wanting to move to alaska!

[Tom]

I think it gets too cold up there.  :-\

[Jeff]

It gets too cold down there!

[SwampDonkey]

Sibling rivalries. :D :D

[SwampDonkey]

Reading about the fella and wife in SD on that link I posted is enough to make me want to stay home. The pictures look a lot like southern Alberta. Yup, I'm staying home. ;D

[ely]

up or down it gets too cold. :D
my cousin and his wife moved up there in more like 5 weeks. but they live in northpole alaska.

[Mooseherder]

Is there name calling and mean spiritedness between the North and the South? ;D

[Jeff]

Depends on what color their chainsaw is.

[Warbird]

Jeff got it.  ;D

[North Pole Kid]

I say go for it. 
Yes- it is hard, but well worth it.
  Not to be a downer, but the cost of living up here is high, but there is lots of work.  My Grampa used to say "Everyone needs a ditch digger", and it holds true up here.  I agree with Warbird, if you are a desk jockey, stay home, but if you are blue collar, this is the place to be.  Lots of oil jobs, construction, roadwork, etc.  Southeast is going to be more like Washington, but as you move north, a little more in-hospitible.  I am in North Pole (how'd you guess), just outside of Fairbanks, and I can't dream of being somewhere else. 
  As far as off the grid, tone it down a little.  There are people who do it, but were raised there.  I have a cabin out in the bush, and spend alot of time there, but couldn't/wouldn't do it year round.  There are plenty of places to be kinda off the grid, but still have some services. 
  I moved up from Oregon, so keep planning, it can be done.

[ARKANSAWYER]

  Now I have spent 3 winters in Alaska at Fort Greely in the cold weather test station and at Black Rock training.  I have seen cold and to be artic certified you have to spend 3 days and 2 nights out and it has to get to -30 to count.  All you have you carry on your back.  It will sure cull the men from the boys most quick.
  So if you want to see if you can do it then just throw the main breaker at your house and turn off the water and gas.  Get a 5 gallon bucket in the bathroom and put in a wood stove to heat and cook on.  You will need to pretty much just move into the room with the wood stove as you are not going to be able to heat the whole house with what wood you can cut by hand.  I had a buddy who lived off grid back in the 80's in Delta Junction and his cabin was 16x20 with walls about 1 ft thick and roof at 2 ft thick and all they had to burn for wood was spruce.  It was nothing for him to burn a cord a week just to keep from freezing.
  There was a PBS show about a guy who flew into some lake up in Canada and built a cabin and lived there by himself till he was in his 80's.  Did it all by hand and way off the grid.  Some friends would bring supplies from time to time by plane.
  Folks move here to Arkansas all the time and try to live off the grid and grow their own food.  Most are gone in just a year or two.  Many do not last the summer.  It is hard work to grow, kill, and store your food.  It is hard work to cut wood to get through 7 months of winter.   I have lived where during the winter the street lights never go off and in the summer they never come on.   It takes some getting used to.  And wait till summer when the skitters take after you.  I just thought they were bad in the swamps of Mississippi.  But there are only snow snakes up there.

[fuzzybear]

well I'm across the border and it's not much different here. It fall into the catagory of living north of the 60th.
  All I can do is sugest you make a plan and stick with it. It takes 7 years min. to set yourself up for living off grid. Now that's an avarage number, may be shorter may be longer.


   Things you have to think about that slip most peoples mind when planning are simple things you take for granted every day.   Example is food.  Now you run to the store when you need food, here offf grid, the store may be a days journey. So you have to have at least a 2 month supply of food.

   Fuel is another supply you will need. Transportation, skidoo for winter, if you keep trails open a long track will do, if you have to break trails to get to town you are going to need a wide track.  If you decide to go totally off grid and use dog team, you need lots of meat for the dogs.
   As far as burning a cord of wood a week, that's extreme.  A cord a month on average here. When it does go to -40/-50's you will burn a cord in 2 weeks. So you need to have at least 10 cords to start your winter.
   When you build your cabin I would suggest building only as big as you need. keep the side walls around 6' and stay away from big open areas. Build a foundation that is double thick, Keep the air out of the floor. There are ways to make radiant heated floors using the wood stove to heat the coolant and it will circulate without electricity. Build in a style that allows you to compartmentalize. This way you can add a small stove to certain rooms for back up heat when it reaches -40. Don't try to heat with one large stove, you become a slave to it if you build to big.
   Water is a major problem living off grid. you have to have a good source of water nearby. in the winter you will have to keep the hole in the ice open to get water. You could go with a plastic holding tank. but you will find that 250 gal will go very fast if you do not conserve water. Most people think you can melt the snow and drink it to survive. This is NOT true. Snow contains no minerals that we need out of water. It is good for doing dishes and washing your self. But remember it takes 1" of water to make 1' of snow, so when you fill up a 5 gal pot with snow you anly get about 4-5 inches of water. it takes alot to fill up a pot.
   If you don't know how now, teach yourself now.  Like cooking, do you plan on packing 100lb propane bottles out into the bush, if not then you need to learn how to cook ontop of and inside the wood stove.
   We have a saying here that is very true, " you spend all summer getting ready for winter, and all winter trying to survive."
FB

[Tillaway]

I have done allot of work in SE Alaska.  Lots of timber in fact residents are allowed something like 5,000 or 10,000BF( can't remember exactly) per year off the Tongass NF.  It is not really advertised but you can check around to get more info.  The problem is all the Cedar within reach of every open road is gone.  I used to see folks getting their wood all the time.
Quite a few portable mills in operation on the islands because of the free logs.  I can't remember seeing a community without one.  The purpose of the program is to supply building material for residents.

It would be pretty hard to starve in SE, every low tide supplies clams.  Sell the car for island life, buy a boat that can handle rough water, preferably a fast one.  A trip to the doctor is via float plane, so is the ride to the hospital (I should know).  Plan on rain, one year I was up there there were just 7 days without it that year, even the residents were complaining.  Garden will have to be indoors and probably under lights.  You can have about anything delivered via barge or landing craft.  Even hot pizza delivery via regular scheduled flights form Juneau or Ketchikan.  Grocery shopping is via mail order.  Its cheaper to buy from a Seattle grocery and mail it up than the store in town.  One large NW regional department/grocery has a program for SE Alaska.

The drawback is that you need to be independently wealthy to pull this off.  Work is seasonal, if you can find it.  The only industry is fishing / processing, tourism and associated support.  Timber is mostly tribal export logs. What land is not owned by the Government is owned by a tribal corporation.  No real private timberland that I can think of.  The full time work is with the Government or tribal corps. 

[LOGDOG]

RockyMountainSawyer,

This used to be a dream of my wife's and mine. I think we're over it. We've been contemplating such a move for about the last 6-7 years. In that time I've followed the real estate market every week and watched the same homes (some not all - but more than I'm comfortable with) stay on the market the whole time. I've seen some come up for sale, sell and then come up for sale again. It's interesting to watch an area like that intensely for such a long period of time. I even read the local papers week by week.

If you want to meet Alaskans then here's a good Forum: http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/
Bookmark that one. You'll need to be a member to see some of the posted pictures. When you get to the homepage of that Forum, scroll down towards the bottom and you'll see there's a whole section dedicated to Alaskan Living. You'll find a number of threads there on both moving to Alaska and living off the grid.

I'm not sure how Jeff would feel about me posting real estate websites on here that I've found but I've found some with lots of remote properties. Believe me, I have a ton of information on this topic archived.

After looking at it thoroughly though, my wife and I have come to the conclusion that there are places that are good to live  and there are places that are good to visit but not necessarily live. For us, I think Alaska falls into the latter.

The reality of life is the thing that a person needs to hold onto when considering something like this. When you have a tooth ache and there's no dentist around you might be rethinking where you're at. One of the places we were considering - Prince of Wales Island- actually has a "dental boat" that comes around and you need to either wait until it does for treatment, or catch a 3-4 hour ferry to Ketchikan or hop a floatplane to Ketchikan. Either way, it's a long, expensive trip or a long, painful wait. Little things like not having access to a pharmacy when you're sick and need medicine can make a huge difference when it comes to quality of life and overall health.

Now, there are places in Alaska where you can live that have conveniences, but you'll find that they basically look like the cities and towns in the lower 48 and have all of the things (on the negative side) that usually prompt us to want to move off the grid. So what you end up with is living some place that's not really the Alaska you and I have dreamed of, but the cost of living is super high because it's Alaska. We decided the lower 48 is a better fit at this stage of our life. That's just us though. If you two decide to give it a go then that's awesome. Best wishes on that. Let me know if you want me to send you a bunch of websites via pm that I've accumulated over time on the subject.

Be sure to check out that Forum. 

Take your time doing the research.

[Carpenter]

     Boy, you guys sure are putting a damper on a good thread with all that realism.  You're making me think of it as Sewards Icebox again.   :
     The way I read it, they didn't intend to live entirely off the grid but just to be as self sufficient as possible. 

[Warbird]

Not trying to put a damper on anything.  I'm trying to help the OP out.  From the sounds of it, he's got the grit to make it here.  I just want him to have the knowledge and tools to get 'er done if he pulls the trigger on it.

[Raider Bill]

But look at all the great info that's flowing in!

Log Dog made some great points, actually everyone has. That's a huge step to take.

Check out Plickety Cat's posts and blog. They are doing it but man does it sound hard and expensive.

[Buck]

I hope he tries it and keeps us posted.

[Chuck White]

     Boy, you guys sure are putting a damper on a good thread with all that realism.  You're making me think of it as Sewards Icebox again.   :
     The way I read it, they didn't intend to live entirely off the grid but just to be as self sufficient as possible. 

Your venture is doable for sure.

Just take the time and think it out before jumping.

There are times and places in Alaska where you can be in a Life & Death situation in a hurry.
Be it the weather or some of the critters that grow there.
A lot depends on just where you intend on going.

I really liked Alaska for the 4½ years I was stationed there.  I was at Elmendorf AFB (near Anchorage).
The weather there isn't much different that right here at home.  We just had the light/dark to deal with.
When I was driving down the Alaska Highway, heading home, I met a family somewhere near Dawson and the guy had a Woodmizer sawmill behind his pick-up and his wife was towing a large camper trailer behind a Suburban.  They were headed for some "homestead property" somewhere in Alaska.
Looked like he had all his ducks lined up.

I'm wishing you the best of luck and good fortune in your move.

[fishpharmer]

Rockymountainsawyer, this is a great thread, I sure am glad you asked. 8)  At one time I wanted to move to Alaska, Jack London quenched most my thirst. Really, I just never wanted to leave the South. I still want to visit Alaska.

Since your gathering info., tonight, for the first time I watched a show on National Geographic Channel about Alaskan State Troopers, interesting show.  Might you give you a a view of Alaska from another perspective.   

[LOGDOG]

Funny you bring that up Fishpharmer. One thing I noticed every week in the paper was the police reports and arrest reports. It's actually startling to find out how many cases of robbery, DUI, DWI, Drunken brawls, domestic abuse, etc there are up there vs. here. I read a report that said Alaska was one of the states with the highest rate of domestic abuse. Between that and the robbery issues that I saw on a coninual basis it made me think that people have a hard time making a go of it. That can cause people to steal or in a husband/wife scenario ...argue about money. Throw in the alcohol and you've got a situation that gets out of hand.

One thing that everyone I have ever talked to regarding moving to Alaska has said is, "Come with a pocket full of money". That saying, "Success is when preparedness and opportunity meet" comes to mind. I think it's wise that RockeyMountainSawyer has made this a 5 year plan. That's a good amount of time to get his ducks in a row and think it through. Also enough time to either hone or develop skills to support the new lifestyle. I hate to say it but there's a pile of sawmills up there and they've got the headstart on connections and relationship business. One thing there is a shortage of is Dry Kilns. Also something that has seemed to be a very necessary trade up there is a good solid diesel mechanic. Doesn't matter if it's big equipment on land or at sea, that stuff breaks down and it's expensive to fix. Look at the money Capt. Phil was having to spend on his boat on Deadliest Catch.

If I were going to live off grid I guess I'd probably try to take in some classes at a local trade school for Solar power and the networking of the panels, batteries etc. I personally would need to take a class on the basics of electrician work as it's one skill I have not learned over the years. May be a good idea to take some carpentry classes if you're looking at building your own place if you're not familiar with carpentry.

I'd probably get used to living off of a tight budget and doing a shop to fill the pantry/freezer for say 6 months at a time and stick to it without fudging one bit. (That's not actually a bad idea even if you stay down in the lower 48.) Check out this couples blog:
http://thehappytrappers.blogspot.com/   ...... I follow it. There's commentary in there on the shopping they do for their extended trips over the winter in their cabin while trapping. Maybe you can email them back and forth and get some tips. I know some of the followers of the blog contact them since they mention it in comments on the blog itself.

I'd probably (if I didn't already know how) learn the basics of butchering meat and putting it up whether via a canning process or curing process. Practice that while you're down here and maybe get used to eating that way. See how you like it.

I'd probably plant you a garden while you're down here. If you're not familiar with gardening it'd be good to get some practice in. SInce Alaska's growing season is short you may want to build you a little cold frame greenhouse and try growing things very early in your growing season and very late in the growing season while you're down here. Again, practice putting up the vegetables via canning, drying, etc.

A class in navigation and map reading probably wouldn't hurt depending on how far off grid you intend to be.

I'd make it a point to pay off any debt well before you leave town. Aquire the tools you may need while you're down south. Learn how to use and take care of them ahead of leaving for up there. Maybe even build you a cabin down where you live now as a practice run.

Just stuff like that.  

I hope you keep us posted. I'd love to follow your progress and live vicariously through you.  ;) I don't think anyone hear wants to discourage you at all. It'll just go better for you if you plan it out well.  ;)

[jim king]

It sounds easier down here in the Amazon.  Plenty of food, warm and not enough worries about living but 20% of the European blood immigrants wake up dead for one reason or another and 50% of the rest go down hill.

Think about it, I hope you do well but don´t ever forget your limits.  If you have never tested your limits you will there or any where similar .  I like air conditioning and a supermarket as close as possible, like 5 blocks.

Telephone, internet, electricity, water and a bunch of other things are not bad.  Going against the grain is always good but when it is to better your self.

[North Pole Kid]

  It doesn't have to be a dream.  If you look at the stats on AK, unemployment has declined (we are in the top ten for work), house prices are stable (recession has not hit us as hard), and population has been flat for a while.  Its a good place to live, but there is definatly some acclimation to the surroundings.  Getting in a bind can be life or death in -50 weather, but as long as you know what your getting into, no worries.
  I dumped a snomachine thru the Tanana river (crossing to my cabin in the winter) at -40.  Dropped thru and got soaked to the bone, but I was prepared for the worst, and was not a big deal.  (My wife had an issue with it)  Just be prepared and you'll do fine.

[LOGDOG]

Bump .....

Where you at RockyMountainSawyer? Just bumping this thread along to see if you checked out the Alaska forum and how that research is coming.

[Raider Bill]

I was watching a show on Discovery green I think it was titled the Alaska experiment.
They put several couples or teams out in the bush at cabins. Gave them some staples, guns and fishing equipt. Judgeing by the one show I saw they are not going to make it through the winter.

[Warbird]

Sheesh.  How come I wasn't selected for that show? ???