Sawmill startup

JDB · April 01, 2011, 07:31:26 AM

Hello all.
I'm looking into starting a portable sawmill business, and figured that this would be the best place to come for some advice. Any advice on equipment both the mill and what support equipment is necessary and what i just nice to have would be appreciated very much.
Also if anyone has a business plan that they would be willing to share that would be very helpful to.
Thank you
JDB

Kansas · April 01, 2011, 09:07:45 AM

First thing to do is take the business plans that various sawmill manufacturing companies have and toss them out the window. They always have these wonderful numbers and you will make lots of money. I never see a line in there about expense trying to get a stuck in the mud portable sawmill out. About wrecking a blade on metal. Etc.

Everyone can toss numbers at you, but I think the main thing is to research your area. Are there too many mills in the area now? Or is there a real need? What are people charging per board foot? Also take a look at your assets, that is, what you can bring to the operation. You say mobile sawing, and that is how we got our start. You also are at the mercy of the weather. I never been to Northern Michigan, but imagine the winters might get rough up there.How many months will you actually be able to saw? Assets would include such things as being able to fix your mill. Never saw one yet that didn't break down. Do you have a barn where you could saw in the winter? Are you in a location that if you did, would you be better off to sell sawn lumber to complement the portable business? A good location is priceless. I don't want to discourage you. I just want you to go into it with eyes wide open. A business plan is only good until the first time the blade starts cutting. Then things change. Species of what you are cutting, how you charge (hour or bd ft), so many factors.

Gary_B · April 01, 2011, 11:33:01 AM

Could not have been said better

thecfarm · April 01, 2011, 04:05:14 PM

JDB welcome to the forum.Not as easy to sell lumber as it is to saw lumber.

Whitetail_Addict · April 01, 2011, 06:31:31 PM

:D I had to laugh at the previous post. You hit that nail right on the head thecfarm!

laffs · April 01, 2011, 07:19:06 PM

you eat chicken one weak the feathers the next week

terrifictimbersllc · April 01, 2011, 07:28:47 PM

Welcome to the forum, JDB. Not enough info for me to comment. How do you know there is any business for sawing in your area? How much can you afford to spend if in worst case, it was a bust and you had to sell your equipment at some loss? How much time do you have to saw? Would you go portable or be stationary at home? Can you saw at home (zoning, room for equipment), would you try to sell lumber?

red oaks lumber · April 01, 2011, 07:44:29 PM

the thing i learned about people is this. don't go around asking if there is a need for sawing, everyone will tell you yes. then after you jump head first and start all those people that were yes men suddenly don't need or have any thing that needs doing.
look around your area,look for advertising ect. if you decide you make a go of it, then start asking people and get your name out there.
people dont take some one serious if its only a dream. what ever the dollar amount you spend getting going have that same amount set aside to keep you afloat till your business starts providing for you. good luck

Kansas · April 01, 2011, 08:26:42 PM

Quote from: laffs on April 01, 2011, 07:19:06 PM
you eat chicken one weak the feathers the next week

A variation of that is......some days you are the dog...some days you are the fire hydrant

Busy Beaver Lumber · April 01, 2011, 09:02:54 PM

If you want to succeed, then your business plan better include more than just sawing boards, because there are a thousand people on this forum that can do that.

You should think about where can you buy logs, and can you buy them at the right price or in sufficient quantities?

What types of wood can you sell in your area and to whom will you sell them to? Why should someone buy from you instead of buying from someone else?

Based on your operating costs, can you be competitive in price and based on your equipment and skills, can you be competitive in output and honor your commitments?

Can you service a niche market like cedarman does? Do you know of a niche market where there is a definitive need and is it one you can fill and turn a profit?

Having more to offer than just sawing or selling pre-cut wood greatly increases your chance of success. For example we also sell bundled firewood and will do over $75,000 just in firewood sales this year just based on existing contracts...and the firewood season is just beginning for us. We also have 46 deliveries already lined up for mulch that we get paid $50 each to deliver (plus a few dollars a yard discount we get to pocket since we are buying so much) and that we will do in the next few weeks. And I have a good health $8,000 backlog in rustic furniture orders to work on through during the next few months

Magicman · April 01, 2011, 09:14:44 PM

Welcome JDB, to the Forestry Forum.

"starting a portable sawmill business" could mean many different things. Part time, side line, full time, etc. Startup could be slow. How many portable sawyers are already in the area? How busy are they? Are you going to have to pay for the mill as you saw?

I'm into my 10th year portable sawmilling. The guy that I bought my sawmill from bought it to make a living with. He failed after two years. It was never intended by me for it to provide a "living" for us, and hasn't. My work is very steady and does provide extra money. My original goal was to saw 2 maybe 3 days a week. I could possible pass my "Million Board Feet" sawed next year.

Doing portable sawmilling, I would encourage you to get a large hydraulic mill that will handle any logs that the customer throws at you, and don't overlook used mills.

More about your plans and goals will help.

Kansas · April 01, 2011, 09:18:43 PM

I do want to point out that red oaks lumber makes a good point. People tend to tell you what you want to hear. Its better to determine demand side not from the average potential customer, but from sawyers. Also, I would assume that you have a list of sawmillers for your area. It would be good to talk to whoever is the district forester in you area, if you have one. Again, make sure they aren't telling you what you want to hear. Also talk to big mills, if there are any around. They may have something they want to sub out. You won't be any threat to them. The more people you talk to, the more you can put together the mosaic of what the industry is in your area. You want to have the best possible chance for this to work.The more people you can talk to in the industry, the better chance you have of knowing if it will work.

Busy Beaver Lumber · April 01, 2011, 09:56:42 PM

Kansas

Every time is see that picture of your dog with the beer can, I feel like going to thr fridge and grabbing myself a cold one 8)

Kansas · April 02, 2011, 06:52:09 AM

I'm glad I can be the inspiration for something.

Cedarman · April 02, 2011, 07:15:23 AM

I can teach someone to saw a cedar log in one day. They will still have things to learn about sawing a cedar log a year from now.
If you go into this, know that you can start sawing immediately, but that you will still be learning the business for years and years. Study this forum for a month. Get all the free trade magazines you can get. Get the back issues of Sawmill and Woodlot mags and read the pertinent articles. Make the subject of mobile sawing the college course that you will attend with rapt attention.
Don't dive in without checking water depth and submerged obstacles.

JDB · April 02, 2011, 07:25:44 AM

Hello everyone
Thank you for the input, and letting me know some of the right questions to ask. to give some more information

I would start part time, however my job is such that I work 60 days on and then have 60 of so it might be more like full time for half of the year
I know there are several medium size mills in the area but only know of one or two portable mills

I hope that this can help help. Any advice is greatly appreciated
JDB

Ax- man · April 02, 2011, 04:23:58 PM

Good replies gentlemen, I could have started this very same thread.

I like Busy Bee Lumber's reply out of all of them. I got a feeling this is the way our business will look within the next few years. I am starting the seeding process this year by trying to resell our wood chip mulch from our tree service biz and seeing if I have any talent at making log furniture. We are already into the firewood biz but wood from residential removals has been slim pickings the last few years for decent hardwood but we have been recycling the lower grade wood into campfire wood which seems to sell as good as the heatwood for winter. Last year we made more selling to campgrounds than we did to the fireplace market.

I would love to have a gas powered mini portable mill also but the cash layout isn't right for me at this time . I am going to start small and see if I can make a few bucks with one of these small chainsaw mill that only cost a few hundred bucks and go from there.

pnyberg · April 02, 2011, 04:29:34 PM

My advise would be to go to page 1 of the 'Sawmills and Milling' forum archives, and start working your way forward. I'm not suggesting that your read every post, or even every thread, but If you just poke your nose into threads that seem interesting, you will learn a lot.

I started a portable sawmill business in January of 2010. I was part time last year, but quit my 'day job' (or maybe semi-retired) at the end of the year, so now I'm available 7 days a week rather than just on weekends, but I'm not really 'full time', and don't intend to be, or need to be.

I decided to jump into this after hiring the sawyer who is now my closest competitor to bring his mill to my property and saw a few logs for me. I mentioned to him that I was considering buying a mill and starting a business, and he responded that that was fine with him, as he kept as busy as he wanted to without advertising at all. That was the extent of my market research.

As for equipment, I think the entry point would be a mill with hydraulics for loading and turning logs.

--Peter

JPM · April 02, 2011, 05:52:33 PM

one thing not said yet is ;what is your BS level? as in how much can you take/listen to, ect.that is one of the biggest things people do not take

Brad_S. · April 03, 2011, 05:32:14 PM

Quote from: pnyberg on April 02, 2011, 04:29:34 PM
I decided to jump into this after hiring the sawyer who is now my closest competitor to bring his mill to my property and saw a few logs for me.

I had a couple of former clients go out and buy mills and another who was already established before I started my business. While they were competitors in the sense that they were also in the same line of work, we were all very civil toward each other and often passed work or leads around. There were a few instances when I was so overwhelmed by an order that I would call someone in to saw with me. My point is, don't burn bridges with "competitors", they can be useful allies.