7 vs 10 degree bands

[kenfrommaine]

Hi
Could someone explain the difference/advantage etc of using 7 degree over say 10 degree bands? All I have used is 10's I know the difference is angle of the tooth and 10 is more aggressive but does one perform better? 
Thanks for the education  

[terrifictimbersllc]

Many will tell you 7 is better than 10 for hardwoods.  And 7 turbo better than 7.  And 4 better than 7 but not necessarily better than turbo 7. 

But it may not be so for you.  Each person's mill, HP, wood, sawing technique, you have to work it out for yourself.
That being said you will probably get better help if you summarize your mill, HP, wood you saw, widths you saw, brand blades, and experiences so far.

[kenfrommaine]

16 hp twin brigs motor, usually saw pine, hemlock and some red oak.  Mostly saw into 1 inch boards widths up to 14" but usually 8 to 12". Have been using ripper 37, been happy just wondering if I am missing out on something lol thanks for the input.

[btulloh]

The blade is always sharper on the other side of the fence.   :D

I never used them, but there are a lot of fans of the Ripper 37's.  Seem to be a little harder to come by than some others.

I gotta second what terrifictimbers said about needing to work it out for you situation.  Can be frustrating to do that though and takes a while.  There'll be some other input showing up.  

Maybe if you're happy with the Ripper 37's, you've already found your sweet spot. ???  

[Mountain_d]

If I am sawing pine with a 24 hp mill and I take my blades to someone else to sharpen, does it make more sense for me to sharpen to 7 degrees instead of 10 degrees as I will get longer use from a blade before needing to resharpen?  Then there could be a discussion on what tooth set is best!
Mountain  

[Screwbolts]

It is truly amazing that we at this point in time have the gratest education tool ever created thus far in Human history and so many fail to use it. A very simple internet search will and were one questions but it does take effort.

I thinks I have seen Cooks Saws advertised possibly as a spinner on this forum.  They, that would be cooks saws, have an unbelievable amont of shout videos on that thing vslled YouTube . It will sctialy take a certen amount of initiative to actual look but they have many short videos that address the OP questions completely.

Regardless of ones opinion of TimberWolf bandsaw blades the offer for free a short 24 page catalog that is a tremendous remorse also answering the OP questions.

It will take some effort to actual educate ones self. But then you are the only one that may or may not know the type of wood your sawing and the condition of the saw your using.  

At least I am adding to my post count. Lol

[Dave Shepard]

You could do all that, but here on The Forestry Forum, you get actual opinions from actual people, who have actually used the bands in question. 

[kenfrommaine]

Screwbolts well yes google has lots of answers and pretty much everything anyone could want to know, but I have always found that some of the best "education" is learned from asking folks with actual experience. At least for me, I have found that some of the "ole timers" are willing to share their knowledge and experiences if ya just ask. Thought forums where to help and pass on knowledge, but thank you for that insightful comment, good luck with your "post count".    

[Southside]

Did they change the "proof" of the water they give out at Wall Drug or something?

[barbender]

Exactly, Dave👍 That's what the Forum is for. Kind of like "peer reviewed" sawing and logging info. You can just go out on Google no doubt. 75% of the time it will lead you right back to this site. The problem with getting the info out on the open internet (or worse, Facebook) is for every good piece of info you get, there is about 9 that are garbage. Don't believe me? Go onto one of the FB sawing groups, post a picture of a red oak log and ask people what species they think it is.

My experience with blades- 10° blades cut just fine. I've sawn with several manufacturer's 10° blades, all of them did fine. I switched to WM 7/34, they seemed to not get as many waves in pine. Now I've went to the WM 7/39 Turbo, it seems to allow faster feed rates as it keeps the sawdust cleaned out of the cut well. Saws pretty straight (probably really straight but I've been in some knotty spruce and pine).
 There is more to a blades aggressiveness than hook angle. I suppose for the same profile, a higher ° hook will be more aggressive, but many of these 7° blades have deep gullets with steep back angles (basically, they look really pointy) so even though the hook angle is shallower, the teeth penetrate and bite into the wood more aggressively because of the shape.  

[kenfrommaine]

Barbender, Thank you. This is the kind of answer I was hoping for.
Do you think  a 7 better is then a 10 with a 16hp? or would that only affect the feed rate?

[Nebraska]

I have a low (13)  hp mill and went from 10 to 7 to 4 degree. I have a box of Rippers 7 degree. I get better results from 4 degree blades.  Very smooth  cuts in knotty stuff, absolutely the best for me.. I am using  Kasco's but WM would probably  be similar. I have used Timberwolf,  Rippers, and Lennox.  No experience  with Cook's or WM.
Just my experience with blades in this journey.

[barbender]

Well, I've only used 7's on my LT40 with a 40hp diesel, so I can't directly answer that from experience. I think WM only recommends the Turbo 7 for higher hp engines, but I've read of people using them with low hp with good success all the same. The standard 7 will undoubtedly work well for your situation. WM has really been pushing the new 747 blade profile, which is pointier yet. I wasn't that impressed with the few I tried, maybe I'll try them again sometime but honestly I'm very satisfied with how the Turbo 7 performs on my machine. The reason Turbo 7s weren't recommended for low hp engines is if you don't maintain a high feed rate, they start to washboard (the blade is trying to bite into something but can't, and starts to vibrate). Theoretically with low hp, you might not be able to push the blade fast enough to not get washboard, without bogging your engine and causing waves. I would get one and give it a try, if you engine will pull it they are nice sawing blades. I run .045x1.5" Silvertips on mine. WM markets them as kind of a cheap throw away blade, but many of us are finding they have better flex life (more sharpenings) than Doublehards, and don't really give much up for how long they stay sharp either. 

[Patrick NC]

I use kasco 7° for everything on my 23 hp mill. Maybe there's something better out there , but these work great for me and chasing blade profiles can get expensive.

[Tacotodd]

@Patrick NC x2

[Jdock]

On a low hp small mill the difference in profiles seems to me to be fairly negligible. I've ran 10 degree sabertooths and 4degree kasco on my 7.5 hp os23 back to back on the same pine log and the only noticable difference was the kascos were 10$ a band cheaper. This was significant at the time as the reason for the blade change was me inadvertently shortening my backstop.

[Stephen1]

Barbender, Thank you. This is the kind of answer I was hoping for.
Do you think  a 7 better is then a 10 with a 16hp? or would that only affect the feed rate?

I always ran 10 on my 1993 lt40hd 24 onan. I only changed to 9 for ash and sugar maple. I ran that mill for 2000 hrs and they always performed great. 
When I upgraded to the new lt40hd with a 38 hp , the 10 was horrible. I couldn't cut pine at all. I run 7/39 turbos now and those 10's are hanging on the wall still.

[Screwbolts]

Part2 of bandsaw blade basics for OP

Sawmill Bandsaw Blade Basics 2 Hook Angle and Set - YouTube

if you can open the link it should be ever so self evident that you stand to learn facts not opinions from a social club of good old boys.


Laus Deo

Screwbolts

[LeeB]

Could it be that a lot of the "good ol' boys" might just happen to know what they're talking about?

[Patrick NC]

Part2 of bandsaw blade basics for OP

Sawmill Bandsaw Blade Basics 2 Hook Angle and Set - YouTube

if you can open the link it should be ever so self evident that you stand to learn facts not opinions from a social club of good old boys.


Laus Deo

Screwbolts

Watched the video. Didn't learn anything about what the OPs question was about. However I have learned a lot about blades and advantages/ disadvantages of different hook angles by following this forum and the advice of the many knowledgeable members here. Another thing I have learned over the years is how what's supposed to be in theory isn't always practical in real world application. I hold the opinions from this "social club of good old boys" in very high regard and wouldn't trade this resource for all the videos on the web. 

[dgdrls]

Kenfrommaine

As important as hook angle is, you have to know what your tooth set is,

Generally softer woods saw better with more hook angle, knots aside,
the wider you saw the more tooth set you can use/need.

D

[Jeff]

Screwball, I've sent you a p m. I strongly advise that you heed the content of that pm.

[Screwbolts]

The video is number 2 in a series, It is a start. And without a Start a journey can not begin. 

And some of use Surfs truly  don't know what we is a talked about is correct in every way.  

I did start doing my reaserch in 84 long before the net.  After that I drew the plans for my mill in late 84 and welded the first steel together in Feb of 85.

Yes this month of April in the Year of 2021 with a fraud at Casle Rock studios,  i did decide to do a major overhall to my old rugged mill.

It is correct that some here do have actually experiance of running some blades.

I do believe that some here may even remember in the late summer of 85 the exciteing phone call from the DoAll customer service guy at The DoAll company shop in Syracuse telling they  they just got the first coil in of this new fangled tooth spacing called 1.3. It might be just what your looking for.

Dont worry about My post count here, it will never get very high.

I still have a Reading room.

I still even have books and manuals you know they were called reference material.  I even dug out some of DoAll's catalogs from way back in 84, just to look at and enjoy  how easy us Surfs have it today. It has all been just a " Richmans Trick" since 1913. If you know, you know

All this was before many of the current crop of wonderful factory made machines were even thought of.

Enjoy the jouney.

If you know you know.

Throw a man a fish he will eat for a day, teach him how to fish he may eat for a life!

Laus Deo, from my reading room.  

Screwbolts.

[Old Greenhorn]

...
Dont worry about My post count here, it will never get very high.
.....

Sounds like a self-fulfilling prophecy.

[Jeff]

He just deleted his photos and answered my pm. Trash and burn exit. Shows what a winner this _ _ _ _ _  _ _ _ was. He is now gone. Here is what I had to say to him.  Everyone can now know going forward, know this guy was a _ _ _  _ _ _ _   or how ever many blanks you might want to add...

You are not earning any citizenship points here on MY FORUM. I wake up to complaints about you to start my day and that don't sit well, as I like to start on a positive note, so let's do that.  You knock it the hell off so I don't have to remove your ability to use this website. Or, leave on your own if you don't have the capabilities of such an adjustment to your online persona. Easy Peasy.

SIGNED THE OWNER AND FOUNDER.