Ideas for bleaching the inside of a log cabin

[ttf5003]

Hi,

I put up an eastern white pine log cabin last year in August but I didn't get the roof on until October. The inside of the logs weathered pretty badly and got dirty during that time.

I've started sanding the logs with a Rotex sander and they're coming out nice for the most part but getting in the grooves and along the corners and such will always be darker than the main part. Also the sandpaper is clogging pretty quickly.

It would be nice if I could treat it with a TSP/bleach solution first to brighten it but the basement has wiring and insulation in it already so I can't really rinse it with a hose. I'm afraid if I can't rinse the bleach well enough that it will affect the finish when I go to put it on.

Any ideas on anything else I can try or should I just keep sanding away?

Thanks,

Travis

[Don P]

Keep sanding. My experience with TSP is it attacks all your metal, never again.

[Walnut Beast]

Soda blast 💥 it

[twar]

In Scandinavia most all panelling is spruce or pine. To keep it light(er) we commonly use a wood lye solution, which is commonly available at the hardware/paint store. Google "wood lye" and see if you can source this near you.

[kantuckid]

I bought bulk sodium percarbonate on ebay last time I refinished our log home outside. It's the active ingredient in Oxyclean (10% as I recall). Mix as need and keep off yer hands & eyes. The best tool I've bought for such cleaning is called a "dairy barn brush" bought from a farm supply in ~ 1979. I still have it from over 40 years ago, bought to clean the inside of our home for the same exact reasons to ask about. It's a sort of oval plastic head with stiff nylon bristles.
It screws on a typical threaded wooden push broom handle (they come in metal or plastic too) and we used household bleach back then with a water rinse. There was no finish floor to be concerned with when done in our e.g.. Ammonia- household or janitorial strength? Ace hdwe sells it cheap. 
Murphy's Oil Soap from Walmart is another thought if you want to go mild? 
 

[jake pogg]

Keep sanding.

I'm with Don on this.

I cleaned the inside of a cabin i built 9 years ago,spruce,scribed logs sised vertically on inside and outside.

Vertical faces werent that challenging of course,but to get inside close to the scribe-line was difficult.

Hate to bring up even the concept of disc grinder,but it was one of the tools i had to use.
Rubber-backed 80 grit disc (4"),it's effective at removal of mat'l. Try to contact the disc to wood at such manner as to orient the scoring mostly with the grain.
4" Makita electric hand plane came in useful,also the 4x24 belt sander(a bear to hold horizontally,but at times useful,also for significant removal depth).
I cleaned up after all of these tools with an uncommonly-powerful random orbit disc,by Metabo,5". I think i went 80 grit and then 120(or meant to,may've left most areas at 80...(here's a funky emoticon wearing shades-it just appeared and won't be deleted...unintentional and of no meaning in this narrative 8)0).

It was brutal work,for a 5-sided cabin of about 1200 sq, ft. I think it took me a month and a half. very tough on arms and back,and of course uber dusty,so goggles and respirator if you can possibly tolerate these.

The result was acceptable,wood clean. final finish was clear,satin acrylic paint,it's not glossy at all,and walls can be cleaned with damp rag et c.
Also compatible with normally-acrylic chinking compounds if they're to be employed.

I'm saddened thinking about this subject as i too will have a cabin to clean up later this season. Finally just gotten to putting on tin today,in fact,so the clean-up of logs (inside,and eventually outside as well) is not too far off.

[kantuckid]

On the outside of my home I sanded the entire outer surface (over 300 16' logs) with a 5" Makita orbital disc sander for a re-finish.
 It was the spring following my completion of full shoulder motion PT for rotator cuff surgery the November prior. At my 6 mo post surgery checkup the doc asked if I could use it OK and I asked him if holding a sander with a fully extended arm on a ladder qualified. :D 
The sanding came after I'd cleaned it with the chemical mix I mentioned above. Off grid it gets lots tougher to use chemicals-thus I'd sand it too. 
Drift logging: my first thought was- wow, that's tough!, then I decided maybe easier than ground logging in some ways? 

[jake pogg]

Drift logging: my first thought was- wow, that's tough!, then I decided maybe easier than ground logging in some ways?

It's definitely easier than conventional logging in some ways.
The trees are already horizontal,they're even limbed,and very easily judged for straightness,against the perfect level plane of water they're floating on.
The main advantage is of course they're already in the water,the medium used traditionally as the most economic means to transport logs.

There're a number of problems of course. It takes a powerful saw to drag the chain through water(that immediately excludes lubrication of chain,i use Stihl 461,and really ought to put that Max-Flo filterkit on that,and port it too).
The root-ball must come off as the log is nearly impossible to tow with it on,but especially to raft up with other logs.

The economy in part comes from using a very small boat (as boom-boat essentially),mine is 14' long and i run anything from 9.8 to 15 h.p. on it.
Anything much bigger would not be maneuverable enough,as the drift run gets so thick at times that the logs,large and small,plus the small sticks and fragments get so as to form a continuous carpet. Running in all that is rough on everything below waterline,the prop at times sounding (and acting) as a coffee grinder...

I run a 25" bar on the saw and generally can cut through all the trees i target,rarely our trees exceed that in girth.
Holding the saw aloft over the side is pretty tough,as one imagines,and getting it pinched is not an option (i pack a scrench in my pocked so if  worse comes to worse to loose the cutting gear,saving the powerhead).

The trees with their vast root systems are spinning and bumping in the current,and there's definitely the potential to loose one's life if the physics suddenly turn against you in one of many ways.

The river is full of flotatious stuff,so that would make it hard to drown even in the event of loosing the boat,but the temperature of the water is only just above freezing this early on,some ice still in the river coming down,so being wet and partially submerged one wouldn't last but a very short time.

But when has Any logging been safe?...:(

 

 

[ttf5003]

Thanks for all the replies. I'll keep working at it with the rotex and the sanders tomorrow. I'm worried even a mild detergent that I can't rinse off might cause me trouble with finishes down the road.

The wood lye looks interesting and I learned something reading about it. Only trouble with that is I have finished some of the other interior boards already and I don't think it would look good to mix them.

I'll try to remember to take some pictures.

[kantuckid]

Concerns with residue might be alleviated by using solvents, not water based. Try mineral spirits (which might be too oily), then stronger ones if need be. They might clean it up OK as they cut the resins thus allowing the rest to come loose on a rag. 

[Tom King]

How tight are the joints you need to get into?  I would probably try scrapeing it.  

I can advise scrapers if that is a consideration.  It's a lot less messy than sanding, and doesn't take as long as you might think.  A sharp scraper leaves a smooth surface.

[Stephen1]

The easiest and best way to mechanically prepare your logs is to use a sand blast system using soda, or I have heard of dry ice pellets, they melt and disappear. Since you are not living in the place yet I would sand blast with the cheapest medium available and then stain inside and out. You will also have to do the outside logs  of logs also to prep before staining. The US Forestry service has a lot of articles on prepping wood for staining. UV degradation starts with in  24 hrs of sunlight. 

[kantuckid]

Olympic brands sells a wood lye based wood stripper. I have some scars to show you from what it does to human arms. But it works OK.
 I originally tried corn cob grit, the typical log cleaner media used by pros but I was using my own small sandblast gun, similar to a paint gun sprayer and a mobile small air compressor. It just wasn't effective with that size compressor. They can be rented a few places. 
As a lifetime woodworker, I own several scrapers and use them some, but I find the idea of scraping an entire cabin pretty tough compared to a power sander.  
I can see soda blasting or dry ice working if worth the expense/effort is the thing there.

Best plan is to have been able to pressure wash them lightly, not to damage levels and before erection, which I wish I could do now, but no water near my logs to use my PW. Then you'd have only some light surface cleaning left when enclosed.   

[Don P]

We had one homeowner that really like bluestained logs, requested them of the log home supplier and they were only too happy to fill that order. The funky logs arrived with the rain and by the time we got dried in about a month later they were in full bloom. Not being his mamma's brightest child, he ignored the warning to put on a mask, began sanding, and made himself quite sick. We can handle some nuisance dust but that kind of job goes well above and beyond. A little creative shaping and I do think scraping in the recesses would be quicker and could get in there better than sanding.

[Tom King]

This will do Way more than it looks like it would, judging by the size of it, and it's worth what it costs.  The carbide cutters last a long time.

https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/hand-tools/scrapers/110314-detail-hand-scraper?item=50K6601

If you can sharpen this one, which is easy with a 6 or 8" mill file, it and the detail scraper can do a square foot in about a minute, with almost nothing to breathe, or get in the air.

https://www.floorsupplies.net/products/1-x-11-wooden-handle-floor-scraper-with-red-devil-blade?variant=32044992331908&currency=USD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&utm_campaign=gs-2020-04-02&utm_source=google&utm_medium=smart_campaign&gclid=Cj0KCQjwwJuVBhCAARIsAOPwGAQzJY7SPLjC-lZ5BH9YBOKm3asRBNYB4Bx1bGxLYoCYl1VpEbZWW1IaAn65EALw_wcB

[kantuckid]

Maybe so but seems slow in my mind vs. a 5" dia sanding pad?
 I did use a Fein detail sander on my entire PT deck that's about 8' x 40' after a sad experience with a low VOC finish that failed miserably. A scraper would have been a tough tool to do that deck with and the only other option was chemicals IMO. 

Perhaps a childhood full of scraping white house paint & gray & green porches lingers in my senior mind :D 
Not a nice job even using heat. 

[Tom King]

Definitely slower, but a lot less messy.   That second scraper is what pro floor finishers use to scrape corners.  At least it's one shot and done.

[Walnut Beast]

If you use Natrium (Soda) it comes in different granular size. The 260 Natrium is the medium one. They make a finer one 150 and one more course 300. You can also use a water injection nozzle with water at the same time to cut dust down to nothing. This is the 260 Natrium application. Most fire & mold restoration, automotive & diesel engines, aerospace parts, turbines, pumps, turbo chargers, tanks, valves, and remanufacturing. Heavy coatings. Applications where efficiencies would be realized by degreasing and removing coatings in a single step.

[Walnut Beast]

Dry ice vs Soda. Know the difference. https://insights.globalspec.com/article/6820/dry-ice-vs-soda-blasting?fbclid=IwAR3SzCzQm8r1xWPMqssAcHCH7rT_aBLSVkmTfJM9I8k5J-cs-IBcjTazy-Y

[kantuckid]

FWIW: There are many various medias used to clean or surface various materials. Blasting via nut shells, glass beads, corn cob grit, abrasive flint sands, soda, steam, pressured water and on and on and on. When I worked in industry, we used mostly steam to clean off a fork truck prior to attempting repairs. The crud was deep and grungy!
 Inside a log building that's new & unoccupied, I'd use a chemical mix and/or abrasives.   

[Walnut Beast]

The beauty of soda blasting is no profile change and absolutely no health or environmental problems and it has a food safe status. Sure you could use a Hotsy pressure washer crank the heat up and put a roto nozzle on. But it's just like painting. You can use a Rustolem  to paint your semi or use a Imron. What's the quality of work you want, how much do you want to spend. You usually get what you pay for

[Walnut Beast]

https://www.armex.com/armex-soda-blasting-media-versus-crushed-glass