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Deer Hunting 2010

Started by Ron Scott, November 03, 2010, 01:24:10 PM

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WH_Conley

Bill

SwampDonkey

Those are some nice deer. We don't have many deer around here, never did have high numbers in my area. Lots of moose instead. But, our deer numbers in the northern part of the province are way low and pretty much none on the far northern end. When I was a kid there were herds of at least 50 together in the deep woods. All the major streams and lakes where opened up with deer paths, it was nice to go fishing by taking those paths down to your fishing hole. And this has all pretty much ended by taking away the older softwood forest by clear cut harvesting. The old guides and hunters predicted this and warned them 25-30 years ago. You know what? They blame it on the winters and predation. That part of their environment hasn't changed for long before my time and according to the frost hardiness maps, it ain't changed at least since the 60's. According to the Al Gores it warming up, but I don't know where they were standing when they made that reading. ::)  Also, the deer on the upper Tobique and smaller arteries of the Mirimachi all migrated down stream in the harshest winters. You go up the Tobique now and all the deer are along the river in private woodlots and you could possibly see 10 to 40 deer in a herd. You go outside the settlement and you won't find a deer.
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

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gary

Quote from: celliott on November 10, 2010, 08:38:07 PM
Quote from: Jeff on November 10, 2010, 04:50:52 PM
I've never shot a buck on my property, so since there are not any deer in which we can practice QDM with, I've decided if given a chance, will shoot the first legal buck I see. This in no way increases my next to nothing odds of getting a deer.

Jeff, we're pretty much in the same boat here in VT. We'll always take the first legal buck.  And there isnt alot of deer either. The state enacted antler restrictions a few years ago (can't take spikehorns) and there always praising the regulation saying everyone keeps taking bigger deer.  I personally haven't noticed, and don't really care for the restrictions.  My Grandfather, a wise man, has an interesting opinion on the antler restriction, and maybe someone here can comment more on it.

He believes that with the antler restriction, you can detract good genes from the genetic pool.  For example, if you pass up a 2 year old spike, but take a 2 year old 4 point, the 4 point 2 year old has better genetics, correct? and now that 4 point is out of the gene pool but the 2 year old spike, with worse genetics (antlerwise) is still in the gene pool. Does this make sense to anyone? opinions and experiences with antler restrictions in other states?
Opening weekend of rifle season is this weekend in Vermont  8) i'm still excited
What you are forgetting about genetics is that 50% of it comes from the mother. A deer that is only 2 years old is not a mature deer. A mature deer is about 4.5 years old.  The 2 year old spike could have been born later in the year than the 2 year old 4 point. Here in Pennslyvania where I hunt a buck has to have 4 points on one side to be legal other parts of the state it only has to have 3 points. One of those points can be a brow tine if it is 1 inch long. The deer biologist that started these antler restrictions here had to have 24 hour armed bodygaurds for himself and his family and he had to wear a bullet proof vest in public. Then we ran him out of the state. Just mention Gary Alt to any Pa deer hunter and watch out for thier reaction. If you want to learn more about antler restrictions or how genetics affect antler growth go to this site Hunting Pa.com. Be warned this these people get worked up about this stuff.

Magicman

A 1 year old spike buck has the same genes that he would have when/if he was an 8 year old monster.  Genes don't change with age.  I sometimes wonder where some of the Biologist went to school and what they were smoking.

I don't shoot young bucks, but their genetics are not different just because they are young.

I realize that I am lucky in that I regularly see several bucks during each day's hunt.  That's why I don't shoot very often.  I just enjoy sitting, relaxing, and watching.   :)
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Jeff

My believe comes from talking with two different individuals over the years that own deer hunting preserves that I built websites for.  I think a spike buck has a pretty good chance of becoming a big buck. I do not fall for that once a spike always a spike.  The breeders I know say that the male genetics is only a piece of the puzzle and that inferior male genes can be overcome by the other determining factors.  The doe's genetics is a major factor. Both these breeders say that they put the Doe as a more important factor then the fathering buck.  Nutrition they say is the number one factor in the quality and size of antlers. Then you have environment. Environment includes things like climate, competition for nutritional resources and other heath hazards.

I'm a firm beleiver if you leave the smaller bucks to grow, you will have better bucks. In my case, I've chose for one time only to take what ever legal buck I might have a chance for if presented with an opportunity. If I don't the predators will.
Just call me the midget doctor.
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celliott

Ok, maybe I dont know a whole lot about deer genetics  :D I wasnt saying once a spike always a spike, I dont believe that either. I was talking about 2 deer, same age, but different rack sizes.
I can imagine that hunters would be outraged in Vermont if they enacted antler restrictions like those in PA. There was alot of uproar and discussion about the law they have now.  There just isnt alot of deer around here, and I personally haven't noticed the deer getting any bigger. I'd say the greater majority of the bucks taken are barely legal, just over the restrictions.  You can easily go a whole season here without seeing a buck. I have for a few years, and I'm out in the woods nearly everyday I can be.....
Chris Elliott

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beenthere

Hunters were in an uproar in CO when they removed the spike bull elk as a legal "bull". Letting those spikes go another year has apparently improved the entire lot of large bulls. Seems the second year those spikes get to be 4x's.  

We have had volunteer deer management areas where hunters pledged to shoot only bucks that had horns reaching beyond their ears. Made for some awesome buck racks. Then these guys started buying bucks from farms to improve the genetics, and brought in the CWD disease (that is the assumption anyway).

We are in an area here in S. WI that now has the CWD disease, and the intention of the DNR management plan is to wipe out the deer herd as much as possible. They are doing it by requiring a doe be shot in order to earn a tag to shoot a buck (3" spike or bigger).  3" spikes are healthy fawns and rarely sometimes yearlings. The plan seems to be working. Lots of bucks around moving at night. Very few doe are seen.
The ratio of bucks to doe that I've caught on camera the past three months has been about 1 doe for 16 bucks of various sizes (not counting the button buck fawns). Still waiting for a rut to happen with all these bucks, but seems with so few doe that the bucks have nothing to chase.
How does one dress up like a doe?   8) 8)

This dude showed up on camera a short while ago. I'd like to meet him during the day.



south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Paul_H

Beenthere,

I still get a kick out this "Daffy Buck" you posted last week. :D


Science isn't meant to be trusted it's to be tested

beenthere

 :D :D :D

You'd look like that too with a pear stuck in back o your mouth.  ;D ;D

I've been known to cut 'em up with an axe a little bit so no one chokes. Would hate to have to do Norm's Patty-hugging maneuver on a buck with those horns.

I kicked this one out of its bed this afternoon at 3 pm. Was about 12 yards from it, and scared the jeepers outta me. Snorted as it jumped, then stopped and looked back at me while it snorted some more. Acted like he didn't like to be scared either.  ;D
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Jeff

Thats pretty gory business chopping a deer up into bits with an axe  :o
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

WH_Conley

That would keep them from choking though. ;D
Bill

Patty

Women are Angels.
And when someone breaks our wings....
We simply continue to fly ........
on a broomstick.....
We are flexible like that.

Weekend_Sawyer


Getting ready for a week and a half of deer camp 2010!


The week before Thanksgiving is Bow hunting and turkey hunting. The week of is gun season.
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

Bibbyman

I'm about afraid to go outside.  Gunfire from every direction.  Opening day in Missouri is tomorrow morning and everyone is out this evening practicing or sighting in or something.  Or just ending the early poaching season. 

Back to my bunker.   help_me
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chevytaHOE5674

Quote from: Jeff on November 08, 2010, 09:21:21 AM
Maybe my focus should be coyotes, but legally I cant shoot them during rifle season...

I thought that changed this year and the coyote season was open during the firearm deer season?

Jeff

Could be. I don't know. It wouldn't matter to me anyhow. If I get a chance to stop one from the damage its about to do, I will.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Jeff

I just looked it up. Yea, its open but its bullcrap.

Fox and Coyote  oct-15  march 1  With game or predator call only. Firearm may be loaded or arrow nocked only when using call.

Coyote(damage control) Sept 15 - Oct. 14  and March 1- March 31  Only on  private lands when doing or about to do damage;landowners and guests only; with game or predator call only: firearm may be loaded or arrow nocked only when using call.

THERE SHOULD BE NO CLOSED SEASON!! There should be no restrictive season at all.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Bibbyman

What about feral cats?  I've tollorated one around the farm all summer.   It kept its distance.  Now two more are hanging around.  Even coming onto the porch and stealing dowg food.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDE25 Super 25hp 3ph with Command Control and Accuset.
Sawing since '94

Jeff

We'll probably protect those as they might be a good food source for the canine predators once the deer are all gone.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

beenthere

More feral cats have walked onto the property here than have walked off. I don't see many any more.  ::) ::)

Have a neighbor who feeds feral cats. But she traps them and takes them to be neutered and then turns them loose.  But another close-by neighbor suspects he caught a possible cougar on his trail cam. Sent it to me. 



south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Reddog

Quote from: chevytaHOE5674 on November 12, 2010, 06:28:24 PM
Quote from: Jeff on November 08, 2010, 09:21:21 AM
Maybe my focus should be coyotes, but legally I cant shoot them during rifle season...

I thought that changed this year and the coyote season was open during the firearm deer season?

Quote from: Jeff on November 12, 2010, 06:48:46 PM
THERE SHOULD BE NO CLOSED SEASON!! There should be no restrictive season at all.

They did:
Coyote Hunting Season:
Statewide July 15 - April 15
See Notes 1 and 2 below.
Residents possessing a valid small game license may hunt coyote during the established season.

Note 1: Coyote may be taken on private property by a property owner or designee all year if they are doing or about to do damage on private property. A license or written permit is not needed.

Note 2: See Nighttime Raccoon and Predator Hunting for specific regulations governing the hunting of these species at night.

celliott

Well maybe good ole Vermont got one thing right- No closed season on coyotes, just can't use lights or shoot them at night.
Chris Elliott

Clark 666C cable skidder
Husqvarna and Jonsered pro saws
265rx clearing saw
Professional maple tubing installer and maple sugaring worker, part time logger

Jeff

okay, tell me what page of the 2010 michigan hunting and trapping digest that is on, because I can't find it in my copy.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Jeff

Never mind. I found it in a different section.  GOOD!
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Reddog


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