why does my wood look like this!

monte · December 27, 2005, 08:34:42 PM

hey guys just looking for input!

My first cut with my new mill makes me wonder if i did something wrong, i'm no pro but should my wood look like this? ???( cut a dry 4x4 spruce )

More blade tension?faster rpm?pushing to fast? or is this normal! Its of coarse a new blade.

Picture quality is not the best. of coarse

Dan_Shade · December 27, 2005, 08:37:20 PM

is it wavy?

from the pic it looks like the band has a tooth with the set off a little bit

monte · December 27, 2005, 08:39:17 PM

Quote from: Dan_Shade on December 27, 2005, 08:37:20 PM
is it wavy?

from the pic it looks like the band has a tooth with the set off a little bit

I agree but its a new blade from the box? :-[ would this happen if I was feeding the head too fast?

ronwood · December 27, 2005, 08:48:06 PM

monte,

I would agree with Dan_Shade. The tooth near the weld may be out of set slightly.

Ron

Dan_Shade · December 27, 2005, 08:51:28 PM

you sure you didn't saw into a backstop? i find new bands the best to do that ;D (i've had boards like that after hitting metal)

Radar67 · December 27, 2005, 09:22:01 PM

Quote from: monte on December 27, 2005, 08:39:17 PM
would this happen if I was feeding the head too fast?

I tend to agree with Dan and Ron. Just how fast was you feeding the blade though?

Stew

monte · December 27, 2005, 09:25:30 PM

just a little slower then walking speed. the engine was not forcing thats for sure!

Radar67 · December 27, 2005, 09:33:02 PM

Walking Speed? That avereages about 3 MPH, which is 264 feet per minute, at a 1 MPH pace, that's 88 feet per minute, seems a little fast either way for a saw. :D :D

Stew

Bibbyman · December 27, 2005, 09:49:48 PM

What kind of blade guides do you have on your mill? Besides a tooth or two out of set, it could be the blade is kind of fluttering if the rollers and blade guides are not adjusted right.

More input... It's possible to get a new blade out of the box and have some teeth out of set. Could have been knocked out in handling, in shipment or when you put it on the mill. It don't take much.

monte · December 27, 2005, 10:14:41 PM

Well just to give you guys a update! I changed the blade and again the same thing!
I have a norwood and as far as I know i cant adjust the bearings as far as I know! :-\

treenail · December 27, 2005, 10:42:30 PM

Have a Norwood 2000 and my guess would be that a tooth is set too far out degree wise. Also, check to make sure that the adjustable blade guide arm is set close to the wood being cut and that the T handle is tightened well. Are your logs partially frozen?

monte · December 27, 2005, 11:26:08 PM

Quote from: treenail on December 27, 2005, 10:42:30 PM
Are your logs partially frozen?

No there not, it was a dry piece of 4x4 that I had in the garage.

Brad_S. · December 28, 2005, 12:27:42 AM

My two cents.

Quoteor is this normal!

No, you should be able to cut very smooth boards.

I'm in the 'bad set' camp. Re-sawing dry wood seems to magnify irregularities. I don't think it's a feed speed problem, that would push the blade back on the guides and cause dipping and rising. You'd have a wavy board, but your photo shows a straight but rough board. If you have setting equipment, check each tooth and see if the set is the same all around the band. The width of the ridge on your board would seem to indicate that several teeth in a row are out of set, not just one here or there. Dan's right, that's the pattern a blade that has struck something often leaves.

What brand of blades are you using? For example, I use Simonds and find that they are not too good right out of the box. After a reset and sharpening are when they cut their smoothest and best.

As the blade runs, is it running straight or is it pulsing back and forth against the guides? Do the wheels look like they're spinning true or do they look to be out of round? Is the running blade making a fairly constant noise or is it 'chugging'?

Re-sawing dry wood is different than sawing green. You usually use a different (less) set, slower feed speed and some use a different grind angle. Try sawing some green wood and see what happens. I think you'll still see a rough board, but not as rough.

The engine won't always bog down (especially in soft woods) before you exceed effective feed speed. Watch the sawdust as it leaves the cut. It should shoot out in a straight line into the chute opening. If it wavers up and down, that indicates your blade is doing the same.

Kirk_Allen · December 28, 2005, 12:34:57 AM

Getting the same result with a different blade would cause me to look closer at my guides and there adjustement.

The apperence is tooth set issues but with a totally different blade giving the same result I tends to point you to another problem.

Ronwood,
I have to ask:
"The tooth near the weld may be out of set slightly"

What in the world would make you think its a specific area of a blade that has the problem? ???

Brad_S. · December 28, 2005, 12:45:19 AM

Kirk,

There is merit to Ronwood's statement. I notice that too on my Simonds. I don't have an explanation why, but the teeth near the weld are often out of set, if only by a few thousandths. My best guess is it's from the clamping during the welding process.

Brucer · December 28, 2005, 01:54:14 AM

Every once in a while I've seen a WM blade with a tooth slightly off, straight out of the box. Nowhere near as bad as that, however.

Other things to check ...
Blade tension too low.
Outboard blade guide too far from the wood.
Sawing too slow (yep, I've scored wood like that when I was being too cautious.

Bibbyman · December 28, 2005, 03:48:07 AM

Another thing to check - the main belt tension.

You said something about the engine "not forcing" - if you meant that the engine didn't appear to have a load on it then it well could be the main belt is slipping and you're loosing blade speed. Main belt slipping is one of those things that is really hard to detect until it get so bad it's obvious.

Mr Mom · December 28, 2005, 06:54:46 AM

You guys are good ;) ;) ;). I dont owen a mill yet and now i know what to look for.

Thanks Mr Mom

monte · December 28, 2005, 08:09:39 AM

Your right there bibbyman! thats what I'm thinking I'm not sure how much tension to put on the belt? the other thing mentioned is that when I start the saw it is not smooth sounding ,there is a chugging noise! the other thing, my roller guide does not extend close to the piece of 4x4 its still about 8 or 10 inchs away! :-\

Bibbyman · December 28, 2005, 08:24:58 AM

The chugging noise ...

I'm not familiar with the Norwood design. Does it have solid wheels or does it run with a belt in a V-groove?

If it uses a v-belt for a tire, look for bark or something in the v-groove.

If it's some kind of solid wheel or wheel with a solid rubber tread, look for some place wher it's damage and missing.

I've even had gunk make a bump on my drive wheel pulley. Any of these will make a chugging sound.

broker farmer · December 28, 2005, 08:31:08 AM

Monte, I tend to agree with Bibbyman. I think your belt isn't tight enough. This is causing the band to vary in speed as it crosses the wood. On my mill I adjust the belt so that it has approximately 1 inch of deflection in it when properly adjusted for tension. You may have to slide the motor over a little more to increase the tension. Are you using a torque wrench to tighten the band? I like to use 35-38 ft. pounds of torque on my mill. There also seems to be something wrong with your inablility to move the blade guide in. 8-10 inches away is too far out.

ronwood · December 28, 2005, 09:29:22 AM

Kirk,

I had an issues one time with a new blade that I got from Woodmizer that gave me a cut similuar to Monte. Called and talked to one of the techs and they thought the problem was most likely with one of the teeth near the weld. Changed the blade problem was solved. Not sure that that us Monte problem.

Ron

ely · December 28, 2005, 04:24:37 PM

i aggree with the teeth at the weld joint being bad at times, not sure it sthe problem here. i would saw a bunch of logs green and dry and see if it changed any even different types of wood. i have found my bands get better with use at times when they are new from the box.

ps. if you are sawing a 4x4 on a norwood the outside roller guide will not be next to the log. mine only goes down to about 10 or 9 inches. never measuered it though. i run my tension in the middle of min. and max. on a new blade to start out with. then vary it from there with use.

logwalker · December 28, 2005, 06:56:28 PM

Try a third and even fourth blade. It looks like a big set problem to me. There is no guarantee the whole batch isn't set too much. Now if the belt was slipping you wouldn't be able to fly through at the speed you are. How much sawdust is left in the cut? With too much set there is likely a lot left. Keep us posted. Nothing more intriguing than blade issues. LW

whitey · December 28, 2005, 07:05:39 PM

Monte
I cut a lot of dry wood on my 2000 , I think you don't have enough band tension or your guide arm is boncing

monte · December 28, 2005, 08:30:26 PM

Quote from: logwalker on December 28, 2005, 06:56:28 PMHow much sawdust is left in the cut? With too much set there is likely a lot left.

Well its funny you mention that!there is alot of sawdust left on the wood ???

Brucer · December 29, 2005, 01:16:58 AM

Quote from: monte on December 28, 2005, 08:09:39 AM
... the other thing, my roller guide does not extend close to the piece of 4x4 its still about 8 or 10 inchs away! :-\

That's a lot. Can you get it closer? 1 or 2 inches is where it should be. When I'm resawing dry stuff down to within an inch of the bed, I have to move the guide out to about 5" to clear my clamp. There's ususally some score marks on the wood right at that spot.

EZ · December 29, 2005, 07:24:12 AM

Make sure your wheels on your carrage are not siding back and forths. Even a 1/4 inch movement will cause a washboard look.
EZ

barbender · December 30, 2005, 08:55:12 AM

I would first make sure there is nothing on the bandwheels that could be making the blade jump up and down, and second, make sure you're not putting a kink in your blades when you uncoil them. I have kinked a few blades when they jumped off the band wheels on my homebrew mill, and they make a cut exactly like yours looks like. It's the same effect as having one tooth over set like others have mentioned. They still cut good and straight, but have a mark from every time the out of set tooth comes around. If your feed rate is steady the mark will be evenly spaced down the length of the board if this is the problem.