blade bulk reels

[hookhill]

Does anyone out there buy bandblade bulk reels and then weld them up. Was wondering how much one could save doing it this way. Thanks.

Jim

[farmerdoug]

Jim,

You can buy the band in bulk but you would have to have an band welder which are not cheap.  You would also have to figure out the cut so when you weld the blade togeher you would have the correct spacing unless you are going the throw away route.  But that would negate the savings of sharpening blades then.  I think unless you were using alot of blades I would let an band blade dealer worry about making the band blades myself.

Farmerdoug

[D._Frederick]

A new resistance blade welder that will weld 1 1/4 bands will set you back a least 5K. The cheap ones do not have the annealing feature that gives the long blade life for the welds.

[abatol]

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=3663
you mean cheap like this ... has anyone tried this welder or know whether or not it will work  ?

[Furby]

From your link:

Weld carbon steel blades from 1/8'' to 1/2''.

Most folks use 1¼" blades and larger.

[abatol]

I saw that  but figure still had to ask .

[low_48]

I've been using silver solder on a skive joint to make 3/4" blades for my shop saw. Works great. I bought a 250' reel on Ebay for $50. Nice cheap blades. I sure wouldn't want to make my own blades for the mill though.

[Tom]

I tried silver soldering my bandmill blades years ago.  I could never get a strong enough joint to hold the tension.

I shopped band welders (zap welders) and the $5,000 ones maxed out at 3/4 inch.  I used 1 1/4" bands. The welders that handled 1" and above were priced to me at $50 grand.  I finally gave up that approach.

[Dave Shepard]

I've spent some time thinking about band costs, and it really is a small part of what it takes to run our operation. We just got four boxes back from resharp, plus one new box. From 12/06 to 2/08, I have used 71 bands to saw over 60,000 feet of mostly 4/4 and 5/4 boards, with about 4,000 feet of assorted timbers and dunnage. That is $.02218/bdft. I am hoping to get many sharpening out of these bands, which will hopefully reduce that by more than half over the life of the band. I know that the initial purchase of a couple of boxes of bands seem like a chunk of change, but there are more profitable areas to invest time and money. I am not trying to be too critical of your band welding idea, just a different outlook. Usually when a band breaks, it is because it has exceeded its flex life.

Interestingly, of the 60 bands we sent back, only one was rejected, which is amazing, as I had a few that had some serious hardware hits. I think it was the one that lost out to the porcelain insulator.  ;)


Dave

[Tom]

The hardest maintenance item from which I suffer, and I dare say many of you as well, is the setting aside for the replacement or upgrade of the mill.  I know they wear out and if we haven't set aside a nominal fund, we're dead in the water, looking for financing again the same as we did for the first mill.

I have always considered it a challenging thing to keep blades handy.  I look on bearings, guides, grease and the physical inspection and re-welding of frames the same way.  Without those things, regardless of what they cost, you don't have a business and won't make a profit, no matter how hard you try.

The more longevity and less downtime a manufacturer builds into his mill, the more money you can make.  The more "downtime to failure" he builds into his mill, or the more expensive he makes parts, the more money he takes out of your pocket and the harder it becomes to make a profit.  It should be a high item on shopping. But, carrying that forward toward the purchase of a second mill is something that we generally let slide.   We step over dollars to pick up dimes when we run blades past their efficiency, or, purchase inferior materials solely on cost.   We waste a lot of time not trusting the Research and Development of our manufacturers when many of us re-invent the wheel over and over again.  It's a good thing, and a fun thing, to challenge existing design, but, it should be done when the existing design fails or when we have nothing else better to do.   Most of these bands and mills have been tested in their configuration to do what they are advertised to do.  When you think of it for a moment, it's a great feeling to have the teams of testers and servicer's behind us the way we do.  By the same token, it behooves manufacturers to take advantage of the open coversation they could have with their customers.  It's a free development base if used properly.

Sawing lumber isn't all a science. It's the art part that keeps us with our hands on.  How the mill is balanced and how the blade removes stock is like using a good knife.  A poorly designed knife might get the job done, but it gets to be work real quick too.

We all go through the bulk band thing.  What you find is that the band welders buy up the machinery if a company goes out of business so that it doesn't end up on the street. I've seen it happen and know of a warehouse full of them that will never be sold.  It's that industry's way of self preservation.

We go through phases of thinking that one grease is better than another, or, one paint is better than another or one mill is better than another, all on decisions made in the short term.   So, It's OK to dream about better stuff, but it's better to acknowledge that you have a team behind you that doesn't want to put a product on the market that doesn't work.  It doesn't have to be a big company either.  The little companies are depending on reputation for profits too.

Blades/bands are strange animals.  While there are good and bad ones, we judge them based on our equipment an its use.  There are bands that some some wouldn't use if they were given to them and that same band might be used on another's machine as the best choice in the world.  Your manufacturer will give you a starting place and it behooves us all to pay attention to it.

I saw wood.  I found that retailing lumber was another industry and I didn't have time for it.   I also found that, by the time I had welded a broken band (at the industrial supply house) I had spent more money in time wasted than a new band would have cost, even though they only charged me a dollar or three.

One of the most important things to derive from making your own business is just what you want the business to be.  I found that I don't mind sharpening my own blades.  As a matter of fact, I like it.   But, I can see that as separate business for someone to have.  I wouldn't want to be in business sharpening other's blades.

Retailing lumber requires a storefront and someone to man it.  That is a business of its own.  Building storage buildings from wood you saw might be a business of its own that could end up interfering with the primary business.

Instead of approaching the world with a shotgun, I think we should approach it with a high powered rifle and try to hit the target dead center every day.  There is plenty of time for growth, expansion, fiddling around in different areas of business and creating our own tools.  What is most important is that we recognize what we want to do, whittle it down to a manageable target and do it well.