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Bar not wearing even

Started by Red Good, December 11, 2015, 10:48:11 AM

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Red Good

Bar is cutting on an angle when in bigger wood , nowhere near as noticeable when just small stuff . Took it apart and the bar looks like uneven so ran it on my band sander till both sides are equal . anyone else have this problem ? Not sure what caused it , maybe ran without oil ? Used saw to me . Will be checking  how straight i got it tomorrow just wondering what you guys do when this happens ?
Stihl 211C saw
Massey 135 deisel tractor with a front loader
Can Am 800 max quad
2001 Chev S10 pick me up
Home made log arch

DeerMeadowFarm

One side of the chain is sharper than the other or the angles are not the same one side to another. It causes the chain to lay over more on one side and wear the bar uneven. Don't ask me how I learned this....  stupid_smiley

Texas-Jim

Deer its not just sharpness that does that even though it can. Thats one draw back of sharpening. Doesnt matter if its by hand or machine, bot sides have to match. If you hit one side 5 strokes and other 3 it will start drifting even if both sides are sharp. Iv see people with machines set it and do one side, when they flip to other side they reset it, never reset it. If you look at a cutting tooth they angle down away from the cutting surface, as we sharpen them they get basicly shorter. Thats why we have to file the rakers as the chain wears away. So it you cut more from one side the cutter is shorter plus the raker is stopping the cutter from getting a good bite so one side bites and other kinda skips across the wood.

Take your chain and have it done on a machine and it will be exact, doing one by hand is every bit as good but it takes a lot of practice and skill.
What we do in life echoes through eternity.

HolmenTree

Regularly flipping your bar over helps keep wear on the rails even.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

leeroyjd

A few years ago I saw two brand new bars that had thickness differences in the rails. Can not recall brands, but something to keep in mind.

John Mc

With the right kind of depth gauge measuring tool, it becomes much less critical to have all the teeth the same length, so the idea of counting strokes or measuring teeth doesn't make as much difference. I just eyeball the length of my cutters to keep them in the ballpark, but even if they are different enough to be clearly visible, I have no problem with my chain trying to cut on a curve.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Red Good

New Stihl chain  and cleaned up the bar like I said and it is not as bad but still doing it . Was way worse with my old chain but still not right . Bar has been over heated on the edges at some point , guess new bar is in order too . Thanks for the ideas guys .
Stihl 211C saw
Massey 135 deisel tractor with a front loader
Can Am 800 max quad
2001 Chev S10 pick me up
Home made log arch

John Mc

Have you also deburred the edges of your bar?

If the groove is worn significantly wider, that can also allow the chain to "lay over" a bit.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Red Good

Yep deburred it but never thought about  the width . Will check that as well . Thanks Red
Stihl 211C saw
Massey 135 deisel tractor with a front loader
Can Am 800 max quad
2001 Chev S10 pick me up
Home made log arch

John Mc

A dime should just fit in an .050" bar slot, a Penny in an .058", and a quarter in an .063" bar.

Another check is to put a straight-edge along the side of the bar running from top to bottom. If you catch a tooth on both the top and bottom, and can push the teeth sideways enough that the straight-edge will hit the side of the bar, either your groove is worn too far, or your bar's rails are sprung.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

HolmenTree

Or to be precise, put a 2 ft carpenter square on your bar. If you see day light on top of one of the rails you'll know their not even :D
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

grassfed

I have to agree with John Mc that the teeth do not have to be the same length for the saw to cut straight. I have had Chains that have hit rocks and lost the corner on one side and I have to file that side much shorter than the other; the saw cut fine.

I sharpen each tooth and keep the rakers set to the length of each tooth and the saw cuts well.

I am not going to waste time and energy cutting with a dull chain but I am not going to waste time and money filing down teeth that I don't need to file just so things are the same length.

I know I have read plenty of times that the teeth need to be equal but I have not found this to be much of a benefit and I get more wood cut at the end of the day not worrying about this.
Mike

HolmenTree

I agree a chain with different cutter lengths all over the place and even one side evenly longer then the other side will cut straight,  if.......all cutting edges are sharp and the bar rails are not excessively spread beyond spec.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

woodsdog2015

Very helpful responses to me John Mc, Grassfed, HolmenTree I tend to be pretty OC about things like this and I was fretten' until I read all your responses.
I'd rather be in the woods.
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Grandedog

     Howdy,
   I've always told people to stand their bar on edge on a hard metal surface like a table saw. If it just falls over, your rails are in really bad shape. The bar should be able to stand, and if it's in good shape, you should be able to slide a square up to it. If it's leaning one way or the other, it should be ground back to square. Unless it's a defective bar, chain maintenance is the leading cause to uneven wear.
Regards
Gregg
Gregg Grande
Left Coast Supplies LLC
1615B South Main Street  Willits, CA 95490
888-995-7307  Ph 707-602-0141                   Fax 707-602-0134  Cell 707-354-3212
E-Mail  gregg@leftcoastsupplies.com   www.leftcoastsupplies.com

John Mc

Quote from: Grandedog on December 18, 2015, 02:00:20 PM
Unless it's a defective bar, chain maintenance is the leading cause to uneven wear.

I'd have to agree, though I've also seen a bar start wearing unevenly after it got pinched when a tree settled back on it. (Maybe that falls in the defective bar category, though in this case it's really more of a "defective operator" or maybe it falls in the "Shtuff happens" category?)  Poor lubrication can also cause funky bar wear.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

CTYank

Quote from: HolmenTree on December 16, 2015, 05:37:24 PM
I agree a chain with different cutter lengths all over the place and even one side evenly longer then the other side will cut straight,  if.......all cutting edges are sharp and the bar rails are not excessively spread beyond spec.

Exactly what I've found to be true. Some folks obsess with micrometer measuring cutter lengths. Silly waste of time that could be better spent making a beer-run.

Dulled cutters on one side, the sort of thing rocks can inflict, will get you a circle-cutter. You might not even see the difference, but should be able to feel it. (What thumbs are for?)

Keep pushing things, dogging in, with sub-par cutters on one side, and the bar will get (un)-even with you.

Basic Harbor Freight precision squares work great for checking rail heights. Then a bench grinder with tool rest set so workpiece is pointed at wheel-center can even the rails quickly and leave oil-retention scratches. It's worked for friends' bars many times.
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Tanaka 260 PF Polesaw, TBC-270PFD, ECS-3351B
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Red Good

Well ground the edges flat and square again and set the new chain in the groove and it lays way over to either side .solved it by getting a new bar to go with my new chain . Will play with it some more when I get a minute see if i can tighten the groove up . Thanks for all the suggestions and ideas guys . Have a veryMerry Christmas and a HappyNew Year .
Stihl 211C saw
Massey 135 deisel tractor with a front loader
Can Am 800 max quad
2001 Chev S10 pick me up
Home made log arch

John Mc

It sounds as though the bar groove is worn or the rails are sprung. If it's the latter, there are bar rail closers you can get. If the groove is only lightly worn, the closer might still work, but they don;t work all that well of the bar is heavily worn.

I've seen someone do a great job of truing up bar rails with a hammer, but I've never even tried it - I figured with my luck I'd just make things worse.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

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