keeping deep cycle batteries charged

[kelLOGg]

I just replaced my sawmill winch batteries with deep cycle batteries. Salesman said to keep an automatic trickle charge on them when not in use to prolong their life and a web search said the same thing. I want a third opinion (from the top) so I want to know if other sawyers with battery systems keep a charger on the batteries when not in use. I may go several months sometimes without milling - so do I keep it under a trickle all that time?

[chevytaHOE5674]

I have trickle chargers on everything I own with a battery that doesn't get used everyday (tractors, snowmobiles, ATV's, lawn mower, etc)

And I've found my batteries last twice as long as before I had them, and the battery is always charged when I want to use something.


http://www.batteryminders.com/batterycharger/catalog/BatteryMINDer-Plus-12-Volt-133-Amp-Charger-Maintainer-Conditio-p-16134.html

[scsmith42]

Bob - I use the same model of Batteryminder that ChevytaHoe published the link to.  I must have at least 10 of them on the farm left on various pieces of equipment.

You can find them in Cary at northern toolhttps://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=position"> Note:Please read the Forestry Forum's postion on this company.

Scott

[gemniii]

Bob - I use the same model of Batteryminder that ChevytaHoe published the link to.  I must have at least 10 of them on the farm left on various pieces of equipment.

You can find them in Cary at northern toolhttps://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=position"> Note:Please read the Forestry Forum's postion on this company.

Scott

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200332201_200332201
Link $10 off today, they also have solar powered ones.

[arj]

I have a deep cycle battery on my Hudson mill , only runs up/dn winch and
mud saw. When I use the mud saw alot i charge it when it gets slow, lately
most of the logs I get are clean, don`t use the mud saw much, I only charged
it once in the spring. I thought deep cycle were made to run down before
recharging.
                         arj

[Chuck White]

I don't have a deep cycle battery on my LT40, but from time to time while in the garage for the winter, I'll put the trickle (2Amp) on for a few days at a time!

Keeping a slow charge on the battery can prevent it from freezing too.

[Tripp]

I keep one on my sawmill battery 24/7. I need to get a few more for other batteries. They do a great job.

Tripp

[ErikC]

  I use them on the mill, and the backhoe and an old chevy truck i seldom drive. It makes life easier for sure. I am off the grid, but they don't seem to draw my system down enough to be a problem. I doubt it will increase your electric bill much.

[Toolman]

I use a solar panel trickle charger. It's a 16" x 16" panel . I have 2, one for mill and one for boat batteries. They work great! $70.00 at Tractor Supply.

[den]

A trickle charger can over charge a bat., a float charger maintains a given voltage.
The best bang for $$$ is the Schumacher SEM-1562A, Walmart $19, Amazon $19.94
I have 3 Harbor Freight float chargers about $5...not proven quality

[scsmith42]

A trickle charger can over charge a bat., a float charger maintains a given voltage.
The best bang for $$$ is the Schumacher SEM-1562A, Walmart $19, Amazon $19.94
I have 3 Harbor Freight float chargers about $5...not proven quality

Den - that was an interesting review that you attached - thanks for sharing.

The Batteryminder is also a float charger with a desulphination mode, but it costs more than the Schumacher...

[shinnlinger]

Den,  THat is a nice review and price...
Smith,  What is your feeling on desulfating batteries???  I hear about it from time to time..  is it worth the hype????

If you were a cheap SOB, and the conditions permitted, could you park your lawn tractor next to your motorcycle, next to your boat,  etc,etc, and then use one float unit after connecting all the batteries in parallel????

[chevytaHOE5674]

The battery minder allows you to hook two batteries up to 1 charger. Most of mine are hooked to two batteries.

[scsmith42]

Den,  THat is a nice review and price...
Smith,  What is your feeling on desulfating batteries???  I hear about it from time to time..  is it worth the hype????

If you were a cheap SOB, and the conditions permitted, could you park your lawn tractor next to your motorcycle, next to your boat,  etc,etc, and then use one float unit after connecting all the batteries in parallel????

I 100% believe in desulphination technology.  I have an old Onan genset from the 60's that is provides backup power to my home (automatic transfer switch).  A telecom grade battery lasted 9 years with Onan's 60's era desulphination technology (pulse charger).  It flat works. 

Re grouping multiple batteries together, the answer is "yes, but..." they all have to be the exact same model of battery (and it's best if they are the same age as well).  Mixing different batteries together in a single charging string will create problems, whereby they charge at different rates.  Ultimately you will lose at least one of the batteries in the string due to inconsistent charging.  It is common practice in telecommunication sites to replace an entire string if a single battery goes bad, otherwise you will lose the rest of the sting in the near future.

[shinnlinger]

Good info here...THanks!!!!

[Larry]

It is common practice in telecommunication sites to replace an entire string if a single battery goes bad, otherwise you will lose the rest of the sting in the near future.

Brings back few memories...when I had a real job working for the phone company every central office had battery backup.  Huge batteries in glass or maybe lexan jars.  We ran a float charge constantly...every month checked the voltage.  This was before digital meters but we used a meter with a mirror behind the needle.  I think each cell was supposed to read 2.14 volts.  Then we checked specific gravity.  The batteries would last for years...20 or more.  The only string I saw replaced was because a cell was leaking due to impact.

Anyhow I'm don't believe any of the hype I read about chargers.  Battery failure is caused by three things.  Vibration, number of discharges, and how deep you discharge.  Of the three, how deep you discharge is the biggest killer.  Try to keep discharges less than 50% and never ever below 80%.  A trickle charger will reduce the numer of discharges...just don't depend on it to bring a battery to full discharge...you need a real charger for that.

I'm running four of the biggest batteries money can buy in my striper boat.  It's a parallel/series wiring system to give me 24 volts at the trolling motor.  Two 2 bank smart chargers that shut off when the battery is charged and turn back on when discharged a bit.  I plug em in as soon as I come in from fishing and unplug the next day.  Turn the chargers on every couple of weeks.  I suppose I should trust the chargers to do there job.  Keep a close eye on them...but now I have these fancy lights on the boat, or my digital voltmeter, or specific gravity test.

[scsmith42]

It is common practice in telecommunication sites to replace an entire string if a single battery goes bad, otherwise you will lose the rest of the sting in the near future.

Brings back few memories...when I had a real job working for the phone company every central office had battery backup.  Huge batteries in glass or maybe lexan jars.  We ran a float charge constantly...every month checked the voltage.  This was before digital meters but we used a meter with a mirror behind the needle.  I think each cell was supposed to read 2.14 volts.  Then we checked specific gravity.  The batteries would last for years...20 or more.  The only string I saw replaced was because a cell was leaking due to impact.

Battery failure is caused by three things.  Vibration, number of discharges, and how deep you discharge. 

Larry, good analysis; however you forgot one other cause of failure...  sulfite buildup on the plates (if the battery is not on a float or other charger).  The pulse chargers break up the sulfites (or keep them from developing).

I remember those big batteries in the CO's - as I recall they cost over 1K each, and there were a lot of them in the strings!

[moonhill]

The lead plates are porous, the desulfator will break the pores open and allow the electrolyte  to flow through the plates.  This happens over time and is a big contributor to the down fall of the lead acid battery.  Another other downfall is lack of sunlight :(

Tim

[scsmith42]

The lead plates are porous, the desulfator will break the pores open and allow the electrolyte  to flow through the plates.  This happens over time and is a big contributor to the down fall of the lead acid battery.  Another other downfall is lack of sunlight :(

Tim

Hmm - looks like I'm learning something.  I knew that the desulfinator broke down sulfite accumultions, but did not realize that it also deteriorated the lead.

Tim, I don't understand the comment about sunlight though.. could you please elaborate?  Thx.

Scott

[moonhill]

Scott, sunlight is my primary charging source.  We have had about 2 day of sun in 3 weeks and short days to boot. 

I don't know about the lead deteriorating, but as you point out sulfite does accumulate, in the pores of the lead plates, which slows or restricts the flow of electrolyte.  As pointed out desulfators will clean the pores, extending battery life. 

Tim 

[Slabs]

I just move my little Schumacher battery-maintainer back and forth between the mower and snow-blower every week or so.

[Magicman]

How many of us has-been telephone folks are on FF?  What did we do....trade telecommunications for sawdust ???

[scsmith42]

Scott, sunlight is my primary charging source.  We have had about 2 day of sun in 3 weeks and short days to boot. 

I don't know about the lead deteriorating, but as you point out sulfite does accumulate, in the pores of the lead plates, which slows or restricts the flow of electrolyte.  As pointed out desulfators will clean the pores, extending battery life. 

Tim 

Re Sunlight... NOW I get it.... sometimes a little slow on the uptake.

[James P.]

well this topic and a walmart gift card had me buy to small trickle chargers Den mentioned. I usually drag around the battery charger all day but thought I might try to change that pattern. I wish they made an inexpensive 24v maintainer. Anyhow all my batteries are old truck batteries that I paid 5 a piece for. In the future when I replace with new ones I will definitely do a better job maintaining them . thanks for the good info.

[LorenB]

I wish they made an inexpensive 24v maintainer. 

James,

It's not inexpensive, but they do make one:
http://www.batteryminders.com/batterycharger/catalog/BatteryMINDer-24-Volt-4-Amp-Charger-Maintainer-Desulfator-Condi-p-16142.html

-- Loren

[LorenB]

kelLOGg,

I don't understand all I know about batteries, but I do know that some types lose their charge faster than others while just sitting around unused. 

Optima batteries are AGM (Absorbed Glass Mat) type.  I own several of their deep-cycle batteries, mostly installed in vehicles, but also as the house batteries in our RV.  So far (knock on wood), I have not had one fail.  The oldest pair is nine years old; the newest are about five years old. 

I do take care of them, mostly by keeping them charged, but also by using the desulphation feature of my Vector (now sold by Black & Decker) charger.  I have noticed that even after sitting unused in a piece of equipment for a month or more, my Optima batteries will provide enough power to start it. 

I'm sure there are other brands that are similar, and I realize that Optima's are not cheap.  The blue-tops that I buy are about $160 each at Sam's club.  In spite of that, I am very happy I spent the money. 

Maybe some electrical wizard here can shed some light on why they hold their charge so long. 

-- Loren

[kelLOGg]

Wow! There is more information in this thread than I ever would have expected. Now I want a "de-sulfinator" ;D. My little 25 year old 2 amp automatic Schumacher says I can leave it indefinitely on the battery being charged but it doesn't say anything about it being a "maintainer".

I have a 120 VAC wattmeter and when I plug the charger into it, it registers about 10 watts when the battery is being charged and eventually falls to 0 (as best as I can read it).  I have been keeping it on my new deep cycle batteries to keep them ready for a job in 2 weeks.
Bob

[motohed]

I use the battery tender version of chargers , they are fairly cheap and you set it and forget it .  It would cost me a small fortune if I had to replace batteries every year in my equipment and toy's .