TIMBCO down!

[Firewoodjoe]

Well I was cutting away and all hydraulics stopped. Like you opened the door and the safety switch disconnected the hydraulics. Well sure enough that wire was broke. I twisted the wires together bypassing the switch and still nothing. I checked the switch fuse and it has power on both sides. What am I missing? It has to be something simple. That safety switch always worked and that wire was broke. So That should have fixed the problem. But the system still isn't armed. I'm calling in a mechanic for tomorrow I hope. 

[nativewolf]

Good luck!  

[kiko]

1. There is no power to the pilot solenoid that the safety switches activate.
2. The pilot solenoid is defective, electrically or mechanically.
3.  The pump drive gear box has failed  
4.  The drive coupler has failed.
5.  Possible pump failure.
Checking for pilot pressure would be the first place I would go.   I may be mistaken because it has been a while but I believe the pilot pressure draws off the charge pump of  of one of the track pumps.

[Firewoodjoe]

Thank you for a quick response. There is only one pump on these. No track pumps. My gauge wouldn't  adapt to the test port but I took the line off and started the machine. Oil shot 75 feet 🤷‍♂️. Using a screw driver there is zero magnetic power on all the solenoids. So at this point I'm guessing no power out to the pilot.  I broke my volt meter in the middle of all this. I'm leaving and coming back with a new meter tomorrow. 

[Firewoodjoe]

What thread are those solenoid spools. Sae? I may plug it and worry about wireing latter. 

[Corley5]

Pilot pressure solenoid.  Good Luck.

[Pulpwood mafia]

Between the boom and the engine open the compartment door. The pilot pump is there towards front of engine. If you take pilot pump off there is a stub shaft that runs off accessory drive. Check splines on pump and stub shaft

[chevytaHOE5674]

Jump power to the pilot pressure solenoid and see what happens.

[Firewoodjoe]

Thanks guys. Yeah it's got to be no power or bad solenoid. I have another volt meter in the truck for today. But what's weird is I have power coming from the safety switch. And the wire was broke. So it's like two things happend. Find out. And no pilot pump. It has one big pump. It's a 415ex. 

[Firewoodjoe]

Between the boom and the engine open the compartment door. The pilot pump is there towards front of engine. If you take pilot pump off there is a stub shaft that runs off accessory drive. Check splines on pump and stub shaft

I will check. But Roland equipment even told me there is no pilot pump on this machine. Thanks. 

[mike_belben]

i assume this is a pressure compensating or flow compensating system, closed center, variable displacement single pump?   

[Firewoodjoe]

i assume this is a pressure compensating or flow compensating system, closed center, variable displacement single pump?  

Heck I don't know. 😆 it has one pump about the size of a 5 gallon bucket. Prolly takes that much money to replace it also lol it has to be electrical. It's like there's a second fuse. But it's a 1 1/2 hour drive to the job and a 1/4 mile walk to the machine. I'm just going to test for power and if non run a jumper like chevytahoe said. On my way now. 

[mike_belben]

i have never owned or wrenched on a compensated closed center system so i cant be much help, my understanding is strictly on paper.  youtube channel "lunchbox sessions" has quick and exceptional tutorials to help you understand how they function which will make troubleshooting and adjusting easier.  theres pressure compensating and flow compensating to the family of load sense pumps, if ive got that right. just different ways to control the swash plate to achieve different results.  i think all of the swash plates are spring loaded for full stroke/full output and then as the system comes online a sleeve piston moves to counterbalance the spring and turn the swash plate to zero stroke, zero flow while maintaining target pressure or flow in the system. when you use fluid somewhere the swash plate activates to replace it at the target levels and keep it maintained.  like an obsessive compulsive waitress who tops off your beer as you drink from a straw. she pours more or less based on how fast you consume.

i really dont know the safety stuff a manufacturer would add on at all.. whether the system is pressurized and a safety solenoid valve blocks you from accessing this fluid pressure, or if they lockout the swash plate from stroking to achieve flow until you have satisfied the safety requirements to complete an electric circuit and let the swash plate swash..  i just dont have a clue.  

if youve got fluid squirting out when you start it that seems to vindicate that the coupling is intact and that the pumping assembly and charge pump are rotating with the crank.  

[BargeMonkey]

Yours is newer than mine but there are a couple fuses and reset buttons on the console / inside, I chased it one day with a similar problem of no power to the door switch / power to the handles and it was the reset. 🤷‍♂️ 

[barbender]

CTL equipment does have the strange habit of unrelated things failing at the same time, which really messes with the troubleshooting!

[mike_belben]

That makes it sound like the safety devices just lock a PLC preventing servo control signals from reaching their servo valves to make use of fluid that is pressurized and available.

[Firewoodjoe]

I'm trying to get someone out here. I've ran jumper wires to all the pilot solenoids and I still have nothing. They will magnetize when I jump them but won't make the hydraulics work. I'm missing something 

[Gary_C]

I had a similar thing happen on my Ponsse where all the hydraulics just quit while processing and it was the main drive coupling behind the engine. That required a service truck with a hoist and pulling the engine to fix. 

[Firewoodjoe]

Right but I should have voltage out to these solenoids. 

[Skeans1]

Right but I should have voltage out to these solenoids.

Check your grounds you said the wire was broke on the safety switch wonder if the ground strap became the fuse.

[chevytaHOE5674]

You need to get gauges in there to see that you have the right pressures. Doesn't take much pressure to get oil to spray out, having pressure under full load is an entirely different thing. 

Also need to check for unseen grounds, fuses, breakers, etc on the electrical side.

[Plankton]

Love the machines I get to run but we have a lot of little electrical problems on these timberpros and timbcos. Is it failing to arm at all? We've had issues with the large connectors in the ican box beneath the seat in our old timbco forwarder that even made our dealer mechanic scratch his head and he's good. Lots of phone calls and wire tracing figured that one out. Not sure if the machine your running is old enough to have that box or not?

You can put a spade fuse in the connector to bypass the door switch as well. All our machines have this (not very safe but I guess we're just lazy hahaha) sounds like your problem may be deeper then that though.

[Firewoodjoe]

Love the machines I get to run but we have a lot of little electrical problems on these timberpros and timbcos. Is it failing to arm at all? We've had issues with the large connectors in the ican box beneath the seat in our old timbco forwarder that even made our dealer mechanic scratch his head and he's good. Lots of phone calls and wire tracing figured that one out. Not sure if the machine your running is old enough to have that box or not?

You can put a spade fuse in the connector to bypass the door switch as well. All our machines have this (not very safe but I guess we're just lazy hahaha) sounds like your problem may be deeper then that though.

What does the ican box look like? There is nothing under the seat. There is a box against the back cab but one side of it was never been hooked up since I bought it. It don't say anything on it. Well I can't get any mechanics out for a few days at least. It's all up to me and over the phone. The one mechanic knows these quite well I guess. He walked me through some valves/ectrical and got me behind the fuel tank to solenoids I didn't even know were behind it.  Those are powered and functional. He said stop with the electric at that point and check pressure. Pilot check valve first than check for pump coupling then call him back. That's tomorrow morning project. I can tell you I'm sick of walking through the woods with different tools! 

[Firewoodjoe]

Between the boom and the engine open the compartment door. The pilot pump is there towards front of engine. If you take pilot pump off there is a stub shaft that runs off accessory drive. Check splines on pump and stub shaft

Your right by the way. So far your the only one that has even mentioned that pump. I'm just having a hard time making myself check pumps at this point when only one little wire broke! But tomorrow we'll find out. My manual has most of this stuff but it's not really in any order so I have to flip page to page and find what I need. That don't help. 

[Skeans1]

Love the machines I get to run but we have a lot of little electrical problems on these timberpros and timbcos. Is it failing to arm at all? We've had issues with the large connectors in the ican box beneath the seat in our old timbco forwarder that even made our dealer mechanic scratch his head and he's good. Lots of phone calls and wire tracing figured that one out. Not sure if the machine your running is old enough to have that box or not?

You can put a spade fuse in the connector to bypass the door switch as well. All our machines have this (not very safe but I guess we're just lazy hahaha) sounds like your problem may be deeper then that though.

What does the ican box look like? There is nothing under the seat. There is a box against the back cab but one side of it was never been hooked up since I bought it. It don't say anything on it. Well I can't get any mechanics out for a few days at least. It's all up to me and over the phone. The one mechanic knows these quite well I guess. He walked me through some valves/ectrical and got me behind the fuel tank to solenoids I didn't even know were behind it.  Those are powered and functional. He said stop with the electric at that point and check pressure. Pilot check valve first than check for pump coupling then call him back. That's tomorrow morning project. I can tell you I'm sick of walking through the woods with different tools!

Is that your relay box for your head?