"Traditional" door frame?

[ballen]

After going to much trouble to use traditional, hand made joinery on my small timber frame project, I'd hate to just "nail in some 2x4's" to frame the entrance door.  Are there "traditional" methods for framing a door that someone can point me to?
Thanks in advance.

[Brad_bb]

Great question.  I'm interested too.  The preservation trades Network does workshops on traditional windows I know, and I bet they have info on door framing if no one here jumps in.
Brad

[Jim_Rogers]

I don't have a picture to post, right now, but most door posts are small pieces of timber. Sometimes 4x5, sometimes 3x4.

Usually they are added after the frame has been raised. And to do that they just cut a regular stub tenon on the bottom with a matching mortise in the sill before the decking is put on. Then they cut a 45° bevel on the top of the door post, and cut a matching 45° bevel on the bottom side of the plate or girt overhead of the door opening.

Now you can slide the bottom stub tenon into the sill pocket and pivot the timber up and into the plate. The siding will hold it in place and from the inside it looks like it is tenoned into the plate.

For a header the two door posts are cut at the correct height with a small shelf, called a diminished haunch. That way you can slide the header into the two door posts after they have been installed.

I have found two pictures I can post.
One is of a nailer that has both ends cut on an angle for sliding into the haunches:



In the above drawing, I have made the timbers see through so you can see what's inside.
One end meets a door post the other end meets a bent post. So you can stop the cut so that the header will stay in place.

Also, I have this one showing how it can be done with one tenon and one slide in end:



Tomorrow, I'll create a drawing showing you how to install the door posts.

Jim Rogers

[Jim_Rogers]

Alright then, I have created this drawing showing a standard width door, in this case I used a 36" doorway opening. And I put it in a gable wall bent, with 8x8 posts, 8x8 tie beam, 8x8 sill and regular braces.

Here it is all assembled from the outside, and looking at it from the outside:



Next I moved several of the timbers so that you can see the joints and understand how it is assembled.

First the right hand door post was just moved out 12" or so. You can see the stub tenon on the bottom and it's mortise in the sill. The header was left in place, but you can see how the ends are cut so that it will be supported by the door posts with the diminished haunch resting on a 1" shelf. You can also see the diminished haunches on the door posts.

The left hand door post was just leaned out 5° so that you can see the top of the post and the bevel cut into the bottom of the tie beam.



The header height was placed at 82" to allow for a 2" thick deck to come right out to the edge of the sill.
However you may need to adjust your header height and the posts placements depending on your structure. And whether or not you're using a pre-hung door. If using a pre-hung door with casings, you'll need to make the door way opening the size of the rough opening size shown in the paperwork that comes with the door.

I hope this has helped you to understand how to do a door frame in a timber framed structure.

Pre-planning everything is necessary so that you're not cutting joint after the frame has been raised. (Don't ask me how I know....)

As questions and I'll do the best I can to answer them.

Jim Rogers

[ballen]

Jim,
As always, you are a treasure of information.  Thanks.
The only thing that seems wierd to me is the slanted "tennon" on the posts but I understand the need for it...they have to be fitted after the frame is raised so that's the only way to slide them in.  Do you nail that joint to keep it in place until the siding is on?

[GaryinMississippi]

Jim,

Why no tenons on the header?  Seems to me you could put tenons on the header and assemble the three-piece frame as a unit.

[Jim_Rogers]

When we build some frames, we put the door posts in before we raise the frame:



Here you can see the two door posts connected to the tie beam with a tenon on the top, and pegged to hold it in place as it's being raised. Here I was raising this "for sale" frame alone one day, long ago.

So to do that I had to line up four stub tenons to the four sill pockets, alone, while driving the fork lift, raising the frame. Loooonnnnnnggggg arms.......

But I got it done, because I could hold the bent up with the fork lift and then push the tenon over the mortise and with a little less lift the tenon would drop into the mortise. Then I'd move to the next one down the bent and sort of stitch the bent to the sills.

When you are planning your frame and know where the doors are going to be and what the rough opening is going to be you can pre-plan it all and then use regular tenon on top of the door posts and stub tenons on the bottom and put it all together and raise it as a whole bent frame.

I was just showing you options for doing it alone. And doing it "after the fact"  should you find yourself with your frame raised and standing there saying: "....now, how do I do the doorway, just toe nail in some 2x4s? that doesn't seem right".....

The header can be tenoned into each post and then the three of them pivoted into place as a unit if you want to.
In this position, the header really isn't there for strength. It is more of a nailer for the siding....

And when you do use the bevel cut door post top, yes you just nail it to the bevel in the tie beam, usually two large spikes only, from the outside going in, and cover it with the siding so that they don't show from the inside.
And the bevel doesn't have to be exactly 45°, it can be whatever you want it to be so that the post fits in.

Good questions....

I hope these answers have helped you.

Jim Rogers

[Brad_bb]

Nice explanation Jim, Thank you.  Add that one to the book....

[ballen]

Yes, Thanks Jim.
I haven't assembled my frame yet so I can still do full joints on the top of the posts and each end of the header with stub tennons at the base of the posts....but good to know the other way too!  My only isue is that I didn't salvage the door frame pieces from the barn that fell down so I have to go searchig for some more 130 year old 4x4's to match the rest of my wall!

[ballen]

...how DID you get the 4 stub tennons in the sill at the same time?

[Jim_Rogers]

As mentioned, the ground was a little uneven and when I lowered the bent down one corner post touched the sill assembly first. So I pushed  it over the mortise. Then the next post towards the other end was resting on the sill assembly so I pushed it over it's mortise. Then I lowered the bent a little with the fork lift and the third tenon hit the sill assembly, so I pushed it over it's mortise. Then the last post was over it's mortise so I lined it up and lowered the entire bent down a little more until all post bottoms touched the sill assembly.

Sort of like stitching the posts across the sill assembly.

Jim Rogers