Who will own farmland in the future?

DanG · August 21, 2009, 10:54:26 PM

Eat hearty, Ronnie! 8) 8) Well, I guess you already have, and have your feet sticking up out of that Lazy-Boy. :D :D :D

moonhill · August 22, 2009, 10:09:09 PM

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6736846601041698993

A little refresher in history to go along with the land grabbing in Africa.

Tim

Ron Wenrich · August 23, 2009, 09:51:24 AM

I learned a long time ago, that what you see in land ownership patterns is not what has always been. When I would set up a timber sale, I would always run a title search to make sure the lines were what the were supposed to be. At times, I could run these searches back to the original warrant deed. Even original land grants were not that large.

I worked several jobs with nice size timber that had been farmland in the past. On one sale, we followed the original rocks on a zig-zag fence, which means it was originally a pasture. On another sale, there was an entire farm that had been left go to forest way back in the late 1800s. Forestland had been increasing at the expensive of farmland since the early 1900s. That has stopped in the 1990s in many areas.

In my area, one of the larger farm owners was an equipment dealer. He sold farm equipment right after WWII. He sold it on credit and had the farmers use their farms as collateral. When they couldn't make payments, he took the farm.

Most of the guys around here that are doing farming full time will lease farm ground. I've seen them on some pretty small plots. With the industrialization of the food sources, there isn't as much of a need for the sprawling farms that provided grazing areas. They feedlot the animals. The biggest problem is what to do with all the manure.

Since 1950, the population in the world has gone up 267%. That means that food output had to match that. The bigger question isn't who's going to own the farmland, but will the farms be able to match output with consumption.

SwampDonkey · August 23, 2009, 12:22:54 PM

I think that also comes down to farm policy and people's lifestyles to. Take this country for instance, we produce way more than we can eat by far. But, also many of our food imports are being subsidized by a cheap food policy. It's nice to have cheap food, but who is actually paying for it under the paperwork? Someday, someone is going to say it's just too expensive to ship a pineapple to NB from Costa Rica, or too expensive to ship strawberries from California to Newfoundland. Not only that, but nobody will be buying them because they won't be $2.99 a box, but 8.99 a box. Blueberries and raspberries out of season are about $8 a handful fresh. Marketing them as AntiOx will get a few health nuts to buy, but the average Joe walks bye. They usually lay in the store and rot or they make parfaits from them just before they turn to mush and sell them for about $4 each for 4 cups out of that handful mixed with yogurt and granola.

crtreedude · August 23, 2009, 12:41:55 PM

I find people in small communities more dependent than those is cities. This is because you have to rely on our neighbor instead of just renting something. Small communities work together to get things done, and know who the deadbeats are. Larger communities tend to put things in the hands of the government.

Who will own the land? Those who are meek. Jesus said that many, many years ago and not surprising, it what I see all the time. Those who feel they need to show off their wealth by having cars and fancy clothes tend to lose what they have, but those who meekly go out to work day by day and continue work and making more valuable the land they have, they will hold onto their land, and increase it.

Large corporations appear to be winning, but really they just look like it. Long term, they fade and die.

moonhill · August 23, 2009, 10:23:14 PM

The bulk of our wild blueberries are frozen within 24 hours, this way they will not rot on the store shelf, and are available year round. I would not mind seeing them in California at $8.00/half pint.

Tim

SwampDonkey · August 24, 2009, 03:24:39 AM

I get them fresh during the season in the store for $13 a 5 lb box. I froze one box, but I have several of my own raspberries frozen which I eat mostly in parfaits. I'll put some frozen blueberries in my cornbread. I make cornbread instead of muffins. I don't buy muffins because they are more like cake, expensive cake at that.

Ironmower · August 25, 2009, 09:18:05 PM

I hole-heartedly believe farmers will still "own" the farmland. You cannot "mechanize" everything for the better. The only thing I wonder, is there going to be any "true" farmers left. I mean true in the form of knowing the land, working the land. Books and schooling is great, but it don't grow the crops. My feeling is, that "most" people believe that their fruits, vegetables, and meats, come from the grocery store.

In the past 15 yrs or so, I've seen some of the best farm ground in my local quad-state area, that is nothing but giant summer homes for the wealthy. The orchards I growed up on, is just that. Sickening!

I'm not tryin to rub anybody the wrong way, but my uneducated thinkin tells me that if we, as the human race keeps trying to save "everybody" from illness, diseases, wars and mothernature we are destine for failure. Yes, I want to live a long healthy life, just like everybody else. Even if it does take medical attention. I guess the point I'm tryin' to make is, the plantet is over-populated, which throws the delicate balance outa-wack. I hope the good lord above has a plan.

DanG · August 25, 2009, 11:55:52 PM

Quote from: Ironmower on August 25, 2009, 09:18:05 PM
my uneducated thinkin tells me that if we, as the human race keeps trying to save "everybody" from illness, diseases, wars and mothernature we are destine for failure. Yes, I want to live a long healthy life, just like everybody else. Even if it does take medical attention. I guess the point I'm tryin' to make is, the plantet is over-populated, which throws the delicate balance outa-wack. I hope the good lord above has a plan.

That doesn't sound like an uneducated mind to me, it sounds like a mind that has not been polluted. ;) The Good Lord does have a plan, according to my beliefs. That plan has already been executed when he gave us a soul, a conscience, the power of reasoning, and opposable thumbs. He gave us dominion over the Earth, and charged us with the responsibility to manage it wisely. If we continue to adapt to the changes that inevitably happen, we will continue to survive, just like the alligator and the cockroach. If we fail to adapt, we will go the way of the dinosaur, and become fuel for the next stewards of this planet.

IMHO, "owning" land is simply holding control of it, or "owning" the right to control it, as far as man is concerned. A true farmer doesn't own his land, but rather the land owns HIM!

As long as we remain free to use the gifts we have been given, there will be farmers that just keep getting better. If we continue to disempower people to control their own destiny, the farmers will not do so well, and there will be a famine. The people who don't know where their food comes from will either wise up, or starve....simple as that.

SwampDonkey · August 26, 2009, 04:46:27 AM

Quote from: Ironmower on August 25, 2009, 09:18:05 PM
My feeling is, that "most" people believe that their fruits, vegetables, and meats, come from the grocery store.

Mom was in the farmer's market over a year ago in early April. This was a time that most farmers were just thinking of scratching the land. This one patron comes by and asks:

Patron: "Do you see any fresh local corn today?"

Mom: "No dear not today"

:

:

Now I live in Carleton county, NB and this is definitely someone who has led a different path in life than I. We probably have the choicest ground in the province for growing food or trees, but corn don't grow like Jack's beanstalk. You certainly can't say this person has the general attitude of folks around here because this is an entirely rural area and most everyone knows about what it takes to grow stuff as far as weather and climate. Makes you shake your head sometimes.

Norm · August 26, 2009, 06:59:15 AM

On our local radio station they had a quiz, what percentage of farm land in Iowa is still considered a family farm. The correct answer was 95%.

DanG · August 26, 2009, 08:03:55 AM

Norm, is most of that land still farmed by the owners, or is there a lot of renting and leasing going on?

Magicman · August 26, 2009, 09:01:33 AM

Quote from: DanG on August 25, 2009, 11:55:52 PM
IMHO, "owning" land is simply holding control of it, or "owning" the right to control it, as far as man is concerned. A true farmer doesn't own his land, but rather the land owns HIM!

Very well said DanG. I "own" a 346 acre tree farm. Does that mean that it is mine? Not hardly. I'm simply it's "caretaker" for my lifetime. It's my responsibility to pass it on in better condition than when I got it. Plain and simple....

crtreedude · August 26, 2009, 10:10:51 AM

Quote from: Magicman on August 26, 2009, 09:01:33 AM
Quote from: DanG on August 25, 2009, 11:55:52 PM
IMHO, "owning" land is simply holding control of it, or "owning" the right to control it, as far as man is concerned. A true farmer doesn't own his land, but rather the land owns HIM!

Very well said DanG. I "own" a 346 acre tree farm. Does that mean that it is mine? Not hardly. I'm simply it's "caretaker" for my lifetime. It's my responsibility to pass it on in better condition than when I got it. Plain and simple....

That is our view as well. I am a steward of everything that the good Lord gave us. I need to be a faithful one. And I will say, even after all these years, I still think it is a miracle when a seed sprouts. I could watch that all day long, except weed seeds of course...

Don_Papenburg · August 26, 2009, 09:37:13 PM

I had a couple Bu. of green beans to sell at the farmers market aweek ago . Alittle girl and her mom stopped by . The girl was about 3rd or 4th grade . She asked why there was a leaf in the beans . I told her it was a bean leaf . ABEAN LEAF? I didn't know beans had leaves. I said well actualy the bean plant has the leaf .and it got in there when i was picking . A BEAN PLANT ? I didn't know beans had plants. So I said yes they grow on a plant.

Cedarman · August 27, 2009, 07:14:05 AM

CR, cedars are considered weeds in many places, especially Oklahoma. And I love those weeds. :D :D I look fondly at those little seedlings on the ranches we cut. The owner has about 4 or 5 years after we remove the trees to have a controlled burn or we get to visit again in another 25 to 30 years. Many are those that hate cedars, and few of us that love them. Ahhh, weeds. :D :D

jim king · August 27, 2009, 08:21:41 PM

I am surprised that no one has mentioned this.

Don`t pay your taxes for a couple of years and lets see who really owns everything.

Like it or not everyone is a renter.

SwampDonkey · August 28, 2009, 05:04:20 AM

I've been saying it for years Jim. We're just paying rent. And the kicker is, someone can snipe it up from under you after 3 years by paying the taxes and buying it on auction. As an example, some older folks who loose there mind and live alone have the money and often cheques hidden in tea cups and never cashed. Some one gets their 300 acre farm and woodlot for maybe $50,000. I've seen a local saw mill get 200 acre of woods for as little as $20,000 cash. In many instances the old timer is still living in the past and doesn't have any idea of land value.

Kodiakmac · August 28, 2009, 06:05:45 AM

Quotesome older folks who loose there mind and live alone have the money and often cheques hidden in tea cups and never cashed. Some one gets their 300,000 acre farm and woodlot for maybe $50,000.

At least these poor folks have an excuse - they've lost their mind. It's the perfectly sane, normal folks who are sitting back and allowing their governments to continuously undermine their property rights that get my goat. And in this part of the country, the majority of farmers are in that category.

You can't get the average farmer off his butt until the government wolves are at his door.

ARKANSAWYER · August 28, 2009, 07:30:19 PM

My family was farmers since they was kicked out of Ireland. Then them DanG carpetbaggers run them off the plantation after the war and they farmed the swamps of eastern Arkansas till the 1950's. My Pa did not want to farm (GrandPa was up to 200 acres and two tractors) nor did my uncle. So after he died the land was least to next farm over. The land was sold by kin for about half price so they could steal the money from a feable old woman. ( hope they get a good seat at the table in Hell) Only one of the family farms now and he does 4,000 acres in eastern Arkansas. He makes good money but works hard for it. If it were not for his Grandparents leaving his pa in good shape he would not ever be able to do it.
But I see less and less farmers and fewer younger ones at that. Corps will take over as most are buying the crops a year in advance. Cuz sells about half of his like this. Last time we spoke he told me that General Mills wanted to buy his whole rice crop. He told them no but offered them half. Riceland made a better deal so he went with them. When it came time to harvest the rice diesel was $3.50 a gallon so he lost money on half his crop but made money on the other half.
I would find it hard to think I had to sell boards for a set price now and not even buy the logs and saw the lumber till next summer. Be a hard row to hoe.

Magicman · August 28, 2009, 08:19:09 PM

I own 346 acres in my tree farm. My property tax bill last year was $3,897.00. That doesn't include liability insurance or any upkeep. Say I make a timber sale every 10 years. That's over 40g's skimmed right off of the top. I'm really not complaining, that's just reality....

maple flats · August 29, 2009, 06:59:39 PM

As has been said before, buy land, that is the only thing they aren't making any more of. I own about 40 acres, more than my parents ever owned, but I am looking for more. I do farm much of it but did not grow up on a farm. I have 3 acres of scotch pine, 4.5 acres of blueberries, and about 1.5 acres of vegetable garden, and 12 acres of tree farm (managed hard and soft wood. We sell blueberries, fresh vegies, make and sell maple syrup. But, we are still not making as much as we should to account for what we consume in a year. Like most others we are a drain on food supplies rather than a contributor.
This world needs more who add more than they consume. With deminishing farm land the food supply will slide until a balance is reached between population and food supply.

jim king · August 30, 2009, 01:23:41 PM

I was just reading the Minneapolis Sunday paper and came across this link which pertains to this blog.

http://www.startribune.com/business/35242889.html

SwampDonkey · August 30, 2009, 03:31:52 PM

I don't buy anything with palm oil and try to avoid anything with bean gums. I just checked around my cupboard and not a single item contains palm oil. A couple items contain a bean gum and they are fig bars and granola bars. I don't buy ice cream and I don't buy yogurt with any kind of bean gum. My margarine is non hydrogenated, and although I don't buy it, I believe butter is better for you. When I was a kid in school everyone took peanut butter sandwiches some time throughout the school year. And if you had a turkey sandwich, you would rather trade for peanut butter. Now we have all these allergies to it and people actually getting very sick or die. I never heard tell of anyone dying or getting sick from it when I was a kid. There is so much poison in that boxed and bottled food, no wonder people get sick. It's starting to catch up with our health. The majority of folks can't believe some corporation would poison us and at the same time getting the stamp of approval. Then it don't help that people are getting too lazy to cook, it would actually be cheaper to eat if you prepared your own instead of eating Swanson's casserole in wrapped in plastic in a paper box to be microwaved in 3 minutes. Mmm mmm the taste of plastic in my dinner. :D

ARKANSAWYER · September 01, 2009, 02:21:12 PM

I am getting where I do not eat much that has more then 5 ingredients in it. Other then Dr Pepper I have cut out alot of stuff. We can and put up alot of our food and catch or kill most of the rest if we do nor raise it. Finding that sheep eat pretty good and are easier to take care of then cows and pigs.
I have wondered if you were to lock some people in on a piece of land how much would it take to feed them? Here it takes about 3 to 5 acres of grass to feed one cow all year. Back last winter when the ice storm hit and people could not get to WalMart every day you thought that they were going to starve to death.