Buying standing Beach trees for firewood?

[jamesconley1962]

I am hoping some of you guys can help me with how I should approach a neighbor of mine who owns several acres of hard woods with an abundance of large beach trees.  He does burn wood but unable to cut and haul his own due to his health.  It would be easy access and I was hoping for an idea on how to approach him and what would be fair to pay him for the standing logs.  Thanks Jim

[beenthere]

Welcome to the forum.
I'd leave the money out, and consider something like you doing all the equipment and labor to cut, split, and haul but leave say 1/5 for the neighbor (or stacked to air dry and then it be 1/6 of the total). Just for starters.

Of 6 cords, neighbor gets 1.  

A lot will depend on what equipment, time, and labor you can give to the project.

[zopi]

Have fun splitting that beech...it is a bugger to split..

Could send some my way though...bucked to twelve feet...mama wants a new kitchen floor...

[John Mc]

Around here, standing firewood (trees that aren't much good for anything else) goes for about $10/cord, and that's if the access to them is good. A friend has log length firewood delivered to his house for under $100/cord (in quantities of about 7 cords). Mixed hardwood firewood, cut and split goes for around $180 to $250 per cord retail (depending on green vs seasoned).

One thing a lot of landowners don't understand is that most of the value in firewood is in the harvesting and processing. I've had folks offer to split the wood with me 50/50 they have the trees, and I do the work. Not even close to a fair deal.

John Mc

[SwampDonkey]

You won't get many people around here that would sell for less than $40/cord standing. Frozen green beech splits pretty easy by splitting maul. Well easy is relative I guess, nothing is as easy as white birch. ;D

[thecfarm]

james,how large is large? I have and had some large beech trees. Probably 2-2½ feet across and most were rotted hearted. Just so you know. But these trees were at least 50 yeras old too. Where abouts are you located? This is beech in Maine.

[stumper]

Contact your state Forest Circus and ask them for a stumpage report.  That should provide a value for the stumpage.  Condition of the trees will be important as that will determine the highest and best use.  If it is covered in scale or has rot it is firewood or pulp.  If they are nice straight log with smooth bark then think logs.  Around here (central maine) fire wood is a little less then $20 a cord but beech saw logs are $50 mbf.  roughly 5 times more.

Wood prices vary by location so check out your location, do not compare a subsidized Canadian industry with a locally depressed area.

Additionally, most small land owners care less about the money then the health of the stand and how it looks to them.  Back when I was young and foolish another forester and I started a business harvesting with horses.  We paid stumpage for log only.  Firewood and pulp was all ours.  Every stand we left was better then when we arrived and we had more lots then we had time to cut.  That being the case walk him through your land and show him you do only top quality work and will leave the stand better then it is now.  You will get the wood and a happy neighbor.

[John Mc]

You won't get many people around here that would sell for less than $40/cord standing.

My $10 figure may be a bit old as well. I have seen $20 on occasion more recently, but have not really researched it.

The highest I've seen is $30/cord for stumpage, but that was an unusual situation and had some good marketing behind it. It was an experiment by Vermont Family Forests in marketing local, sustainably managed and grown firewood to customers who were willing to pay a premium for log length firewood harvested to this standard. The customer ended up paying $150/cord delivered (6 cord minimum) for green, log length wood, and then cut and split it themselves. You can find out a bit more at this link to VFF's Neighborwood project.

It was an interesting experiment, and the 50 cords they did sold out quickly. I'm not sure how well it would hold up at a larger scale, or in other areas where there isn't such a strong "green" movement. At the time, you could find green cut and split hardwood firewood for $185 - $220 per cord, but without all the extras of sustainably grown, responsibly harvested & etc.

[SwampDonkey]

Dad used to practice sustainable firewood cutting, left the log trees to stand. But I have walked a lot of woodlots and when it comes to firewood, the majority of the cutting takes all the bigger trees (rock maple and beech) and leaves the runts and junk. And after 3 or 4 years that junk is all dead on the top and then they left wondering why their hardwood is dying back.  : Big trees makes for less felling, volumes adds up quicker. Won't change old habits. ;)

[thecfarm]

Swampdonkey,so many people think like that. But some don't think the rotten wood or the limby ones will burn good. Take too much time. They have no idea how much thier lazyness cost them. Cut the junk first and let the good stuff grow. Just like I try to tell people,a junk tree will grow more junk wood. Cut it down and let something good takes it place. I run all over my lot just looking for the nasty looking trees I can find.

[jamesconley1962]

james,how large is large? I have and had some large beech trees. Probably 2-2½ feet across and most were rotted hearted. Just so you know. But these trees were at least 50 yeras old too. Where abouts are you located? This is beech in Maine.

All the trees range in area from 19" and up, there is a lot of junk and that is all I am interested in.  Here in Michigan they used to make wooden shoes and bowls from the real nice beach but that's gone with everything else.   I have not been in the woods in 6 yrs but do know that no one has logged it.  The owners keep to them self and are on a tight budget so they don't get out much.  I hoped they would be interested in getting something out of the non valuable timber instead of letting it take up acreage which could be used to grow better timber.  (A junk tree takes up just as much room as a veneer tree)