I was just wondering how many of you go portable with a manual mill. I was thinking about doing this and wanted to here some of your experiences doing this,such as set up time , log handling , board feet per day, ect.... I will be using an EZ Boardwalk mod. 40 , some day I would love to own a lt40 hydraulic
I have a home-built mill that is manual. I plan to use it away from home but have only done that once so far. Log handling was easier than at home (a tractor was handy). I know that I can not compete with a hydraulic mill and do not intend to try (Milling for myself only).
Seldom mill for anyone other than myself. When I do, I have to charge by the board foot. Could not compete with hydraulics on a time basis.
OlJarhead is custom sawing with an LT10 WoodMizer. He has a thread going about it. What I learned from what he is doing is that he found a niche in his area, and established an hourly rate that was enough to make it worthwhile for him, and was fair to his customers.
I started milling on my own with my FIL's LT40G18 Manual mill in 2007.
I would usually average 1,000 board feet per day, sawing White Pine and Hemlock and maybe a few hardwoods thrown in!
Now, with my LT40HDG24 Hydraulic mill I average 1,800 to maybe 2,000 board feet per day!
The hydraulics definately speed thing up, but then so does the horse power!
I have a manual. Yes,the borad feet is low,BUT the work is ALOT harder. I don't use mine too long at any one time. I go into the woods,cut a tree,run the mill and than I build. Gives me a break from sawing.I do have a friend that comes over at times. That makes a BIG diffenace.
Manual lt40 here. First question is whether your manual mill is set up to be mobile. I saw for a few folks and usually quote them a price per log and then give them an estimate of how long it will take. If I am going solo, I might be as low as a couple hundred board feet in a day. A helper can triple that. BF/day is contingent on so many factors though.
The folks I've milled for are usually so fascinated by their tree turning into usable lumber that they don't much care about the lack of speed.
2nd the comment about the hard work. My mill has electronic feed but it is still quite the ordeal at times.
I started with a chainsaw mill, and moved up to a hydraulic mill. Milling alone, I love my hydraulic mill. So much easier to load and turn the mill/cant, and it just simply keeps my back from killing me. When I first started on this forum, I asked the same question you did to several members, and from their experience and mine, I concluded it was as much a matter of organization around the mill, as it was in the type of mill you own. You will always have to clean around the mill, keep it lubed maintained (regardless what size or type of motor, CS or not), efficiently load and unload material, and stack and sticker the finished product. All without killing yourself or your friends. If your friends like you, and have a need for wood, they will come around occasionally to help. But if your setup is fun and safe to operate, you'll have to chase them away with a stick!
I'm still working on my millsite, and learning tons of info one this forum, and your Board foot per day will greatly increase if you practice most of what you read.
My partner and I have our manual mill portable (lt25). We have traveled a few times. We get travel time and depending on the logs and methods of loading can get about 1000 to 1100 bd ft a day.
I believe that you will work for very low pay at competitive going rates.
If you'll be sawing for walkin around money, Then sawing manual is fine. If you need to pay the bills with it, you're gonna need hydraulics. I run a non hydraulic mill and saw for others, but I'm stationary. I use a cable and winch system to load the log deck and to turn big logs. still hard work. When I build my next mill, hydraulics will be the first thing I engineer. ;) :D
I don't typically custom saw with my stationary manual LT15. If I do, it is by the hour. If the price is too high for the customer, then they can go find another mill to do their sawing. I don't make any excuses with the manual mill, and I tell people that they can get a better deal if they go find a portable hydraulic mill. They can do what they want to do. That is what makes America great. Free Will.
I started off in portable milling with an LT40 manual mill. It was hard work and my hourly net income was way below minimum wage. But ...
It earned me a reputation as an honest and reliable sawyer, and it gave me enough hard information to make a good business plan using real numbers. That in turn let me take out a 5 year (60 month) loan to upgrade to a hydraulic mill. So one year and 10 days after I bought my manual mill, I sold it and bought a hydraulic mill ;D.
If you start with a manual mill, keep detailed records of everything you do with it.
Oh, yeah. I paid off the loan in only 20 months ;D.
Like Brucer says, a manual mill wont give you high production, so you can't earn a lot.
But what it will do is get you into the milling business without a heap of financial risk. If you are considering a part time business, maybe just weekends, you can saw, and earn some $$ out from it, and not have the worry of HAVING to make payments each month. OK, you might only be making minimum wage, but look on it as an apprenticeship. You are learning about sawing, and running a business, and finding clients etc.
Then you may find that there isn't the demand. No big loss, you still have the mill. You can use it for your own use, or sell it and get most of your $$ back. Or you might be happy running your part time business. Or you find the demand is there to go full time and take on the payments of a nice fully automatic mill. Because you now have the experience sawing, the business experience, and the clients lined up, the risk of doing this is much less.
As for pricing, don't sell yourself short. Your hourly rate should be less, both because your production is less, but so are you expenses (no huge mill payment, less maintenance, less fuel use etc). If you price by Bd/ft rate it should be be comparable. Maybe slightly higher as your mill is easier to move to the smaller jobs that a larger operation won't be interested in. But if for example if someone with a larger mill want's a $500 minimum for a job, but the customer only has a few logs (500bd ft?). You rock up to the job, cut it out in a Sat afternoon, and earn $250. Sure your rate is 50c, while the bigger mill is 40c, but you did the job cheaper.
So can you make some "pocket money"? Sure. Make a "good" profit? Not so easy. But that's not to say you can't use it as a first step into business.
Ian
I have gone portable with my mill for about 10 years but now for the last two years strongly prefer to mill at home (too much traffic). I probably topped out at 500 bd ft/day working alone but more frequently less. I am retired and love to saw and so don't try to make a living but do make enough to supplement income. I have never tried for production but prefer to saw for wood workers who ooh and aah along with me over the next beautiful board coming off the log. And then they pay me but sometimes I do jobs for free. Again, I'm retired.
Bob
My business? plan is very similar to Kellogg's.My mill stays @home and people bring me orphan logs to saw as well as I cut sawlogs off our property.I have a friend who has traveled all over central Vt.with an Lt40 manual mill.He saws 1st rate lumber,has a great reputation,a hernia,and works too cheap.It is his choice and he's been @ it for 25 years.Lot's of good advice here,give it a go and see how you like it.
Mick
I agree with WDH,I have had a some people contact me about sawing with my manual mill. First off they would have to bring the logs to me. Than I quote a kinda high price. But most of these was just "Talkers",looking for that low price. These are the ones that don't think about how well the job is done,just they got the job done cheaper.
Lots of good advice here. My real job is construction,been doing it for 30 years. I been milling for a couple and really like the change of pace. I get a few jobs but not enough to keep busy full time,thats why I was thinking about portable milling ,thought I might get more jobs. Not any portable mills in my area that I know of. P.S. I learned alot about milling from this forum. Thanks.
I like the EZboardwalk mills and am seriously considering one, but I will build a trailer for it so I can leave the mill elevated enough to save bending over while being mobile. Taking blocks along to get it up high enough would be an option too.
Quote from: board on February 28, 2014, 01:00:16 PM
I was just wondering how many of you go portable with a manual mill. I was thinking about doing this and wanted to here some of your experiences doing this,such as set up time , log handling , board feet per day, ect.... I will be using an EZ Boardwalk mod. 40 , some day I would love to own a lt40 hydraulic
Lots of good advise here. My suggestion is don't sell your service short.
No reason to say boards off a manual mill are any less valuable than those
that come off a hydraulic mill.
Make sure you cover your costs and put some profit in your account.
Best
DGDrls
Quote from: board on March 01, 2014, 10:11:00 AM
Lots of good advice here. My real job is construction,been doing it for 30 years. I been milling for a couple and really like the change of pace. I get a few jobs but not enough to keep busy full time,thats why I was thinking about portable milling ,thought I might get more jobs. Not any portable mills in my area that I know of. P.S. I learned alot about milling from this forum. Thanks.
The customer has a big advantage with a portable miller!
The customer
doesn't have to transport the logs and then transport the lumber!
That is a good "customer getter"! ;)