The Forestry Forum

I figured we could start a new thread to talk about anything related to maple syrup and sap production for the 2017 season.

We started tapping this week, earliest we have ever started. Added 7200 new for us this year, been busy with installations all year long.

Might have some big news to share in the near future- we could be getting a new woods to lease  ;)

Got a new machine to test out too- a can am 6x6, with a track kit on it. See how it goes in the snow. The woods we are tapping now is a long ways from the tank to the first trees.

How's everybody coming along? Anyone tapping yet? Got a run of sap yet?

I want to see a picture of that can am 6x6, with a track kit on it.  :D
Really small scale on my end. No sugar shack this year,I had a thread on it last year and the stove part.

We were just talking about getting ready for maple syrup season yesterday.  Our ice fishing shack is also our syrup shack.  When we were fishing yesterday we were talking about how we only have a month or so of comfortable fishing left before we will need to move the shack and set it up for syrup.

We added about 400 new taps this past Summer, so now we're up to right around 1,600 taps.

We made 185 gallons with 1,200 taps last season, so we should do pretty good this year!

We cleared everything but Maples out of a 4-5 acre woods for tapping next year (2018).

We set the pans on the evaporator this morning, so it's all set now!

Should be tapping in 3-4 weeks!

Good luck everyone!

Quote from: thecfarm on January 20, 2017, 06:57:18 AM
I want to see a picture of that can am 6x6, with a track kit on it.  :D
Really small scale on my end. No sugar shack this year,I had a thread on it last year and the stove part.

It is a beast! We didn't test it out yet, the tracks just got installed today, but holy cow it's huge with the tracks, way bigger than I was expecting. It's wider, longer and has way more ground clearance than the polaris big boss 6x6's we have been using. We didn't have tracks for those though, just tire chains.

Got about 6000 tapped so far. Gotta repair some big pipes tomorrow, a tree hit a bulls-eye right on some T's on our conductor pipes. Busted them both, air and liquid line separated both directions....

Pulling the first line.  That's Jordan Hunt of Michigan Maple Systems our regional Leader Maple Equipment dealer.  We got a few runs pulled in yesterday.  Lots more to do before season.  We've got about 1,500 potential taps.  We're concentrating on this lot first which has 600-700.  If there's time we'll work on the other lot.  Still have work in the sugar shack to do.  The evaporator, R.O. and vacuum pump will be here the middle of next month.  Lots to do.  Spring isn't far away.



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The pump house where the vacuum releaser and pump will be.  It's 900 feet from here to the sugar shack across the hayfield.



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 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10027/WP_20161210_11_33_41_Pro5B15D.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1484961440)

I want to try some of this fresh maple syrup

Quote from: bucknwfl on January 21, 2017, 01:55:02 AM
I want to try some of this fresh maple syrup

There should be plenty of it very soon. Alot of people still have syrup to sell from last year as well.
We made a little over 17,000 gallons last season. Hope to get there or top it this year too!

This guy might have some.
maple flats syrup (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,79853.20.html)

I am still using mine from last season. I doubt I could tell the diffance in taste of what I had bottled up last year and this year.

Syrup certainly doesn't go bad if it's stored and packaged properly. The only way to get truly "fresh" syrup is hot off the evaporator.
I think you can tell the flavors better after it's cooled down. Hot off the evaporator is nice though!

Quote from: celliott on January 21, 2017, 06:27:33 PM
Syrup certainly doesn't go bad if it's stored and packaged properly. The only way to get truly "fresh" syrup is hot off the evaporator.
I think you can tell the flavors better after it's cooled down. Hot off the evaporator is nice though!

Hot off the evaporator is the only way to offer newbies a sample as for many it is like a laxative.
Of course most sugar houses, for tax purposes, do not have bathrooms.
Smile as you serve it you sly devil,
Gerald

Quote from: GAB on January 21, 2017, 07:24:35 PM

Quote from: celliott on January 21, 2017, 06:27:33 PM
Syrup certainly doesn't go bad if it's stored and packaged properly. The only way to get truly "fresh" syrup is hot off the evaporator.
I think you can tell the flavors better after it's cooled down. Hot off the evaporator is nice though!

Hot off the evaporator is the only way to offer newbies a sample as for many it is like a laxative.
Of course most sugar houses, for tax purposes, do not have bathrooms.
Smile as you serve it you sly devil,
Gerald 

We have an outhouse, so emergencies can be dealt with!   ;)   ::)

Been tapping a Bud lite keg. No snow shoes required.

Quote from: ozarkgem on January 22, 2017, 06:28:56 PM
Been tapping a Bud lite keg. No snow shoes required.

And I'm on snowshoes all day every day poking holes in trees, wishing I was tapping a keg. I must be doing something wrong.


Nah, I still love it  8) It just makes the beer taste that much better at the end of the day!

Chris;  Might I ask, how many taps does your outfit have?

Gotta be a lot to make 17,000 gallons last year!

The biggest outfit around here claims 60 barrels in one day last season!

 :)

Last year we boiled from approx. 35,000. We had one producer with about 8,000 taps that sold us sap the whole year, so we didn't have to tap it or take care of it, just boil. Our own trees that we have to tap, vacuum check and maintain, is approximately 36,000 this year. I think we are still getting sap from the one producer again, so our boiled from # will be higher.

60 barrels a day is quite alot! Assuming 40 gallon drums that's 2400 gallons. We had a few 1200 gallon days.

Off to tap more trees. Hopeful to get our coldest, steepest woods done today. We do it first before the snow gets unreasonably deep. approx. 8000 taps, we should be in good shape to finish it today.

I probably wont tap until the end of Feb, depending on the weather. We use mostly buckets ,so our window for sap is a lot shorter then tubing. Do you get most of your supplys from Goodriches?  I usually get up there for my filters and buckets. I was up to Ed Farrs a few weeks ago and picked up an old "NEW" Marlin. I see the Langmaid brothers every once in a while . They usually cost me money !!! ;D ;D

Quote from: loggah on January 24, 2017, 01:15:23 PM
I probably wont tap until the end of Feb, depending on the weather. We use mostly buckets ,so our window for sap is a lot shorter then tubing. Do you get most of your supplys from Goodriches?  I usually get up there for my filters and buckets. I was up to Ed Farrs a few weeks ago and picked up an old "NEW" Marlin. I see the Langmaid brothers every once in a while . They usually cost me money !!! ;D ;D

Loggah, I work for Glenn Goodrich.

Sounds like you know my area fairly well!

Do you know Steve Davis? He drives sap truck for us in the spring.

I might know him by sight,i usually go up to Goodriches a few times during sugaring season.

Loggah
Good to hear from ya :)

You to, I know you been going thru a rough time !!!!! :o

There isn't the density of maple that you NE guys have, here in AR, but my acreage has enough to run a good number of taps for me.  My evaporator tray is being tweaked by some sheet metal guys now, should be done tomorrow. I plan on running 100 taps this season to get my feet wet, and go up from there. Based on wandering my property I think we could run 250-300 max. Just a hobby.

With 100 taps, you'll have enough syrup for your family and still have a little left over to sell! 

Have fun, it is interesting!

Quote from: RPowers on January 24, 2017, 08:59:24 PM
There isn't the density of maple that you NE guys have, here in AR, but my acreage has enough to run a good number of taps for me.  My evaporator tray is being tweaked by some sheet metal guys now, should be done tomorrow. I plan on running 100 taps this season to get my feet wet, and go up from there. Based on wandering my property I think we could run 250-300 max. Just a hobby.

With 100 taps if you have a good year you could expect as much as 15-20 gallons of finished syrup.  The last couple years I have been averaging 5-7 taps per gallon of syrup.

We've got one short 3/4" mainline left to run first thing in the AM and we think we'll get the wet/dry hung up tomorrow.

I'm going to tap my maples for the first time in eight years.  Got to get a new pan made for my 55-gallon drum arch.  Probably going to do about 20 taps, used to use old-school metal spiles and buckets, this year it will be a small plastic spile, a short length of tubing to a 5-gallon bucket w/ lid.  I can only boil on weekends so I have to collect for the week.  Hope the weather cooperates.

That works pretty good, Engineer!

If the tree is big enough, put in additional taps, proportional to the size of the tree, and put the end of the line in a 5-gallon pail!

We see quite a few of those setups in yards in this area!

Engineer, unless you have stuff already, try 3/16" tubing for that, it should work really well.

  We got the wet/dry hung up today.  I'm going to work on the shack the next few days as our advisor is advising others until Tuesday ;) 8)  Tuesday we hope to get the main lines tied into the wet dry and start hanging the 5/16" laterals on Wednesday.
  I've been meaning to get some pics but we're pretty busy during the day  ;D and it's been foggy, snowy and generally crappy for photos as well as working outside :) :)

What is a wet dry?
I just tap walnut trees may have as many as 12 taps this year.

  The wet dry is the main lines that carry vacuum and the sap.  The top line is the vacuum line and the bottom is for sap.  They are connected where the 3/4" mainlines enter the wet dry.  Having a separate line for sap and vacuum makes the vacuum transfer more efficient.  I'll get some pics when we start plumbing them together :)

Quote from: Corley5 on January 27, 2017, 04:34:39 PM
    Having a separate line for sap and vacuum makes the vacuum transfer more efficient.

It also greatly increases the carrying capacity of the size pipe used for your liquid line. For example, a 3\4" mainline is rated for up to 200-250 taps. Make that a 1" air line over 3\4 liquid line and you're good for about 1000 taps. The liquid line can be 100% full and vacuum still transferred to mainlines with the air line.
Checking vacuum leaks becomes easier as well because you can isolate mainlines that have leaks, VS a mono-pipe system where one leak affects the whole line.

How are you tying your mainlines in Corley? We use stainless steel pipe fittings to create a manifold that T's into the air, liquid, and mainline, with ball valves and a vacuum gauge.

We are almost 1\2 tapped. Think the crew did about 2800 today, averaged about 400 per person. That's with fixing alot of down lines and squirrel chews  >:(
We are on pace to get all tapped in record time this year. We usually haven't even started tapping yet, and we've got about 13,000 done.

That's what we're using minus the vac gage.  Our mains are 3/4" and the wet dry is 1 1/4".  We'll have more than 500 taps in this lot.  My son and I did an estimate last fall and figured there may be as many as 750.
  The wet dry will be extended to take in the other woodlot for the 2018 season.  There's another 1,000 or so over there.  We're going to slick out some veneer logs there first.  The lot we're working in now has been tapped previously and has very few veneer candidates.  The other lot is different  ;D 8)
  We're considering a remote monitoring system.  Leader is the U.S. dealer for the Magika systems. 

Anyone have sap ladders in their bush ???  We've got one spot that needs one.  It'll serve 30 or 40 taps.

They work just fine . add extra tee's in case you flow more than what 12 lines can handle . My brother has 2 ladders on one main . we had to go with 3 stars top and bottom . I think he is close to 200 taps on that line . He maintains 25 to 26 inches if we can control the squirrel bites .

  We've been carrying shotguns while working to deal with the red squirrels.  I hear squirrels are a real problem especially after the first season.
  Knocked off a BIG porcupine the other day  :(  Judging by the size of the quills it was sporting I'm sure it was the one my dogs tangled with last fall.

I don't know what it is, but squirrels like to chew on the plastic lines, fortunately, we don't get much damage from them!

About two more weeks and we'll be tapping!

Always anxious at this point, to get started!

Happy sugaring, guys!   8)

We don't get much squirrel damage in out woods thankfully, but we get enough. We did an installation earlier this year, and I guess after we left about 2000 taps worth of lines were on the ground. Critters chewed every single end hook off and dissapeared with them. Coyotes and bears bit mainlines, it was a mess!

We're tapping a new woods right now. Around 7000, all fresh trees :) makes for fun drilling. Except the terrain is crazy steep. Like 150% slope steep. I still was able to tap 500 trees today although it felt like I did 700 or 800.

Bring on the sap!

This year I am thinking of setting up a small pipeline system.  I am planning on doing it a cheaply as possible and that means a homemade sap releaser and vacuum pump.  The releaser I think I have figured out I don't know if my pump will be have enough vacuum.

I am converting a 1 cylinder engine into the pump and it should be capable of around 20-25 cfm and around 20 in/hg.  Is that enough to use on a pipeline?  I know ideally you want closer to 27in/hg at the pump but will 20in/hg be enough?  Also will the cfm be enough?

Quote from: Joe Hillmann on February 03, 2017, 09:58:01 AM
This year I am thinking of setting up a small pipeline system.  I am planning on doing it a cheaply as possible and that means a homemade sap releaser and vacuum pump.  The releaser I think I have figured out I don't know if my pump will be have enough vacuum.

I am converting a 1 cylinder engine into the pump and it should be capable of around 20-25 cfm and around 20 in/hg.  Is that enough to use on a pipeline?  I know ideally you want closer to 27in/hg at the pump but will 20in/hg be enough?  Also will the cfm be enough?

For ten taps or less you should be ok.  For 10000 or more taps you will need a larger vacuum pump.
The long and short of it is there is insufficient info to properly answer your question.
Gerald

Quote from: GAB on February 03, 2017, 10:16:06 AM

Quote from: Joe Hillmann on February 03, 2017, 09:58:01 AM
This year I am thinking of setting up a small pipeline system.  I am planning on doing it a cheaply as possible and that means a homemade sap releaser and vacuum pump.  The releaser I think I have figured out I don't know if my pump will be have enough vacuum.

I am converting a 1 cylinder engine into the pump and it should be capable of around 20-25 cfm and around 20 in/hg.  Is that enough to use on a pipeline?  I know ideally you want closer to 27in/hg at the pump but will 20in/hg be enough?  Also will the cfm be enough?

For ten taps or less you should be ok.  For 10000 or more taps you will need a larger vacuum pump.
The long and short of it is there is insufficient info to properly answer your question.
Gerald

We are looking at doing 80 to 100 taps on the pipe line system.  There is probably 25-30 feet of drop from the top of the hill to where our tank and pump would be mounted.  The mainline would be about 500 feet with laterals set up 5 or 6 trees on each branch.

I don't really know much about pipeline systems other than what I have read(I hope to be able to tour one locally to see how it is done in person in the next few weeks). 

It is only a hobby so I have a hard time justifying even the cost of the tubing and fuel and for sure couldn't justify the cost of buying a proper pump and releaser.

For the releaser I plan to build something very similar to this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfmadtYqWew
only one valve and the rest is done with counterweights.

There is no electric where I am tapping so my plan is to have the pump powered by a gas engine.  The idea is to go out to the woods around 11:00am, fill the gas tank with 5 hours worth of gas, start the engine and let the vacuum run until the engine runs out of gas and shuts off.  Then the next day do the same thing and while I am there empty the tank and bring the sap home.

As I said I am new to using a pipeline so I don't know if any of my ideas will work.

Joe Hillman, a couple thoughts.

For the amount of taps you are suggesting, instead of a gas powered pump and homemade releaser, you might look into a sap puller diaphragm type pump. It can run off electricity (generator) requires no releaser, and is very maintenance free. Can use up to ~ 1200 taps and will pull 25" of vacuum.

Another option for your size operation, is to use 3\16" tubing just gravity feed. Don't even use a mainline, just run all your tubing lines from your tank into the woods, 20 or so taps per line will work good. No pumps at all, no mainline, no wire, no wire ties, and I'd wager the 3\16" tubing would perform well enough like that you would be swimming in sap!
This would also be by far your cheapest option. You're into it a few rolls of tubing, fittings and droplines. That's it. This is what I would recommend unless you have plans to eventually expand to upwards of 500 taps.

What do you have for evaporation equipment?

Quote from: celliott on February 03, 2017, 04:56:45 PM
Joe Hillman, a couple thoughts.

For the amount of taps you are suggesting, instead of a gas powered pump and homemade releaser, you might look into a sap puller diaphragm type pump. It can run off electricity (generator) requires no releaser, and is very maintenance free. Can use up to ~ 1200 taps and will pull 25" of vacuum.

Another option for your size operation, is to use 3\16" tubing just gravity feed. Don't even use a mainline, just run all your tubing lines from your tank into the woods, 20 or so taps per line will work good. No pumps at all, no mainline, no wire, no wire ties, and I'd wager the 3\16" tubing would perform well enough like that you would be swimming in sap!
This would also be by far your cheapest option. You're into it a few rolls of tubing, fittings and droplines. That's it. This is what I would recommend unless you have plans to eventually expand to upwards of 500 taps.

What do you have for evaporation equipment?

I have thought of going with 3/16 tubing.  But my understanding is that it needs 30 or so feet of drop from the last tap.  At most I have 30 feet of drop from the first.

For an evaporator we have a flat pan that is about 26x32 on an arch made from an old heating oil drum and a blower.

It's not a need, exactly. It will perform better with more drop, IE more natural vacuum further up your tubing line, but it will certainly still work (and work well) with less than 30ft of elevation drop. Vacuum will be highest at the last tap, and zero at the end, no matter what. Just maintain some downward grade all the way to your tank and it will be fine, and still outperform 5\16 tubing. You'll be swimming in sap.

If you really want to get into a tubing system on the cheap, this is the way to go. If you don't have any tools and stuff, get the Dominon and Grimm (D&G) soft blue tubing. You will be able to put together all your fittings without any special tools and make your droplines. Heat (or give it a quick chew) the end and push them together, easy. Would require a second set of hands for droplines, but better than buying a $250 tubing tool for 100 taps. No mainline means no high tensile wire, wire ties, pipe fittings, anchors, saddle fittings and tools, etc. etc.
Otherwise, leader 30p 3\16 comes in an 800ft roll (vs 500ft) for about the same money. But way stiff for droplines and needs a tool to put fittings in.

Just my 2 cents though. We do tubing installations for people. Probably installed 25,000 taps of 3\16 tubing this season. We're sold on using it for vacuum pump systems and gravity systems.

Quote from: celliott on February 03, 2017, 09:33:47 PM
It's not a need, exactly. It will perform better with more drop, IE more natural vacuum further up your tubing line, but it will certainly still work (and work well) with less than 30ft of elevation drop. Vacuum will be highest at the last tap, and zero at the end, no matter what. Just maintain some downward grade all the way to your tank and it will be fine, and still outperform 5\16 tubing. You'll be swimming in sap.

If you really want to get into a tubing system on the cheap, this is the way to go. If you don't have any tools and stuff, get the Dominon and Grimm (D&G) soft blue tubing. You will be able to put together all your fittings without any special tools and make your droplines. Heat (or give it a quick chew) the end and push them together, easy. Would require a second set of hands for droplines, but better than buying a $250 tubing tool for 100 taps. No mainline means no high tensile wire, wire ties, pipe fittings, anchors, saddle fittings and tools, etc. etc.
Otherwise, leader 30p 3\16 comes in an 800ft roll (vs 500ft) for about the same money. But way stiff for droplines and needs a tool to put fittings in.

Just my 2 cents though. We do tubing installations for people. Probably installed 25,000 taps of 3\16 tubing this season. We're sold on using it for vacuum pump systems and gravity systems.

Do you have a preference for which taps to use with 3/16 tubing?

Quote from: celliott on February 03, 2017, 09:33:47 PM
No mainline means no high tensile wire, wire ties, pipe fittings, anchors, saddle fittings and tools, etc. etc.

When using 3/16 how do you keep it tight?  Just put a tap in the tree, put the tubing on and stretch it tight to the next tree?  Do you need it so tight so there is no sag where sap can collect or doesn't it matter much?

Will it still work if there is only a couple feet of drop from the tap closest to the barrel and the top of the barrel?

Joe,

For spouts we are using H20 brand and they are a softer material, they seal really well under vacuum. We replace spouts every year. CDL makes a polycarbonate clear spout we liked last year.

As far as keeping tubing tight, yes it needs to be tight enough to not sag between trees. The way we run tubing, start at one end (probably the tank end) put the roll of tubing on your left arm andspin it/unravel it as you go up the hill. Try to go back and forth between trees to keep tension on the line, you might bump against some non maple trees to prevent long spans. If you still find it is loose, when you cut in droplines, simply cut out what slack you need to to prevent sagging.

So, I would stretch a wire above your barrel/tank. Attach a connector with hook to the end of your tubing. Unravel/spin the tubing roll on your left arm as you work up the hill, going back and forth between the maple trees so the tubing stays against one side of the maple, keeping tension on tue tubing as you go. When you get to the last tree, wrap once around the tree and cut your tubing, attaching an end hook fitting. You have just run a tubing line. Pick the next end tree and work down the hill. I'd shoot for a minimum of 10 trees, upward of 20 per line is fine.
Sorry if I'm not explaining real well. I do this all the time so it makes sense to me, but my explanations might be lacking. It'd be way easier to show it. If you weren't so far away if come help ya!

Yes it will work with just a few feet of drop. Think of it simply as water running downhill. As long as a downhill grade of some degree is maintained all the way to the tank, sap will come out the end. With less slope it becomes more important to prevent saggy spots. If you have a 45 degree slope, a little sag doesn't matter, it'll still make it downhill. 2-3%? Tubing must be tight and not saggy. However the nice thing about 3/16 is it does not need to be super tight because it's lighter and won't sag under it's own weight as bad as 5/16 (which can be run VERY tight).

Quote from: celliott on February 04, 2017, 06:01:53 AM
Joe,

For spouts we are using H20 brand and they are a softer material, they seal really well under vacuum. We replace spouts every year. CDL makes a polycarbonate clear spout we liked last year.

As far as keeping tubing tight, yes it needs to be tight enough to not sag between trees. The way we run tubing, start at one end (probably the tank end) put the roll of tubing on your left arm andspin it/unravel it as you go up the hill. Try to go back and forth between trees to keep tension on the line, you might bump against some non maple trees to prevent long spans. If you still find it is loose, when you cut in droplines, simply cut out what slack you need to to prevent sagging.

So, I would stretch a wire above your barrel/tank. Attach a connector with hook to the end of your tubing. Unravel/spin the tubing roll on your left arm as you work up the hill, going back and forth between the maple trees so the tubing stays against one side of the maple, keeping tension on tue tubing as you go. When you get to the last tree, wrap once around the tree and cut your tubing, attaching an end hook fitting. You have just run a tubing line. Pick the next end tree and work down the hill. I'd shoot for a minimum of 10 trees, upward of 20 per line is fine.
Sorry if I'm not explaining real well. I do this all the time so it makes sense to me, but my explanations might be lacking. It'd be way easier to show it. If you weren't so far away if come help ya!

Yes it will work with just a few feet of drop. Think of it simply as water running downhill. As long as a downhill grade of some degree is maintained all the way to the tank, sap will come out the end. With less slope it becomes more important to prevent saggy spots. If you have a 45 degree slope, a little sag doesn't matter, it'll still make it downhill. 2-3%? Tubing must be tight and not saggy. However the nice thing about 3/16 is it does not need to be super tight because it's lighter and won't sag under it's own weight as bad as 5/16 (which can be run VERY tight).

I think that was a pretty good explanation.  I think I understood it.

Just to make a couple things clear.  From the line you ran you then cut it (with it still under tension) put a T in it and run a tubing/dropline from the T to the tap in the tree?  Once I have as many trees tapped on the line as long as everything is tight that's it?

How do you attach the wire to the end of the line near the barrel?

The end farthest away from the the barrel is completely blocked off so no air can get in there? Correct?

Once I get to the top of the hill can I keep going with the pipeline being pretty flat as long as it goes down hill at the other end?

To get more slope can I drill into the trees much higher than I normally would if I was using buckets?

Do you set up the droplines so they and the taps are also helping support the line?

These may be stupid questions but since I have someone answering them I'm going to ask rather than guessing or assuming.

Quote from: Joe Hillmann on February 04, 2017, 03:29:16 PM

Quote from: celliott on February 04, 2017, 06:01:53 AM
Joe,

For spouts we are using H20 brand and they are a softer material, they seal really well under vacuum. We replace spouts every year. CDL makes a polycarbonate clear spout we liked last year.

As far as keeping tubing tight, yes it needs to be tight enough to not sag between trees. The way we run tubing, start at one end (probably the tank end) put the roll of tubing on your left arm andspin it/unravel it as you go up the hill. Try to go back and forth between trees to keep tension on the line, you might bump against some non maple trees to prevent long spans. If you still find it is loose, when you cut in droplines, simply cut out what slack you need to to prevent sagging.

So, I would stretch a wire above your barrel/tank. Attach a connector with hook to the end of your tubing. Unravel/spin the tubing roll on your left arm as you work up the hill, going back and forth between the maple trees so the tubing stays against one side of the maple, keeping tension on tue tubing as you go. When you get to the last tree, wrap once around the tree and cut your tubing, attaching an end hook fitting. You have just run a tubing line. Pick the next end tree and work down the hill. I'd shoot for a minimum of 10 trees, upward of 20 per line is fine.
Sorry if I'm not explaining real well. I do this all the time so it makes sense to me, but my explanations might be lacking. It'd be way easier to show it. If you weren't so far away if come help ya!

Yes it will work with just a few feet of drop. Think of it simply as water running downhill. As long as a downhill grade of some degree is maintained all the way to the tank, sap will come out the end. With less slope it becomes more important to prevent saggy spots. If you have a 45 degree slope, a little sag doesn't matter, it'll still make it downhill. 2-3%? Tubing must be tight and not saggy. However the nice thing about 3/16 is it does not need to be super tight because it's lighter and won't sag under it's own weight as bad as 5/16 (which can be run VERY tight).

I think that was a pretty good explanation.  I think I understood it.

Just to make a couple things clear.  From the line you ran you then cut it (with it still under tension) put a T in it and run a tubing/dropline from the T to the tap in the tree?  Once I have as many trees tapped on the line as long as everything is tight that's it?

How do you attach the wire to the end of the line near the barrel?

The end farthest away from the the barrel is completely blocked off so no air can get in there? Correct?

Once I get to the top of the hill can I keep going with the pipeline being pretty flat as long as it goes down hill at the other end?

To get more slope can I drill into the trees much higher than I normally would if I was using buckets?

Do you set up the droplines so they and the taps are also helping support the line?

These may be stupid questions but since I have someone answering them I'm going to ask rather than guessing or assuming.

No question is stupid if you don't know the answer. I do this stuff all the time, so I know. I'd like to run a bandsaw mill, but if you put me in control of an LT40 hydraulic I'd be asking a few questions before sawing any lumber.

On the droplines- Yes, cut it while under tension and splice in a 3 way T. Two ends attach to the tubing line, the upward hole gets a piece of tubing ~ 36" long. This is your dropline. Spout attaches to the end. 36" gives you lots of freedom to tap all over the tree, preventing cluster tapping (like buckets, you only tap a certain height...) Cutting it while under tension will require a second set of hands, unless you purchase or make a dropline tool. The tool has two clamps, so you clamp both, cut the middle, open the tool up, and press your T in, the clamps hold the tubing tension. A good one will run you $150 or more. And yes, cut in the droplines, when you have it cut, you may take slack out if required at this time. Once you get a dropline at each tree, that tubing line is finished.

For your barrel, if you have two trees nearby, I would anchor, or wrap around (with some tree protection) a piece of wire to span over the barrel. The tubing lines will hook onto this wire with the hook connector. Sap should then drop into the barrel. Maybe you will need to attach a second piece of tubing on the other side of the connector to drop into the barrel.

The end of the tubing line (furthest from the barrel) will be sealed from air, yes. You will get an end of line fitting, some are a combination dropline and end hook, others are simply a hook that plugs into the tubing and hooks around the tree to the tubing line to secure it.

Once you get to the top of the hill, just maintain grade. It can't go uphill, then down, then back up again, must be a downhill grade the whole way (from the top). Imagine pouring water into the tubing at the end (top of the hill) will it run all the way down to the barrel without encountering a low spot or uphill? It can be fairly flat too, 2% slope is minimum I'd say, and you can't really see that with your eyeball.
You can cheat slope a little bit, by starting the line low and going to the next tree high, if that makes sense, and make your end tree higher as well. The tap/droplines should not hold the tubing up. If run properly against the trees and tensioned right, it will stay up on it's own.
When you tap, the dropline doesn't need to be tight, straight up and down, as high as it can go, but it shouldn't have a "belly" or sag from the tap down to the T. You can wrap it around the tree, go high, low, wherever, as long as it will run un-impeded to the T.

Small scale gravity tubing installation 101, via the Forestry Forum  :)

Quote from: celliott on February 04, 2017, 05:00:03 PM

On the droplines- Yes, cut it while under tension and splice in a 3 way T. Two ends attach to the tubing line, the upward hole gets a piece of tubing ~ 36" long. This is your dropline. Spout attaches to the end. 36" gives you lots of freedom to tap all over the tree, preventing cluster tapping (like buckets, you only tap a certain height...) Cutting it while under tension will require a second set of hands, unless you purchase or make a dropline tool. The tool has two clamps, so you clamp both, cut the middle, open the tool up, and press your T in, the clamps hold the tubing tension. A good one will run you $150 or more. And yes, cut in the droplines, when you have it cut, you may take slack out if required at this time. Once you get a dropline at each tree, that tubing line is finished.

If I don't want to spent the money on the proper tools would it possibly work to run the line.  Tension it.  Mark where I want all the splices to go.  Let off the tension.  Put in all the splices.  Then retension it? 

Also on the T's on the line, is it just the barbs that hold it or do you put clamps on each joint?

Some pictures of tying the wet/dry and main lines together 8) 8)  I thought I had one of a finished connection.  I was at a Farm Bureau conference Wednesday and Thursday but Jordan Hunt of Michigan Maple Systems and my hand Brandon got most of the 5/16 up.  There's one short line to finish and then we'll start cutting in drop lines.  We're moving along.  The vac pump and R.O. will be here Monday afternoon.  The evaporator next week.



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I would not recommend trying it that way. What will most likely happen will be that some of your droplines will not be in the right place. You'll get some too far away from the tree for the dropline to reach. Cutting them in while the tubing is tight ensures they will be in the proper place. You take that line down, there is no guarantee it will go back up the same way, with the same tension or stretch.

If you use the softer D&G tubing, you really don't need a tool. That's why I recommend it. It seems like you are budget conscious, and using this stuff you can get set up without fancy tools. Chew on the end a little and you can push every fitting you will need together.
The barbs on the dropline T will hold a surprising amount of tension. The tubing is soft and conforms and grips the barbs very well. No clamps required. If you're pulling fittings out of the tubing, it's way too tight.

So if you're gonna cut in droplines without a tool- you will need a second person to help you, or be very talented. Your helper holds the tubing line with both hands, you cut the tubing between their hands where you want the dropline to go (ideally about 3-6" away from the tree on the downhill side) then take one end, push the T in, grab the other end, push it on the T as well. Line is re-connected, and you're all set.

That is a little different style than we use Corley. We've done it that way and it definitely works, achieves the same purpose. Different strokes is all. I'll try and get a picture of one of our standard single mainline and double mainline manifolds.
I installed 22 of our single\double manifolds in a 7200 tap woods earlier this week. Was a nice break from tapping.

So, how do you connect this spiderweb?
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Here is a special manifold for the very end of a wet\dryline conductor system. It has 2x 3\4" mainlines and 2x 1" mainline coming into it, into a 1-1/4" airline over 1" liquid line. With the ballvalves you can isolate a mainline and watch the vacuum gauge to determine leaks. Typically we make these to connect one mainline, or two. This circumstance called for a special built unit. All woods setups are different.

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Looks like you have some wire tying to do Corley  ;)

Wow!! 8) 8) 8)
Lots of wire tying to do ;D  We got the wrong length for the wet dry and had to twist them together to get it hanging.  Longer ones are on Monday's truck.  We also ordered two of the auto twisters to speed the process up a bit ;) ;D 

Ah the auto twisters. I personally can't stand them. Seems about half of us like them, the other half like the manual ones. With practice we can really fly with the manual ones. Flying in the sense of moving 18 inches at a time  :D

Make bundles of ties sized so you can hold them in your fist. Use the hook on the tool to pull one end out of your hand, you're half hooked up already. Index finger on the loop of the tie\hook of tool, wrap the other end around the pipe with the other hand, twist away. Saves a bit of time. Wire tying is not the most glorious job of sugaring, but it's necessary.

We had one main fell on a corner twice . The first time we blamed the deer . Turned out when it got real cold the line shrunk to the point it pulled the twist out of the wire . Fixed by running the free end of the wire back thru the loop has held for 5 years now .

Not looking good here right now, rained all night and snow drifts and snow banks are all that's left!

Supposed to cool right down again though!

It was warm today, rained last night, we still have plenty of snow, and now it's heavy  ::)
Tapholes were a little wet today, sap was dribbling. Not enough to say so. Yup, now it's back to cold cold cold. High of 14 tomorrow, 7 on Friday. We have about 10,000 left to tap, and it's looking like we will be done plenty early before sap season really starts.

Anyone need help tapping? Thinking about freelancing on the weekends, maybe during the week if there is enough work.

The evaporator arch, pans, hoods and stacks, R.O., vacuum pump, filter press and tanks will be here tomorrow.  We're putting the end wall in the building and getting ready for a new roof on it.  Monday we're going to start cutting in drop lines.  I think we're going to make it.  Maybe :)  :D

We had a RO demo yesterday!  :)

Our next move is to tap, everything else is done!  8)

  Most of the equipment was delivered today.  The R.O., vacuum pump, evaporator arch with pans and stacks as well as firebrick.  We're lacking the sap pan hood and filter press.  The hood is on the next truck coming from Vermont.  We may not get the filter press we picked out just yet.  We'll have one.  The one we were supposed to get got back ordered due to a lack of diaphragm pumps.  I've been told manufacturers were forced to switch to air operated diaphragm pumps from bronze gear pumps because of bronze fines in syrup.  The cover for the smoke stack is still out too.  We got the top hats for the steam stacks.  I was going to take pics but the unloading took place during an Alberta Clipper.  When we were done we were done.  Supposed to be nicer tomorrow.  I'll take pics.  Going to work on the pump house.  It needs insulation and sheathing inside, the electric box mounted and vacuum releaser plumbed and wired.  We're getting there.

Thought I'd jump in here, from northwest mass but I go up and tap/pull taps for a few different sugar makers in south vt. We tapped one producer almost out on Jan 16th. 24000 taps total we put in 18000 in 5 days with 6 of us and 7 one day. Just tapped out a smaller producer last week with 6100 in 3.5 days with 3 of us going at it.

The going was unbelievably good with crampons or cork boots hard crust better then no snow. Could just fly around the sugar bush. Best tapping conditions in a few years.


Looking to start my own sugar operation on family land here in mass estimating around 8000 tap potential, virgin trees. Been planning and asking lots of questions for the last few years. Think I'm going to run line to the 3000 or so that are already thinned next summer.

In a week or two up to help finish tapping out a 28000 tap bush in the same area. They already have around 12000 in as of yesterday.

That's really cruising plankton!

Our crew of 6 can do 3000 in a day if we go hard. Depends alot on tap density, terrain, how much you have to fix\repair, and of course the snow.  Wednesday was rough, heavy wet snow. We have some steep stuff left to tap too. Like 60 degrees grade steep...... And a low density, really brushy, deep snow woods. Cuts down on daily production. About 10,000 left to tap.
Good snow\walking conditions help immensely!

Are spouts already on droplines when you tap, or do you put new ones on as you go?
What are you using for tapping drills?
We use the precision tapper attachments on Dewalt brushless motor 20v max XR drills. We can get 1000 holes out of one battery. Impressive drills to say the least.

Ya we were tearing up the woods because the snowpack was beyond perfect. Every sugar maker I know calls them something different but the stubbys/adaptors are already on the drops. The larger producer had just replaced a lot of the drops with new 40" 3/16 so good wood was really easy to find.

The smaller producer went ahead of us and pulled the drops off the plugs so they were hanging there made a suprising difference in speed. He's 78 and doesn't like to tap to much anymore but still gets around in the woods just fine. A wizard in the sugar house and makes some of the best syrup I've ever tasted, fires with wood too. He's been sugaring his whole life and has some wiked story's to tell.

We use the same dewalt 20v rapid tappers. Really nice and make excellent holes. Never gotten 1000 taps out of a battery though! That's awesome. We swap batterys out at lunch and ther ussually at 2 or one bars by then

Ground and density makes a huge difference, when we're on really steep grades ussually we have one guy on bottom of the laterals , one in the middle and one at the top

We don't use the stubby adaptors anymore. New spouts each year, cut them off when we pull them. So we're applying new spouts to every dropline. Having them hanging really does save time. A lot of ours are frozen/stuck on (pushed on too far when we pulled spouts) and we end up cutting each one. That takes a lot of time.

On steep slopes we do the same thing. 3 man right across the mainline. Just have to communicate so we dont miss 2 tappers or short lines.

Are your battery's new? We never change them out during the day. Not saying we do 1000 often! But it's very rare we can kill a battery in a day. Drillbit size could be a factor, depth, lots of things. I know those drills are pretty awesome though!

Ya the stubbys are fixed on the drops and we put new straight spouts in every year.

Batterys are probably year or two old, they do still drill fine at 2 bars but you can start to tell a difference if it warms up a little in the day.

Sounds like you know your stuff about running line so I had a question.

Im thinking of tapping two field edges at the farm here in mass this year. I was considering running 3/16 at around 2% or more of a grade (the fields are pretty much flat) then at the end of the line dropping down to a collection tub hopefully 30 ft or so. Which would be possible given the terrain.

Do you think this would give me any vacuum advantage?

Probably would total around 200 taps enough to cut my teeth on and dust off the old pan we've got lying around.

If all those hardwood species and the fall color were not enough you get maple syrup too. 

(insert emoticon for envy) :)

Quote from: Plankton on February 11, 2017, 12:53:17 PM
Sounds like you know your stuff about running line so I had a question.

Im thinking of tapping two field edges at the farm here in mass this year. I was considering running 3/16 at around 2% or more of a grade (the fields are pretty much flat) then at the end of the line dropping down to a collection tub hopefully 30 ft or so. Which would be possible given the terrain.

Do you think this would give me any vacuum advantage?

Probably would total around 200 taps enough to cut my teeth on and dust off the old pan we've got lying around.

Yup, that ought to work very well. On any given slope, 3\16 tubing will outperform 5\16 tubing in a gravity application. We even think it outperforms on high vacuum systems too, but that's not conclusive, and there are pros and cons to each size of tubing. But for gravity applications, yes, 3\16 is definitely the way to go.

The more slope\drop the better, obviously but as long as it makes grade it will work. You will see your highest vacuum level at the last tree, and the tank end will be zero. Don't be afraid to really load your tubing runs up, 20+ taps is good to go.

A perfect 3\16 gravity setup would have all your taps on a steep slope, and then dropping straight off a cliff to the tank. This would help achieve the high vacuum levels on all the taps. Obviously this isn't really possible, but if you can extend your tubing runs a bit further before the 1st tap (longer and more drop) you would see higher vacuum levels at each tree.

We figure with a high vacuum system we can lift sap about 12 vertical feet with 3\16 tubing, no sap ladder, just a regular tubing line, ran downhill. Not standard practice, but acceptable for those few hard to get trees. We also are experimenting with tapping below the lateral line with 3\16 droplines. We do this on trees that are not the healthiest, maybe they've been tapped awhile, etc. We would rather tap good wood and have it not leak than have it be above grade. Looks weird, I gotta say, but it works!

Thanks for the input! I'll do that then maybe borrow a vacuum guage and see what I'm pullin just for kicks.

As far as 3/16 drops below the lateral, we do that all the time on two different sugar farms. They  have 5/16 laterals with 3/16 drops and we ussually do 1 under 2 in middle and 2 high depending on the trees and the line of course but we shoot for a mix, makes it easier since most of there woods have been tapped since the 40s.

When we start having some fun giving twists and coils to the drops having them alternating like that makes a really cool lookin woods.

Weve found as long as you twist the drop so that the T on the lat. Is sticking up they perform good.

On the biggest trees with two taps they like us to do opposite sides one below the lateral and one high up

I have a couple Qs 
how far apart do you put taps on one tree? ( inches horizontal )

Is there a rule of thumb  for dia. of trunk to the number of taps ?

I have one tree that has four taps that will put out a gallon per tap and another that is larger that would not give me a quart .  any advice ,suggestions ,wisdom ?

Does it matter how high on the tree that the tap is ? I have seen many at about 3'  but have also seen them much higher.  is there an optimum height ?

Quote from: Don_Papenburg on February 11, 2017, 09:37:10 PM
I have a couple Qs 
how far apart do you put taps on one tree? ( inches horizontal )

Is there a rule of thumb  for dia. of trunk to the number of taps ?

I have one tree that has four taps that will put out a gallon per tap and another that is larger that would not give me a quart .  any advice ,suggestions ,wisdom ?

Does it matter how high on the tree that the tap is ? I have seen many at about 3'  but have also seen them much higher.  is there an optimum height ?

Everyone has different tapping guidelines, but I'll give you ours. We try not to tap smaller than 9" DBH trees. Multi stem trees are treated as individual stems if the fork is below DBH. If above, it is treated as one stem. 9" to about 20" get one tap. 20" get two taps. Real monsters may get 3 occasionally 4, but I'm talking about the 50" DBH field edge monsters, and this is only because our droplines can't effectively cover enough area. When we put two taps on a tree, we try to tap as close to 180 degrees opposite as we can. If you've ever seen taphole lumber, you will notice the stain, approximately 3" wide, and up to\over a foot long from the original taphole. This is unproductive wood, you should avoid tapping this close to previous tapholes.
If you are using buckets, you are really limited to where you can tap. This can lead to cluster tapping and actually girdling a tree. I cringe when I see a tree with buckets all the way around, same height. That'll kill a tree...
When using tubing and droplines, you have alot of options on where to tap, you have a 36" length of tubing to work with. We have tapped low, and as high as 10' off the ground (figure 2' of snow, i'm 6'2'' and can reach up about 8') you can wrap all the way around the tree, lots of choices.

As to why individual trees are putting out more\less sap, it could be a number of reasons. Health of the tree, the side (aspect) you are tapping, tapping into good wood\unproductive wood, really alot of factors come into play.

Our system is all on gravity, no vacuum!

We got all of our line barrels in place yesterday, and plan on tapping on the 16, 17 & 18th.

celliott,  Thanks for the info.       Are you saying that you tap360 degrees of the tree ?  I was told just the south half.           Then each year tap 3-4" either side of the previous years tap hole and 9-12" above or below ?   
I am close with your directions,  except for the multi taps,  I am a little close . Some are as close as 5" in the 16"and larger DBH .     I am up to 19 taps this year  in four different locations  .  Not  a lot of suitable walnut trees in the neighborhood.  even less maples.  I use 5gallon buckets and 5/16 tubing . No more than three tubes to a bucket.  That gives me 24hour turnaround . 

Yup, we tap all around the circumference of the tree. It'd be nice to only tap the south side of the tree but you'll run out of places to tap in a few years. Some people use a pattern, we try to do it totally random. We'll get the south side some years, others we wont. Tapping into good productive wood should be priority over anything else.

Put in my 300 taps this weekend. Others in the area tapped a week ago and have been getting some sap. Had to get my syrup pan fixed, so that delayed tapping. Tapping on the southern side of the tree is great for the beginning of the season but the north side taps should outperform them late in the season.

Thanks for that information ,  I will need that for next year. 
 

We tap the full circumference of the trees!

We are going to start tapping today, might also take most of tomorrow too!

Leader has cone pre filters . Would that be enough to eliminate the sugar sand? We will make maybe 3gallons this year , so the pump forced filter does not pencil out. What else  could I do to get sediment free syrup.

I don't think that one filtering process will do it Don!

If you want to "nearly" guarantee that you won't have any sediment, you would likely need to filter it 3-4 times!

That sugar sand is some mighty fine stuff, especially when you figure that it goes up through the veins of the Maple trees with the water (sap)!

We tapped a little over 700 yesterday and "might" finish the other 700+ today!

Thanks,  so I will need the fine filter papers that are used by the pressure filter .
Unless there is a gravity filtering system that would work.  Any ideas   on this ?

When I was a kid we made several gallons a year and just used a few layers of cheese cloth. It worked ok back then for home use. :-\

Don  Use a couple of the pre filters inside the regular cone filter. As the prefilter clogs up remove it, pouring the remaining syrup into the next prefilter. Do not heat the syrup above 195 after filtering it and it should stay clear.

We'll I'm really glad we got the majority of our tapping done before the snow got deep. We are knee deep or deeper on snowshoes, doing our steepest woods now... Production is cut in half. About 6000 left to go. We'll be done early, I think the boss got us another 1000 tap installation to do. That'll be fun!
Long range forecast here doesn't look like sap weather till mid march.

Little warm spell coming up over the weekend here so we're going to put in the last 1500 on a bush tommorow. Not looking forward to tramping through the snow but shire glad we already put in the other 23k or so taps on that ice pack.

Lots of guys here in mass haven't tapped yet. I think this year it was worth it to tap early not for the runs since there wernt many but for the going in the woods.

We finished tapping today, we have 1,521 taps total, 1,485 taps on-line and 36 on buckets!

Sap started running a little today, but nothing significant!

Maybe late tomorrow afternoon we'll need to gather!

It'll be nice to get going at it again!   8)

Well this year has been the worst since we moved here 5 years ago for sap production. We've had an exceptionally mild winter, hardly any nights since early January below freezing and frequent highs into the 60s. So not much sap is running and the bugs and mold are aweful. We managed to get a gallon made one week that stayed decently cool, but I'm not fighting the bugs and hot for another. By the time it cools down again the trees will have budded out, the red maples are already blooming and my peaches are wanting to. Bleah.

3 feet of snow at my camp. the long range forecast has the temperatures starting to look good. 

We gathered between 750 & 800 gallons of sap yesterday, ran it through the RO and boiled!

We drew off just under 5 gallons of "very lite" syrup!

Good taste, but I really prefer the Medium Amber!

We'll probably gather around 350 gallons this morning!

At the moment we have 125-ish taps.  The weather has been perfect, low 20's at night and sunny and 40"s in the day but the sap is just barley running.  In three days we have about 110 gallons of sap.  It took 21 hours over two days to boil it down into 2-3 gallons of finished syrup. 

I am really thinking of building a bigger pan so we can boil it down faster.

With the warm weather day and night we have predicted to be coming up I am worried the trees may bud out and that will end our season before it really started.

I plan to put out some buckets this week. No more than 20. The days will be warm enough I should get something being on a southern slope.

Weird weather here.  Hasn't hardly froze at night and in the 40s during the day.  Haven't missed much if anything. Supposed to be very warm, maybe record highs, before it gets cold the end of the week.  We cut in 300 drop lines yesterday.  Should just about get done with them today and will make the connections to the 3/4 lines tomorrow.  Hoping to be ready to boil the first of next week. 

We bottled up 16 gallons of syrup this morning.

Sap started running somewhere around 2:00PM, so we'll have more to gather in the morning!

We turned vacuum pumps on, have got a little sap but not enough to fire up. Finished tapping one woods, just a few left in another (we won't do those till we really start up, there is 4 road culvert crossings that always freeze up) Still cold here and deep snow. Should be good the rest of the week, then it looks like another long freeze!

We have another 1000 taps to install next week. Talk about a last minute install!

Small scale operation here, Maybe 75-100 taps, Got 150 gallons or so to do. Going to boil all weekend. ;D

The weather here has been hot (55-70) Should get cold this weekend but hardly freezing at night .  Sap has been running slow most of the month . 
We about completely burned up one pan of sap .  we ended up with enough to fill the hydrometer cup and the hydrometer bulb would not sink past the rim.  Oh that stuff is good,Great walnut taste and almost as thick as molasses .

What was supposed to be a day and a half of tapping turned into 5 days of tapping/walking vacuum for 4 different producers in so. Vt.  Lots of fun, cool to see how everyone does things.

Me and a buddy walked the whole woods at one guys place with 8000 taps. Got him up from 15 inches to 26 inches in 10 hrs. He was only runnin 35 amps on his pump so he is pretty tight.

Sap is running really good right now down here, everyone is concentrating and boiling every day. Supposed to be good all this week. A little on the warm side but hopefully not too much.

Boiled out 30 gallons of syrup yesterday, will be bottling it up shortly!

We put the last of the drop lines in yesterday.  Ended up with 797 taps.  We're going to hook the laterals to the mains today.  Hasn't been syrup weather here.  We had some pretty intense thunder storms last night.  Looks like Tuesday for a run?  I think we'll be ready by then.  Maybe ;) ;D

I Put in another 60 or so taps today, boy and his buddy put more into! have around 200 or more in! Enough for first year!

We've been checking vacuum and trying to get everything ready to- pumps on, tanks on trucks, etc etc running around. First boil today, think we made about 500 gallons. Sap is testing low on sugar but coming up and also clearing up. Weather looks promising through next week. And we were supposed to install 1000 taps when it got cold. Ha!

Well not doing bad for a small operation, we have 200 taps in tops, Got 2 gallons made so far and will have a couple more today!

We have not been having good weather for sugaring.

Sugaring is at a STOP right now.

We're just over 60 gallons produced at this point, no sap on hand and no sap running!

In this area, sugaring could either FLIP or FLOP, who knows!

From 15 buckets I got 7 half pint jars of syrup this past week. I had one great day followed by very little run because the nights were too warm and days too hot. It hit 70 at my cabin. Saturday I collected at most two gallons of sap and got 1/4 of a pint from it. The weather looks good for a couple days of good sap run this week, I hope.

Well first year in the syrup business and I already see a problem!! We got to many taps out for our evaporator! The boy is already talking about a bigger one!

Quote from: Woodhauler on February 27, 2017, 06:23:10 AM
Well first year in the syrup business and I already see a problem!! We got to many taps out for our evaporator! The boy is already talking about a bigger one!

What size is your pan?

I'm only at 20 taps and I've decided this hillbilly evaporator is just barely going to cut it for this year, never mind 200!  I can see this might end up as an expensive hobby if I don't watch it!


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Lots of us started out like that!   ;)

Quote from: Chuck White on February 27, 2017, 10:13:00 PM
Lots of us started out like that!   ;)

The maple bug is just like the sawdust bug - no known cure.
Gerald

Well a few days off is nice. We are froze up till next week. Last week we got the vacuum level tuned up real good at all our woods. Boss made 1000 gallons Thursday. Think we are over 3500-4000 so far. Not bad considering historically he makes the majority of his syrup in April.
Started a 1000 tap install yesterday, finish it up Monday.

Might be another long season!

For us we should get enough today to check vacuum . We are at 18 inches now and will check for bites , breaks and misses . First to the woods to get another load of firewood .

I pulled my taps today , the trees are starting to bud out .  Some of the sap was real cloudy some was clear.  Weather has been too warm but will cool a bit this week  with snow showers and rain .  I am 20 gallon short of last year.  I should be able to make a gallon of walnut syrup  this year.
Thanks for the advise you all gave . I might get big in this game , maybe 3 gallons next year.

Looks like first cook today . Dumped the first run yesterday to clean the lines .To the woods first to get one more load of firewood out of the swamp .

First boil today, going to be real cold for a couple days. Sap was running real good

Hope to boil tomorrow, should have about 70 gallons of sap. the weather has been up and down like crazy here.

We gathered 500 gallons yesterday and boiled until depleted and made 10.5 gallons of syrup.

The evaporator is still full, so we'll drain the back pan into barrels and fill the pan with perm water and finish off the boil with just the front pans.

It's a lot of fuss, but with the freeze-up coming, it's the best idea.

So, we'll have the evaporator completely drained at the end of the day, then we'll have a few days off, sort of!  ::)

We had real high winds yesterday that blew a lot of trees down. I drove past a woods that has a lot of blue tubing that was a real mess . the  down trees had knocked down a lot of the tubing. :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

We were lucky, we had 1 limb that came down on a main-line but did no damage.

We just bottled 5 gallons of syrup yesterday. Last year we bottled it in beer bottles with crimp on caps.  This year we got a couple hundred 16 oz flip top Grolsch bottles so that is what we are using until they run out.

Here's a couple pictures of our syrup house and evaporator.  The main syrup house is an 8x12 iceshack on skids made this winter out of live edge siding I cut on the mill.  Even with the evaporator halfway in there we couldn't keep it warm so we put an addition around the back of the evaporator using last years ice shack minus the roof.  The evaporator is a 2x3 pan made out of mild steal and the arch is a 275 gallon fuel oil barrel lined with silo staves and railroad tie plates for insulation.  The silver square on the side of the arch is the door from a stainless fridge to add a bit of extra insulation so a person can stand there to stir the pan and test the syrup without getting burned.



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Nice set up!!  I've had the fuel tank for years but need to cut it up and do what you did....  How do you load your wood?  Does the front door swing down?  Must be tough to have to drink all that Grolsch so that you have bottles for your syrup.   8) 8)  All the best, Rob

Quote from: 78NHTFY on March 10, 2017, 06:07:51 PM
Nice set up!!  I've had the fuel tank for years but need to cut it up and do what you did....  How do you load your wood?  Does the front door swing down?  Must be tough to have to drink all that Grolsch so that you have bottles for your syrup.   8) 8)  All the best, Rob

The front door swings up.  I didn't drink the beer to empty the bottles.  I'm not rich enough to drink that brand.  I got them from a recycling bin across the road from my house.  I soak them in bleach water than boil them and fill them hot so they should be plenty clean.

Put 80 buckets inlast week starting out the home bush here on the farm. Boiled twice, been pretty cold and I put them in pretty late since I've been putting other people's taps in. Made 2 gals of the good stuff so far. Tiny 3x3 pan and wood arch we had kicking around. Makes syrup but sure is slow. Boiled from 3 pm till 530 am last night and made 5 quarts of medium amber.

Made a deal with a neighbor for a 5x12 wood arch with all the goodies for $2500. Plan is at least 2000 taps on line next year, putting in 3/16 natural vacuum over the summer.

Boiled all of the stuff that was in the evaporator, AGAIN!

We filled the flue pan with water and fed what was in there into the front pan, as required until most of it was boiled out, then let is cool a few hours and finished it off in a 18"x36" pan on a turkey cooker burner!

We ended up with 9.3 gallons of syrup for the day!

The freeze-up is expected to last about a week!

Tapping is done, vacuum checking can't happen, no more installations, so we are working on firewood. We will have a couple thinning projects to do as well once the firewood runs out. Busy work until the sap starts running again.
Think we are a little over 6000 gallons for the season.

This morning, per WPTZ, the temperature in Burlington is zero and the wind chill is -19.
The only place the sap is running this morning is at the end of my nose.  Achoooo.
Gerald

  We decided to pull the plug on our maple operation for this season.  We weren't going to have the building in the shape we wanted it.  It was going to be cobbled up to make things work this spring.  This gives us a few months to make things right.  We'll have everything the way we want next season as well as having the whole bush tapped.  We've got 800 ready now with another 1,000 or so to set up.  We've got a new roof on the building, stacks are in along with a chimney for a woodstove.  Insulation, steel ceiling, lighting and plumbing along with a concrete pour to bring the old gutter level with the rest of the slab.  This was a milk house built in 1950.  Grandpa and Dad got out of the dairy business in 1965.  I wish I'd kept track of the man hours we invested cleaning the 52 years of accumulation out.   
  All the equipment is here.  Evaporator, R.O., vacuum pump, pans, filter press, barrels etc.     



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That's going to be really nice!    8)  8)   smiley_thumbsup    smiley_thumbsup

Are you intending it to be a business that actually makes you money or more of a hobby that may help to pay for itself?  I ask because it looks like a lot of money tied up in equipment.

Quote from: Corley5 on March 15, 2017, 09:15:35 PM
  We decided to pull the plug on our maple operation for this season.  We weren't going to have the building in the shape we wanted it.  It was going to be cobbled up to make things work this spring.  This gives us a few months to make things right.  We'll have everything the way we want next season as well as having the whole bush tapped.  We've got 800 ready now with another 1,000 or so to set up.  We've got a new roof on the building, stacks are in along with a chimney for a woodstove.  Insulation, steel ceiling, lighting and plumbing along with a concrete pour to bring the old gutter level with the rest of the slab.  This was a milk house built in 1950.  Grandpa and Dad got out of the dairy business in 1965.  I wish I'd kept track of the man hours we invested cleaning the 52 years of accumulation out.   
  All the equipment is here.  Evaporator, R.O., vacuum pump, pans, filter press, barrels etc.     



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It's supposed to make $$$.  That's the plan anyway :)  It's comparable in $$$ to a new diesel pickup  ;) :)

Do you have an idea of how long it will take to pay for itself?  How many trees do you plan to supply it with?

Quote from: Corley5 on March 16, 2017, 01:43:09 PM
It's supposed to make $$$.  That's the plan anyway :)  It's comparable in $$$ to a new diesel pickup  ;) :)

Looks like you'll have a nice operation for next season.

Just got off the phone with a few different sugar makers in vt. Not looking too good this year. This freeze up has gone on for too long most are only at half crop and one further up north is at a quarter crop.

They'll make some syrup next week, but April is up in the air as long as it doesn't warm up too fast might be a average season but if that April sun hits those trees and the air gets too warm it will be over fast.

Could go either way but I'm thinking it will end fast, hope I'm wrong.

  At last year's bulk prices the equipment and infrastructure has about a 5 year pay back with 1,500 taps.  That goes down with more retail sales and value added processing but we're looking at mostly bulk for now.  We'll also have more taps than the original estimate of 1,500 to 1,600.  The equipment is sized to handle up to about 3,000 taps at which time either a bigger R.O. or a steam away will be needed.  We have more potential taps.  There's another 60 acres of bush across the road that could be developed and a 20 adjacent to us that we've been approached about possibly purchasing in the future.

Quote from: Corley5 on March 16, 2017, 06:25:02 PM
  At last year's bulk prices the equipment and infrastructure has about a 5 year pay back with 1,500 taps.  That goes down with more retail sales and value added processing but we're looking at mostly bulk for now.  We'll also have more taps than the original estimate of 1,500 to 1,600.  The equipment is sized to handle up to about 3,000 taps at which time either a bigger R.O. or a steam away will be needed.  We have more potential taps.  There's another 60 acres of bush across the road that could be developed and a 20 adjacent to us that we've been approached about possibly purchasing in the future.

That pay back time is just figuring on the equipment you bought so far or also including time and fuel it will take to make the syrup each year?  I ask because I often wonder how big operations are able to come out ahead with all the expenses.

On a side note,  I looked at the five gallons we bottled last week and they have a huge amount of sediment in each bottle so we have to re jar all of it.  I am in the process of building a stainless water jacketed bottling/settling tank that I hope will be ready in a couple days that will make rebotteling it easier.

  The payback time includes energy costs but not our efforts.  Our energy costs are a bit less because we've got our own supply of wood and a firewood processor.  I really wish we had natural gas available.

We figure that it'll warm up enough for the sap to start running sometime early afternoon tomorrow!

This is the "Maple Weekend" coming up and we have nothing now, so hopefully on Sunday we'll have enough sap to boil!

Another week or two of warm weather when it comes and the season will be over quick. Some of my red maples that I'm not tapping were already showing signs of budding a week ago. If it warms up again the reds I have tapped are going to be out. The sugar maples will be okay a bit longer but it's not good to lose the reds so quick.

Sap ran a little yesterday afternoon, and we expect to have enough to gather this afternoon, then boil after gathering again tomorrow!

Managed to do a boil on the 16th. things have been hit or miss here with the weather. We got around 6 inches of snow last night but the long range forecast looks promising.

Gathered yesterday morning, boiled, shut down and then they really started running so we gathered again, around 7:00PM.

Otherwise, we would have barrels running over NOW!

Still 36° here, so we'll be gathering again in a couple of hours!

We are at 150 gallons of syrup as of last night, last year we had 185 gallons!

We figure that we'll go over 200 this year, we'll see!

Having a tough time here. We get a good day then it gets cold and everything freezes up. Boiling a few hundred gallons of sap today.

This is our second year of making syrup. We made a little over 3.5 gallons on Saturday (our second boil of the year).

When I started this thread, I hinted at some big news, a new lease for us.

Quote from: celliott on January 20, 2017, 06:51:24 AM
Might have some big news to share in the near future- we could be getting a new woods to lease  ;)

Well it's official. The boss signed the papers earlier this week. We will be leasing a chunk of land that is part of a 5700 acre property in Eden VT. Currently the landowner is only opening up a certain portion of the property for the maple lease. We will be constructing a new sugarhouse on site, strictly a production facility. Everything we can get to run to this sugarhouse we can tap.

We are expecting to get about 120,000 taps here. No, there isn't an extra zero there.

Eventually if the company that owns the land decides they like how the sugaring lease is going, they will open up the rest of the property, and a second sugarhouse would likely be built, to boil another 100-120,000 taps.

We started some of the layout today, marking out where the two main conductors will go to the sugarhouse. Two sets of big pipes. 4" air line, 3" liquid line, hung on 3\8" cable, fusion welded pipe. We marked out the first .9 miles to where they will branch off. One will end up nearly 2.5 miles from the sugarhouse.

The plan right now is to start in force as soon as we pull spouts from this season. We will be doing the construction of the sugarhouse, 75'x120', as well as installing the first 50,000+ taps. The year after we will install the remainder, likely with two pump up stations gathering 25,000 taps. It will be all 3\16'' tubing under high vacuum. I don't know the exact vacuum pumps that we will be using but one we spec'd out was 25hp, 6 feet long and weighed 1200lbs. We would need two.

I'm excited to be taking part in this project, I can't wait to see it running full steam. I have been on large acre properties before cruising timber, but to install mainlines and tubing over such an area, it gives me quite an appreciation for the immensity and scale of what we are doing. When it is all said and done, we will have installed over 1 million feet ( 190 miles) of mainline. We will have nearly 2.5 million feet of tubing (470 miles) in the woods.

It's gonna be a busy year!

Wow,
How many taps did you guys have before this?

Quote from: celliott on March 25, 2017, 11:01:27 AM
When I started this thread, I hinted at some big news, a new lease for us.

Quote from: celliott on January 20, 2017, 06:51:24 AM
Might have some big news to share in the near future- we could be getting a new woods to lease  ;)

Well it's official. The boss signed the papers earlier this week. We will be leasing a chunk of land that is part of a 5700 acre property in Eden VT. Currently the landowner is only opening up a certain portion of the property for the maple lease. We will be constructing a new sugarhouse on site, strictly a production facility. Everything we can get to run to this sugarhouse we can tap.

We are expecting to get about 120,000 taps here. No, there isn't an extra zero there.

Eventually if the company that owns the land decides they like how the sugaring lease is going, they will open up the rest of the property, and a second sugarhouse would likely be built, to boil another 100-120,000 taps.

We started some of the layout today, marking out where the two main conductors will go to the sugarhouse. Two sets of big pipes. 4" air line, 3" liquid line, hung on 3\8" cable, fusion welded pipe. We marked out the first .9 miles to where they will branch off. One will end up nearly 2.5 miles from the sugarhouse.

The plan right now is to start in force as soon as we pull spouts from this season. We will be doing the construction of the sugarhouse, 75'x120', as well as installing the first 50,000+ taps. The year after we will install the remainder, likely with two pump up stations gathering 25,000 taps. It will be all 3\16'' tubing under high vacuum. I don't know the exact vacuum pumps that we will be using but one we spec'd out was 25hp, 6 feet long and weighed 1200lbs. We would need two.

I'm excited to be taking part in this project, I can't wait to see it running full steam. I have been on large acre properties before cruising timber, but to install mainlines and tubing over such an area, it gives me quite an appreciation for the immensity and scale of what we are doing. When it is all said and done, we will have installed over 1 million feet ( 190 miles) of mainline. We will have nearly 2.5 million feet of tubing (470 miles) in the woods.

It's gonna be a busy year!

Joe, we are boiling from 42,000 this year. And that is with only 2000 running to the sugarhouse, all the rest is scattered between 5 other sugarbushes, all in different towns and directions. We have to truck all of it in. One woods is hauled from with a 1700 gallon tank on a dump trailer with a farm tractor because it is nearby and the road gets very bad. We have an older kenworth triaxle with a 5000 gallon tank and a newer international triaxle with a 5500 gallon tank. The boss figures our cost of trucking sap at about $1.50 per tap. Take that totally out of the equation for this woods.

One reason we are all so excited about this is because everything will be right there in one spot. No running around, splitting the crew 3-4 ways, everyone is an hour away in different directions. No more worrying about muddy roads sap hauling. Not worrying about whether the vacuum is on and sap running in one woods, and not the other, or how full tanks are, the list goes on and on and on.

It is going to be an incredible convenience having everything in one spot, even though the tubing system will be vast.

Last night we were boiling and decided to make some wine.  We pulled 5 gallons of 25% sap and let it cool before pitching in some yeast and putting it in a carboy with an air lock.

I have made quite a few 1 gallon batches in the past it comes out tasting kind of like brandy.

That sounds good Joe!    8)

The day certainly won't be measured gallons but a quality day. I'm no expert at making syrup, make a 3 or 4 gallons a year on an old wood stove converted to a small evaporator.  I got a call a little after noon time from a guy I know about helping his 12 year old son make a batch.  I said sure and grabbed my thermometer and went over.

I know the boy some, he tries to buy boards for whatever he is up to and I point him to the mistake pile and tell him to take what he needs, well he built a deer blind/ sugar shack with a bunch of the stuff he dragged home last fall.  He bought his own buckets and taps with birthday money, tapped & collected sap himself and took dads turkey cooker out to the shack.  He has a book on syruping and he put the questions to me all afternoon while we boiled, that's after he told his father I was there to help him and he could go back to he house anytime he was ready.  We got a quart and a half of syrup and the boy offered me half, told him no I have enough for us already. 

I was glad to get to know him a little better.  I got two boys in college and didn't realize I missed those pre teen days. Was a good day.

Good on ya, Ricker!   8)

Has bin running for six week and not that good,this week don't look good /little snow and rain /GOTA COME PRETTY SOON?

It looks like our season will be ending this week. Trees are starting to bud out and with the warm weather predicted for this week more will be budding each day.

Last year was considered to be a pretty bad year and this year is producing 1/2 - 1/4 of last year.  I have talked to quite a few sugar makers in the area and they all agree that it is a poor year.

Joe, I'm north of you about 75 miles. Same thing here , either too warm or so cold everything is frozen up

Quote from: millwright on March 29, 2017, 12:33:42 PM
Joe, I'm north of you about 75 miles. Same thing here , either too warm or so cold everything is frozen up

And for some reason the few days that should have been perfect only produce maybe a 1/2 gallon per tree.  We tapped on February 13th and since then we have only had one day where we averaged close to 1 gallon per tap. 

Joe, I am boiling right now, should have about 4-1/2 gals  will collect tommrow hoping for 200 gallons from about 200 taps  that should be it as the trees will bud soon

its been too cold here for the last few weeks for sap. We need some of that spring weather.

Warm spell we had about a week ago started to bring out the buds, but then the cool down stopped them.

We're 9 gallons over our last year total, we have made 194 gallons so far!

It's not as good as it sounds, because we added about 300 taps last summer, so actually we're down some!

It won't be long now and it will shut down!

I am still under half the volume I got last year with the same amount of taps. We have not had good weather.

Well we are hoping things let go this week. We have been getting one or two small runs a week, its been too cold for us. When it has run we have been able to get vacuum levels way up everywhere so when we do get some big runs we should be all set!

This week looks good. Bring on those 1000 gallon days!
We typically make 1/2 or more of our syrup in April anyways, we will be going for two more weeks minimum.

You guys thinking your season is over, try to hold out, we see far too many people pull the plug too soon. Vacuum helps a lot there too.

Wow, great thread. I missed it until now.
I started tapping 1/7/17 but didn't finish til 2/21/17, because I had far more repairs needed than ever before. We've had far too much wind too many times blowing lots of trees and limbs down. It seems every critter in the woods has to chew any line on the forest floor, instead of just squirrels at the trees. I have 750 taps this year, all on vacuum, 568 on a lease and the rest around the sugarhouse. The lease is on vacuum using an old Alamo dairy pump tied to a 1000 gal vacuum tank. Because a vacuum tank is only good for up to 20" vacuum or it can implode, I run that at 18". Just over half of the taps there have good slope so I have changed them over to 3/16 lines for natural vacuum, then tied them into my vacuum mains at just under 18". This gives me near 28-29" vacuum near the top of the hill and even at 15-18' above the main I still get 25"+. Last year I started changing them to the 3/16 and it was impressive.
I noticed some discussion earlier in this thread on 3/16 and how tight it needs to be. While tight and slope are good, I've had areas where trees and limbs have fallen in season on 3/16 lines. As long as the bottom of the line is lower than where the line sags or is pushed to the ground, you will still get impressive flow. I get almost hypnotized watching the flow in the 3/16 lines, it is not like a 5/16. In 3/16 line the sap does not pass by the air (tree gasses), it remains segregated, that is how it generates gravity vacuum. The flow will be a moving column of sap/gas/sap/gas etc. and it will keep flowing to the main (or a barrel if you end at a barrel or tank), even if pushed to the ground along the line. It will flow down to under the limb that landed on it, and will climb back up to the next tap, as long as nothing was pulled apart when that limb fell on it.
I've had a long season but my sugar has been at record lows all season. I generally start at 2.1-2.5% sugar, and one year even had a 2 day period when I got 3.75% sugar. This year my high was 1.8%, most ran between 1.4-1.6% and Saturday I pulled in 240 gal at 1.2% sugar. If I didn't have a reverse osmosis to remove lots of the excess water I'd have likely quit long before now.
Last year was my lowest per tap syrup total ever, I only made 119 gal off 700 taps, I usually average between .25-.35 gal/tap in syrup. This year, with loads of long stretches of below freezing  followed by long spans of no freeze and then back again, I've now made 140 gal and I'm still going. However I think this may be my last week. The trees at the sugarhouse have not opened bud yet, but they stopped running a few days ago (Jan 7-Mar 29). The lease has slowed but is still flowing. The forecast for this week is all in the upper 40's into the 60's until Saturday when it may have an overnight freeze. I think that will end my season, at well below my typical .25-.35 gal/tap in syrup. I'd love to get to 200 gal but I don't see it happening again this year.

Dave, you're right, as long as the end is lower than anything upstream, the lines will run!

The weather has been really screwy this season, but we got more than last year, last years total was 185 gallons and this year were at 220 right now and the pans are still flooded and we should have another run to gather later on this afternoon!

We're about done though, the buds are starting to show!

Good luck to all you guys that delve in this project/hobby!

We collected on Saturday after a week of not collecting we end up with 40 gallons of sap from 125 taps.  We had planned to pull the taps but only a few of the trees are budded yet so we only pulled the taps from the budded trees.  With the predicted weather this week I doubt it will run anymore.  The only reason we didn't pull all the taps is other years the ground was covered with wood-anemone and hepatica flowers flowers and so far this year I haven't seen a single one yet. 

I figure if the flowers haven't bloomed yet the trees may not be done running yet either.

I pulled everything , got about 225 gals from 200 taps. Ended up with about normal amount of finished syrup. Trees are really budding here.

Gathered 365 gallons of sap this morning and boiled it down!

Disconnected all barrels, we're done!

Tomorrow we'll drain the back pan and flood it with water and finish off in the front pan as far as we can, then finish the final batch in a pan over a turkey cooker base!

Right now we're at 227 gallons of syrup and expect to end up near 238 gallons.

Three barrels full, one barrel 3/4 full, and the last one will have around 15-18 gallons.

I went to collect more sap this morning but it was spoiled, too warm. I dumped it and left the vacuum pump off. Friday night and Sat. night are forecast to be possible freezes. Thus on Friday, I'll run the pump an hour or 2 then dump that sap, then I'll wash the tank. Then, if we do get a freeze Sat. morning I'll start the pump and hope for the best, then will run it Sunday too (if the forecast holds).
In the sugarhouse I did some bottling and cleaning of pans. I drained my syrup pan into the draw off tank and pumped some permeate into it. On Friday I'll see if the permeate removed the niter, if not, I'll use white vinegar. For the flue pan, I drained it and ran my Lapierre Flue pan washer for about an hour. (that has 6 arms that spin like on the upper rack of a dish washer. I pump permeate thru it and then send that to drain.) It does a pretty nice job and is super easy.
Now It's just a waiting game to see how the forecast pans out. If it doesn't run or if the buds open, then I'll concentrate the rest in my finisher, put it in a barrel and call it quits. Then the business of pulling taps starts. Pulling them only takes about a day, but I do it slower, way faster than fixing all the off season damages I had this year. I start by pulling just the end tree tap on each lateral and then run the vacuum pump for about 5-6 hrs. That gets most of the moisture out. Then I pull the rest of the taps again, with the vacuum on. as each lines dries I plug the taps onto the T pegs.
Then I pray for no high wind that will necessitate lots of preseason repairs before the next season. I have about 100 or so more taps that are going to be converted from 5/16 to 3/16, and another 50 or so new taps, mostly on the lease. I'm also adding a few at the sugarhouse on another sap ladder. Those will need to be lifted over the main driveway heading into the sugarhouse. I think I may try putting then on a single 3/16 with about 22 taps and then pull the sap up and over the drive, need a lift of about 12' to clear, but that vacuum runs at 26-27", should work OK. It will be a new way to make a sap ladder.
I'm still at 140 gal but I have maybe 15 gal waiting in the finisher and what is drained from the pans. That usually makes 12-16 gal more when finished. Sure would be nice to get 2 more days good sap flow. After Sunday's possibility of flow the forecast is for 4 days way too warm before another possibility of a freeze. I really don't think the buds will stay closed that long with the days in the 50's and 60's in the middle.

Well, we're finally done, we finished up with 236 gallons of syrup!

Biggest year yet!

Now all we have is the cleaning of the barrels and the lines, then putting the barrels in the tool shed!

After that, it's just cutting next years sugar wood!

Barrels gathered and cleaned, evaporator disassembled and cleaned, tanks cleaned, pails cleaned.

All that's left is flushing the sap lines and pulling spouts, and putting up next years sugar wood!

I know nothing about the Maple Syrup operation but I enjoy the journey each Spring as you describe your successes and woes.  Thanks to each of you for sharing.   :)

We did this last year, and the company wanted more this year. Today we barreled and shipped 4000 gallons of 15% concentrated sap. We are doing the same again on monday, providing we have enough sap to concentrate! It is going to the U.K to be used for maple tree water. The company also does birch and coconut water. It's nice for us, we don't have to run the evaporator or wash it or any of those related jobs. Just haul sap in, concentrate it and barrel it as fast as we can. let the RO do most of the work.

Quote from: Magicman on April 07, 2017, 09:31:29 AM
I know nothing about the Maple Syrup operation but I enjoy the journey each Spring as you describe your successes and woes.  Thanks to each of you for sharing.   :)

One woe that was often encountered when gathering sap from a bucket tapped orchard was slipping on ice or wet leaves and going down with a full pail of sap.  I took quite a few sap baths and some of them were cold.
Gerald

We were going to clean and flush the sap lines and pull spouts today, but the weather didn't cooperate!

We have had a mix of snow and rain all day, so we just hung around the sugar house and puttered on thing for a few hours, then went home!

I boiled for the last time this year on Tuesday. Made another 14 gallons. Sugar content was low all season, 1.5 to 1.9. Did have one run that was 2.0. Finished up with 247 gallons on 1000 taps. Plan for next year is add more taps and put vacuum on my larger sugar bush. Also looking at another location that may have 300 to 500 taps.

After no flow a few days, we again got a mild freeze yesterday morning and a better freeze this morning. Sap ran yesterday but was real cloudy so I dumped it. Today's sap was clear. Additionally I collected 260 gal of clear sap from another producer. When I pumped it the flow was going good. I'll also get his sap Monday morning. He's Amish and asks that I not pump on Sunday, I'll respect his wish. The bad part is that the sap was only at 1.1%. The 550 gal tank should be full when I get there Monday, I hope the sugar doesn't get worse.
With no freezes after tonight and warm temps all week in the forecast, Monday will be my final sap haul for this season.
It has been a long season for sure, my first sap was hauled in late Jan. and now my last will be 4/10, unfortunately the sugar % was record low all season. I usually average just over 2% sugar for the season, this year my average will likely end up at or below 1.5%. Without the RO I'd have run out of wood and desire a long time ago. I still have about 2 cord left. That's the lowest I've been in at least 7 years.

That's the nice thing about an RO, it becomes more economical when the sugar content is low. If you were boiling raw 1.1% that'd take forever! (86 gallons to 1)

Our sugar content started out low in February but has come up. One of our woods just defies logic. It's 6800 taps, our oldest tubing, the trees seem to be the poorest health (maybe not why they appear) and we have the hardest time keeping vacuum up there. It's been running 2.8-3%!
Other woods have been doing 2.2-2.7%. One guy who sells us sap has a lower elevation woods than all of ours and his sugar has dropped under 2%

The RO takes it all to the same sugar but you get more concentrate from the 2.8% than the 1.6%.

It looks very warm for next week in our area. If we can hold out through the middle of the week we may see a freeze at our higher elevation woods and be alright for awhile longer. Otherwise the end is near.

We pulled our taps yesterday.  Over half the trees were budded/budding out.  Pulling the taps went much faster than I had expected.  Now we need to clean all the buckets and finish taking the sugar house down.  With 125 taps we ended up with just over 13 gallons of finished syrup.  With that many taps we  expected 25-30 gallons so it was a dissipating season.  And in order to get that amount we had to tap a month earlier than normal because of a warm spell in February.  Several people I know in the area didn't tap until the middle of march so there season must have been very poor.

not freezing much here and looks like another week like that/haven't made much syrup  NOVA SCOTIA

I did a small boil on Friday, left the taps out and I am hoping for one more boil. Currently I am at half of last years total.

Quote from: Corley5 on March 15, 2017, 09:15:35 PM
  We decided to pull the plug on our maple operation for this season.  We weren't going to have the building in the shape we wanted it.  It was going to be cobbled up to make things work this spring.  This gives us a few months to make things right.  We'll have everything the way we want next season as well as having the whole bush tapped.  We've got 800 ready now with another 1,000 or so to set up.  We've got a new roof on the building, stacks are in along with a chimney for a woodstove.  Insulation, steel ceiling, lighting and plumbing along with a concrete pour to bring the old gutter level with the rest of the slab.  This was a milk house built in 1950.  Grandpa and Dad got out of the dairy business in 1965.  I wish I'd kept track of the man hours we invested cleaning the 52 years of accumulation out.   
  All the equipment is here.  Evaporator, R.O., vacuum pump, pans, filter press, barrels etc. 

You across the street now? I saw all the tubing back in the woods when I went to Preston Saturday and all kinds of projects going on.

We got half of our spouts pulled and the lines flushed today.

The other half is planned for Wednesday!

My sap was mostly running off color and off tasting yesterday so I think it's safe to say it's over this year. I think I made 5 gallons or so. From 15 taps. Hard to say because I boiled the last few batches into sugar and made a lot of candy too. I'm hoping to get a sugar shack up this summer and a proper evaporator set up. If I do I'll get tubing set up next year. I think I may be able to hit 100 taps on my place. I never did finish the maple inventory.

I finished 5 days ago. I pulled in 840 gal total that day from 2 locations, early that day. One was 550 gal at 1.1% and the rest was at 1.2%. Then it got way too hot, as it got to 81 degrees. I boiled that down and it was very dark syrup.
I ended up with just 174 gal from 750 taps because the sugar % in the sap was at my lowest ever, had it been at my previous 3 season average I'd have gotten .4 gal/tap in syrup. As it was I only got .232 gal/tap.
Now I'm planning for next year. Will change more laterals to 3/16 tied to my vacuum set up, and add 50-75 more taps, possibly even 100. I am also putting my bigger vacuum pump on my vacuum tank and setting it up with a releaser rather than using the tank as a vacuum tank, then I'll be able to add 5-7" more vacuum on the mains and all of the 3/16 will be at max. possible vacuum once they are just 4-6' above the mainline elevation. In 3 areas I'm also going to add a sap ladder or 2 to get better slope on those mains. I got my 7 current sap ladders to perform very well this year, keeping my vacuum loss under 2" from the pump out to the far end of each main, some of which are up to 2000' away from the pump. The longest one at about 2000' long and with 2 sap ladders held at 2" vacuum loss, I thought that was good.

Well its not 2017 anymore but, the sap suckers have started in on my red maple trees and the sap is starting to flow. I also cut a small maple sapling to for a walking stick for my youngest son and you could watch the sap drip out of the cut end. Its not going to be long before the red maples think its spring time.