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Author Topic: 7 vs 10 degree bands  (Read 1911 times)

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Offline kenfrommaine

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7 vs 10 degree bands
« on: April 26, 2021, 03:39:11 PM »
Hi
Could someone explain the difference/advantage etc of using 7 degree over say 10 degree bands? All I have used is 10's I know the difference is angle of the tooth and 10 is more aggressive but does one perform better? 
Thanks for the education :) 

Offline terrifictimbersllc

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2021, 05:38:35 PM »
Many will tell you 7 is better than 10 for hardwoods.  And 7 turbo better than 7.  And 4 better than 7 but not necessarily better than turbo 7. 

But it may not be so for you.  Each person's mill, HP, wood, sawing technique, you have to work it out for yourself.
That being said you will probably get better help if you summarize your mill, HP, wood you saw, widths you saw, brand blades, and experiences so far.
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Offline kenfrommaine

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2021, 05:52:09 PM »
16 hp twin brigs motor, usually saw pine, hemlock and some red oak.  Mostly saw into 1 inch boards widths up to 14" but usually 8 to 12". Have been using ripper 37, been happy just wondering if I am missing out on something lol thanks for the input.

Online btulloh

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2021, 05:58:00 PM »
The blade is always sharper on the other side of the fence.   :D

I never used them, but there are a lot of fans of the Ripper 37's.  Seem to be a little harder to come by than some others.

I gotta second what terrifictimbers said about needing to work it out for you situation.  Can be frustrating to do that though and takes a while.  There'll be some other input showing up.  

Maybe if you're happy with the Ripper 37's, you've already found your sweet spot. ???  

Offline Mountain_d

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2021, 07:38:41 PM »
If I am sawing pine with a 24 hp mill and I take my blades to someone else to sharpen, does it make more sense for me to sharpen to 7 degrees instead of 10 degrees as I will get longer use from a blade before needing to resharpen?  Then there could be a discussion on what tooth set is best!
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Offline Screwbolts

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2021, 09:13:43 PM »
It is truly amazing that we at this point in time have the gratest education tool ever created thus far in Human history and so many fail to use it. A very simple internet search will and were one questions but it does take effort.

I thinks I have seen Cooks Saws advertised possibly as a spinner on this forum.  They, that would be cooks saws, have an unbelievable amont of shout videos on that thing vslled YouTube . It will sctialy take a certen amount of initiative to actual look but they have many short videos that address the OP questions completely.

Regardless of ones opinion of TimberWolf bandsaw blades the offer for free a short 24 page catalog that is a tremendous remorse also answering the OP questions.

It will take some effort to actual educate ones self. But then you are the only one that may or may not know the type of wood your sawing and the condition of the saw your using.  

At least I am adding to my post count. Lol







Offline Dave Shepard

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2021, 09:37:46 PM »
You could do all that, but here on The Forestry Forum, you get actual opinions from actual people, who have actually used the bands in question. 
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Offline kenfrommaine

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2021, 09:49:16 PM »
Screwbolts well yes google has lots of answers and pretty much everything anyone could want to know, but I have always found that some of the best "education" is learned from asking folks with actual experience. At least for me, I have found that some of the "ole timers" are willing to share their knowledge and experiences if ya just ask. Thought forums where to help and pass on knowledge, but thank you for that insightful comment, good luck with your "post count".    

Offline Southside

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2021, 09:58:39 PM »
Did they change the "proof" of the water they give out at Wall Drug or something?
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Offline barbender

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2021, 10:02:05 PM »
Exactly, Dave👍 That's what the Forum is for. Kind of like "peer reviewed" sawing and logging info. You can just go out on Google no doubt. 75% of the time it will lead you right back to this site. The problem with getting the info out on the open internet (or worse, Facebook) is for every good piece of info you get, there is about 9 that are garbage. Don't believe me? Go onto one of the FB sawing groups, post a picture of a red oak log and ask people what species they think it is.

My experience with blades- 10 blades cut just fine. I've sawn with several manufacturer's 10 blades, all of them did fine. I switched to WM 7/34, they seemed to not get as many waves in pine. Now I've went to the WM 7/39 Turbo, it seems to allow faster feed rates as it keeps the sawdust cleaned out of the cut well. Saws pretty straight (probably really straight but I've been in some knotty spruce and pine).
 There is more to a blades aggressiveness than hook angle. I suppose for the same profile, a higher hook will be more aggressive, but many of these 7 blades have deep gullets with steep back angles (basically, they look really pointy) so even though the hook angle is shallower, the teeth penetrate and bite into the wood more aggressively because of the shape.  
Too many irons in the fire

Offline kenfrommaine

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2021, 10:12:02 PM »
Barbender, Thank you. This is the kind of answer I was hoping for.
Do you think  a 7 better is then a 10 with a 16hp? or would that only affect the feed rate?

Offline Nebraska

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2021, 10:19:57 PM »
I have a low (13)  hp mill and went from 10 to 7 to 4 degree. I have a box of Rippers 7 degree. I get better results from 4 degree blades.  Very smooth  cuts in knotty stuff, absolutely the best for me.. I am using  Kasco's but WM would probably  be similar. I have used Timberwolf,  Rippers, and Lennox.  No experience  with Cook's or WM.
Just my experience with blades in this journey.

Offline barbender

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2021, 10:26:28 PM »
Well, I've only used 7's on my LT40 with a 40hp diesel, so I can't directly answer that from experience. I think WM only recommends the Turbo 7 for higher hp engines, but I've read of people using them with low hp with good success all the same. The standard 7 will undoubtedly work well for your situation. WM has really been pushing the new 747 blade profile, which is pointier yet. I wasn't that impressed with the few I tried, maybe I'll try them again sometime but honestly I'm very satisfied with how the Turbo 7 performs on my machine. The reason Turbo 7s weren't recommended for low hp engines is if you don't maintain a high feed rate, they start to washboard (the blade is trying to bite into something but can't, and starts to vibrate). Theoretically with low hp, you might not be able to push the blade fast enough to not get washboard, without bogging your engine and causing waves. I would get one and give it a try, if you engine will pull it they are nice sawing blades. I run .045x1.5" Silvertips on mine. WM markets them as kind of a cheap throw away blade, but many of us are finding they have better flex life (more sharpenings) than Doublehards, and don't really give much up for how long they stay sharp either. 
Too many irons in the fire

Offline Patrick NC

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2021, 07:25:58 AM »
I use kasco 7 for everything on my 23 hp mill. Maybe there's something better out there , but these work great for me and chasing blade profiles can get expensive.
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Offline Tacotodd

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2021, 08:10:37 AM »
Trying harder everyday.

Online Jdock

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2021, 12:21:46 PM »
On a low hp small mill the difference in profiles seems to me to be fairly negligible. I've ran 10 degree sabertooths and 4degree kasco on my 7.5 hp os23 back to back on the same pine log and the only noticable difference was the kascos were 10$ a band cheaper. This was significant at the time as the reason for the blade change was me inadvertently shortening my backstop.

Offline Stephen1

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2021, 08:33:48 PM »
Barbender, Thank you. This is the kind of answer I was hoping for.
Do you think  a 7 better is then a 10 with a 16hp? or would that only affect the feed rate?
I always ran 10 on my 1993 lt40hd 24 onan. I only changed to 9 for ash and sugar maple. I ran that mill for 2000 hrs and they always performed great. 
When I upgraded to the new lt40hd with a 38 hp , the 10 was horrible. I couldnt cut pine at all. I run 7/39 turbos now and those 10s are hanging on the wall still.
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Offline Screwbolts

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #17 on: April 27, 2021, 08:35:39 PM »
Part2 of bandsaw blade basics for OP



if you can open the link it should be ever so self evident that you stand to learn facts not opinions from a social club of good old boys.


Laus Deo

Screwbolts




Offline LeeB

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2021, 08:58:49 PM »
Could it be that a lot of the "good ol' boys" might just happen to know what they're talking about?
'98 LT40HDD/Lombardini, Case 580L, Cat D4C, JD 3032 tractor, JD 5410 tractor, Husky 346, 372 and 562XP's. Stihl MS180 and MS361, 1998 and 2006 3/4 Ton 5.9 Cummins 4x4's, 1989 Dodge D100 w/ 318, and a 1966 Chevy C60 w/ dump bed.

Offline Patrick NC

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Re: 7 vs 10 degree bands
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2021, 09:36:20 PM »
Part2 of bandsaw blade basics for OP



if you can open the link it should be ever so self evident that you stand to learn facts not opinions from a social club of good old boys.


Laus Deo

Screwbolts
Watched the video. Didn't learn anything about what the OPs question was about. However I have learned a lot about blades and advantages/ disadvantages of different hook angles by following this forum and the advice of the many knowledgeable members here. Another thing I have learned over the years is how what's supposed to be in theory isn't always practical in real world application. I hold the opinions from this "social club of good old boys" in very high regard and wouldn't trade this resource for all the videos on the web. 
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