, so no drilling and ony one screw to change it out.

Ironwood

[treenail]

I have the Norwood log loading winch and ramps for my LM2000. As I work mostly alone, then from the safety standpoint, they are very valuable. I bought my mill nine years ago, and have milled some pretty hefty logs with it, that would have required at least another person to help roll the logs and cants, but with the loader, they can be done alone. It is a great addition to the mill.

[ahlkey]

I did not buy the log loader as I received a winch with my trailer towing package so I made up my own design for less than $50 dollars. The factory price with shipping would of cost me $785.  I also purchased heavy duty RV stablizers all around for around $100 dollars instead of the leveling feet support legs (factory price would of been another $650).   The only one feature that I would recommend you have on this mill is the toe board package for leveling logs with high taper and horizontally positioning.

[den]

I think they have priced themselves out of the market. So far they only sold 2 in PA.
I'm not 100% sure, none in DE. MD. WV.

[Planman1954]

I use the norwood log loader with a winch too. It would have been a better design if the log loader pieces could be designed to rest on the bed without having to remove them every time. They do get heavier as the day goes on. Seems as though they could rest on the bed some way to let the mill pass by. Anyway, my two cents worth.

[paul case]

my ez boardwak's manual winch turner is hinged at the bottom with a pin type catcher that hooks on the track to keep it upright. it lays down when not in use. i looked but couldnt find any pictres of the design but it does work real well.
a turner of some kind is priceless. whether you build it or buy it  you will need it. on logs that are 10' and 14'' i can easily turn them with a cant hook but on 20''x16' logs you need something. i have turned some real big uns with mine. 34''  pc

[Jeff]

I think they have priced themselves out of the market. So far they only sold 2 in PA.
I'm not 100% sure, none in DE. MD. WV.

Now how would you know any of this?

[gizmodust]

I have a LM2000 with a 15 hp Kohler that I bought new 4 yrs. ago.  I got the base unit and made my own extensions and trailer package for it.  One thing about a manual mill is that it  makes you think before you head into a log.  How many turns will it take, what is the best cuts.  I think I like the idea of feeling the blade in the wood.  You can tell if the speed is right or not.  Sometimes it's a good thing.  Have to admit that toe boards and turner would make it nice.  I have cut some monsters and have stopped people in their tracks when I cut at shows.  The biggest one was 34" x 22.5' .  That took a 950 Case to handle ;D ;D.  Welcome to the forum and try not to get the house too dusty  

[Apple farmer]

Apple farmer, welcome to the forestry forum.  Good info on the Lumbermate mills.  I am curious how they configure two electric motors on the mill.  Do both motors drive the blade at the same time?

Do you have a link showing such configuration?

Thanks for the friendly welcome. Yes, both motors drive the blade. When you push the start button the first motor starts, and then there are some sort of automatic delay and the second motor starts a second or two later, this is called E-twin by Logosol. I haven´t been able to find any video on YouTube where you can actually see it. The mill used for the video demonstrating the LM410 Log Moulder is configured this way, but it isn´t easy to see. The written description is on both the Norwegian and Swedish Logosol-sites, but I guess most of you are not very familiar with the Nordic languages :(  I will try to post som pics when I get the mill later this summer.

BTW: there are also a Canadian company called Eastquip offering electric motors on the LumberMate mills. You can find a video on YouTube if you search for "Quiet Runner", but they have separate start/stop buttons for the two motors.

rgds, Knut aka Apple farmer

[den]

Jeff  Jeff  Jeff

The old fashion way...call, or the modern way...Email  ;D

The known, two in PA.
The gray area, 4 hrs. radius would cover most of DE. and MD. better then half of WV. and VA.
I guess someone from each state could call and get a list from their state if their interested.

I tell my wife, I hate it when she questions me, she says get use to it.  :D
--------------------------------------------------------------------

On: Jun 06/01/10 9:11 AM
Hi xxxx
I have checked and there is non within your area.
Sorry about that.

If you have any questions please do not hesitate to contact me.

Best Regards,
xxxx
Norwood Industries Inc.
Canada: 1660 Hwy 11 North, Kilworthy, ON  Canada P0E 1G0
U.S.A.:    252 Sonwil Drive, Buffalo, NY. USA 14225

Tel: (705) 689-2800
Fax (705) 689-1982

Website: www.norwoodindustries.com

------------------------------------------------------

On 5/31/2010 10:13 PM,xxxx wrote:

I'm assuming your checking the radius area of 17225, because I'm 15 minutes from MD. and 30 minutes from WV.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi xxxx
Since the LumberMate Pro MX34 is new to the market I only have two in the state of PA so far that have received delivery of them.
One is in Marshalls Creek, PA almost 3 hours from you and the other is in Lewis Run, PA which is about 4 hours from you.  If either of these are of interest let me know & I will contact the owner to see if I can give their contact information to you.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would like to see one of your bandmills.
Are there any MX34 owners near me, Greencastle, PA. 17225

[fishpharmer]

Apple farmer, are you speaking of this video?  For a quiet runner its surprisingly loud.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOp9iv2plKY

[Apple farmer]

Apple farmer, are you speaking of this video?  For a quiet runner its surprisingly loud.

Yes, this is the Canadian conversion with separate buttons to start the two engines, but as I said the Logosol-conversion sold in Norway and Sweden has only one button. The sound is mainly from the blade I suppose, not much noise from one or two electrical engines ;)

rgds, Knut aka Apple farmer

[Mike@Norwood]

Hello guys



If I may chime in, we have our tradeshow LumberMate Pro MX34 stored in our Buffalo warehouse right now if you would like to stop by and have a look.  We also have both the LumberMate Pro MX34 and LumberLite ML26 mills on display in our showroom in our Ontario facility and the LumberMate Pro is on display at Norwood's Alberta and New Brunswick dealers.  You'll also find us at many tradeshows this season.  Please feel free to stop by and pay us a visit. 



In response Den, while we have many sawmills in the field, not everyone authorizes us to disclose their contact information.  We take our customers' privacy very seriously; if our customers don't want to be contacted, we will not even disclose their existence.  Each day we have more and more mills reaching the hands of our customers, and more customers who give us permission to give out their name and number to others.  Give us a call to see if an owner near you has signed up for our referral program.



For those who haven't seen the new MX34 Pro in person, I must say I think you'll be thoroughly impressed. It's a challenge to capture the size difference of the new LumberMate MX34 compared to the LumberMate 2000.  You truly have to see it in person to get a full appreciation.



Although the LumberMate Pro MX34 and LumberLite ML26 have new patented features and larger capacity, both were based on the same premise as the LumberMate 2000 – user-friendly, rugged and dependable. 



Thank you for your support



Have a great day,

Mike@Norwood

[Walnutclyde]

thanks everyone for the input...

ahlkey and I are thinking along the same lines..my plan is to try and find a used LM2000 before mid
august, as I won't have time to use it or money to buy it until then...I have a refundable deposit
on  the MX34 just in case I don't find a used one...but I'm pretty sure I'll find one..a couple have
come up but guys seem to be asking a lot...one for $7000 bare bones set up, which is more than they
were new(when they were avail.)


My husband's LM2000 was bought in 2006.  It didn't cost under 7000.00 new.  Of course it has the trailer pkg and  other extras.   I have the invoice right here in front of me.  You must consider the shipping also.  Some might get excited about putting one together, but  I will never forget the arrival of the crates!  I felt a lot overwhelmed.  My husband did enjoy putting it together.  I might run across all the pics taken of it being put togther. 

[Ironwood]

Nearly ALL the noise is the blade guides, they are supposed to be noisy.

Ironwood

[ohsoloco]

I don't know anything about the new Lumbermate, but I LOVE my LM2000.  Contrary to what a couple other people have said, I wouldn't recommend the log roller/toe boards.  They just aren't beefy enough (not sure if they've been changed or not, I bought mine back in 2001).  The logs that are big enough to warrant using the rollers are too heavy to allow you to raise them.  I bent the bar/handle used to raise them, and finally broke one of the bolts. 

They're lying on the ground near the mill site if anyone's interested...