I just bought a Ford 860 tractor with a rear end forklift. It runs good but the wiring is a mess.
The fellow I bought it from said the generator most likely doesn't work. I need to run new wires to everything, but before I do this, should I convert it to 12V's?
If it matters the winters are mild here compared to you Easterners. We rarely get -20's and get below 0 F for less than a month.
I'm looking for about tree fifty worth of advice. Because I aint paying mor dan tree fifty for advice. ;D
I really don't know what the advantage is supposed to be. We have two old tractors that we still use that are 6v-----one we use almost every day to pull our edger. I don't ever remember having much electrical problems with them.
If it were me, I wouldn't spend the money to convert it. Chances are brushes will fix your generator.
That makes me think, I've always wondered why some of those old tractors were positive ground?
Quote from: Bro. Noble on September 06, 2005, 04:23:46 PM
I've always wondered why some of those old tractors were positive ground?
I don't know for sure but I believe it was the way they did it in England.
I had an Austin-Healy Sprite and I will always remember that it said on the instrument panel "Positive Earth".
-Doug
My son, born in 1970, has a 1948 Ford F-1 pickup with a six volt, positive ground system. It's funny that this came up because I spent a couple of hours, over at his house last night, discussing and diagnosing a bad battery cell. Six cells didn't used to be so uncommon. I'm sure glad that we finally settled on Negative ground though. :)
I read somewhere sometime in the past that it was believed that a positive ground system gave a "smoother" spark that was less likely to burn points. Some of our old tractors are still on 6V and others have been converted. An H Farmall with a 12 volt system sure starts nice ;) We've got a B Farmall that Grandpa converted to 12V long ago. I've driven it out of the barn in low gear with the starter ;D Wouldn't want to go to far though ;D If the 6V system is going to require a lot of work and dollars and you're not concerned that the Correct Police are going to come and haul you away a one wire GM alternator is the way to go.
Converted my little Ford tractor to 12V many moons ago. I love it, and now I even got really bright lights for plowin' dat white stuff. 8)
I didn't pick it up the day I bought it, he's going to deliver it for me. I stopped by today and he agreed to fix the starter switch for me and it turns out he went and fixed most of it.
I think I'll buy a generator rebuild kit and start from there. The brushes are cheap. If that doesn't work, I'll probably conver it to 12V's before buying gages.
thanks for your tree fifty,
6V works real good as long as your cables are nice and thick and making good contact.
I would run it on 6V unless, like Chet, you want bright lights, or like Corley, you like to drive around on the starter ;)
I'd like to have bright lights, so I think I'll plan on converting it in the long run. You know how that goes, "Hmmm I've been figurin to change that for a spell now." ;D
Ask me a year from now how it's going. ;)
My neighbors ford is converted, I think its an 860, there is a resistor in the works. If I remember right its in the ignition circuit. My ol' MF is still 6v and when in good tune does just fine. In cold weather you don't get a whole lot of tries with 6v is the only trouble I've had...course my lights have been gone for years, we call that quittin time ;D.
I have found most of my older tractors with six volt start ok in below zero weather if properly tuned and the electrical system is clean and in good order. There are some pretty good six volt lights out there. The twelve volt will overcome alot of issues that might need fixing anyways. ;)
Will
I replaced the the worn hydraulic hoses last night at a friend's shop. He's the forklift repairman that's working on getting the 18k forklift.
Here's a bad photo of the new hoses. :D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11541/DEGoi04.JPG)
This should probably be listed under Health and Safety... This is what the rear straps looked like when I got home, in the dark, last night.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11541/DEGoi03.JPG)
:o :o
I have a new rule for myself, "Get the DanG flashlight out when straping down equipment at night."
Ya man, good rule! ;)
That's a pretty neat forklift. Is attached to the three point ??? How much will it lift and how high ::)
You may need a rebuilt generator or just a voltage regulator to get the charging system back in the pink. The Ford dealer in town my brother use to work for has 8V batteries for those old 6V systems. They give just a bit more power to the starter ands will charge fine on the original charging system.
I had a 1951 Ford 8N for 25 years during that time I don't think the charging system ever worked. The 6V battery would be good for about 2 months of starting before needing a charge. I don't have lights on the tractor which helped battery life.
On really cold days in the Northeast the tractor would start just fine. You can use a 12V battery on a 6V starter, but do not crank it for more than a few seconds. A 12V altenator can be used in place of a generator, use the kind that have the voltage regulator built in and I think you need to add a diode to 12V feed from the battery. Then you can add 12V work lights which are easier to find.
Randy
I decided to go to the 12V mostly due to lights. Thanks for your input on this question.
A little embarassing but, I can't figure out how to put oil into the engine. :-[ I'm going to have to read the manual. :-[ I was chuckling to myself last night walking from one side of the engine to the other, repeatedly scratching my head. Hmmmm who would of thunk it?
Well, read the manuals and I still don't know how to get oil into the engine. Anyone know how?
This is really really embarassing.
Well I knew how to put the oil into the backhoe, just couldn't find the dipstick..... until I realized I WAS the dipstick! ::)
Have someone else look for ya. ;)
If there is no cap on the valve cover there should be a fill in the block somewhere. I that does not help you could pump it up through the drain and put in the plug real quick. ::) Or pour into a sparkplug hole real slow and wait and wait and wait. :D
Will
GO 12!!!!!!!!!!!! Good choice. While your at it, check for an electronic ignition that are now widely available for the old girls. Love my tractor converted.
REID
Wiam,
The plug is 3" dia. HUGE drain, no fill. I guess I just need to find a nice hill to roll her over on her back?
The manual was helpful in telling me to make sure the oil level is full though.
Last winter when I rebuilt my tractor I rewired it and put a new generator and voltage regulator on it. I like to NEVER have figured out how it all worked. . John Deer 3020 diesel. The charging system consists of Two twelve volt batteries giving 24 volt negative ground to the starter............... and splits 12 volt negative ground to half of the electrics and lights........... and 12 volt positive ground the the other half. Whoever figured that out in the beginning HAD to have been out of their mind, and it like to run ME out of my mind rewiring and trouble shooting it.
Corely,
Up close I think it'll lift 3,000 - 4,000 lbs. It'll lift to about 6'
Shoot, I was hoping somone would point out a magic hole that I hadn't seen yet.
Finally found out where to put the oil. There's a crank Breather cap, then a post to mount the cap to. This post slips into a tube that goes into the block. A bit of hammering and I got the top popped off.
Oh, FYI, don't connet the ampmeter (-) to ground....
I'm in the middle of switching the ol' 841 Ford from 6 to 12 and could use some help. The 1 page paperwork that came with it lists 2 wires that aren't even there. Schematic is lame, etc. So what's the theory of alternators vs. generators? ???
Do I still use the old voltage regulator from the 6 V ? Or is that built into the alternator? Does the old voltage reg . now act as a connector that's important? Or can it come out? ???
How does the alternator recharge the battery? Does it flow back thru the system? Thru the solenoid?
There's 2 wires supposed to go to an ammeter. I have no ammeter on the tractor tho' I do have a charging light. Is that the "in-lieu " ammeter? Do I just hook the 2 wires together? or tape them off? ???
What's the theory of pos ground vs.neg grnd? 6 vs 12v. ?? ???
The reason I'm doing it is improved cranking in cold. PLUS I can run a winch off of 12v. 8)
By the way, The oil fill is usually where the breather cap is on the old tractors. Front right on mine...........Pull up the cap off the tube.... so look for a tube about 1" in diameter. 8)
What brand is the alternator? 6 volt regulator will have to go.
Will
Paperwork says Sparex. I'll check the unit itself and post.
You should add oil on the right side by pulling the breather cap; if memory serves me right. I used to run 1960 861. that tractor was a beast. I love those old fords. I converted mine to 12 volts it was pretty easy. But I ended up doing a complete rewire to eliminate all the old farmer fixes. After that, she would sit all winter and still have a full charge in the spring. I love those old fords.
There is a breather cap on the side of the block just forward of the distributor, thats the oil fill.
Ed
Hopefully he figured it out during sixteen years since he posted the question.
oil fill cap is on right side of tractor up near the radiator, also acts as crankcase vent. will be a round domed cap with a slit in it for vent
Quote from: btulloh on July 06, 2021, 11:47:36 PM
Hopefully he figured it out during sixteen years since he posted the question.
That does seem to be a little long, I like to check mine at least every decade whether it needs it or not.